From zapadlo at melzer.cz  Thu Sep  1 07:10:44 2005
From: zapadlo at melzer.cz (Petr Zapadlo)
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 08:10:44 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <000401c5ae6d$1903e0c0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz>
	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<000401c5ae6d$1903e0c0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <200509010810.44164.zapadlo@melzer.cz>


> Doted jsem byl presvedcenej ze kdystal na HPWT si zaostrim treba na 3
> metry, posvitim s tim do RX a budu hejbat dokud tam nebude nejvetsi napeti,
> ale asi to bude uplne jinak.
> Poradite prosim nekdo ??
> Moc diky :/

Tohle je uplne chybnej postup, zkus nad tim popremyslet. Ja jsem stravil na 
strese dve noci nez jsem pochopil proc. Predstav si:

Mas rozostreny vysilac, ten ma siroky svazek a namiris ho na Rx. Nicmene se ti 
to nepodari zamerit  presne osove a ted zacnes menit zaostreni svazku. Svazek 
se zacne zuzovat, ale protoze nemiri presne na RX tak ho RX najednou prestane 
prestane videt, protoze uz je uzky a miri jinam. Takze obsluha ma pocit ze se 
to zhorsuje, ale je to naopak.

Spravny postup je takovy, ze si nejprve v klidu dole na zemi zaostris Tx roury 
a pak uz s nimi nehybas.

Ja pouzivam vzdalenost cca 80m (vidim z dilny na zed skolky, ktera ma svetlou 
fasadu o velke plose a dobre se to na ni zaostruje).
najdes si zed ktera je vzdalena cca tuhle hodnotu a snazis se dosahnout co 
nejmensiho a zaroven nejjasnejsiho bodu. pokud to udelas na 80 metru, je to 
stejne jako pro nekonecno.
Podivej se v dokumentaci Ronji, je tam postup jak najit ten nejvhodnejsi bod.

Jeste jedna vec pro tvoji uvahu.
Existuji 2 zaostreni, na cip a na vrcholek pouzdra diody.
Nejvic energie je koncentrovano ve svazku jestlize je zaostreno na vrcholek 
diody. Takze zaostrovaci postup je takovy, ze si nechas na zdi zobrazit cip 
(zaostreno na cip) a ted musis vzdalil ledku od cocky aby se do hniska misto 
cipu dostal vrchlik pouzdra. Na zdi uvidis jak se cip rozmazne a zmeni na 
kolecko, ktere je podstatne jasnejsi nez cip. Dalsim posuvem se kolecko 
zvetsuje a vyrazne slabne.
Je treba si to vyzkouset nejlepe predem aby ses na strese nestresoval tim ze 
uz to chces mit hotove.




S pozdravem
-- 
Petr "Zapik" Zapadlo


Ing. Petr Zapadlo
vedouc? odd?len? syst?mov? podpory
Melzer, spol. s r.o.
Doln? 71, 796 01 Prost?jov
tel: 582 330 301
fax: 582 330 302
mailto: zapadlo at melzer.cz
http://www.melzer.cz


From srnkap at extranetplus.cz  Thu Sep  1 08:43:58 2005
From: srnkap at extranetplus.cz (Pavel Srnka)
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 09:43:58 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><000401c5ae6d$1903e0c0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<200509010810.44164.zapadlo@melzer.cz>
Message-ID: <000a01c5aec8$e97cf560$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>

mockrat dekuju , zkusime to ...

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Petr Zapadlo" <zapadlo at melzer.cz>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 8:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX



> Doted jsem byl presvedcenej ze kdystal na HPWT si zaostrim treba na 3
> metry, posvitim s tim do RX a budu hejbat dokud tam nebude nejvetsi 
> napeti,
> ale asi to bude uplne jinak.
> Poradite prosim nekdo ??
> Moc diky :/

Tohle je uplne chybnej postup, zkus nad tim popremyslet. Ja jsem stravil na
strese dve noci nez jsem pochopil proc. Predstav si:

Mas rozostreny vysilac, ten ma siroky svazek a namiris ho na Rx. Nicmene se 
ti
to nepodari zamerit  presne osove a ted zacnes menit zaostreni svazku. 
Svazek
se zacne zuzovat, ale protoze nemiri presne na RX tak ho RX najednou 
prestane
prestane videt, protoze uz je uzky a miri jinam. Takze obsluha ma pocit ze 
se
to zhorsuje, ale je to naopak.

Spravny postup je takovy, ze si nejprve v klidu dole na zemi zaostris Tx 
roury
a pak uz s nimi nehybas.

Ja pouzivam vzdalenost cca 80m (vidim z dilny na zed skolky, ktera ma 
svetlou
fasadu o velke plose a dobre se to na ni zaostruje).
najdes si zed ktera je vzdalena cca tuhle hodnotu a snazis se dosahnout co
nejmensiho a zaroven nejjasnejsiho bodu. pokud to udelas na 80 metru, je to
stejne jako pro nekonecno.
Podivej se v dokumentaci Ronji, je tam postup jak najit ten nejvhodnejsi 
bod.

Jeste jedna vec pro tvoji uvahu.
Existuji 2 zaostreni, na cip a na vrcholek pouzdra diody.
Nejvic energie je koncentrovano ve svazku jestlize je zaostreno na vrcholek
diody. Takze zaostrovaci postup je takovy, ze si nechas na zdi zobrazit cip
(zaostreno na cip) a ted musis vzdalil ledku od cocky aby se do hniska misto
cipu dostal vrchlik pouzdra. Na zdi uvidis jak se cip rozmazne a zmeni na
kolecko, ktere je podstatne jasnejsi nez cip. Dalsim posuvem se kolecko
zvetsuje a vyrazne slabne.
Je treba si to vyzkouset nejlepe predem aby ses na strese nestresoval tim ze
uz to chces mit hotove.




S pozdravem
-- 
Petr "Zapik" Zapadlo


Ing. Petr Zapadlo
vedouc? odd?len? syst?mov? podpory
Melzer, spol. s r.o.
Doln? 71, 796 01 Prost?jov
tel: 582 330 301
fax: 582 330 302
mailto: zapadlo at melzer.cz
http://www.melzer.cz

_______________________________________________
Ronja mailing list
Ronja at lists.pointless.net
http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 



From supermaster at seznam.cz  Fri Sep  2 09:49:23 2005
From: supermaster at seznam.cz (SuperMaster)
Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 10:49:23 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>
	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>

1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu 
podruhe.
2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci 
fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v 
ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout 
reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi 
ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila 
cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy 
pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec 
muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko 
550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.

Pavel Srnka napsal(a):

>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe 
>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm , nicmene 
>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>
>
>  
>
>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>
>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>    
>>
>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>
>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo 
>>>nas
>>>tohle :(((
>>>
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem miste a
>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda ohnisko
>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy a
>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>
>>>>>dik
>>>>>
>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat jestli je
>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>
>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>
>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja tubuse
>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>  nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim do
>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master" 
>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala 
>>>>>>50kc,
>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny 
>>>>>>pumer
>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro TX.
>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu, kdezto
>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v prstenci 
>>>>>>o
>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna jen
>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne 
>>>>>>tak
>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca 
>>>>>>106mm.
>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly obe
>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
>>    
>>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>  
>



From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Thu Sep  1 12:44:22 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Thu,  1 Sep 2005 13:44:22 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>
	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.

> 1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu 
> podruhe.
> 2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci 
> fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v 
> ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout 
> reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi 
> ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila 
> cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy 
> pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec 
> muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko 
> 550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
> 
> Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> 
> >stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe 
> >vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm , nicmene
> 
> >kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
> >
> >----- Original Message ----- 
> >From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
> >To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
> >Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >
> >
> >  
> >
> >>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
> >>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
> >>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
> >>
> >>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>    
> >>
> >>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
> >>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
> >>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
> >>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
> >>>
> >>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo 
> >>>nas
> >>>tohle :(((
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>----- Original Message ----- 
> >>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
> >>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
> >>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem miste
> a
> >>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda ohnisko
> >>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy a
> >>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>dik
> >>>>>
> >>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat jestli
> je
> >>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
> >>>>>
> >>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
> >>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
> >>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
> >>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
> tubuse
> >>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
> >>>>>  nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim do
> >>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master" 
> >>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
> >>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
> >>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>          
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala 
> >>>>>>50kc,
> >>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny 
> >>>>>>pumer
> >>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro TX.
> >>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu, kdezto
> >>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
> >>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
> >>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v prstenci
> 
> >>>>>>o
> >>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna jen
> >>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne 
> >>>>>>tak
> >>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca 
> >>>>>>106mm.
> >>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly
> obe
> >>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
> >>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
> >>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
> >>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>>            
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>
> >>>>>          
> >>>>>
> >>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Ronja mailing list
> >>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Ronja mailing list
> >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> >  
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 





From srnkap at extranetplus.cz  Thu Sep  1 13:01:43 2005
From: srnkap at extranetplus.cz (Pavel Srnka)
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:01:43 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz><004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>
	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <000801c5aeec$eb40e220$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>

mam to na 340metru :)) ale chtel bych aby to bylo spolehlivejsi i z ahorsich 
atmosferickych podminek :)

----- Original Message ----- 
From: <Seligr at sh.cvut.cz>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 1:44 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX


Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.

> 1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu
> podruhe.
> 2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci
> fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v
> ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout
> reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi
> ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila
> cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy
> pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec
> muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko
> 550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>
> Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>
> >stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
> >vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm , 
> >nicmene
>
> >kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
> >
> >----- Original Message ----- 
> >From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
> >To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
> >Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
> >>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
> >>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
> >>
> >>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>
> >>
> >>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
> >>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
> >>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
> >>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
> >>>
> >>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo
> >>>nas
> >>>tohle :(((
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>----- Original Message ----- 
> >>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
> >>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
> >>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem 
> >>>>miste
> a
> >>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda ohnisko
> >>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy 
> >>>>>a
> >>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>dik
> >>>>>
> >>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat jestli
> je
> >>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
> >>>>>
> >>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
> >>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
> >>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
> >>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
> tubuse
> >>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
> >>>>>  nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim 
> >>>>> do
> >>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
> >>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
> >>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
> >>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala
> >>>>>>50kc,
> >>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny
> >>>>>>pumer
> >>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro TX.
> >>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu, 
> >>>>>>kdezto
> >>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
> >>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
> >>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v 
> >>>>>>prstenci
>
> >>>>>>o
> >>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna 
> >>>>>>jen
> >>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne
> >>>>>>tak
> >>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
> >>>>>>106mm.
> >>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly
> obe
> >>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
> >>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
> >>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
> >>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Ronja mailing list
> >>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Ronja mailing list
> >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>




_______________________________________________
Ronja mailing list
Ronja at lists.pointless.net
http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 



From kubajz at kbx.cz  Thu Sep  1 13:11:52 2005
From: kubajz at kbx.cz (Jakub Sykora)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2005 14:11:52 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <000801c5aeec$eb40e220$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz><004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<000801c5aeec$eb40e220$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <4316F008.10200@kbx.cz>

:)))) Tak neni lepsi uz tam zavesit opticke vlakno? :)))

340 metru - to me pobavilo :)

K

Pavel Srnka wrote:
> mam to na 340metru :)) ale chtel bych aby to bylo spolehlivejsi i z ahorsich 
> atmosferickych podminek :)
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <Seligr at sh.cvut.cz>
> To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 1:44 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> 
> 
> Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
> 13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
> 
> 
>>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu
>>podruhe.
>>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci
>>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v
>>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout
>>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi
>>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila
>>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy
>>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec
>>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko
>>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>>
>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>
>>
>>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
>>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm , 
>>>nicmene
>>
>>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
>>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>>>
>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
>>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
>>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>>>
>>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo
>>>>>nas
>>>>>tohle :(((
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem 
>>>>>>miste
>>
>>a
>>
>>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda ohnisko
>>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy 
>>>>>>>a
>>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>dik
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat jestli
>>
>>je
>>
>>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
>>
>>tubuse
>>
>>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>>> nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim 
>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
>>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala
>>>>>>>>50kc,
>>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny
>>>>>>>>pumer
>>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro TX.
>>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu, 
>>>>>>>>kdezto
>>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
>>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v 
>>>>>>>>prstenci
>>
>>>>>>>>o
>>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna 
>>>>>>>>jen
>>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne
>>>>>>>>tak
>>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
>>>>>>>>106mm.
>>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly
>>
>>obe
>>
>>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
>>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja

-- 
Jakub S?kora
email: kubajz at kbx.cz
ICQ: 68976632
mobil: +420 777 594 201
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From fabyhenko at centrum.cz  Thu Sep  1 13:19:54 2005
From: fabyhenko at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Petr_Dvo=F8=E1k?=)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2005 14:19:54 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <000801c5aeec$eb40e220$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz><004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<000801c5aeec$eb40e220$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <4316F1EA.7000304@centrum.cz>

130mm je na 340m desnej over-kill, to bude infra? (sry nesledoval sem 
ted mailing list)

ROOTen

Pavel Srnka wrote:

>mam to na 340metru :)) ale chtel bych aby to bylo spolehlivejsi i z ahorsich 
>atmosferickych podminek :)
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: <Seligr at sh.cvut.cz>
>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 1:44 PM
>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>
>
>Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
>13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
>
>  
>
>>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu
>>podruhe.
>>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci
>>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v
>>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout
>>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi
>>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila
>>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy
>>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec
>>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko
>>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>>
>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>
>>    
>>
>>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
>>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm , 
>>>nicmene
>>>      
>>>
>>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
>>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>>>
>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
>>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
>>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>>>
>>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo
>>>>>nas
>>>>>tohle :(((
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem 
>>>>>>miste
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>a
>>    
>>
>>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda ohnisko
>>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy 
>>>>>>>a
>>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>dik
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat jestli
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>je
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>tubuse
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>>> nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim 
>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
>>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala
>>>>>>>>50kc,
>>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny
>>>>>>>>pumer
>>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro TX.
>>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu, 
>>>>>>>>kdezto
>>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
>>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v 
>>>>>>>>prstenci
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>o
>>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna 
>>>>>>>>jen
>>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne
>>>>>>>>tak
>>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
>>>>>>>>106mm.
>>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>obe
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
>>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
>  
>



From kubajz at kbx.cz  Thu Sep  1 13:24:43 2005
From: kubajz at kbx.cz (Jakub Sykora)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2005 14:24:43 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <4316F1EA.7000304@centrum.cz>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz><004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<000801c5aeec$eb40e220$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<4316F1EA.7000304@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <4316F30B.5070605@kbx.cz>

To hlavne nema byt 130mm ale tank s ohromnyma fresnelkama.

Jestli to bude nekdy nekde k videni, tak prosim o fotodokumentaci a 
mozna by stalo za to pozvat nekoho z agentury Dobry den a zapsat to do 
Guinessovy knihy rekordu jako nejvetsi funkcni overkill ve FSO 
komunikaci na svete :)

Hodne zdaru,

K

Petr Dvo??k wrote:
> 130mm je na 340m desnej over-kill, to bude infra? (sry nesledoval sem 
> ted mailing list)
> 
> ROOTen
> 
> Pavel Srnka wrote:
> 
> 
>>mam to na 340metru :)) ale chtel bych aby to bylo spolehlivejsi i z ahorsich 
>>atmosferickych podminek :)
>>
>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>From: <Seligr at sh.cvut.cz>
>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 1:44 PM
>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>
>>
>>Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
>>13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
>>
>> 
>>
>>
>>>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu
>>>podruhe.
>>>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci
>>>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v
>>>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout
>>>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi
>>>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila
>>>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy
>>>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec
>>>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko
>>>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>>>
>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>
>>>   
>>>
>>>
>>>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
>>>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm , 
>>>>nicmene
>>>>     
>>>>
>>>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>>>>
>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
>>>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>>>>
>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>       
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
>>>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
>>>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo
>>>>>>nas
>>>>>>tohle :(((
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>         
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem 
>>>>>>>miste
>>>>>>>           
>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>a
>>>   
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>           
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda ohnisko
>>>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy 
>>>>>>>>a
>>>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>dik
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat jestli
>>>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>je
>>>   
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
>>>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>tubuse
>>>   
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>>>>nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim 
>>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
>>>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala
>>>>>>>>>50kc,
>>>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny
>>>>>>>>>pumer
>>>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro TX.
>>>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu, 
>>>>>>>>>kdezto
>>>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
>>>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v 
>>>>>>>>>prstenci
>>>>>>>>>               
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>o
>>>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna 
>>>>>>>>>jen
>>>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne
>>>>>>>>>tak
>>>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
>>>>>>>>>106mm.
>>>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly
>>>>>>>>>               
>>>>>>>>>
>>>
>>>obe
>>>   
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
>>>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>               
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>           
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>         
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>       
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     
>>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>>   
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>
>> 
>>
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja

-- 
Jakub S?kora
email: kubajz at kbx.cz
ICQ: 68976632
mobil: +420 777 594 201
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From sith at wifistar.net  Thu Sep  1 15:35:09 2005
From: sith at wifistar.net (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?David_Sedl=E1=E8ek?=)
Date: Thu, 01 Sep 2005 14:35:09 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <4316F30B.5070605@kbx.cz>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz><004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<000801c5aeec$eb40e220$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<4316F1EA.7000304@centrum.cz>
	<4316F30B.5070605@kbx.cz>
Message-ID: <4317119D.3030202@wifistar.net>

Nevim co vam na tom prijde nepochopitelneho. My mame 13cm cocky i na
300m 4V lince, sice jsme ji museli trochu "rozhodit", ale vetsinou to
funguje i v mlze.
Pokud nema moznost vykopu, nejlepsi reseni.

To se zas nekdo nudi..

Jakub Sykora napsal(a):
> To hlavne nema byt 130mm ale tank s ohromnyma fresnelkama.
> 
> Jestli to bude nekdy nekde k videni, tak prosim o fotodokumentaci a
> mozna by stalo za to pozvat nekoho z agentury Dobry den a zapsat to do
> Guinessovy knihy rekordu jako nejvetsi funkcni overkill ve FSO
> komunikaci na svete :)
> 
> Hodne zdaru,
> 
> K
> 
> Petr Dvo??k wrote:
> 
>> 130mm je na 340m desnej over-kill, to bude infra? (sry nesledoval sem
>> ted mailing list)
>>
>> ROOTen
>>
>> Pavel Srnka wrote:
>>
>>
>>> mam to na 340metru :)) ale chtel bych aby to bylo spolehlivejsi i z
>>> ahorsich atmosferickych podminek :)
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: <Seligr at sh.cvut.cz>
>>> To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>> Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 1:44 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>
>>>
>>> Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
>>> 13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>> 1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu
>>>> podruhe.
>>>> 2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci
>>>> fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v
>>>> ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout
>>>> reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi
>>>> ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka
>>>> vysila
>>>> cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy
>>>> pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec
>>>> muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma
>>>> ohnisko
>>>> 550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>>>>
>>>> Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>
>>>>  
>>>>
>>>>> stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
>>>>> vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm ,
>>>>> nicmene
>>>>>    
>>>>> kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jakub Michn?k"
>>>>> <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>>>>> To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>    
>>>>>
>>>>>> je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>>>>> neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc
>>>>>> dobre
>>>>>> :) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>      
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G)
>>>>>>> cocky z
>>>>>>> dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem
>>>>>>> 37cm, je
>>>>>>> skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX
>>>>>>> ???
>>>>>>> Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale
>>>>>>> prekvapilo
>>>>>>> nas
>>>>>>> tohle :(((
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kendy - HKFree"
>>>>>>> <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>>>>> To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>        
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na
>>>>>>>> stejnem miste
>>>>>>>>          
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> a
>>>>  
>>>>
>>>>>>>> pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda
>>>>>>>>> ohnisko
>>>>>>>>> jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene
>>>>>>>>> 4kusy a
>>>>>>>>> byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> dik
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat
>>>>>>>>> jestli
>>>>>>>>>            
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> je
>>>>  
>>>>
>>>>>>>>> nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>>>>> 2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>>>>> 3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>>>>> nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> 4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
>>>>>>>>>            
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> tubuse
>>>>  
>>>>
>>>>>>>>> tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>>>>> nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla ,
>>>>>>>>> dosadim do
>>>>>>>>> vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
>>>>>>>>> <supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>>>>> To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>>>>> Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>            
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna
>>>>>>>>>> stala
>>>>>>>>>> 50kc,
>>>>>>>>>> ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a
>>>>>>>>>> skutecny
>>>>>>>>>> pumer
>>>>>>>>>> je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade
>>>>>>>>>> pro TX.
>>>>>>>>>> Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu,
>>>>>>>>>> kdezto
>>>>>>>>>> ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>>>>> stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca
>>>>>>>>>> polovina
>>>>>>>>>> vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v
>>>>>>>>>> prstenci
>>>>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>>>> o
>>>>>>>>>> uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo
>>>>>>>>>> mozna jen
>>>>>>>>>> 30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a
>>>>>>>>>> podstatne
>>>>>>>>>> tak
>>>>>>>>>> snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
>>>>>>>>>> 106mm.
>>>>>>>>>> Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby
>>>>>>>>>> byly
>>>>>>>>>>              
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> obe
>>>>  
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>>>>> presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich
>>>>>>>>>> obvod) a
>>>>>>>>>> zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>>>>> vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>>> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>            
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>          
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>        
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Ronja mailing list
>>>>>> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>      
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Ronja mailing list
>>>>> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>    
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Ronja mailing list
>>>> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>
>>>>  
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Ronja mailing list
>>> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Ronja mailing list
>>> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Ronja mailing list
>> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja

-- 
Regards,
David Sedl??ek
WiFiStar.net, o.s.
skype: sith_cz


From srnkap at extranetplus.cz  Thu Sep  1 13:44:32 2005
From: srnkap at extranetplus.cz (Pavel Srnka)
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 14:44:32 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz><004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz><000801c5aeec$eb40e220$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<4316F1EA.7000304@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <003301c5aef2$e6aec820$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>

ne , zatim to bude LED, infra plosnak je ve vyvoji, nahodou crusader co mam 
ted na strese je infra, ma taky 130mm cocky a jede na 200m :) zbuchne to v 
mlze tak 2krat do roka, ale je fakt ze to je ted doladeny jenom na 30% :)
fotodokumentace samozrejmebude :)


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Petr Dvo??k" <fabyhenko at centrum.cz>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 2:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX


130mm je na 340m desnej over-kill, to bude infra? (sry nesledoval sem
ted mailing list)

ROOTen

Pavel Srnka wrote:

>mam to na 340metru :)) ale chtel bych aby to bylo spolehlivejsi i z 
>ahorsich
>atmosferickych podminek :)
>
>----- Original Message ----- 
>From: <Seligr at sh.cvut.cz>
>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>Sent: Thursday, September 01, 2005 1:44 PM
>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>
>
>Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
>13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
>
>
>
>>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu
>>podruhe.
>>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci
>>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v
>>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout
>>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi
>>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila
>>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy
>>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec
>>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko
>>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>>
>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>
>>
>>
>>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
>>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm ,
>>>nicmene
>>>
>>>
>>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
>>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>>>
>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
>>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
>>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>>>
>>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo
>>>>>nas
>>>>>tohle :(((
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem
>>>>>>miste
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>a
>>
>>
>>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda ohnisko
>>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy
>>>>>>>a
>>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>dik
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat jestli
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>je
>>
>>
>>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>tubuse
>>
>>
>>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>>> nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim
>>>>>>>do
>>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
>>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala
>>>>>>>>50kc,
>>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny
>>>>>>>>pumer
>>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro TX.
>>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu,
>>>>>>>>kdezto
>>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
>>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v
>>>>>>>>prstenci
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>o
>>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna
>>>>>>>>jen
>>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne
>>>>>>>>tak
>>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
>>>>>>>>106mm.
>>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>obe
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
>>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
>
>


_______________________________________________
Ronja mailing list
Ronja at lists.pointless.net
http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 



From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep  1 20:40:27 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 1 Sep 2005 21:40:27 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Bugfix Twister radiation
Message-ID: <20050901194027.GA6190@kestrel>

I have uploaded bugfix and fixed version of Twister manual to Ronja.
http://ronja.twibright.com/news.php

CL<


From supermaster at seznam.cz  Fri Sep  2 15:10:46 2005
From: supermaster at seznam.cz (SuperMaster)
Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 16:10:46 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>
	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz>

Bude to na 1.6km, ale chtel bych aby to jelo co nejlepe i v mlze, 
snezeni a tak. Pri silne mlze nemam sanci, ale pri slabe doufam ze jo. A 
prepsal jsem se, maj rozmer 320x400 s 550, nebo 310x310 s 330mm 
ohniskem, jeste uvidim, pro co se rozhodnu.

Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):

>Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
>13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
>
>  
>
>>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu 
>>podruhe.
>>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci 
>>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v 
>>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout 
>>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi 
>>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila 
>>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy 
>>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec 
>>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko 
>>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>>
>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>
>>    
>>
>>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe 
>>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm , nicmene
>>>      
>>>
>>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>>>
>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
>>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>>>
>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>   
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
>>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
>>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>>>
>>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo 
>>>>>nas
>>>>>tohle :(((
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>     
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem miste
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>a
>>    
>>
>>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>       
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda ohnisko
>>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy a
>>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>dik
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat jestli
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>je
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>tubuse
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>>> nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim do
>>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master" 
>>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>         
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala 
>>>>>>>>50kc,
>>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny 
>>>>>>>>pumer
>>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro TX.
>>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu, kdezto
>>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
>>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v prstenci
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>o
>>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna jen
>>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne 
>>>>>>>>tak
>>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca 
>>>>>>>>106mm.
>>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>obe
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
>>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>           
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>         
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>       
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>     
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
>>>>   
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>  
>



From daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz  Fri Sep  2 15:17:36 2005
From: daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz (Daniel Strnad)
Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 14:17:36 -0000
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>
	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <opswhbbmzkn6qjls@daman>

A jak to chces resit po mechanicky strance? Do ceho to chces zasadit?

On Fri, 02 Sep 2005 16:10:46 +0200, SuperMaster <supermaster at seznam.cz>  
wrote:

> Bude to na 1.6km, ale chtel bych aby to jelo co nejlepe i v mlze,
> snezeni a tak. Pri silne mlze nemam sanci, ale pri slabe doufam ze jo. A
> prepsal jsem se, maj rozmer 320x400 s 550, nebo 310x310 s 330mm
> ohniskem, jeste uvidim, pro co se rozhodnu.


From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Fri Sep  2 16:20:08 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Fri, 02 Sep 2005 17:20:08 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <opswhbbmzkn6qjls@daman>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz>
	<opswhbbmzkn6qjls@daman>
Message-ID: <43186DA8.8000703@centrum.cz>



Daniel Strnad napsal(a):
> A jak to chces resit po mechanicky strance? Do ceho to chces zasadit?

....do truhliku :P

> 
> On Fri, 02 Sep 2005 16:10:46 +0200, SuperMaster <supermaster at seznam.cz>  
> wrote:
> 
> 
>>Bude to na 1.6km, ale chtel bych aby to jelo co nejlepe i v mlze,
>>snezeni a tak. Pri silne mlze nemam sanci, ale pri slabe doufam ze jo. A
>>prepsal jsem se, maj rozmer 320x400 s 550, nebo 310x310 s 330mm
>>ohniskem, jeste uvidim, pro co se rozhodnu.
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep  2 17:08:54 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 18:08:54 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] about my final project
In-Reply-To: <353aafeb05090206065c8183be@mail.gmail.com>
References: <353aafeb05081708375c21ec2@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050819095313.GA11640@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<353aafeb0508210400563ff6bb@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050822090340.GA1891@kestrel>
	<353aafeb05082702013bee6e32@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050827160133.GA13926@kestrel>
	<353aafeb05090206065c8183be@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050902160854.GA31802@kestrel>

On Fri, Sep 02, 2005 at 06:36:31PM +0530, vipul kalia wrote:
> hey karel help needed again well tell me at 10mpbs the transmitter will 
> appear continueously on so how will reciever know that its logical 1or 

Appear for human eye only. Human eye is slow. Actually the transmitter
will turn light and dark in rhythm of 10Mbps.

> logical 0 and can you please mail me the data sheets of HPWT-BD00-F4000 
> ,BPW43,all other main components because on ronja site there is broken link 

http://ronja.twibright.com/datasheets/

> well please send some more stuff i am making RONJA as my final year project 
> well 

Look into ronja.twibright.com website. What stuff is missing there?

> in india nobody has about it well when i showed project sysnopsis 
> to my college they found it very good well please help me .
> if any other help may be needed i will mail 
> sorry for trouble .
> thanks vipul 

You're welcome.

CL<


From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Fri Sep  2 20:05:29 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Fri,  2 Sep 2005 21:05:29 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>
	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>
	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <1125687929.4318a279914a7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

To by te mohlo zajimat tohle http://laser.webpark.cz/work.html , ozivil jsem
Clockovu Interpolis s vyuzitim stavajicich dilu s 13cm sikmovokejma cockama.
Zatim si to brousi zuby na cca 3km.
Prvni testy na 2,5km dopadly nadejne.

> Bude to na 1.6km, ale chtel bych aby to jelo co nejlepe i v mlze, 
> snezeni a tak. Pri silne mlze nemam sanci, ale pri slabe doufam ze jo. A 
> prepsal jsem se, maj rozmer 320x400 s 550, nebo 310x310 s 330mm 
> ohniskem, jeste uvidim, pro co se rozhodnu.
> 
> Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
> 
> >Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
> >13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
> >
> >  
> >
> >>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu 
> >>podruhe.
> >>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci 
> >>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v 
> >>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout 
> >>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi 
> >>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila 
> >>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy 
> >>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec 
> >>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko 
> >>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
> >>
> >>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>
> >>    
> >>
> >>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe 
> >>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm ,
> nicmene
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
> >>>
> >>>----- Original Message ----- 
> >>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
> >>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
> >>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> 
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
> >>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
> >>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
> >>>>
> >>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>>>   
> >>>>
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
> >>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
> >>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
> >>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo
> 
> >>>>>nas
> >>>>>tohle :(((
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
> >>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
> >>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
> >>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>     
> >>>>>
> >>>>>          
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem
> miste
> >>>>>>            
> >>>>>>
> >>a
> >>    
> >>
> >>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>       
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>            
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda
> ohnisko
> >>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy
> a
> >>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>dik
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat
> jestli
> >>>>>>>              
> >>>>>>>
> >>je
> >>    
> >>
> >>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
> >>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
> >>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
> >>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
> >>>>>>>              
> >>>>>>>
> >>tubuse
> >>    
> >>
> >>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
> >>>>>>> nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim
> do
> >>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master" 
> >>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
> >>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
> >>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>         
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>              
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala 
> >>>>>>>>50kc,
> >>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny 
> >>>>>>>>pumer
> >>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro
> TX.
> >>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu,
> kdezto
> >>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
> >>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
> >>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v
> prstenci
> >>>>>>>>                
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>o
> >>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna
> jen
> >>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne
> 
> >>>>>>>>tak
> >>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca 
> >>>>>>>>106mm.
> >>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly
> >>>>>>>>                
> >>>>>>>>
> >>obe
> >>    
> >>
> >>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
> >>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
> >>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
> >>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>>>>           
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>                
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>         
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>              
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>>       
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>            
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>     
> >>>>>
> >>>>>          
> >>>>>
> >>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
> >>>>   
> >>>>
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>
> >>> 
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Ronja mailing list
> >>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Ronja mailing list
> >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> >  
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 





From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep  3 09:03:49 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 10:03:49 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] RSSI indikator
In-Reply-To: <42F85222.8070805@centrum.cz>
References: <42F769EF.4060500@centrum.cz> <42F78B3F.9080101@katka.biz>
	<42F794DC.8060302@centrum.cz> <42F7A6D0.4000005@seznam.cz>
	<42F85222.8070805@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050903080349.GC9618@kestrel>

On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 08:50:10AM +0200, Jakub Michn?k wrote:
> no tak uzkaz co mas, dyz tak ti s tistakem muzu pomoct. jestli to stoji 
> jenom na tomhle nevim na co se ceka :) ale urcite by k tomu chtelo 
> nakeho sikovneho programatora ktery k tomu udela soft i pro linux, aby 
> to umelo i graf a tak .. kdyz uz se to dela at je to poradne. ja sice 

rrdtool?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep  2 20:19:10 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:19:10 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Rozdil mezi BF908 a BF988
In-Reply-To: <42F5124C.7060103@seznam.cz>
References: <42F5124C.7060103@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <20050902191910.GA8748@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sat, Aug 06, 2005 at 09:41:00PM +0200, Austin wrote:
> mate s tim pls nekdo zkusenosti? ja mam totiz BF988, protoze v GMku v 
> Ostrave nic jineho nemaji :(
> a porad mam na zemi dosah tak do 1,2-1,5 metru.. uz nevim cim by to 
> mohlo byt, vsecky ostatni soucastky mam standartni a LEDku mam SFH2030 a 
> BD00-F4000.
> a spajene si myslim ze to mam celkem vpohode (vrabcakem). teda nevim jak 
> s estetikou :) ale vyvody mam, nebo se snazim delat co nejkratsi kde to 
> de.. takze si myslim ze v tom problem neni... navic u meho 1. spoje, 
> ktery byl spajen naprosto nechutne :) a vsecko bylo co nejdelsi jak jen 
> to slo :o) je rozdil v dosahu tak maximalne 20%..
> uz nevim na co to svest jineho nez na to BF988...

Are the G2 blocking capacitors next to Q101 as newly added into guide?
You can send picture I tell you if it's OK.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep  2 20:16:23 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 21:16:23 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] How to bend a tin (for hood)?
In-Reply-To: <20050805222518.GA13265@feanor>
References: <20050801102519.GA5139@feanor> <20050804071730.GD21994@kestrel>
	<20050805222518.GA13265@feanor>
Message-ID: <20050902191623.GA8566@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sat, Aug 06, 2005 at 12:25:18AM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 04, 2005 at 09:17:30AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> > On Mon, Aug 01, 2005 at 12:25:20PM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> > > Hello
> > > Yesterday we were producing hoods for Ronja, but after a hour of trying to
> > > bend a cutted metal sheet (width 0.5 mm) we gave up.
> > 
> > Did you try sliding it over edge of table?
> 
> We tried sliding it over pipes of several diameters and using hammer.
> 
> > Was it steel?
> 
> Yes, it was common 0.5 mm zinc-coated sheet metal.
> 
> > What thickness do you think would be suitable for steel?
> 
> I don't know

Thanks for report. I have fixed it in the guide and uploaded.

CL<



From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep  2 21:23:49 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 2 Sep 2005 22:23:49 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Rozdil mezi BF908 a BF988
In-Reply-To: <opsu318gh7n6qjls@daman>
References: <42F5124C.7060103@seznam.cz> <42F514E4.9000508@hkfree.org>
	<42F515D2.1010306@seznam.cz>
	<1123358638.42f517ae22560@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<opsu318gh7n6qjls@daman>
Message-ID: <20050902202349.GB8748@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sat, Aug 06, 2005 at 11:58:54PM -0000, Daniel Strnad wrote:
> On Sat,  6 Aug 2005 22:03:58 +0200, <Seligr at sh.cvut.cz> wrote:
> 
> >Taky kondik 1N mezi G2 MOSFETu a zemi nesmi byt takovy ten zluty/oranzovy
> >epoxidovy, ale musi se tam dat obyc. hnedy. Jinak jsou s tim problemy.
> Tak o tom nevim. Mohl bys blize specifikovat jak ten kondik vypada? Zatim  
> co jsem videl tak oranzovy a zluty jsou vsechny a pak jeste modry.

According to research results in
http://ronja.twibright.com/how.php
the disc capacitors have greater inductance than the small ones so this
doesn't sound real to me.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep  3 08:54:45 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:54:45 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Rozdil mezi BF908 a BF988
In-Reply-To: <1123432173.42f636ed83bb6@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <001801c59b56$d07b9560$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<000601c59b58$8d32ef40$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<42F616F2.3060608@centrum.cz>
	<1123432173.42f636ed83bb6@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050903075445.GA9618@kestrel>

On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 06:29:33PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Kdyz tady vidim jakuba - tak me napada nemas obracene fotodiodu?
> S tim zlutim kondikem je potiz. Kdyz na G2 byl samotny zluty 100N, tak to jelo
> tak na 15cm, pritom na osciloskopu nebylo nic poznat. Kdyz se pridal "hnedy" 1N
> sup uz to jelo na 2m.

The 1n capacitor is already online for some times in the guide.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep  3 08:57:38 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 09:57:38 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Rozdil mezi BF908 a BF988
In-Reply-To: <42F639E8.5060909@centrum.cz>
References: <001801c59b56$d07b9560$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<000601c59b58$8d32ef40$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<42F616F2.3060608@centrum.cz>
	<1123432173.42f636ed83bb6@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<42F639E8.5060909@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050903075738.GB9618@kestrel>

On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 06:42:16PM +0200, Jakub Michn?k wrote:
> 
> 
> Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
> >Kdyz tady vidim jakuba - tak me napada nemas obracene fotodiodu?
> 
> :)
> 
> >S tim zlutim kondikem je potiz. Kdyz na G2 byl samotny zluty 100N, tak to 
> >jelo
> >tak na 15cm, pritom na osciloskopu nebylo nic poznat. Kdyz se pridal 
> >"hnedy" 1N
> >sup uz to jelo na 2m.
> 
> a bylo to urcite tim ze ten kondik byl hnedy nebo ze byl paralelne a mel 
>  1n ?:) ... vi nekdo jak sou stavene ty smd (tim padem i zlute z GM) 
> konidky? ty hnede sou diskove. na keramice placce sou naparene 
> elektrody. ale ty smdcka naji elektrody dycky stejne a moc male na 
> takovou kapacitu. mozna ze maji nakou tu "vnitrni geometrii" pro ronju 
> nevyhovujici ... :/ ...

I am using various crappy capacitors and didn't have problem. Don't care
about capacitor types as long as they are not against the guide. If it
doesn't run well, it's a problem of internal geometry of my brain, not
internal geometry of the capacitor ;-) Make sure you got it according to
the guide, and if yes, then bugreport it.

CL<


From supermaster at seznam.cz  Sun Sep  4 12:02:56 2005
From: supermaster at seznam.cz (SuperMaster)
Date: Sun, 04 Sep 2005 13:02:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <1125687929.4318a279914a7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz>
	<1125687929.4318a279914a7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <431AD460.8030606@seznam.cz>

Super! Konecne jsem se nekde docetl, jak pouzit to UTP misto koaxu, diky 
za link. Mechanicky to chci udelat tak, ze to bude ctyrboky jehlan 
svareny z poradnych vinglu, ve vrcholu budou kolejnie pro RX modul. Cele 
to bude derzet minimalne o 100% zvetseny puvodni clockuv drzak, 
pravdepodobne jeste lehce modifikovany pro vetsi tuhost. Cele to bude 
vazit klidne 20kg. Ted mi jeste poradte: premyslim nad 310x310 s 330mm, 
coz dava dopadovy uhel priblizne 25 stupnu, nebo ta 320x400 s 550, ktera 
dava uhel delsi strany 20 stupnu. Delsi ohnisko je lepsi pro vetsi 
citlivost fotodiody, ale zaroven bude nachylnejsi na presnost zamereni i 
pripadne krouceni budovy/drzaku. Cena je 15 resp. 28 dolaru, takze to 
neni primarni problem. Dalsi moznost je ze koupim tu 310x310 a oriznu ji 
na prumer 210 a dam ji do te nejvesi odpadove roury, kterou uz mam 
koupenou. Myslite ze tech 310x310 resp 320x400 je overkill na 1.6km? 
mame tu dost casto mlhy, je to nad hostivari, takze bych to chtel mit co 
mozna nejlepsi.

Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):

>To by te mohlo zajimat tohle http://laser.webpark.cz/work.html , ozivil jsem
>Clockovu Interpolis s vyuzitim stavajicich dilu s 13cm sikmovokejma cockama.
>Zatim si to brousi zuby na cca 3km.
>Prvni testy na 2,5km dopadly nadejne.
>
>  
>
>>Bude to na 1.6km, ale chtel bych aby to jelo co nejlepe i v mlze, 
>>snezeni a tak. Pri silne mlze nemam sanci, ale pri slabe doufam ze jo. A 
>>prepsal jsem se, maj rozmer 320x400 s 550, nebo 310x310 s 330mm 
>>ohniskem, jeste uvidim, pro co se rozhodnu.
>>
>>Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
>>
>>    
>>
>>>Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
>>>13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu 
>>>>podruhe.
>>>>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci 
>>>>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v 
>>>>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout 
>>>>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi 
>>>>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila 
>>>>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy 
>>>>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec 
>>>>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko 
>>>>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>>>>
>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>
>>>>   
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe 
>>>>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm ,
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>nicmene
>>    
>>
>>>>>     
>>>>>
>>>>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>     
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>>>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
>>>>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>  
>>>>>>
>>>>>>       
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
>>>>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
>>>>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>nas
>>>>>>>tohle :(((
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>         
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>miste
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>           
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>a
>>>>   
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>      
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>           
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>ohnisko
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>a
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>dik
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>jestli
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>je
>>>>   
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
>>>>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>tubuse
>>>>   
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>>>>>nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>do
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master" 
>>>>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>        
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala 
>>>>>>>>>>50kc,
>>>>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny 
>>>>>>>>>>pumer
>>>>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>TX.
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu,
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>kdezto
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
>>>>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>prstenci
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>>>               
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>o
>>>>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>jen
>>    
>>
>>>>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>tak
>>>>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca 
>>>>>>>>>>106mm.
>>>>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly
>>>>>>>>>>               
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>obe
>>>>   
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
>>>>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>>          
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>               
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>                    
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>        
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>             
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>                  
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>      
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>           
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>                
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>    
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>         
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>              
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
>>>>>>  
>>>>>>
>>>>>>       
>>>>>>
>>>>>>            
>>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>     
>>>>>
>>>>>          
>>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>
>>>>   
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>    
>>
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>  
>



From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep  3 12:22:55 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:22:55 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem with RX testpoints
In-Reply-To: <20050828014819.GA13615@twin.jikos.cz>
References: <20050828014819.GA13615@twin.jikos.cz>
Message-ID: <20050903112255.GA10415@kestrel>

On Sun, Aug 28, 2005 at 03:48:19AM +0200, Jirka Bohac wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I've got a small problem with the RX testpoints. I've got two RX boxes and
> they both behave pretty much the same:
> 
> P110 is about 11.7V
> P101 should be no more than 0.5V less, but is ~10.95V ->  0.7V less

Bug of the manual, fixed.

> P102 is around 3.25V (should be 3.5 - 4)
> 
> I tried tuning P102 by replacing the default R104 resistor if 180k by a
> 120k, but this resulted in P102 ~= 4.25 which is too much. I put the
> 180k back in.

Bug of the schematic, fixed. 150k added and 82k removed for tuning.

> 
> How much of a problem is this? I tested the link on the floor and there
> is no packetloss for distances < 2.5m  (hpwt-bd00-f4000); Should I care?

This is not a problem. Use 150k for tuning of P102 now.

Thanks for report.

CL<

> 
> P104 will probably need a little tuning to, it's around 4.5V, but I
> guess this would not fix the wrong P101 and P102, so I did not want to
> do any mods before I know what's going on.
> 
> 
> Thanks for any advice,
> 
> 
> Jirka
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep  3 12:23:58 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 13:23:58 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Rozdil mezi BF908 a BF988
In-Reply-To: <1123358638.42f517ae22560@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <42F5124C.7060103@seznam.cz> <42F514E4.9000508@hkfree.org>
	<42F515D2.1010306@seznam.cz>
	<1123358638.42f517ae22560@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050903112358.GA10441@kestrel>

On Sat, Aug 06, 2005 at 10:03:58PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Jo cip diody musi byt bezpodminecne "vevnitr" v krabicce. Jinak to chyta ruseni.
> Taky kondik 1N mezi G2 MOSFETu a zemi nesmi byt takovy ten zluty/oranzovy
> epoxidovy, ale musi se tam dat obyc. hnedy. Jinak jsou s tim problemy.

Added into the guide that the chip must be inside.

CL<


From srnkap at extranetplus.cz  Sat Sep  3 21:14:06 2005
From: srnkap at extranetplus.cz (Pavel Srnka)
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 22:14:06 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz><1125687929.4318a279914a7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<431AD460.8030606@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <000801c5b0c4$09a11f40$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>

co se tyce zapojeni s utp, tak je to docela perfektni, z moji zkusenosti 
nedochazi k ruseni tv (ronja cca 1m od tv anten), nicmene nevim na jakym to 
chytam kmitoctu, takze se muze jednat jenom o stesti :)
jinak posilam slibenou fotodokumentci ( crusader dole ronja (asi prvni sveho 
druhu v techto koncinach)  nahore), na 340m  4,02 a 4,16V, takze to snad 
pojede i za mlhy.
Jenom mam takovy dotaz, uz kdyz jsem je mel na stole a pingal jsem mezi 
sebou, bylo videt ze jedna strana lakoby pohasinala a znovu se rozsvecela, 
na prenosy to nema vliv (v obou smerech 1150kB) ale pri uploadu jsou pri 
plne rychlosti pingy 5-7ms (coz by slo) , pri downloadu nad cca 900kB to ale 
skoci reba i lehce pres 50ms, netusi nekdo cim by to mohlo byt ??

http://ronja.pavel.extranetplus.cz


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "SuperMaster" <supermaster at seznam.cz>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 1:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX


Super! Konecne jsem se nekde docetl, jak pouzit to UTP misto koaxu, diky
za link. Mechanicky to chci udelat tak, ze to bude ctyrboky jehlan
svareny z poradnych vinglu, ve vrcholu budou kolejnie pro RX modul. Cele
to bude derzet minimalne o 100% zvetseny puvodni clockuv drzak,
pravdepodobne jeste lehce modifikovany pro vetsi tuhost. Cele to bude
vazit klidne 20kg. Ted mi jeste poradte: premyslim nad 310x310 s 330mm,
coz dava dopadovy uhel priblizne 25 stupnu, nebo ta 320x400 s 550, ktera
dava uhel delsi strany 20 stupnu. Delsi ohnisko je lepsi pro vetsi
citlivost fotodiody, ale zaroven bude nachylnejsi na presnost zamereni i
pripadne krouceni budovy/drzaku. Cena je 15 resp. 28 dolaru, takze to
neni primarni problem. Dalsi moznost je ze koupim tu 310x310 a oriznu ji
na prumer 210 a dam ji do te nejvesi odpadove roury, kterou uz mam
koupenou. Myslite ze tech 310x310 resp 320x400 je overkill na 1.6km?
mame tu dost casto mlhy, je to nad hostivari, takze bych to chtel mit co
mozna nejlepsi.

Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):

>To by te mohlo zajimat tohle http://laser.webpark.cz/work.html , ozivil 
>jsem
>Clockovu Interpolis s vyuzitim stavajicich dilu s 13cm sikmovokejma 
>cockama.
>Zatim si to brousi zuby na cca 3km.
>Prvni testy na 2,5km dopadly nadejne.
>
>
>
>>Bude to na 1.6km, ale chtel bych aby to jelo co nejlepe i v mlze,
>>snezeni a tak. Pri silne mlze nemam sanci, ale pri slabe doufam ze jo. A
>>prepsal jsem se, maj rozmer 320x400 s 550, nebo 310x310 s 330mm
>>ohniskem, jeste uvidim, pro co se rozhodnu.
>>
>>Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
>>
>>
>>
>>>Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
>>>13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu
>>>>podruhe.
>>>>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci
>>>>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v
>>>>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout
>>>>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi
>>>>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila
>>>>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy
>>>>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec
>>>>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko
>>>>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>>>>
>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
>>>>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm ,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>nicmene
>>
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>>>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc 
>>>>>>dobre
>>>>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
>>>>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
>>>>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale 
>>>>>>>prekvapilo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>nas
>>>>>>>tohle :(((
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>miste
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>ohnisko
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 
>>>>>>>>>4kusy
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>a
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>dik
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>jestli
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>je
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>tubuse
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>>>>>nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>do
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
>>>>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala
>>>>>>>>>>50kc,
>>>>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny
>>>>>>>>>>pumer
>>>>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>TX.
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>kdezto
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca 
>>>>>>>>>>polovina
>>>>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>prstenci
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>o
>>>>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>jen
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a 
>>>>>>>>>>podstatne
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>tak
>>>>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
>>>>>>>>>>106mm.
>>>>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby 
>>>>>>>>>>byly
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>obe
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) 
>>>>>>>>>>a
>>>>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
>


_______________________________________________
Ronja mailing list
Ronja at lists.pointless.net
http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 



From zajio1am at artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz  Sat Sep  3 21:53:26 2005
From: zajio1am at artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Ondrej Zajicek)
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 22:53:26 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <000801c5b0c4$09a11f40$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>
	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>
	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<431AD460.8030606@seznam.cz>
	<000801c5b0c4$09a11f40$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050903205326.GC9430@feanor>

On Sat, Sep 03, 2005 at 10:14:06PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> Jenom mam takovy dotaz, uz kdyz jsem je mel na stole a pingal jsem mezi 
> sebou, bylo videt ze jedna strana lakoby pohasinala a znovu se rozsvecela, 
> na prenosy to nema vliv (v obou smerech 1150kB) ale pri uploadu jsou pri 
> plne rychlosti pingy 5-7ms (coz by slo) , pri downloadu nad cca 900kB to ale 
> skoci reba i lehce pres 50ms, netusi nekdo cim by to mohlo byt ??

No hypoteticky muzes mit na full-duplex Ronje zapojene do Linuxu
az sekundovou latenci, nebot defaultni delka fronty je 1000 paketu
(ifconfig txqueuelen).
> 
-- 
Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo

Ondrej 'SanTiago' Zajicek (email: santiago at mail.cz, jabber: santiago at njs.netlab.cz)
OpenPGP encrypted e-mails preferred (KeyID 0x11DEADC3, wwwkeys.pgp.net)
"To err is human -- to blame it on a computer is even more so."
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From m.malusek at seznam.cz  Sat Sep  3 22:19:56 2005
From: m.malusek at seznam.cz (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Michal_Mal=F9=B9ek?=)
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 23:19:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz><1125687929.4318a279914a7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz><431AD460.8030606@seznam.cz>
	<000801c5b0c4$09a11f40$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <001501c5b0cd$3d7af620$0103450a@thechosen>

za mlhy (poradne) ti to stejne nepojede. mame spoj asi 300m a 4V na kazde
strane a nic.

Glo

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Pavel Srnka" <srnkap at extranetplus.cz>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 10:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX


co se tyce zapojeni s utp, tak je to docela perfektni, z moji zkusenosti
nedochazi k ruseni tv (ronja cca 1m od tv anten), nicmene nevim na jakym to
chytam kmitoctu, takze se muze jednat jenom o stesti :)
jinak posilam slibenou fotodokumentci ( crusader dole ronja (asi prvni sveho
druhu v techto koncinach)  nahore), na 340m  4,02 a 4,16V, takze to snad
pojede i za mlhy.
Jenom mam takovy dotaz, uz kdyz jsem je mel na stole a pingal jsem mezi
sebou, bylo videt ze jedna strana lakoby pohasinala a znovu se rozsvecela,
na prenosy to nema vliv (v obou smerech 1150kB) ale pri uploadu jsou pri
plne rychlosti pingy 5-7ms (coz by slo) , pri downloadu nad cca 900kB to ale
skoci reba i lehce pres 50ms, netusi nekdo cim by to mohlo byt ??

http://ronja.pavel.extranetplus.cz


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "SuperMaster" <supermaster at seznam.cz>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 1:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX


Super! Konecne jsem se nekde docetl, jak pouzit to UTP misto koaxu, diky
za link. Mechanicky to chci udelat tak, ze to bude ctyrboky jehlan
svareny z poradnych vinglu, ve vrcholu budou kolejnie pro RX modul. Cele
to bude derzet minimalne o 100% zvetseny puvodni clockuv drzak,
pravdepodobne jeste lehce modifikovany pro vetsi tuhost. Cele to bude
vazit klidne 20kg. Ted mi jeste poradte: premyslim nad 310x310 s 330mm,
coz dava dopadovy uhel priblizne 25 stupnu, nebo ta 320x400 s 550, ktera
dava uhel delsi strany 20 stupnu. Delsi ohnisko je lepsi pro vetsi
citlivost fotodiody, ale zaroven bude nachylnejsi na presnost zamereni i
pripadne krouceni budovy/drzaku. Cena je 15 resp. 28 dolaru, takze to
neni primarni problem. Dalsi moznost je ze koupim tu 310x310 a oriznu ji
na prumer 210 a dam ji do te nejvesi odpadove roury, kterou uz mam
koupenou. Myslite ze tech 310x310 resp 320x400 je overkill na 1.6km?
mame tu dost casto mlhy, je to nad hostivari, takze bych to chtel mit co
mozna nejlepsi.

Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):

>To by te mohlo zajimat tohle http://laser.webpark.cz/work.html , ozivil
>jsem
>Clockovu Interpolis s vyuzitim stavajicich dilu s 13cm sikmovokejma
>cockama.
>Zatim si to brousi zuby na cca 3km.
>Prvni testy na 2,5km dopadly nadejne.
>
>
>
>>Bude to na 1.6km, ale chtel bych aby to jelo co nejlepe i v mlze,
>>snezeni a tak. Pri silne mlze nemam sanci, ale pri slabe doufam ze jo. A
>>prepsal jsem se, maj rozmer 320x400 s 550, nebo 310x310 s 330mm
>>ohniskem, jeste uvidim, pro co se rozhodnu.
>>
>>Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
>>
>>
>>
>>>Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
>>>13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu
>>>>podruhe.
>>>>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci
>>>>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v
>>>>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout
>>>>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi
>>>>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila
>>>>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy
>>>>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec
>>>>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko
>>>>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>>>>
>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
>>>>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm ,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>nicmene
>>
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>>>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc
>>>>>>dobre
>>>>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
>>>>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
>>>>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale
>>>>>>>prekvapilo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>nas
>>>>>>>tohle :(((
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>miste
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>ohnisko
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene
>>>>>>>>>4kusy
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>a
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>dik
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>jestli
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>je
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>tubuse
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>>>>>nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>do
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
>>>>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala
>>>>>>>>>>50kc,
>>>>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny
>>>>>>>>>>pumer
>>>>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>TX.
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>kdezto
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca
>>>>>>>>>>polovina
>>>>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>prstenci
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>o
>>>>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>jen
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a
>>>>>>>>>>podstatne
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>tak
>>>>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
>>>>>>>>>>106mm.
>>>>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby
>>>>>>>>>>byly
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>obe
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod)
>>>>>>>>>>a
>>>>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
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>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
>


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http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


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http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From srnkap at extranetplus.cz  Sat Sep  3 22:43:45 2005
From: srnkap at extranetplus.cz (Pavel Srnka)
Date: Sat, 3 Sep 2005 23:43:45 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz><001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org><001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz><1125687929.4318a279914a7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz><431AD460.8030606@seznam.cz><000801c5b0c4$09a11f40$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<001501c5b0cd$3d7af620$0103450a@thechosen>
Message-ID: <001701c5b0d0$8f7bd270$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>

jj tu extremni co tu je 2x do roka neprosviti nic :(( ale to se da prezit :) 
hlavne se mi libi ze se to da pouzivat na twistu, rj45 zasuvky a nerusi to 
tv :) a to padani se mi ale zda ze  muze vyresit funkce spaning tree 
nekterejch switchu a dobrej navrh topologie :)))



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Michal Mal??ek" <m.malusek at seznam.cz>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 11:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX


za mlhy (poradne) ti to stejne nepojede. mame spoj asi 300m a 4V na kazde
strane a nic.

Glo

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Pavel Srnka" <srnkap at extranetplus.cz>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Saturday, September 03, 2005 10:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX


co se tyce zapojeni s utp, tak je to docela perfektni, z moji zkusenosti
nedochazi k ruseni tv (ronja cca 1m od tv anten), nicmene nevim na jakym to
chytam kmitoctu, takze se muze jednat jenom o stesti :)
jinak posilam slibenou fotodokumentci ( crusader dole ronja (asi prvni sveho
druhu v techto koncinach)  nahore), na 340m  4,02 a 4,16V, takze to snad
pojede i za mlhy.
Jenom mam takovy dotaz, uz kdyz jsem je mel na stole a pingal jsem mezi
sebou, bylo videt ze jedna strana lakoby pohasinala a znovu se rozsvecela,
na prenosy to nema vliv (v obou smerech 1150kB) ale pri uploadu jsou pri
plne rychlosti pingy 5-7ms (coz by slo) , pri downloadu nad cca 900kB to ale
skoci reba i lehce pres 50ms, netusi nekdo cim by to mohlo byt ??

http://ronja.pavel.extranetplus.cz


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "SuperMaster" <supermaster at seznam.cz>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 1:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX


Super! Konecne jsem se nekde docetl, jak pouzit to UTP misto koaxu, diky
za link. Mechanicky to chci udelat tak, ze to bude ctyrboky jehlan
svareny z poradnych vinglu, ve vrcholu budou kolejnie pro RX modul. Cele
to bude derzet minimalne o 100% zvetseny puvodni clockuv drzak,
pravdepodobne jeste lehce modifikovany pro vetsi tuhost. Cele to bude
vazit klidne 20kg. Ted mi jeste poradte: premyslim nad 310x310 s 330mm,
coz dava dopadovy uhel priblizne 25 stupnu, nebo ta 320x400 s 550, ktera
dava uhel delsi strany 20 stupnu. Delsi ohnisko je lepsi pro vetsi
citlivost fotodiody, ale zaroven bude nachylnejsi na presnost zamereni i
pripadne krouceni budovy/drzaku. Cena je 15 resp. 28 dolaru, takze to
neni primarni problem. Dalsi moznost je ze koupim tu 310x310 a oriznu ji
na prumer 210 a dam ji do te nejvesi odpadove roury, kterou uz mam
koupenou. Myslite ze tech 310x310 resp 320x400 je overkill na 1.6km?
mame tu dost casto mlhy, je to nad hostivari, takze bych to chtel mit co
mozna nejlepsi.

Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):

>To by te mohlo zajimat tohle http://laser.webpark.cz/work.html , ozivil
>jsem
>Clockovu Interpolis s vyuzitim stavajicich dilu s 13cm sikmovokejma
>cockama.
>Zatim si to brousi zuby na cca 3km.
>Prvni testy na 2,5km dopadly nadejne.
>
>
>
>>Bude to na 1.6km, ale chtel bych aby to jelo co nejlepe i v mlze,
>>snezeni a tak. Pri silne mlze nemam sanci, ale pri slabe doufam ze jo. A
>>prepsal jsem se, maj rozmer 320x400 s 550, nebo 310x310 s 330mm
>>ohniskem, jeste uvidim, pro co se rozhodnu.
>>
>>Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
>>
>>
>>
>>>Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
>>>13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu
>>>>podruhe.
>>>>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci
>>>>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v
>>>>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout
>>>>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi
>>>>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila
>>>>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy
>>>>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec
>>>>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko
>>>>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
>>>>
>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
>>>>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm ,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>nicmene
>>
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
>>>>>
>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
>>>>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc
>>>>>>dobre
>>>>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
>>>>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
>>>>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale
>>>>>>>prekvapilo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>nas
>>>>>>>tohle :(((
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
>>>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
>>>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>miste
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>a
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>ohnisko
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene
>>>>>>>>>4kusy
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>a
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>dik
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>jestli
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>je
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
>>>>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
>>>>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
>>>>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>tubuse
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>>>>>>>>>nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>do
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
>>>>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
>>>>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>>>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
>>>>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala
>>>>>>>>>>50kc,
>>>>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny
>>>>>>>>>>pumer
>>>>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>TX.
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>kdezto
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
>>>>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca
>>>>>>>>>>polovina
>>>>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>prstenci
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>o
>>>>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>jen
>>
>>
>>>>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a
>>>>>>>>>>podstatne
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>tak
>>>>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
>>>>>>>>>>106mm.
>>>>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby
>>>>>>>>>>byly
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>obe
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
>>>>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod)
>>>>>>>>>>a
>>>>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
>>>>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
>


_______________________________________________
Ronja mailing list
Ronja at lists.pointless.net
http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


_______________________________________________
Ronja mailing list
Ronja at lists.pointless.net
http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


_______________________________________________
Ronja mailing list
Ronja at lists.pointless.net
http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 



From ladmanj at volny.cz  Sun Sep  4 07:49:31 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 08:49:31 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER - CPLD Twister status
Message-ID: <200509040849.32128.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Czech: (English question on the end)
Tak jsem asi zjistil pro? mi zat?m nov? exempl??e spidera nefungujou jak by 
m?ly.
V prototypu je pou?it RJ45 konektor s integrovan?m transform?torem kter? jsem 
koupil nov? a m?l jsem k n?mu datasheet. Ale proto?e jeho z?sk?n? bylo 
problematick? a dnes ji? jej ani tehdej?? dodavatel neprod?v?, pou?il jsem do 
nov? verze trafa vyp??en? z 3com s??ovek. Jedn? se o typy FL1173 a FL1066. K 
t?m jsem ov?em ??dn? datasheet nena?el a tak jsem vlastn? jejich pou?it? 
risknul a ejhle na v?stupu trafa sm?rem do p?ij?ma?e je amplituda sign?lu 
t?etinov? oproti trafu na prototypu. Z n?kter?ch s??ovek a switch? jde 
sign?ltak siln?, ?e t?m projde, ale z v?t?iny za??zen? ne, tak?e se trafa 
mus? p?einterfacovat, zjistit, zda nemaj? vy??? v?stupn? impedanci a zm?nit 
p?izp?soben?, nebo koupit n?jak? jin?.

Pokud by n?kdo zv?s m?l k dispozici technickou specifikaci t?ch FL1066 a 
FL1073 byl bych za poskytnut? neskonale vd??n?.
Jakub Ladman

If anybody have technical specificaton of VALOR FL1066 and/or VALOR FL1173 
twisted pair transformers/filters, please send me it.
Thank you
Jakub Ladman


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 09:26:48 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 10:26:48 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?Q?Nep=E1jiteln=E9?=
	=?iso-8859-2?Q?_krabi=E8ky?=
In-Reply-To: <200508142004.j7EK4Tn03453@twin.jikos.cz>
References: <001001c5a0c3$33fd91d0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<200508142004.j7EK4Tn03453@twin.jikos.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904082648.GA16890@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Aug 14, 2005 at 10:04:20PM +0200, Luk?? Burian wrote:
> [cz] Mam takov? men?? dotaz. Kamar?d mi vyrobil kr?sn? krabi?ky, bohu?el ale
> z m?d?n?ho plechu asi 0,4 co? se d? p?jet leda nad plynov?m ho??kem.
> Zp?sobilo by n?jak? probl?m do Rx aTx vlo?it na dno t?eba desti?ku
> kuprextitu s vrstvou m?di a p?jet to na n?? ?ekn?me ?e bych ji po obvodu
> vp?jel do krabi?ky...

No that's not a problem. Just take the gas burner and solder it along
the edges before. Take care to have the cuprextit fit well otherwise the
solder won't bridge too big gap.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 09:28:30 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 10:28:30 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <42FFE309.9040307@wifistar.net>
References: <200507211821.8528@centrum.cz>
	<20050814211623.GA8282@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<42FFE309.9040307@wifistar.net>
Message-ID: <20050904082830.GB16890@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 12:34:17AM +0000, David Sedl??ek wrote:
> 
> 
> Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> > On Thu, Jul 21, 2005 at 06:21:18PM +0200, rasken at centrum.cz wrote:
> > 
> >>to Cipis:
> >>- ty si s tim nedas pokoj ze ;-) mas stesti ze se zname a beru to jen jako malinky popichnuti....
> >>doufam ze na tech obrazcich "uz" nic nenajdes :-p
> >>
> >>to Phill:
> >>- a tak kdyz se vam to tak libi tak vam tam dam i to Tx-ko ...
> >>
> >>http://sweb.cz/RPelka/fotky/Rx_ronja.jpg
> >>http://sweb.cz/RPelka/fotky/Tx_ronja.jpg
> >>http://sweb.cz/RPelka/fotky/Twistr_ronja.jpg
> > 
> > 
> > Hmm ta civka se nastorc do RX prihradky nevejde.
> > 
> > Mohl bys to pls prekreslit aby to bylo na ty draty a ne na F konektory a
> > WAGO svorkovnice a BNC? V Ronje nic takovyho neni a lidi by to akorat
> 
> Detail - nejsou WAGO, ale obyc na sroubovak ;-). Nekde jsem videl foto,
> ale uz si nevzpomenu.

Crap anyway. You can't make the preload pressure as big as you want as
with the screw terminals.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 09:52:41 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 10:52:41 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Rozdil mezi BF908 a BF988
In-Reply-To: <1123399031.42f5b5775591f@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <42F5124C.7060103@seznam.cz> <42F514E4.9000508@hkfree.org>
	<42F515D2.1010306@seznam.cz>
	<1123358638.42f517ae22560@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<opsu318gh7n6qjls@daman>
	<1123399031.42f5b5775591f@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904085241.GA29460@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 09:17:11AM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> > 
> > > Taky kondik 1N mezi G2 MOSFETu a zemi nesmi byt takovy ten zluty/oranzovy
> > > epoxidovy, ale musi se tam dat obyc. hnedy. Jinak jsou s tim problemy.
> 
> > Tak o tom nevim. Mohl bys blize specifikovat jak ten kondik vypada? Zatim  
> > co jsem videl tak oranzovy a zluty jsou vsechny a pak jeste modry.
> > 
> 
> http://spar.hkfree.org/ronja/P1110071.html  - ty s napisem 222 ty jsou OK.

I took some pictures into the gallery, don't you mind?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 09:54:42 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 10:54:42 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Rozdil mezi BF908 a BF988
In-Reply-To: <1123407017.42f5d4a94e5b5@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <42F5124C.7060103@seznam.cz> <003d01c59b24$62f6da40$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<42F5D01E.8050504@hkfree.org>
	<1123407017.42f5d4a94e5b5@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904085442.GB29460@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Aug 07, 2005 at 11:30:17AM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Tenhle odpor R106 je potreba poladit vzdy, aby na P104 bylo napeti 6+-0,5V. Tech
> 5V je uz malo.
> Divim se ze to clock nema explicitne uvedeno v navodu. 

http://ronja.twibright.com/tetrapolis/testing.php
"Adjusting R106 Adjust R106 value by possibly soldering it out and
replacing with one resistor of R125...R137 until the voltage on P104 is
in specified range.  If any other value except P104 is out of range, it
is suspicious and consult it on the mailing list." `

> Nejlepsi je misto nej pro zacatek zapojit trimr 2k2 seriove k nemu
> odpor 220 Ohm a postelovat si tech 6V. Pak to zmerit ohmmetrem a dat
> tam vhodny pevny odpor.
> 
> Jinak BF988/998 jsou asi nejlepsi tranzistory do Ronji co se daji
> bezne sehnat.

BF908 should be theoretically probably even better but does anyone
have it? I can't get it nowhere. It's mfg by Philips.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 10:17:07 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 11:17:07 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Focal distance / ohniskova vzdalenost
In-Reply-To: <001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <5670.7387-23227-279447819-1122217879@seznam.cz>
	<001901c59c3d$1dae7dc0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050904091707.GA29754@kestrel.twibright.com>


> 4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja tubuse 
> tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
>    nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim do 
> vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?

There was a picture how to do it here:
http://ronja.twibright.com/faq.php
But it was obviously not enough explanatory for
everyone so I added explanation.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 11:00:21 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 12:00:21 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] RSSI indikator
In-Reply-To: <1123592617.42f8a9a9e6733@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <537.1353-2643-1864264518-1123586535@seznam.cz>
	<1123592617.42f8a9a9e6733@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904100021.GA30019@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Tue, Aug 09, 2005 at 03:03:37PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Cituji z emailu od Pavel Krejci <krepa at seznam.cz>:
> 
> > 
> > Mozna by slo udelat universalni desku a tu pak pichnout do ty desky
> > zajistujici napajeni jako do metherboardu.
> > 
> > Zkuste nadefinovat, co by ten univerzalni merak mel delat a ja s tim mozna
> > zase pohnu.
> 

I would ask for 10-bit ADC with input analogue compressor which would
eliminate the response of the RSSI circuit with the two Schottky diodes.
The response can be determined by measurement or simulation and will be
similar for all diodes.

So 0...255 would increase as decibels of input optical (not electrical!)
signal would increase.

Let the interface between PC and measurement device has these properties:
1) Runs over single coaxial cable with virtually unlimited length
2) Doesn't radiate and is immune to radiation
3) Supports at least 1000 measurements per second
4) Allows the inner conductor of the coax to be used for 5-48V carriage
5) 

Let the measurement device has mean time between SW crashes even under
external EM spikes generated by ordinary means (except lightning) 10^3
years.

If the measurement device is put into nonoperable state by lightning
strike (register or memory flip) then let it either resume valid state
max. after 10s or can be remotely completely reset by the PC. Watchdog
is not a solution to this (a software state which still refreshes the
watchdog yet doesn't perform function correctly can easily be
constructed).

Let the device has remote firmware upload capability from the PC which
works regardless of how fucked up the current firmware and software
state is.

Let the device doesn't generate any RF interference and is immune
against it and is of such size that can be inserted into the RX head
and connected on the RSSI internally, with the communications coaxial
cable going instead of RSSI outside the optical head.

Let the shield of the communications coaxial cable is directly connected
to the console of the optical installation (protection against fire of
home PC in case of lightning strike into the coaxial cable) with a
connection of max. 0.5ohm resistance and capability to withstand 100kA
for 3us without interruption of the connection.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 11:03:40 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 12:03:40 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?Q?nefun=E8n?=
	=?iso-8859-2?Q?=ED?= twister, ale jako ze divne
In-Reply-To: <1436.2380-5545-1152328976-1123700832@seznam.cz>
References: <1436.2380-5545-1152328976-1123700832@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904100340.GB30019@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 09:07:12PM +0200, Petr Salek wrote:
> postavil jsem nekolik twisteru a jeden divne nefunguje, 
> kdyz ho pichnu do sitovky, tak zacne ledka indikujici aktivitu
> na sitovce zurive blikat, coz jsem bral jako prvni znameni 
> ze neco neni vporadku. Kdyz jsem ho zkousel testovat, tak 
> data pres nej prolezla,ale jenom jednim smerem, pouze prijimal
> pakety, vysilal neco zmrsenyho, ledky sice blikaly i na druhym twisteru-prijem, ale
> do druhyho pc nedorazilo nic, zkouseno tcpdumpem.
> 
> vsechny soucastky jsou prekontrolovany, krome kondiku, na ty
> merak nemam, staveno na jednu serii plosnaku a soucastky kupovany
> najednou z GM, presne podle seznamu z webu. 
> 
> voltmetrem jsem trosku omakal vsechny soucastky a oproti funkcnimu twisteru
> je rozdil na 74HC32N, na kondiku C101 co z nej vede by melo byt cca +5, neni
> a pak jsou taky rozdily 74HC93E, tusim ze je to citac, na jedny noze mi neustale napeti kolisalo,
> predpokladam ze cital, ale bylo to na jiny nez u funkcniho twistera plus nejaky dalsi odchylky, podobne
> i na AM26LS32, zbytek asi stejnej, ale uz si to nepamatuju presne. 

AM26LS32 is wrong. AM26LS32A is right. It's written clearly in the
material equivalents list.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 11:06:20 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 12:06:20 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?Q?nefun=E8n?=
	=?iso-8859-2?Q?=ED?= twister, ale jako ze divne
In-Reply-To: <1436.2380-5545-1152328976-1123700832@seznam.cz>
References: <1436.2380-5545-1152328976-1123700832@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904100620.GC30019@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 09:07:12PM +0200, Petr Salek wrote:
> postavil jsem nekolik twisteru a jeden divne nefunguje, 
> kdyz ho pichnu do sitovky, tak zacne ledka indikujici aktivitu
> na sitovce zurive blikat, coz jsem bral jako prvni znameni 
> ze neco neni vporadku. Kdyz jsem ho zkousel testovat, tak 
> data pres nej prolezla,ale jenom jednim smerem, pouze prijimal
> pakety, vysilal neco zmrsenyho, ledky sice blikaly i na druhym twisteru-prijem, ale
> do druhyho pc nedorazilo nic, zkouseno tcpdumpem.
> 
> vsechny soucastky jsou prekontrolovany, krome kondiku, na ty
> merak nemam, staveno na jednu serii plosnaku a soucastky kupovany
> najednou z GM, presne podle seznamu z webu. 
> 
> voltmetrem jsem trosku omakal vsechny soucastky a oproti funkcnimu twisteru
> je rozdil na 74HC32N, na kondiku C101 co z nej vede by melo byt cca +5, neni
> a pak jsou taky rozdily 74HC93E, tusim ze je to citac, na jedny noze mi neustale napeti kolisalo,
> predpokladam ze cital, ale bylo to na jiny nez u funkcniho twistera plus nejaky dalsi odchylky, podobne
> i na AM26LS32, zbytek asi stejnej, ale uz si to nepamatuju presne. 

I have put an explicit note into Twister Material that AM26LS32 is
wrong.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 11:07:53 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 12:07:53 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <000a01c59dea$76332aa0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <000a01c59dea$76332aa0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050904100753.GD30019@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Wed, Aug 10, 2005 at 10:31:17PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> V arichivu jsem se docetl o problemech s rusenim tv pripadne i dalsich
> spoju ronji navzajem od coax kabelu ktere vedou z hlavic.  Chtel bych
> se zeptat, jestli by treba bylo mozne reseni pouzit nejaky SFTP kablik
> a kazdy z kroucenych paru pouzit jako nahradu za vodic koaxu + shield
> uzemnit zvlast treba k racku.  A jestli by toto mohlo fungovat cca do
> 20m svodu ? Predem dik za infos..

No this won't work. Apply the patch that is already published.
http://ronja.twibright.com/bugfixes/twister_rad.php

CL<



From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 17:02:37 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 18:02:37 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?Q?nefun=E8n?=
	=?iso-8859-2?Q?=ED?= twister, ale jako ze divne
In-Reply-To: <1412.2354-12778-1310942246-1123751737@seznam.cz>
References: <1123750638.42fb12ef0276e@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<1412.2354-12778-1310942246-1123751737@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904160237.GB9336@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 11:15:37AM +0200, Petr Salek wrote:
> Chyba pravdepodobne odhalena, jeste to musim dukladne otestovat.
> Oscilator byl ok, meril jsem ho osciloskopem, nejakou neplechu a asi
> velkou delal utp kablik, prestoze jsem ho zmeril ohmetrem jako OK, tak
> kdyz jsem ho dneska rano vymenil za pulku patchkabelu, tak  zacaly
> pakety zazracne prochazet. Z toho plyne, ze uz nikdy nikdy vice nebudu
> kabliky na twistera vyrabet.

I bought here an an expensive wall RJ45 Cat5e socket, expensive STP
cable and expensive tool to crimp the cable into socket, and it was
working, just DHCP wasn't going through. After I rammed the wires with
the most brute force (the highest just to be sure the PCB in the socket
doesn't crack) it started to work.

Crimped contacts seem to not have a reason to be reliable. It's neither
gold-to-gold nor a plastically deformed metal where the preload force
cannot drop under the plastic deformation. If 230V wirings were done
this way, all houses would be permanently in flames ;-)

Is it possible to get solderable RJ45 sockets? (Really solderable, not
like one BNC which was sold to me by Pusterla as solderable and was
obviously designed for screw mounting, and melted down when soldered).

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 17:06:04 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 18:06:04 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?Q?nefun?=
	=?iso-8859-2?B?6G7t?= twister, ale jako ze divne
In-Reply-To: <1123757223.42fb2ca7eef88@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <1412.2354-12778-1310942246-1123751737@seznam.cz>
	<1123757223.42fb2ca7eef88@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904160604.GC9336@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 12:47:03PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Jo patchkabely rulez. To uz se me stalo trikrat (z cca 30kabelu) taky. Konektor
> nakrimpovan, vizualne zkontrolovan OK, ohmetrem premeren OK. Zasunu do karty
> nejde. Ohmmetrem premeren v karte - nema kontakt. Vizualne zkontrolovan OK.

We got the same problem when crimping 100m cable segment in Prague for
community network and also with crimped BNC network. My father who
worked professionally in this field in Czech Academy of Science also
says that he never uses crimped connectors because they are unreliable.
Soldered instead.

I also got the problem with self-cutting IDE crimped cables (factory
made). After some time they "wear out" and start to be unreliable
between the cable and the connector.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 17:18:00 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 18:18:00 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz>
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904161800.GD9336@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 02:31:18PM +0200, -=RYS=- wrote:
> Dle spektraku?a jinejch merakach?ano.
> Nejvetsi spektrum kmitoctu jsem mel (otevrene krabicky na stole) okolo 4 a 12MHz.
> A pak sli harmoniky az do 460MHz.

Did you try with closed boxes? What were the results?

> Zvlaste plusovej "stineni" od RX, krasna vysilaci antena.
> TX mi delal bordel okolo 1 az 1.6MHz (nikoliv harmonika), ale RX to je doslova
> generator bileho sumu.
> Takze pochopitelne, kdyz mas takto Ronju na strese vedle TV/R anten, tak jedna z harmonik (u me) se
> dostava do oblasti 200MHz, kde u nas vysila TV NOVA (Klinovec 7k) a TV divaci ziskavaj pekne horizontalni pruhy.
> Je to asi mesic a pul, kdy jsem byl na Berounce u Hashiho a na stole mi poustel loop Twister - TX - RX.
> Ja vytahl spektroskop do 2.5GHz a to bylo "bordelu".
> Mel to jen na "dratkach", ale nektere harmoniky bylo slyset za S9 na vzdalenost 10m.

What does "just on little wires" mean? Did he use cables according to the guide?

> A ted si predstav, ze to je na strese, delsi "spravne" koaxi dolu k Twisteru a mas nadhernej vysilac.
> Pri testu s 2m koaxem RX>Twister venku, jsem signaly (harmoniny) mel za S9 jeste ve vzdalenosti 30m.
> Takze uz z principu Ronja porusuje GP-18/1997 (tabulka 2). Takze az by prijeli z CTU, tak pokuta je 50 koliku.
> Snazil jsem se ten problem vyresit napriklad tim, ze celej koax natocim (15 zavitu na trnu 6cm) do civky.
> Ale nepomohlo to, ani pokusy dat toroidni material a natocit na nem plus uvnitr roury.
> Je tu moznost, prave ji davam dohromady.
> Vyrabim Ronju ( http://www.qsl.net/ok0bez/files/rys/TPinterface_Ronja/Ronja?) a pritom zaroven
> delam jiste upravy v puvodni konstrukci.

What changes are you doing?

> Ted mam jiz hotove TX moduly, jak vidis na fotce mam tam CINCH koliky
> , je to pro moznou rychlou upravu/opravu.

> Na zadku roury mam vodotesnej konektor - 4kolik, ktery je celej stinenej.
> Takze signal i napajeni prichazeji ve dvou koaxialech, cili to nezari ven.
> Uvnitr jsem udelal taky "revoulci".
> Clock tam dal vzdusnou civku a za ni 7805 a mezi tim si vytahl napeti pro dalsi uzitit.
> Jenze je tu problem:
> - nikdy nevis jake napeti jde dovnitr
> - nikdy nevis jak vyhlazene napeti jde dovnitr
> - nikdy ti to neodrusi VF injektovane ruseni

Why it doesn't block VF injected interference? Do you mean VF injected
interference which is injected outside the shielded box? In this case
the energy should reflect on input 1nF/100nF blocking capacitors, and
be blocked by the coil and the capacitors behind the coil, right? Why
shouldn't this work?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 17:22:56 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 18:22:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <005c01c59e94$153ced30$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz>
	<005c01c59e94$153ced30$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050904162256.GE9336@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 06:45:29PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> No to jsem si presne myslel, dalsi problem , co jsem slysel je , ze
> pri nejakym atmosferickym vyboji +12V coaxova antena nachyta prepeti a
> odkouri celou elektroniku ronjitka.

I got atmospheric discharge called "lightning strike" and the only
damage was that BF988 got partially broken through and started to noise.
After replacing it, the RX continued to work. TX and Twister wasn't
affected.

That was considered a bug of the filtering of the DC cable between RX
and TX and temporary patch was added into the guide. The patch
is that shielded coaxial cable is used instead of unshielded.


> Myslis ze by pohla uprava v kabelazi a) pouzit SFTP kabel a kazdym z paru v nem nahradit vodice coaxu a stineni kabelu uzemnit zvlast treba na PEN vodic  nebo
>                                                       b) pouzit tri nebo ?ty?i coaxialy s dvojitym stinenim ? 
> 
> Co nevidet to budu instalovat na strechu spoj a jestli se osvedci tak jich pak bude v provozu hafo takze bych chtel predejit problemum.
> 
> P.S. 
> 
> Jak by byl nakladny vyvoj aby ronja vyhovovala z hlediska EMC ?? A jeste by me zajimalo, jestli jste nekdo videli konstrukci komercniho crusadera a jestli nekdo vi,

I always tried to make it as much EMC quiet and tolerant as I was able.
If it isn't, just report bugs. This is something Ronja already should be
and if it isn't, it's a bug.

Recently I (almost perfectly) fixed the 30mVpp radiation of Twister.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 17:35:47 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 18:35:47 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <006401c59ea1$0d304e40$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz>
	<006401c59ea1$0d304e40$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050904163547.GG9336@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:14:07PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> Popisovanou situaci prave ted taky promyslim - o vikendu se chystam na
> instalaci spoje s 90mm hlavicemi, ktere budou na strese pobliz tel. anten. Z
> pripadneho ruseni mam obavu.
> 
> Navrhnul jsem to jednoduse: stineni obou koaxu pripojit na gnd a uzemnit,
> napajeni +12 pak privedu po samostatne dvojlince. Co si o tom myslite?
> a) Predstavuje takto stineny koax problem, co se tyka ruseni?

No.

> b) Muze vyzarovat napajeci vodic +12 z twisteru? (Jde o to, jestli primo z
> twisteru nejdou harmoniky po +12 napajeni.)

Before patch it radiated, now it practically shouldn't.

But by splitting the 12V apart you don't get anything, the
filters remain the same.

> c) Musim opt. hlavy napajet z vystupu na twisteru nebo muzu pouzit jiny
> stab. zdroj?

You can use a different power supply.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 17:36:28 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 18:36:28 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Problem s Twistery
In-Reply-To: <006501c59ea1$0df3c550$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <200508110018.17065@centrum.cz>
	<006501c59ea1$0df3c550$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050904163628.GH9336@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:16:55PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> Diky za rady. Sice AUI uz asi dneska nikdo stavet nebude, ale mozna by se to
> mohlo dat na wiki, treba by to nekomu pomohlo.

Maybe people pissed off with unreliability of UTP connectors ;-)

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 17:58:20 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 18:58:20 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <1123785278.42fb9a3e5fc9a@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz>
	<005c01c59e94$153ced30$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<1123785278.42fb9a3e5fc9a@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904165820.GI9336@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:34:38PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:

[...]

> 
> Na RYSa krasne plati jeden Murphyho prikazani: "Kdyz uz nerozumis tomu co delas,
> tak to delej aspon precizne."

RYS said he put LM7812 into the path. But that's incorrect because
7812 required min. like 2V drop for the regulator so the input
voltage would have to be min. 14V, which it isn't.

CL<



From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 18:03:08 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 19:03:08 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <008601c59ea4$1b7191a0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <002e01c59e94$cf825220$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>
	<008601c59ea4$1b7191a0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050904170308.GJ9336@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:40:12PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> Nejsem teda elektronik, ale jestli rikate kluci, ze ten interferenc leze  z 
> tx a +12, tak to kvalitni kabelaz musi spravit alespon na prijatelnou 
> uroven aby to nikoho neomezovalo
> a aby na me nevystartovali z CTUcka :) Cili reseni je tu nekolik a jelikoz 
> jste z oboru tak me zajima vas nazor co je nejvhodnejsi z hlediska funkce a 
> vyzarovaneho ruseni a s jakou
> urovni vyzarovani pak muzu pocitat ? Jak jsem rikal bude to kousek od tv 

To fix it by cabling you would have to use exclusively shielded cables
with all shields connected to ground and all non-ground signals sent
through wires inside these cables. And be sure to have ground
connections well connected (no BNC, cinches and similar crap that
gets loose on the roof after some times).

I think it's easier to fix Twister according to the radiation patch
http://ronja.twibright.com/bugfixes/twister_rad.php

CL<


From krepa at seznam.cz  Sun Sep  4 18:17:03 2005
From: krepa at seznam.cz (Pavel Krejci)
Date: Sun, 04 Sep 2005 19:17:03 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] RSSI indikator
In-Reply-To: <20050904100021.GA30019@kestrel.twibright.com>
References: <537.1353-2643-1864264518-1123586535@seznam.cz>	<1123592617.42f8a9a9e6733@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<20050904100021.GA30019@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <431B2C0F.30409@seznam.cz>

See bellow.
krepa


> I would ask for 10-bit ADC with input analogue compressor which would
> eliminate the response of the RSSI circuit with the two Schottky diodes.
> The response can be determined by measurement or simulation and will be
> similar for all diodes.

What exactly do you mean by elimination of the RSSI response?

> 
> So 0...255 would increase as decibels of input optical (not electrical!)
> signal would increase.

Why do you need 10bit ADC for 0..255 range? ;o)) BTW ATMEGA8 which I 
inted has integrated 10bit successive aproximation ADC.
What dynamic range (in dB) you expect?
10bit ADC is ideally ~60dB so if there is enough computational power of 
the microcontroller the result in dB can be calculated inside.

> 
> Let the interface between PC and measurement device has these properties:
> 1) Runs over single coaxial cable with virtually unlimited length

RS485 is twisted pair and can be run with pretty long distance. More 
than several hundreds meters. RS232 possibly can be run on coax but my 
idea was that the device will have both way communication -> at least 3 
wires on RS232. RS485 is single pair differential 
transmission/reception. See here for comparison. 
http://www.rs485.com/rs485spec.html
> 2) Doesn't radiate and is immune to radiation
> 3) Supports at least 1000 measurements per second
> 4) Allows the inner conductor of the coax to be used for 5-48V carriage
> 5) 
> 
> Let the measurement device has mean time between SW crashes even under
> external EM spikes generated by ordinary means (except lightning) 10^3
> years.
I'll wait till you measure 10^3 years :o)

> If the measurement device is put into nonoperable state by lightning
> strike (register or memory flip) then let it either resume valid state
> max. after 10s or can be remotely completely reset by the PC. Watchdog
> is not a solution to this (a software state which still refreshes the
> watchdog yet doesn't perform function correctly can easily be
> constructed).
> 
> Let the device has remote firmware upload capability from the PC which
> works regardless of how fucked up the current firmware and software
> state is.
>
Yes it is on my Todo

> Let the device doesn't generate any RF interference and is immune
> against it and is of such size that can be inserted into the RX head
> and connected on the RSSI internally, with the communications coaxial
> cable going instead of RSSI outside the optical head.
This could be easy one. I'm using internal oscillator, so I do not 
expect any RF disturbance... But need to be checked. All will be SMD - 
size should not be an issue.

> 
> Let the shield of the communications coaxial cable is directly connected
> to the console of the optical installation (protection against fire of
> home PC in case of lightning strike into the coaxial cable) with a
> connection of max. 0.5ohm resistance and capability to withstand 100kA
> for 3us without interruption of the connection.


> 
> CL<
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 



From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 18:12:27 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 19:12:27 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] RX PCB design - coils
In-Reply-To: <1123792740.42fbb764395c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz>
	<005c01c59e94$153ced30$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<1123785278.42fb9a3e5fc9a@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<42FBABF5.70306@seznam.cz>
	<1123792740.42fbb764395c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050904171227.GK9336@kestrel.twibright.com>

You are using S-shaped coils on your PCB design
http://twiki.twibright.com/bin/view/Main/RxPcbSeligr

How did you determine their inductance? Do you have
some formula for it's calculation?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep  4 18:43:56 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 19:43:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Twister radiation fix
Message-ID: <20050904174356.GA10303@kestrel.twibright.com>

I have added some explanatory photos how to put the capacitors there:
http://kestrel.twibright.com/bugfixes/twister_rad.php

CL<


From petr.cipis at tiscali.cz  Sun Sep  4 19:13:51 2005
From: petr.cipis at tiscali.cz (Cipis)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 20:13:51 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz><005c01c59e94$153ced30$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><1123785278.42fb9a3e5fc9a@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<20050904165820.GI9336@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <002001c5b17c$67bfa0c0$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>

Mno, neni problem sehnat lowdrop stabilizatory, ty potrebuji akorat 0,65V
navic.
Myslim, ze doplnit stabilizatory a zvetsit napajeni neni vubec spatny napad.

Cipis

----- Original Message -----
From: "Karel Kulhavy" <clock at twibright.com>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 6:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX


> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:34:38PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> >
> > Na RYSa krasne plati jeden Murphyho prikazani: "Kdyz uz nerozumis tomu
co delas,
> > tak to delej aspon precizne."
>
> RYS said he put LM7812 into the path. But that's incorrect because
> 7812 required min. like 2V drop for the regulator so the input
> voltage would have to be min. 14V, which it isn't.
>
> CL<
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From anmic at fmg.sk  Sun Sep  4 20:12:55 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 21:12:55 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz><006401c59ea1$0d304e40$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050904163547.GG9336@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic>

1) Situace na nodu "anMic"
----
Opt. hlavy jsem testoval na strese jeste pred bugfixem twisteru s tim, ze
napajeni bylo tazeno primo ze zdroje po samostatne dvojlince a oba koaxy
(RG6, 2x 6 m) byly stineny na GND boxu twisteru.

Funkcnost OK, ale ruseni TV Nova - vertikalni pruhy na obrazovce. Ruseni
prokazatelne zpusobuje Ronja - pri vypnuti napajeni pruhy zmizi.
(Nezasveceny clovek by to hned asi nezaregistroval, ale technik by si jiste
vsiml okamzite a sel by na jisto na Ronju. Nemuzu si dovolit neco rusit,
protoze sousede si vsichni vsimli nove nainstalovanych tubusu na strese a
pripadne ruseni by si jiste spojili prave s Ronjou).

Nevim, jestli ma toto ruseni co do cineni primo se zminovanym bugem v
twisteru. Mozna vyzaruje primo neco z opt. hlavy (nahradit svorkovnice F
konektory?). Uvidime, jak se situace vyvine, az zapojim opraveny twister -
budu informovat.

2) Situace na nodu "Tony"
----
Na protistanici je zapojeno Aui Forte, signal je tazen k PC RG6 2x 27m
koaxem.

Pri standartnim zapojeni podle navodu (stineni TX=GND, stineni RX=+12) se
projevilo ruseni TV Prima. Nemame moznost zjistit blizsi info. (Vybehla na
nas zenska z 30m vzdaleneho baraku, ze jim nejak "lita" tv Prima. Ruseni si
vsak nastesi nespojila s Ronjou, ale s CB transceiverem, ktery jsem mel
zrovna v ruce.)

Podle vseho nam bude asi +12 z Aui Forte vyzarovat vice nez napajeni z
Twisteru a tezko rict, na kterych frekvencich.

Navrhli jsme reseni:
- stinit oba koaxy na GND
- napajeni vest k opt. hlavam samostatne
- primo do aui konektoru napajet filracni 100n kondenzator (zamezi pripadne
sireni rusivych kmitu do +12 vetve zdroje pc?)
- casem prechod na twister

----
Prosim o komentar a o (konstruktivni) kritiku.
Diky.

pekny den preje anMic




> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:14:07PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> > Popisovanou situaci prave ted taky promyslim - o vikendu se chystam na
> > instalaci spoje s 90mm hlavicemi, ktere budou na strese pobliz tel.
anten. Z
> > pripadneho ruseni mam obavu.
> >
> > Navrhnul jsem to jednoduse: stineni obou koaxu pripojit na gnd a
uzemnit,
> > napajeni +12 pak privedu po samostatne dvojlince. Co si o tom myslite?
> > a) Predstavuje takto stineny koax problem, co se tyka ruseni?
>
> No.
>
> > b) Muze vyzarovat napajeci vodic +12 z twisteru? (Jde o to, jestli primo
z
> > twisteru nejdou harmoniky po +12 napajeni.)
>
> Before patch it radiated, now it practically shouldn't.
>
> But by splitting the 12V apart you don't get anything, the
> filters remain the same.
>
> > c) Musim opt. hlavy napajet z vystupu na twisteru nebo muzu pouzit jiny
> > stab. zdroj?
>
> You can use a different power supply.
>
> CL<



From srnkap at extranetplus.cz  Sun Sep  4 20:42:36 2005
From: srnkap at extranetplus.cz (Pavel Srnka)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 21:42:36 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz><006401c59ea1$0d304e40$0101a8c0@anmic><20050904163547.GG9336@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <000c01c5b188$cd45cee0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>

Z ceho mas opticke hlavy ? je to z plastaku nebo plechovy ? mam rx plosnak 
od skontropa (ktery pry rusi nejvic) v 130 at 0,2mm plechu (konstrukce 
samozr.uzemena) svorkovnice v malych pvc krabickach za tubusy a svod asi 
2*15m UTP nestinenym, do racku kde je twister (jestli neco vyzaruje tak ten 
plehovej rack to snad pohlti a kdyz ne tak zelezobetonovy zdi toho panelaku 
:)) ) zapojeni dratku dle schematka co tu nekdo posilal a hlavne je to asi 
metr od stozaru s televiznima antenama (kterej jsme navic ovencili wifi 
sejtama :)) a nerusi to jediny program (zpocatku jsem mel strach kdyz se 
objevili pruhy horizontalni na prime, ale dela to jenom nekdy (a i pred 
instalaci) a mam 100% overeny ze to nedela ronja.Jinak instalace vypada asi 
takto http://ronja.pavel.extranetplus.cz   (dole crusader nahore ronja) 
(jeste podotykam, ze utpcka mam po cely delce (asi 2m) tazeny v husim krku a 
zbytek v plechovy lavce spolu s RLkama od wifin a dalsima UTP.
Docela by me zajimalo, jestli by ti zapojeni pres to UTP pomohlo.



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "anMic" <anmic at fmg.sk>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 9:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi


> 1) Situace na nodu "anMic"
> ----
> Opt. hlavy jsem testoval na strese jeste pred bugfixem twisteru s tim, ze
> napajeni bylo tazeno primo ze zdroje po samostatne dvojlince a oba koaxy
> (RG6, 2x 6 m) byly stineny na GND boxu twisteru.
>
> Funkcnost OK, ale ruseni TV Nova - vertikalni pruhy na obrazovce. Ruseni
> prokazatelne zpusobuje Ronja - pri vypnuti napajeni pruhy zmizi.
> (Nezasveceny clovek by to hned asi nezaregistroval, ale technik by si 
> jiste
> vsiml okamzite a sel by na jisto na Ronju. Nemuzu si dovolit neco rusit,
> protoze sousede si vsichni vsimli nove nainstalovanych tubusu na strese a
> pripadne ruseni by si jiste spojili prave s Ronjou).
>
> Nevim, jestli ma toto ruseni co do cineni primo se zminovanym bugem v
> twisteru. Mozna vyzaruje primo neco z opt. hlavy (nahradit svorkovnice F
> konektory?). Uvidime, jak se situace vyvine, az zapojim opraveny twister -
> budu informovat.
>
> 2) Situace na nodu "Tony"
> ----
> Na protistanici je zapojeno Aui Forte, signal je tazen k PC RG6 2x 27m
> koaxem.
>
> Pri standartnim zapojeni podle navodu (stineni TX=GND, stineni RX=+12) se
> projevilo ruseni TV Prima. Nemame moznost zjistit blizsi info. (Vybehla na
> nas zenska z 30m vzdaleneho baraku, ze jim nejak "lita" tv Prima. Ruseni 
> si
> vsak nastesi nespojila s Ronjou, ale s CB transceiverem, ktery jsem mel
> zrovna v ruce.)
>
> Podle vseho nam bude asi +12 z Aui Forte vyzarovat vice nez napajeni z
> Twisteru a tezko rict, na kterych frekvencich.
>
> Navrhli jsme reseni:
> - stinit oba koaxy na GND
> - napajeni vest k opt. hlavam samostatne
> - primo do aui konektoru napajet filracni 100n kondenzator (zamezi 
> pripadne
> sireni rusivych kmitu do +12 vetve zdroje pc?)
> - casem prechod na twister
>
> ----
> Prosim o komentar a o (konstruktivni) kritiku.
> Diky.
>
> pekny den preje anMic
>
>
>
>
>> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:14:07PM +0200, anMic wrote:
>> > Popisovanou situaci prave ted taky promyslim - o vikendu se chystam na
>> > instalaci spoje s 90mm hlavicemi, ktere budou na strese pobliz tel.
> anten. Z
>> > pripadneho ruseni mam obavu.
>> >
>> > Navrhnul jsem to jednoduse: stineni obou koaxu pripojit na gnd a
> uzemnit,
>> > napajeni +12 pak privedu po samostatne dvojlince. Co si o tom myslite?
>> > a) Predstavuje takto stineny koax problem, co se tyka ruseni?
>>
>> No.
>>
>> > b) Muze vyzarovat napajeci vodic +12 z twisteru? (Jde o to, jestli 
>> > primo
> z
>> > twisteru nejdou harmoniky po +12 napajeni.)
>>
>> Before patch it radiated, now it practically shouldn't.
>>
>> But by splitting the 12V apart you don't get anything, the
>> filters remain the same.
>>
>> > c) Musim opt. hlavy napajet z vystupu na twisteru nebo muzu pouzit jiny
>> > stab. zdroj?
>>
>> You can use a different power supply.
>>
>> CL<
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 



From anmic at fmg.sk  Sun Sep  4 21:24:15 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 22:24:15 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz><006401c59ea1$0d304e40$0101a8c0@anmic><20050904163547.GG9336@kestrel.twibright.com><006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<000c01c5b188$cd45cee0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <000401c5b18e$a2e24f60$0101a8c0@anmic>

ronja je postavena podle navodu, tzn.
- tubusy kovove (z kourove trubky)
- rx je airwire
- svorkovnice v tubusech

vzdalenost od tv anten asi 1,5 m (tv Nova ma u nas relativne slaby signal,
proto se mozna ruseni vic projevuje)

zapojeni pres UTP zvazuji, ale chtel bych pokud mozno vyuzit jiz zakoupeny
koax, hlavne na protistanici, kde je ho pres 50 m

anMic

> Z ceho mas opticke hlavy ? je to z plastaku nebo plechovy ? mam rx plosnak
> od skontropa (ktery pry rusi nejvic) v 130 at 0,2mm plechu (konstrukce
> samozr.uzemena) svorkovnice v malych pvc krabickach za tubusy a svod asi
> 2*15m UTP nestinenym, do racku kde je twister (jestli neco vyzaruje tak
ten
> plehovej rack to snad pohlti a kdyz ne tak zelezobetonovy zdi toho
panelaku
> :)) ) zapojeni dratku dle schematka co tu nekdo posilal a hlavne je to asi
> metr od stozaru s televiznima antenama (kterej jsme navic ovencili wifi
> sejtama :)) a nerusi to jediny program (zpocatku jsem mel strach kdyz se
> objevili pruhy horizontalni na prime, ale dela to jenom nekdy (a i pred
> instalaci) a mam 100% overeny ze to nedela ronja.Jinak instalace vypada
asi
> takto http://ronja.pavel.extranetplus.cz   (dole crusader nahore ronja)
> (jeste podotykam, ze utpcka mam po cely delce (asi 2m) tazeny v husim krku
a
> zbytek v plechovy lavce spolu s RLkama od wifin a dalsima UTP.
> Docela by me zajimalo, jestli by ti zapojeni pres to UTP pomohlo.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "anMic" <anmic at fmg.sk>
> To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 9:12 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
>
>
> > 1) Situace na nodu "anMic"
> > ----
> > Opt. hlavy jsem testoval na strese jeste pred bugfixem twisteru s tim,
ze
> > napajeni bylo tazeno primo ze zdroje po samostatne dvojlince a oba koaxy
> > (RG6, 2x 6 m) byly stineny na GND boxu twisteru.
> >
> > Funkcnost OK, ale ruseni TV Nova - vertikalni pruhy na obrazovce. Ruseni
> > prokazatelne zpusobuje Ronja - pri vypnuti napajeni pruhy zmizi.
> > (Nezasveceny clovek by to hned asi nezaregistroval, ale technik by si
> > jiste
> > vsiml okamzite a sel by na jisto na Ronju. Nemuzu si dovolit neco rusit,
> > protoze sousede si vsichni vsimli nove nainstalovanych tubusu na strese
a
> > pripadne ruseni by si jiste spojili prave s Ronjou).
> >
> > Nevim, jestli ma toto ruseni co do cineni primo se zminovanym bugem v
> > twisteru. Mozna vyzaruje primo neco z opt. hlavy (nahradit svorkovnice F
> > konektory?). Uvidime, jak se situace vyvine, az zapojim opraveny
twister -
> > budu informovat.
> >
> > 2) Situace na nodu "Tony"
> > ----
> > Na protistanici je zapojeno Aui Forte, signal je tazen k PC RG6 2x 27m
> > koaxem.
> >
> > Pri standartnim zapojeni podle navodu (stineni TX=GND, stineni RX=+12)
se
> > projevilo ruseni TV Prima. Nemame moznost zjistit blizsi info. (Vybehla
na
> > nas zenska z 30m vzdaleneho baraku, ze jim nejak "lita" tv Prima. Ruseni
> > si
> > vsak nastesi nespojila s Ronjou, ale s CB transceiverem, ktery jsem mel
> > zrovna v ruce.)
> >
> > Podle vseho nam bude asi +12 z Aui Forte vyzarovat vice nez napajeni z
> > Twisteru a tezko rict, na kterych frekvencich.
> >
> > Navrhli jsme reseni:
> > - stinit oba koaxy na GND
> > - napajeni vest k opt. hlavam samostatne
> > - primo do aui konektoru napajet filracni 100n kondenzator (zamezi
> > pripadne
> > sireni rusivych kmitu do +12 vetve zdroje pc?)
> > - casem prechod na twister
> >
> > ----
> > Prosim o komentar a o (konstruktivni) kritiku.
> > Diky.
> >
> > pekny den preje anMic
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:14:07PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> >> > Popisovanou situaci prave ted taky promyslim - o vikendu se chystam
na
> >> > instalaci spoje s 90mm hlavicemi, ktere budou na strese pobliz tel.
> > anten. Z
> >> > pripadneho ruseni mam obavu.
> >> >
> >> > Navrhnul jsem to jednoduse: stineni obou koaxu pripojit na gnd a
> > uzemnit,
> >> > napajeni +12 pak privedu po samostatne dvojlince. Co si o tom
myslite?
> >> > a) Predstavuje takto stineny koax problem, co se tyka ruseni?
> >>
> >> No.
> >>
> >> > b) Muze vyzarovat napajeci vodic +12 z twisteru? (Jde o to, jestli
> >> > primo
> > z
> >> > twisteru nejdou harmoniky po +12 napajeni.)
> >>
> >> Before patch it radiated, now it practically shouldn't.
> >>
> >> But by splitting the 12V apart you don't get anything, the
> >> filters remain the same.
> >>
> >> > c) Musim opt. hlavy napajet z vystupu na twisteru nebo muzu pouzit
jiny
> >> > stab. zdroj?
> >>
> >> You can use a different power supply.
> >>
> >> CL<
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From petr.cipis at tiscali.cz  Sun Sep  4 22:07:21 2005
From: petr.cipis at tiscali.cz (Cipis)
Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 23:07:21 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz><006401c59ea1$0d304e40$0101a8c0@anmic><20050904163547.GG9336@kestrel.twibright.com><006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic><000c01c5b188$cd45cee0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<000401c5b18e$a2e24f60$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <000f01c5b194$a554c740$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>

hmm, jenze to muze byt prave taky tema antenama na TV
na jakem kanalu u vas ta nova jede a na jake kanaly je konstruovana antena,
kterou to prijimaji?
jestli jsou tam polsky sita, tak je to tema sitama, ne ronjou
akorat se strasne tezko nekomu vysvetluje, ze mu to deset roku jelo jen diky
tomu, ze nahodou nic nerozhodilo ten smejd v antene
a ze to mel vlastne 10 roku blbe udelane

Cipis


----- Original Message -----
From: "anMic" <anmic at fmg.sk>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 10:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi


> ronja je postavena podle navodu, tzn.
> - tubusy kovove (z kourove trubky)
> - rx je airwire
> - svorkovnice v tubusech
>
> vzdalenost od tv anten asi 1,5 m (tv Nova ma u nas relativne slaby signal,
> proto se mozna ruseni vic projevuje)
>
> zapojeni pres UTP zvazuji, ale chtel bych pokud mozno vyuzit jiz zakoupeny
> koax, hlavne na protistanici, kde je ho pres 50 m
>
> anMic
>
> > Z ceho mas opticke hlavy ? je to z plastaku nebo plechovy ? mam rx
plosnak
> > od skontropa (ktery pry rusi nejvic) v 130 at 0,2mm plechu (konstrukce
> > samozr.uzemena) svorkovnice v malych pvc krabickach za tubusy a svod asi
> > 2*15m UTP nestinenym, do racku kde je twister (jestli neco vyzaruje tak
> ten
> > plehovej rack to snad pohlti a kdyz ne tak zelezobetonovy zdi toho
> panelaku
> > :)) ) zapojeni dratku dle schematka co tu nekdo posilal a hlavne je to
asi
> > metr od stozaru s televiznima antenama (kterej jsme navic ovencili wifi
> > sejtama :)) a nerusi to jediny program (zpocatku jsem mel strach kdyz se
> > objevili pruhy horizontalni na prime, ale dela to jenom nekdy (a i pred
> > instalaci) a mam 100% overeny ze to nedela ronja.Jinak instalace vypada
> asi
> > takto http://ronja.pavel.extranetplus.cz   (dole crusader nahore ronja)
> > (jeste podotykam, ze utpcka mam po cely delce (asi 2m) tazeny v husim
krku
> a
> > zbytek v plechovy lavce spolu s RLkama od wifin a dalsima UTP.
> > Docela by me zajimalo, jestli by ti zapojeni pres to UTP pomohlo.
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "anMic" <anmic at fmg.sk>
> > To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> > Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 9:12 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
> >
> >
> > > 1) Situace na nodu "anMic"
> > > ----
> > > Opt. hlavy jsem testoval na strese jeste pred bugfixem twisteru s tim,
> ze
> > > napajeni bylo tazeno primo ze zdroje po samostatne dvojlince a oba
koaxy
> > > (RG6, 2x 6 m) byly stineny na GND boxu twisteru.
> > >
> > > Funkcnost OK, ale ruseni TV Nova - vertikalni pruhy na obrazovce.
Ruseni
> > > prokazatelne zpusobuje Ronja - pri vypnuti napajeni pruhy zmizi.
> > > (Nezasveceny clovek by to hned asi nezaregistroval, ale technik by si
> > > jiste
> > > vsiml okamzite a sel by na jisto na Ronju. Nemuzu si dovolit neco
rusit,
> > > protoze sousede si vsichni vsimli nove nainstalovanych tubusu na
strese
> a
> > > pripadne ruseni by si jiste spojili prave s Ronjou).
> > >
> > > Nevim, jestli ma toto ruseni co do cineni primo se zminovanym bugem v
> > > twisteru. Mozna vyzaruje primo neco z opt. hlavy (nahradit svorkovnice
F
> > > konektory?). Uvidime, jak se situace vyvine, az zapojim opraveny
> twister -
> > > budu informovat.
> > >
> > > 2) Situace na nodu "Tony"
> > > ----
> > > Na protistanici je zapojeno Aui Forte, signal je tazen k PC RG6 2x 27m
> > > koaxem.
> > >
> > > Pri standartnim zapojeni podle navodu (stineni TX=GND, stineni RX=+12)
> se
> > > projevilo ruseni TV Prima. Nemame moznost zjistit blizsi info.
(Vybehla
> na
> > > nas zenska z 30m vzdaleneho baraku, ze jim nejak "lita" tv Prima.
Ruseni
> > > si
> > > vsak nastesi nespojila s Ronjou, ale s CB transceiverem, ktery jsem
mel
> > > zrovna v ruce.)
> > >
> > > Podle vseho nam bude asi +12 z Aui Forte vyzarovat vice nez napajeni z
> > > Twisteru a tezko rict, na kterych frekvencich.
> > >
> > > Navrhli jsme reseni:
> > > - stinit oba koaxy na GND
> > > - napajeni vest k opt. hlavam samostatne
> > > - primo do aui konektoru napajet filracni 100n kondenzator (zamezi
> > > pripadne
> > > sireni rusivych kmitu do +12 vetve zdroje pc?)
> > > - casem prechod na twister
> > >
> > > ----
> > > Prosim o komentar a o (konstruktivni) kritiku.
> > > Diky.
> > >
> > > pekny den preje anMic
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:14:07PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> > >> > Popisovanou situaci prave ted taky promyslim - o vikendu se chystam
> na
> > >> > instalaci spoje s 90mm hlavicemi, ktere budou na strese pobliz tel.
> > > anten. Z
> > >> > pripadneho ruseni mam obavu.
> > >> >
> > >> > Navrhnul jsem to jednoduse: stineni obou koaxu pripojit na gnd a
> > > uzemnit,
> > >> > napajeni +12 pak privedu po samostatne dvojlince. Co si o tom
> myslite?
> > >> > a) Predstavuje takto stineny koax problem, co se tyka ruseni?
> > >>
> > >> No.
> > >>
> > >> > b) Muze vyzarovat napajeci vodic +12 z twisteru? (Jde o to, jestli
> > >> > primo
> > > z
> > >> > twisteru nejdou harmoniky po +12 napajeni.)
> > >>
> > >> Before patch it radiated, now it practically shouldn't.
> > >>
> > >> But by splitting the 12V apart you don't get anything, the
> > >> filters remain the same.
> > >>
> > >> > c) Musim opt. hlavy napajet z vystupu na twisteru nebo muzu pouzit
> jiny
> > >> > stab. zdroj?
> > >>
> > >> You can use a different power supply.
> > >>
> > >> CL<
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Ronja mailing list
> > > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Sun Sep  4 22:13:43 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Sun, 04 Sep 2005 23:13:43 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] jenom takova kravina...
Message-ID: <431B6387.8070206@centrum.cz>

jak izolujete RXovy konektor na interfacu od plechove krabice? myslim 
tim BNCaky Fka  Cinche a tak... ja delam takove papirove podlozky, je to 
funkcni ale dosti neelegantni... nemate nekdo neco lepsiho?


From Korda.M at seznam.cz  Mon Sep  5 05:36:01 2005
From: Korda.M at seznam.cz (=?us-ascii?Q?Milan=20Korda?=)
Date: Mon, 05 Sep 2005 06:36:01 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: [Ronja] jenom takova kravina...
In-Reply-To: <431B6387.8070206@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <1309.2029-6848-958067005-1125894961@seznam.cz>

Zdravim, ja davam kousky kuprextitu..


From ok2zaw at seznam.cz  Mon Sep  5 08:29:43 2005
From: ok2zaw at seznam.cz (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Jan_=A9ustr_-_OK2ZAW?=)
Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2005 09:29:43 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
Message-ID: <20050905072943.7A71414801C@relay.sattnet.cz>

Zdravim, setkal sem se s rusenim TV, kter? pochyzi z 10Mbit site na UTP,
vyleci se to feritama t?eba z monitorovejch kablu, staci tak 2x-3x provlict
UPT, to samy bych udelal na obou koncich koaxu k RX a TX co nejbliz modulum
a interfejsu. Nebylo by to spatny i na tom propojeni napajeni. 

Pokud tam mas polsky sito, tak si jeden z tech stovek nestastnych a
proklinanych lidi, co normalnim lidem rusi TV:o)) Ale jim to nevysvetlis, ze
maj na strese smejd..

 

S pozdravem Jan ?ustr / best Regards, Jan ?ustr

| HYPERLINK "mailto:ok2zaw at seznam.cz"ok2zaw at seznam.cz | ICQ: 337068178 |
HYPERLINK "http://www.ok2zaw.com"www.ok2zaw.com |

 


-- 
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From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Mon Sep  5 10:10:05 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Mon, 05 Sep 2005 11:10:05 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] P105 Rx
Message-ID: <431C0B6D.4080105@centrum.cz>

Na P105 na Rxu mam 1,4V. kdyz odpajim R109 (680R) tak se tam tech 5V 
obevi. usoudil jsem vadnym NE592. vymenil - nic. vymenil sem za jiny, 
zas nic. dycky to same. kdyz merim I pres ten R109 do 14. pinu NE592 je 
tam 1mA. pres R108 tece 4,5uA. U dobreho Rx tece pres R109 aji R108 
4,5uA. Uz me nenapada nic jineho nez vadny NE592ka, ale mel sem tam 
SNDcko, vymenil sem ho a ted sem tam dal este obyc v dilu a porad nic 
... furt to same... poradi mi nekdo?

dik


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep  5 10:52:10 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2005 11:52:10 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] How to tell footprint= value for the old m4 packages
Message-ID: <20050905095210.GA8634@kestrel.twibright.com>

----- Forwarded message from Bill Wilson <billw at dslextreme.com> -----

Date: Sun, 4 Sep 2005 18:14:31 -0500
From: Bill Wilson <billw at dslextreme.com>
To: geda-user at seul.org
Subject: Re: gEDA-user: SOT143
X-Mailer: Sylpheed version 1.0.0-gtk2-20041224 (GTK+ 2.6.8; i386-pc-linux-gnu)

On Sun, 4 Sep 2005 14:25:35 +0200
Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com> wrote:

> If I find in PCB Window -> Library -> ~geda -> SOT143, SMT transistor, 4
> pins and I want it, what should I put into footprint= in gschem?
> 
> sot143
> SOT143
> sot 143
> SOT 143
> sot_143
> SOT_143
> sot-143
> SOT-143
> 
> ?
> 
> Where is it possible to obtain algorithm to translate
> "SOT143, SMT transistor, 4 pins" into the string that is necessary to
> put into footprint=?

>From the description line:

    SOT143, SMT transistor, 4

You just use the SOT143 string directly as the footprint value.  That
string should be defined to be a macro which expands with the right
SMT footprint parameters in the geda.inc file.  Use the string exactly
and case must match.

If you try such strings from the descriptions and don't get what
you expect, do this to help debug what's going on:

1) cd /usr/local/share/pcb/m4
   ( or to wherever your PCB m4 install directory is)

2) grep SOT143 *   gives:
    geda.inc:define(`PKG_SOT143',   `PKG_SMT_TRANSISTOR4( `$1', `$2', `$3', 19, 21)');
    geda.list:geda_SOT143:SOT143:SOT143
    geda.m4:define(`Description_geda_SOT143',       ``SMT transistor, 4 pins'')

3) So you now know that in geda.inc, a macro SOT143 is defined which
in turn calls another macro SMT_TRANSISTOR4.  (The "PKG_" is always
prefixed for you, so you don't include it in the footprint value).

The first three args are always handled for you in gsch2pcb, so you can use as
your footprint either:

    SOT143
or
    SMT_TRANSISTOR4 19 21

Bill

----- End forwarded message -----


From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Mon Sep  5 12:30:36 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Mon,  5 Sep 2005 13:30:36 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] P105 Rx
In-Reply-To: <431C0B6D.4080105@centrum.cz>
References: <431C0B6D.4080105@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <1125919836.431c2c5c809e7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

Jestli je to na plosnaku od kohouta, tak promer nozicky c.3,4,11,12 proti zemi
jestli nemaj zkrat. Jedna varka plosnaku mela zkrat primo pod svabem na zem, ze
nebyl na prvni pohled videt.

> Na P105 na Rxu mam 1,4V. kdyz odpajim R109 (680R) tak se tam tech 5V 
> obevi. usoudil jsem vadnym NE592. vymenil - nic. vymenil sem za jiny, 
> zas nic. dycky to same. kdyz merim I pres ten R109 do 14. pinu NE592 je 
> tam 1mA. pres R108 tece 4,5uA. U dobreho Rx tece pres R109 aji R108 
> 4,5uA. Uz me nenapada nic jineho nez vadny NE592ka, ale mel sem tam 
> SNDcko, vymenil sem ho a ted sem tam dal este obyc v dilu a porad nic 
> ... furt to same... poradi mi nekdo?
> 
> dik


From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Mon Sep  5 12:39:57 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Mon,  5 Sep 2005 13:39:57 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <20050905072943.7A71414801C@relay.sattnet.cz>
References: <20050905072943.7A71414801C@relay.sattnet.cz>
Message-ID: <1125920397.431c2e8dbfbee@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

Cituji z emailu od Jan ?ustr - OK2ZAW <ok2zaw at seznam.cz>:

> Zdravim, setkal sem se s rusenim TV, kter? pochyzi z 10Mbit site na UTP,
> vyleci se to feritama t?eba z monitorovejch kablu, staci tak 2x-3x provlict
> UPT, to samy bych udelal na obou koncich koaxu k RX a TX co nejbliz modulum
> a interfejsu. Nebylo by to spatny i na tom propojeni napajeni. 
> 

Bohuzel samotny ferit to neresi. Koaxy je potreba pekne smotat jako pary v
UTPcku a pridat kondiky jak psal clock. Ale stejne porad zari stineni koaxu k RX
protoze je blbe zablokovany. Kdyz je signal dost silny, tak se dostane na
opleteni jako by bylo pripojeno pres kapacitni delic proti zemi.

> Pokud tam mas polsky sito, tak si jeden z tech stovek nestastnych a
> proklinanych lidi, co normalnim lidem rusi TV:o)) Ale jim to nevysvetlis,
> ze
> maj na strese smejd..
> 

Nepomlouvej sejto. To je jedna z nejlepsich anten.
To (ne)jen polaci delaj misto zesilovacu oscilatory a pak se clovek divi jak to
muzou prodavat, ze jim to nekdo nezatrhne. 

> 
> S pozdravem Jan ?ustr / best Regards, Jan ?ustr
> 


From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Mon Sep  5 12:41:54 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Mon, 05 Sep 2005 13:41:54 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] P105 Rx
In-Reply-To: <1125919836.431c2c5c809e7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <431C0B6D.4080105@centrum.cz>
	<1125919836.431c2c5c809e7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <431C2F02.9060304@centrum.cz>

fakt ze jo. 11ka to je. a to je pod broukem? ale nechces rict ze ho 
musim vypajet ze ne? :( kazdopadne dik, snad to tim bude

Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
> Jestli je to na plosnaku od kohouta, tak promer nozicky c.3,4,11,12 proti zemi
> jestli nemaj zkrat. Jedna varka plosnaku mela zkrat primo pod svabem na zem, ze
> nebyl na prvni pohled videt.
> 
> 
>>Na P105 na Rxu mam 1,4V. kdyz odpajim R109 (680R) tak se tam tech 5V 
>>obevi. usoudil jsem vadnym NE592. vymenil - nic. vymenil sem za jiny, 
>>zas nic. dycky to same. kdyz merim I pres ten R109 do 14. pinu NE592 je 
>>tam 1mA. pres R108 tece 4,5uA. U dobreho Rx tece pres R109 aji R108 
>>4,5uA. Uz me nenapada nic jineho nez vadny NE592ka, ale mel sem tam 
>>SNDcko, vymenil sem ho a ted sem tam dal este obyc v dilu a porad nic 
>>... furt to same... poradi mi nekdo?
>>
>>dik
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 


From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Mon Sep  5 12:48:08 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Mon,  5 Sep 2005 13:48:08 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] RX PCB design - coils
In-Reply-To: <20050904171227.GK9336@kestrel.twibright.com>
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz>
	<005c01c59e94$153ced30$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<1123785278.42fb9a3e5fc9a@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<42FBABF5.70306@seznam.cz>
	<1123792740.42fbb764395c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<20050904171227.GK9336@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <1125920888.431c3078625b2@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

Pokud to budes brat ciste jako civku /coz neni presne tento pripad/, tak: Doc.
Ing. Karel Hoffmann, "Planarni mikrovlnne obvody", Vydavatelstvi CVUT, 2001, str.78.

> You are using S-shaped coils on your PCB design
> http://twiki.twibright.com/bin/view/Main/RxPcbSeligr
> 
> How did you determine their inductance? Do you have
> some formula for it's calculation?
> 
> CL<



From polous at katka.biz  Mon Sep  5 15:38:55 2005
From: polous at katka.biz (Martin Polehla)
Date: Mon, 05 Sep 2005 14:38:55 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <1125920397.431c2e8dbfbee@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <20050905072943.7A71414801C@relay.sattnet.cz>
	<1125920397.431c2e8dbfbee@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <431C587F.9070605@katka.biz>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:

> Cituji z emailu od Jan ?ustr - OK2ZAW <ok2zaw at seznam.cz>:
>
>> Zdravim, setkal sem se s rusenim TV, kter? pochyzi z 10Mbit site
>> na UTP, vyleci se to feritama t?eba z monitorovejch kablu, staci
>> tak 2x-3x provlict UPT, to samy bych udelal na obou koncich koaxu
>> k RX a TX co nejbliz modulum a interfejsu. Nebylo by to spatny i
>> na tom propojeni napajeni.
>>
>
> Bohuzel samotny ferit to neresi. Koaxy je potreba pekne smotat jako
> pary v UTPcku a pridat kondiky jak psal clock. Ale stejne porad
> zari stineni koaxu k RX protoze je blbe zablokovany. Kdyz je signal
> dost silny, tak se dostane na opleteni jako by bylo pripojeno pres
> kapacitni delic proti zemi.
>
Jak mam upravit stavajci prijmac aby to bylo spravne ? rad bych si to
opravil pokud to jde, nez postavim dalsich x modulu

dik
p0l0us
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From kubajz at kbx.cz  Mon Sep  5 15:05:31 2005
From: kubajz at kbx.cz (Jakub Sykora)
Date: Mon, 05 Sep 2005 16:05:31 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <431C587F.9070605@katka.biz>
References: <20050905072943.7A71414801C@relay.sattnet.cz>	<1125920397.431c2e8dbfbee@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<431C587F.9070605@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <431C50AB.1020607@kbx.cz>

Bugfix twisteru je na webu...

K

Martin Polehla wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> 
> 
>>Cituji z emailu od Jan ?ustr - OK2ZAW <ok2zaw at seznam.cz>:
>>
>>
>>>Zdravim, setkal sem se s rusenim TV, kter? pochyzi z 10Mbit site
>>>na UTP, vyleci se to feritama t?eba z monitorovejch kablu, staci
>>>tak 2x-3x provlict UPT, to samy bych udelal na obou koncich koaxu
>>>k RX a TX co nejbliz modulum a interfejsu. Nebylo by to spatny i
>>>na tom propojeni napajeni.
>>>
>>
>>Bohuzel samotny ferit to neresi. Koaxy je potreba pekne smotat jako
>>pary v UTPcku a pridat kondiky jak psal clock. Ale stejne porad
>>zari stineni koaxu k RX protoze je blbe zablokovany. Kdyz je signal
>>dost silny, tak se dostane na opleteni jako by bylo pripojeno pres
>>kapacitni delic proti zemi.
>>
> 
> Jak mam upravit stavajci prijmac aby to bylo spravne ? rad bych si to
> opravil pokud to jde, nez postavim dalsich x modulu
> 
> dik
> p0l0us
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
> Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
> 
> iD8DBQFDHFh/Yo9JRD7EbFIRAsf3AJ4uEVJhKBPkIhQ+ipfLNjaCETGhSgCfbdf4
> FbPDN+NJDguxER9DR7qc1OU=
> =NkPa
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja

-- 
Jakub S?kora
email: kubajz at kbx.cz       <')
ICQ: 68976632               ( =-
mobil: +420 777 594 201      ''
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From ok2zaw at seznam.cz  Mon Sep  5 16:20:55 2005
From: ok2zaw at seznam.cz (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Jan_=A9ustr_-_OK2ZAW?=)
Date: Mon, 5 Sep 2005 17:20:55 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <431C587F.9070605@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <20050905152054.375DA148025@relay.sattnet.cz>

No prave ony ferity funguju jako proudovy balun, ov?em de o frekvenci jaka
po pleteni putuje, pokud je nizka, tak jeden ferit muze byt malo, vytvori
malou indukcnost, rozhodne tim nic nezkazis, ale vyzarovani na vyssich
frekvencich tim rozhodne zblokujes.. teda aspon trochu. Jinak se spravnym
zablokovanim souhlasim, slozit keramiky od 1n, 10n a 100n..

S pozdravem Jan ?ustr / best Regards, Jan ?ustr
| ok2zaw at seznam.cz | ICQ: 337068178 | www.ok2zaw.com |
-----Original Message-----
From: ronja-bounces+ok2zaw=seznam.cz at lists.pointless.net
[mailto:ronja-bounces+ok2zaw=seznam.cz at lists.pointless.net] On Behalf Of
Martin Polehla
Sent: Monday, September 05, 2005 4:39 PM
To: Twibright Ronja
Subject: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:

> Cituji z emailu od Jan ?ustr - OK2ZAW <ok2zaw at seznam.cz>:
>
>> Zdravim, setkal sem se s rusenim TV, kter? pochyzi z 10Mbit site
>> na UTP, vyleci se to feritama t?eba z monitorovejch kablu, staci
>> tak 2x-3x provlict UPT, to samy bych udelal na obou koncich koaxu
>> k RX a TX co nejbliz modulum a interfejsu. Nebylo by to spatny i
>> na tom propojeni napajeni.
>>
>
> Bohuzel samotny ferit to neresi. Koaxy je potreba pekne smotat jako
> pary v UTPcku a pridat kondiky jak psal clock. Ale stejne porad
> zari stineni koaxu k RX protoze je blbe zablokovany. Kdyz je signal
> dost silny, tak se dostane na opleteni jako by bylo pripojeno pres
> kapacitni delic proti zemi.
>
Jak mam upravit stavajci prijmac aby to bylo spravne ? rad bych si to
opravil pokud to jde, nez postavim dalsich x modulu

dik
p0l0us
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_______________________________________________
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Ronja at lists.pointless.net
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From ladmanj at volny.cz  Mon Sep  5 23:26:30 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 00:26:30 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
Message-ID: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Tak spider uz zda se perfektne funguje, stacilo pridat jen jeden odpor :-)

Tady jsou dukazy z loopback testu :-)
Vysilal jsem tohle:
ping 10.16.1.134 -f -s 500
 
tcp dump ukazal tohle:
100880 packets captured
100880 packets received by filter

v priloze je zabaleny soubor data.vcd, prohlednutelny napr programem gtkwave 
(pridruzen k geda) ktery je vystupem logickeho analyzatoru kterym jsem to 
behem pingu meril. Je to velmi krasne doporucuji se na to mrknout :-)
Ovsem i zabalene je to velke, asi to do ml neprojde.

V nejblizsi dobe snad provedu test i s optickou trasou.
Jakub
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From ladmanj at volny.cz  Tue Sep  6 01:28:53 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 02:28:53 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
In-Reply-To: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Najde se zde n?kdo komu bych spidera v cel? sv? kr?se p?edvedl a p?edal 
dokumentaci s t?m ?e by to on n?jak zform?toval a po m?m schv?len? dal na web 
(web m?me)?
Pro Clocka: pokud si to nerozmysl?m, nov? verze bude v gschem a pcb, ale je 
nesmysl s jej?m n?vrhem za??t ne? budou zn?my v?echny chyby t?hle desky.
Ale mus? se naj?t zp?sob jak m?, zhej?kan?ho eaglem, to nau?it.
(ale stejn? je free software toolchain naru?enej v?vojov?ma n?strojema pro 
CPLD, k ?emu? se jentak svobodn? alternativa neobjev?)
Jakub Ladman

On Tuesday 06 of September 2005 00:26, Jakub Ladman wrote:
> Tak spider uz zda se perfektne funguje, stacilo pridat jen jeden odpor :-)
>
> Tady jsou dukazy z loopback testu :-)
> Vysilal jsem tohle:
> ping 10.16.1.134 -f -s 500
>
> tcp dump ukazal tohle:
> 100880 packets captured
> 100880 packets received by filter
>
> v priloze je zabaleny soubor data.vcd, prohlednutelny napr programem
> gtkwave (pridruzen k geda) ktery je vystupem logickeho analyzatoru kterym
> jsem to behem pingu meril. Je to velmi krasne doporucuji se na to mrknout
> :-) Ovsem i zabalene je to velke, asi to do ml neprojde.
>
> V nejblizsi dobe snad provedu test i s optickou trasou.
> Jakub


From fabyhenko at centrum.cz  Tue Sep  6 05:46:41 2005
From: fabyhenko at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Petr_Dvo=F8=E1k?=)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 06:46:41 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
In-Reply-To: <200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <431D1F31.1060901@centrum.cz>

jak uz sem ti psal, cely projekt je mozne vystavit na czflabs.net, v 
jakej formatu je dokumentace?

ROOTen
Jakub Ladman wrote:

>Najde se zde n?kdo komu bych spidera v cel? sv? kr?se p?edvedl a p?edal 
>dokumentaci s t?m ?e by to on n?jak zform?toval a po m?m schv?len? dal na web 
>(web m?me)?
>Pro Clocka: pokud si to nerozmysl?m, nov? verze bude v gschem a pcb, ale je 
>nesmysl s jej?m n?vrhem za??t ne? budou zn?my v?echny chyby t?hle desky.
>Ale mus? se naj?t zp?sob jak m?, zhej?kan?ho eaglem, to nau?it.
>(ale stejn? je free software toolchain naru?enej v?vojov?ma n?strojema pro 
>CPLD, k ?emu? se jentak svobodn? alternativa neobjev?)
>Jakub Ladman
>
>On Tuesday 06 of September 2005 00:26, Jakub Ladman wrote:
>  
>
>>Tak spider uz zda se perfektne funguje, stacilo pridat jen jeden odpor :-)
>>
>>Tady jsou dukazy z loopback testu :-)
>>Vysilal jsem tohle:
>>ping 10.16.1.134 -f -s 500
>>
>>tcp dump ukazal tohle:
>>100880 packets captured
>>100880 packets received by filter
>>
>>v priloze je zabaleny soubor data.vcd, prohlednutelny napr programem
>>gtkwave (pridruzen k geda) ktery je vystupem logickeho analyzatoru kterym
>>jsem to behem pingu meril. Je to velmi krasne doporucuji se na to mrknout
>>:-) Ovsem i zabalene je to velke, asi to do ml neprojde.
>>
>>V nejblizsi dobe snad provedu test i s optickou trasou.
>>Jakub
>>    
>>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
>  
>



From ladmanj at volny.cz  Tue Sep  6 08:17:17 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 09:17:17 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
In-Reply-To: <431D1F31.1060901@centrum.cz>
References: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz> <431D1F31.1060901@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <200509060917.17310.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Dne ?t 6. z??? 2005 06:46 Petr Dvo??k napsal(a):
> jak uz sem ti psal, cely projekt je mozne vystavit na czflabs.net, v
> jakej formatu je dokumentace?

M? nejde o um?st?n?, t?ch najdu deset prdel?. 
M? jde o zdatn?ho grafomana, kter? z toho co je - zdroj?ky ve verilogu, 
reporty z p?eklada?e verilogu, eaglov? soubory s ti???kama, gerber data 
ti???k? a p?r fotek - ud?l? prezentovateln? web.

Jakub Ladman
>
> ROOTen
>
> Jakub Ladman wrote:
> >Najde se zde n?kdo komu bych spidera v cel? sv? kr?se p?edvedl a p?edal
> >dokumentaci s t?m ?e by to on n?jak zform?toval a po m?m schv?len? dal na
> > web (web m?me)?
> >Pro Clocka: pokud si to nerozmysl?m, nov? verze bude v gschem a pcb, ale
> > je nesmysl s jej?m n?vrhem za??t ne? budou zn?my v?echny chyby t?hle
> > desky. Ale mus? se naj?t zp?sob jak m?, zhej?kan?ho eaglem, to nau?it.
> >(ale stejn? je free software toolchain naru?enej v?vojov?ma n?strojema pro
> >CPLD, k ?emu? se jentak svobodn? alternativa neobjev?)
> >Jakub Ladman
> >
> >On Tuesday 06 of September 2005 00:26, Jakub Ladman wrote:
> >>Tak spider uz zda se perfektne funguje, stacilo pridat jen jeden odpor
> >> :-)
> >>
> >>Tady jsou dukazy z loopback testu :-)
> >>Vysilal jsem tohle:
> >>ping 10.16.1.134 -f -s 500
> >>
> >>tcp dump ukazal tohle:
> >>100880 packets captured
> >>100880 packets received by filter
> >>
> >>v priloze je zabaleny soubor data.vcd, prohlednutelny napr programem
> >>gtkwave (pridruzen k geda) ktery je vystupem logickeho analyzatoru kterym
> >>jsem to behem pingu meril. Je to velmi krasne doporucuji se na to mrknout
> >>
> >>:-) Ovsem i zabalene je to velke, asi to do ml neprojde.
> >>
> >>V nejblizsi dobe snad provedu test i s optickou trasou.
> >>Jakub
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Ronja mailing list
> >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Tue Sep  6 08:35:25 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 09:35:25 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
In-Reply-To: <200509060917.17310.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>	<200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<431D1F31.1060901@centrum.cz> <200509060917.17310.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <431D46BD.9010306@centrum.cz>

gratuluju gratuluju. mam ale takovy dotazecek... asi ses proti tomu 
soupnout zdrojaky, tistaky osazovaky no proste ten zaklad aby to slo 
spajet a aby to jelo jenom nekam aby se nedockavci (jako ja :) ) do toho 
mohli pustit ze? ...

nebyla by nejaka foteczka spidera?

Jakub Ladman napsal(a):
> Dne ?t 6. z??? 2005 06:46 Petr Dvo??k napsal(a):
> 
>>jak uz sem ti psal, cely projekt je mozne vystavit na czflabs.net, v
>>jakej formatu je dokumentace?
> 
> 
> M? nejde o um?st?n?, t?ch najdu deset prdel?. 
> M? jde o zdatn?ho grafomana, kter? z toho co je - zdroj?ky ve verilogu, 
> reporty z p?eklada?e verilogu, eaglov? soubory s ti???kama, gerber data 
> ti???k? a p?r fotek - ud?l? prezentovateln? web.
> 
> Jakub Ladman
> 
>>ROOTen
>>
>>Jakub Ladman wrote:
>>
>>>Najde se zde n?kdo komu bych spidera v cel? sv? kr?se p?edvedl a p?edal
>>>dokumentaci s t?m ?e by to on n?jak zform?toval a po m?m schv?len? dal na
>>>web (web m?me)?
>>>Pro Clocka: pokud si to nerozmysl?m, nov? verze bude v gschem a pcb, ale
>>>je nesmysl s jej?m n?vrhem za??t ne? budou zn?my v?echny chyby t?hle
>>>desky. Ale mus? se naj?t zp?sob jak m?, zhej?kan?ho eaglem, to nau?it.
>>>(ale stejn? je free software toolchain naru?enej v?vojov?ma n?strojema pro
>>>CPLD, k ?emu? se jentak svobodn? alternativa neobjev?)
>>>Jakub Ladman
>>>
>>>On Tuesday 06 of September 2005 00:26, Jakub Ladman wrote:
>>>
>>>>Tak spider uz zda se perfektne funguje, stacilo pridat jen jeden odpor
>>>>:-)
>>>>
>>>>Tady jsou dukazy z loopback testu :-)
>>>>Vysilal jsem tohle:
>>>>ping 10.16.1.134 -f -s 500
>>>>
>>>>tcp dump ukazal tohle:
>>>>100880 packets captured
>>>>100880 packets received by filter
>>>>
>>>>v priloze je zabaleny soubor data.vcd, prohlednutelny napr programem
>>>>gtkwave (pridruzen k geda) ktery je vystupem logickeho analyzatoru kterym
>>>>jsem to behem pingu meril. Je to velmi krasne doporucuji se na to mrknout
>>>>
>>>>:-) Ovsem i zabalene je to velke, asi to do ml neprojde.
>>>>
>>>>V nejblizsi dobe snad provedu test i s optickou trasou.
>>>>Jakub
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Tue Sep  6 09:21:40 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 10:21:40 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
In-Reply-To: <431D46BD.9010306@centrum.cz>
References: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<200509060917.17310.ladmanj@volny.cz> <431D46BD.9010306@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <200509061021.41332.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Dne ?t 6. z??? 2005 09:35 Jakub Michn?k napsal(a):
> gratuluju gratuluju. mam ale takovy dotazecek... asi ses proti tomu
> soupnout zdrojaky, tistaky osazovaky no proste ten zaklad aby to slo
> spajet a aby to jelo jenom nekam aby se nedockavci (jako ja :) ) do toho
> mohli pustit ze? ...
>
> nebyla by nejaka foteczka spidera?
mmnt, zkusim nejaky praweb vytvo?it
Jakub
>
> Jakub Ladman napsal(a):
> > Dne ?t 6. z??? 2005 06:46 Petr Dvo??k napsal(a):
> >>jak uz sem ti psal, cely projekt je mozne vystavit na czflabs.net, v
> >>jakej formatu je dokumentace?
> >
> > M? nejde o um?st?n?, t?ch najdu deset prdel?.
> > M? jde o zdatn?ho grafomana, kter? z toho co je - zdroj?ky ve verilogu,
> > reporty z p?eklada?e verilogu, eaglov? soubory s ti???kama, gerber data
> > ti???k? a p?r fotek - ud?l? prezentovateln? web.
> >
> > Jakub Ladman
> >
> >>ROOTen
> >>
> >>Jakub Ladman wrote:
> >>>Najde se zde n?kdo komu bych spidera v cel? sv? kr?se p?edvedl a p?edal
> >>>dokumentaci s t?m ?e by to on n?jak zform?toval a po m?m schv?len? dal
> >>> na web (web m?me)?
> >>>Pro Clocka: pokud si to nerozmysl?m, nov? verze bude v gschem a pcb, ale
> >>>je nesmysl s jej?m n?vrhem za??t ne? budou zn?my v?echny chyby t?hle
> >>>desky. Ale mus? se naj?t zp?sob jak m?, zhej?kan?ho eaglem, to nau?it.
> >>>(ale stejn? je free software toolchain naru?enej v?vojov?ma n?strojema
> >>> pro CPLD, k ?emu? se jentak svobodn? alternativa neobjev?)
> >>>Jakub Ladman
> >>>
> >>>On Tuesday 06 of September 2005 00:26, Jakub Ladman wrote:
> >>>>Tak spider uz zda se perfektne funguje, stacilo pridat jen jeden odpor
> >>>>
> >>>>:-)
> >>>>
> >>>>Tady jsou dukazy z loopback testu :-)
> >>>>Vysilal jsem tohle:
> >>>>ping 10.16.1.134 -f -s 500
> >>>>
> >>>>tcp dump ukazal tohle:
> >>>>100880 packets captured
> >>>>100880 packets received by filter
> >>>>
> >>>>v priloze je zabaleny soubor data.vcd, prohlednutelny napr programem
> >>>>gtkwave (pridruzen k geda) ktery je vystupem logickeho analyzatoru
> >>>> kterym jsem to behem pingu meril. Je to velmi krasne doporucuji se na
> >>>> to mrknout
> >>>>
> >>>>:-) Ovsem i zabalene je to velke, asi to do ml neprojde.
> >>>>
> >>>>V nejblizsi dobe snad provedu test i s optickou trasou.
> >>>>Jakub
> >>>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Ronja mailing list
> >>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From polous at katka.biz  Tue Sep  6 11:38:02 2005
From: polous at katka.biz (Martin Polehla)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 10:38:02 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
In-Reply-To: <200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <431D718A.8020107@katka.biz>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Jakub Ladman wrote:

> Najde se zde n?kdo komu bych spidera v cel? sv? kr?se p?edvedl a
> p?edal dokumentaci s t?m ?e by to on n?jak zform?toval a po m?m
> schv?len? dal na web (web m?me)? Pro Clocka: pokud si to
> nerozmysl?m, nov? verze bude v gschem a pcb, ale je nesmysl s jej?m
> n?vrhem za??t ne? budou zn?my v?echny chyby t?hle desky. Ale mus?
> se naj?t zp?sob jak m?, zhej?kan?ho eaglem, to nau?it. (ale stejn?
> je free software toolchain naru?enej v?vojov?ma n?strojema pro
> CPLD, k ?emu? se jentak svobodn? alternativa neobjev?) Jakub Ladman
>
>

S gschem & pcb mi hodne pomoh tenhle tutorial:
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/billw/gsch2pcb/tutorial-old.html


> On Tuesday 06 of September 2005 00:26, Jakub Ladman wrote:
>
>> Tak spider uz zda se perfektne funguje, stacilo pridat jen jeden
>> odpor :-)
>>
>> Tady jsou dukazy z loopback testu :-) Vysilal jsem tohle: ping
>> 10.16.1.134 -f -s 500
>>
>> tcp dump ukazal tohle: 100880 packets captured 100880 packets
>> received by filter
>>
>> v priloze je zabaleny soubor data.vcd, prohlednutelny napr
>> programem gtkwave (pridruzen k geda) ktery je vystupem logickeho
>> analyzatoru kterym jsem to behem pingu meril. Je to velmi krasne
>> doporucuji se na to mrknout :-) Ovsem i zabalene je to velke, asi
>> to do ml neprojde.
>>
>> V nejblizsi dobe snad provedu test i s optickou trasou. Jakub
>
skvele, gratuluju k uspechu - pokud to chces nekde testovat, mam tedka
nekolik hotovych vrabcu Rx, Tx, ktery cekaji na nasazeni na bile
hore/repy, pokud mas zajem slo by se asi dohodnout.

p0l0us


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From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 11:16:15 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 12:16:15 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
In-Reply-To: <200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <20050906101615.GB19744@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Tue, Sep 06, 2005 at 02:28:53AM +0200, Jakub Ladman wrote:

Hmm congratulations :)

> Najde se zde n?kdo komu bych spidera v cel? sv? kr?se p?edvedl a p?edal 
> dokumentaci s t?m ?e by to on n?jak zform?toval a po m?m schv?len? dal na web 
> (web m?me)?
> Pro Clocka: pokud si to nerozmysl?m, nov? verze bude v gschem a pcb, ale je 
> nesmysl s jej?m n?vrhem za??t ne? budou zn?my v?echny chyby t?hle desky.

Yes that would be good and it's necessary for Ronja ;-)

> Ale mus? se naj?t zp?sob jak m?, zhej?kan?ho eaglem, to nau?it.

lucasvo and p0l0us are currently trying to do RX PCB (polous) and
RX SMD PCB (lucasvo). We're on #ronja on freenode IRC. If you come there
you can get the same information how to work with gschem and PCB. p0l0us
has already placed the parts roughly around the board.

I don't have time I am going to work but I do it that when someone gets
stuck he posts question on #ronja and I give him a hint how to unstick
and it successfully goes this way :)

> (ale stejn? je free software toolchain naru?enej v?vojov?ma n?strojema pro 
> CPLD, k ?emu? se jentak svobodn? alternativa neobjev?)

You can reduce it by using wine or the web interface for the fitter.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 11:24:40 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 12:24:40 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
In-Reply-To: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <20050906102440.GA21203@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Tue, Sep 06, 2005 at 12:26:30AM +0200, Jakub Ladman wrote:
> Tak spider uz zda se perfektne funguje, stacilo pridat jen jeden odpor :-)

I have seen the data.vcd, looks impressive (though I didn't have time to
pick at it and look if the timing is right).

Can you send the rest of source codes too (Eagle .sch and .brd and the
Verilog or VHDL source)?

Can you please put the .vcd file on Ronja wiki into "Under develoment"
or how is this section called so one can download it from the web?

I have lately fixed TWiki so it allows Czech characters with accents
to be entered, even as topic names ;-)

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 12:14:11 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 13:14:11 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Dribble in Spider
Message-ID: <20050906111411.GA21704@kestrel.twibright.com>

Hi Jakub

There seems to be a dribble after EOFD somewhere between 810343-811200
ns in the data.vcd. I think that shouldn't be there. AFAIK Twister doesn't
generate this. At least IIRC I tried to design so it doesn't generate
it.

CL<


From fabyhenko at centrum.cz  Tue Sep  6 13:46:51 2005
From: fabyhenko at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Petr_Dvo=F8=E1k?=)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 14:46:51 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
In-Reply-To: <200509060917.17310.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>	<200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<431D1F31.1060901@centrum.cz> <200509060917.17310.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <431D8FBB.4070807@centrum.cz>

tak to bohuzel ne, se zdrojaky z verilogu nemam zadne zkusenosti, s 
eagle trochu jo,  gerber celkem jo, ale chtelo by to nekoho kdo to umi 
komplexne..

ROOTen
Jakub Ladman wrote:

>Dne ?t 6. z??? 2005 06:46 Petr Dvo??k napsal(a):
>  
>
>>jak uz sem ti psal, cely projekt je mozne vystavit na czflabs.net, v
>>jakej formatu je dokumentace?
>>    
>>
>
>M? nejde o um?st?n?, t?ch najdu deset prdel?. 
>M? jde o zdatn?ho grafomana, kter? z toho co je - zdroj?ky ve verilogu, 
>reporty z p?eklada?e verilogu, eaglov? soubory s ti???kama, gerber data 
>ti???k? a p?r fotek - ud?l? prezentovateln? web.
>
>Jakub Ladman
>  
>
>>ROOTen
>>
>>Jakub Ladman wrote:
>>    
>>
>>>Najde se zde n?kdo komu bych spidera v cel? sv? kr?se p?edvedl a p?edal
>>>dokumentaci s t?m ?e by to on n?jak zform?toval a po m?m schv?len? dal na
>>>web (web m?me)?
>>>Pro Clocka: pokud si to nerozmysl?m, nov? verze bude v gschem a pcb, ale
>>>je nesmysl s jej?m n?vrhem za??t ne? budou zn?my v?echny chyby t?hle
>>>desky. Ale mus? se naj?t zp?sob jak m?, zhej?kan?ho eaglem, to nau?it.
>>>(ale stejn? je free software toolchain naru?enej v?vojov?ma n?strojema pro
>>>CPLD, k ?emu? se jentak svobodn? alternativa neobjev?)
>>>Jakub Ladman
>>>
>>>On Tuesday 06 of September 2005 00:26, Jakub Ladman wrote:
>>>      
>>>
>>>>Tak spider uz zda se perfektne funguje, stacilo pridat jen jeden odpor
>>>>:-)
>>>>
>>>>Tady jsou dukazy z loopback testu :-)
>>>>Vysilal jsem tohle:
>>>>ping 10.16.1.134 -f -s 500
>>>>
>>>>tcp dump ukazal tohle:
>>>>100880 packets captured
>>>>100880 packets received by filter
>>>>
>>>>v priloze je zabaleny soubor data.vcd, prohlednutelny napr programem
>>>>gtkwave (pridruzen k geda) ktery je vystupem logickeho analyzatoru kterym
>>>>jsem to behem pingu meril. Je to velmi krasne doporucuji se na to mrknout
>>>>
>>>>:-) Ovsem i zabalene je to velke, asi to do ml neprojde.
>>>>
>>>>V nejblizsi dobe snad provedu test i s optickou trasou.
>>>>Jakub
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>      
>>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>    
>>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
>  
>



From ladmanj at volny.cz  Tue Sep  6 14:11:48 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 15:11:48 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER funguje !!!
In-Reply-To: <20050906101615.GB19744@kestrel.twibright.com>
References: <200509060026.30976.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<200509060228.54527.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<20050906101615.GB19744@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <200509061511.49179.ladmanj@volny.cz>

> You can reduce it by using wine or the web interface for the fitter.
Now is "native" linux version of webpack available for free too, but it is not 
free software.

>
> CL<
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Tue Sep  6 15:35:50 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 16:35:50 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?q?Str=E1nky_projektu_spider?=
Message-ID: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Tak tady jsou narychlo sp?chnut? str?nky v?novan? Spiderovi.
http://bleesmrt.hopto.org/~ladmanj/spider/
P?esto ?e jsou opravdu narychlo, str?vil jsem t?m asi p?t hodin, ne? jsem 
v?echno dal dohromady.

Zat?m je tam probl?m se zobrazov?n?m diakritiky, proto?e server nechce 
pochopit ?e jsou str?nky v iso-8859-2.

Zat?m tak? pouze ?e?tina. 
Na anglick? verzi bude muset zapracovat n?kdo jinej, proto?e j? se nem?n?m 
prezentovat svoj? k?ov??tinou.

Tak s t?m zach?zejte jak nejl?p um?te.
Jakub Ladman


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Tue Sep  6 15:54:42 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 16:54:42 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?q?Str=E1nky_projektu?= spider
In-Reply-To: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <200509061654.42932.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Co vy na to?

Dne ?t 6. z??? 2005 16:35 Jakub Ladman napsal(a):
> Tak tady jsou narychlo sp?chnut? str?nky v?novan? Spiderovi.
> http://bleesmrt.hopto.org/~ladmanj/spider/
> P?esto ?e jsou opravdu narychlo, str?vil jsem t?m asi p?t hodin, ne? jsem
> v?echno dal dohromady.
>
> Zat?m je tam probl?m se zobrazov?n?m diakritiky, proto?e server nechce
> pochopit ?e jsou str?nky v iso-8859-2.
>
> Zat?m tak? pouze ?e?tina.
> Na anglick? verzi bude muset zapracovat n?kdo jinej, proto?e j? se nem?n?m
> prezentovat svoj? k?ov??tinou.
>
> Tak s t?m zach?zejte jak nejl?p um?te.
> Jakub Ladman
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 18:44:32 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 19:44:32 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <42FBC638.5020108@post.cz>
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz>
	<005c01c59e94$153ced30$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<1123785278.42fb9a3e5fc9a@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<42FBABF5.70306@seznam.cz>
	<1123792740.42fbb764395c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<42FBC638.5020108@post.cz>
Message-ID: <20050906174432.GA24499@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 11:42:16PM +0200, Jan Martinu wrote:
> A co konstrukce zem na stineni a +12V na stredovem vodici koaxu pres
> tlumivku? Ja pouzil tlumivky 33uH. Musi se samozrejme zapojit pred vaz.
> kondenzatory

What type of coil with what max. current and what resistance did
you use, where did you buy it, how much did it cost, and how big is
it?

CL<

> jak v TX a RX, tak v interfacech a vyhodit odpory 82 Ohm.
> 
> profix


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 18:53:08 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 19:53:08 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <200508120257.30240@centrum.cz>
References: <200508120257.30240@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050906175308.GC24499@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Fri, Aug 12, 2005 at 02:57:13AM +0200, -=RYS=- wrote:
> ______________________________________________________________
> > Od: srnkap at extranetplus.cz
> > Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > CC: 
> > Datum: 11.08.2005 18:46
> > P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
> >
> > No to jsem si presne myslel, dalsi problem , co jsem slysel je , ze pri
> > nejakym atmosferickym vyboji +12V coaxova antena nachyta prepeti a odkouri
> > celou elektroniku ronjitka.
> Presne, naprikla mas CB antenu typ 5/8 bez T (nebo L) clanku proti zemi.
> Tudiz zivej zaric se pekne nabiji a v koaxu na konektoru ti dole preskakujou jiskry...je tam 2000V, protoze
> se ne nevybiji pres zemak na zem, ale je to ve "vzduchu".
> Existuje na to i prevodni tabulka (pouzivaj radioamateri).
> Treba ja, na KV ( do 30MHz) pouzivam na panelak antenu G5RV, coz jsou v podstate dva "draty", kazdy
> o delce cca 15m, ktere jsou napojene na "zebricek" do invertovaneho V.
> Ale i kdyz jsem pouzival jen dipol na 3.7MHz (2x20m dratu), kde stred je napojen na koax na primo a je na spici
> stozaru STA a kraje jsou chyceny na boku panelaku, tak 35m svodu RG213 do bytu mi odkouril vstup vysilacky,

I know what you mean.

If you have Twister then Twister is usually not galvanically grounded at
the PC but floating as DC wall cubes are floating.

However coaxial pair is grounded to the console and the guide requires
the user to connect the console into the lightning conductor.

At least in CZ, the lightning conductor must be connected with earth
protect conductor of the 230V system at the point where electric company
cable leaves the house.

If someone fails to do it according to the guide, he gets what
you describe: high voltage from the atmosphere on Ronja. If it's high
enough it can break through the insulation in TP transformer of the
NIC or insulation in DC power supply and during such a discharge kill
the things around the TP cable (both in Twister and PC).

Ronja is connected the way how TV antennas are. There's no difference.
If you install TV antenna incorrectly, you get fire or killed on
lightning strike or damaged electronics from atmospheric electricity.
The same with Ronja, if you install it against the guide.

CL<

> protoze pri vetru a za deste zaroven se kabel nabyl jak elyt na 6000V a tos me videt, kdyz jsem za bourky
> odpojoval koax od vysilacky, jak me konec kabelu (konektor PL259) tak "nakopl", ze vysilacka drzena
> v druhe ruce letela pres celej obejvak. Pak jsem tam dal jiskriste? 
> (http://www.qsl.net/ok0bez/files/rys/TPinterface_Ronja/foto/g5rv_jiskriste.jpg)
> takze se to napeti zmensilo jen na 500V a navic u vysilacky jsem si dal antenni tuner? (T-clanek), takze
> se to stejne vybije do kostry nez to prijde do vysilacky.
> Tudiz je jasne, ze kdyz se venku rozfouka a je zaroven mrholeni, tak se koax muze nabit i na 300V, coz
> spolehlive odkouri elektroniku. Nemusi hned, ale ten fetak v RX se bude postupne "upalovat", az
> bude RSSI co nejmensi a nebude to chodit (upalujou se diry ve fetaku...viz princim fetaku).
> 
> > Myslis ze by pohla uprava v kabelazi 
> > a) pouzit SFTP kabel a kazdym z paru
> > v nem nahradit vodice coaxu a stineni kabelu uzemnit zvlast treba na PEN
> > vodic nebo
> ?nepomuze
> 
> > b) pouzit tri nebo
> > ?ty?i coaxialy s dvojitym stinenim ? 
> 
> to je lepsi
> > 
> > Co nevidet to budu instalovat na strechu spoj a jestli se osvedci tak jich
> > pak bude v provozu hafo takze bych chtel predejit problemum.
> > P.S.?
> > Jak by byl nakladny vyvoj aby ronja vyhovovala z hlediska EMC ??
> To prave delam. Az budu hotovy, dam to na web.
> >?A jeste
> > by me zajimalo, jestli jste nekdo videli konstrukci komercniho crusadera a
> > jestli nekdo vi,
> > zda-li tento EMC splnuje ? Ja jsem k nemu dostal jakesi prohlaseni o
> > schode ale EMC ani ETSI ani ?.
> Crusader 10LED ... nesplnuje EMC, mechanicke zkousky (ESC/CSN)?ani ?50/8 z elektriky.
> -=RYS=-
> 
> 

> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 18:55:54 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 19:55:54 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <200508120257.30240@centrum.cz>
References: <200508120257.30240@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050906175554.GD24499@kestrel.twibright.com>

> Crusader 10LED ... nesplnuje EMC, mechanicke zkousky (ESC/CSN)?ani
> ?50/8 z elektriky.

How can $50/8 be violated in low-voltage device? Problems with
lightning?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 18:57:30 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 19:57:30 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <200508120305.30744@centrum.cz>
References: <200508120305.30744@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050906175730.GE24499@kestrel.twibright.com>

> Ano a dokonce i po GND (ja napriklad pouzivam cast hromosvodu jako antenu).
> VF "jde" i po zemi (GND)?, neni to DC napeti, ale VF napeti.

Did you see a case where RF would go through metal? Like if you place
RF device into closed soldered-up copper box without holes so it can
go through?

Can it go through when the box is tinned Fe instead? And what about
untinned Fe (like 0.5mm)?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 19:04:00 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 20:04:00 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <200508122325.27125@centrum.cz>
References: <200508122325.27125@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050906180400.GF24499@kestrel.twibright.com>

> > zabrani
> > to zminenemu ruseni, co vychazi z twisteru?
> 90% ruseni jde z RX
> Melo by pomoci, ale neznam konkretni Vasi situaci.

Did you do a test with RX closed down? What frequency is the
interference? What strength? Which wire does it spread over?

Is it white noise, some complicated interference, or spectral spikes
(oscillations)?

Does it appear even when I put RX just alone on 12V power?

CL<



From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Tue Sep  6 19:40:59 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 20:40:59 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?ISO-8859-2?Q?Str=E1nky_projektu_spider?=
In-Reply-To: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>

zupa, mi to staci :) .... jaka je sehnatelnost soucastek ve firmach ges 
a GM ? 50?% :) doufam ze vic :) ... nebylo by na skodu dat veci pro 
vyrobu TS horkemu, nebo proste to udelat tak, aby se u neho daly 
obednavat tistaky jako na tiwstra ... budiz mu brzo lehka zem :P ...

pak jak se divam na to schema, zda se ze po pridani 3 7404, ledky 
oriznuti TS je z toho kombinovany TX+iface ...nicht wahr?

Jakub Ladman napsal(a):
> Tak tady jsou narychlo sp?chnut? str?nky v?novan? Spiderovi.
> http://bleesmrt.hopto.org/~ladmanj/spider/
> P?esto ?e jsou opravdu narychlo, str?vil jsem t?m asi p?t hodin, ne? jsem 
> v?echno dal dohromady.
> 
> Zat?m je tam probl?m se zobrazov?n?m diakritiky, proto?e server nechce 
> pochopit ?e jsou str?nky v iso-8859-2.
> 
> Zat?m tak? pouze ?e?tina. 
> Na anglick? verzi bude muset zapracovat n?kdo jinej, proto?e j? se nem?n?m 
> prezentovat svoj? k?ov??tinou.
> 
> Tak s t?m zach?zejte jak nejl?p um?te.
> Jakub Ladman
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 19:43:49 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 20:43:49 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <200508120302.30548@centrum.cz>
References: <200508120302.30548@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050906184349.GA24989@kestrel.twibright.com>

> EMC od roku 1996 musi splnovat jakekoliv elektricke zarizeni.
> Dale specialne VSECHNA telekomunikacni zarizeni musi splnovat GP-18/1997.

That's not true. Ronja is telecommunication device and is out of scope
of GP-18/1997. GP-18/1997 says it's scope are only radio stations.

> 
> > Prohl??en? o shod?, jako?to koncov?mu z?kazn?kovi, naprosto sta??.
> 
> Prohlaseni o shode vydava autorizovana osoba/organizace na zaklade:
> elektricke zkousky, mechanicke zkousky (v tomto FSO pripade), EMC zkousky

What is mechanic test? Who prescribes what mechanic tests does it have
to pass?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 19:45:06 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 20:45:06 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <1123933573.42fddd85b445a@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <200508122325.27125@centrum.cz>
	<000301c59fd5$637157b0$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<1123933573.42fddd85b445a@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050906184506.GB24989@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sat, Aug 13, 2005 at 01:46:13PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Cituji z emailu od anMic <anmic at fmg.sk>:
> 
> > >> Pokud bych opt. hlavy napajel z jineho +12 stab. zdroje nez twister,
> > >> zabrani
> > >> to zminenemu ruseni, co vychazi z twisteru?
> > >90% ruseni jde z RX
> > >Melo by pomoci, ale neznam konkretni Vasi situaci.
> > 
> > A co kdybych zabalil RX i jeho svod do alobalu?
> > 
> Alobal moc nepomuze. To uz je lepsi pouzit STP.
> Cely v vtip je v tom ze krouceny par dratu sam o sobe skoro nezari, pokud se
> neprovede nejaka zhovadilost. Proste Maxwellovy zakony plati at se to nekomu

Twisted pair radiates. If it didn't, it could be put next to power lines
and not into min. 20cm distance.

CL<



From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 19:46:49 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 20:46:49 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] re
In-Reply-To: <005301c5a01b$e73664f0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <005301c5a01b$e73664f0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050906184649.GD24989@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sat, Aug 13, 2005 at 05:30:15PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> Re:
> 
> Ahoj Pavle, prosim te napis do konfery, ze z postovniho serveru centrum.cz nelze odeslat

I send a question to Jasper Wallace, maintainer of pointless.net

CL<
> 
> msg na ronja at list.pointless.net, takze jsem nemohl mnoha lidem odpovedet.
> 
> Ad Clock odblokuje domenu  centrum.cz  , protoze tohle mi prislo jako odpoved kdyz jsem
> 
> chtel odpovidat:
> 
> =================
> 
>       Od: The Post Office postmaster at centrum.cz 
> 
> 
>       P?edm?t: Returned mail: see the transcript [FAILED(1)] 
> 
> 
> -----------------------
> 
> 
> This is a collection of reports about email delivery
> process concerning a message you originated.
> 
> Some explanations/translations for these reports
> can be found at:
>      http://zmailer.org/delivery-report-decoding.html
> 
> If you are our customer, further help is available
> at email address: ____ @ ______  (TO BE FILLED IN)
> Reporting-MTA: dns; mail1002.centrum.cz
> Return-Path: <cd930 at centrum.cz>
> Arrival-Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:35 +0200
> Local-Spool-ID: S42566115AbVHMOyf
> 
> 
> FAILED:
>  Original Recipient:
>      rfc822;ronja at lists.pointless.net
>  Final Recipient:
>      RFC822;ronja at lists.pointless.net
>  Status:
>      5.1.1 (bad destination mailbox)
>  Remote MTA:
>      dns; thingy.pointless.net (195.82.99.78|25|213.29.7.174|55549)
>  Last Attempt Date:
>      Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:47 +0200
>  X-ZTAID:
>      smtp[14678]
>  Diagnostic Code:
>      smtp; 550 (spam source -- 1117152006)
>  Control data:
>      smtp lists.pointless.net ronja at lists.pointless.net 65534
>  Diagnostic texts:
>      <<- MAIL From:<cd930 at centrum.cz> SIZE=2861
>     ->> 250 OK
>     <<- RCPT To:<ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>     ->> 550-rejected because 213.29.7.174 is in a black list at dnsbl.njabl.org :
>     ->> 550 spam source -- 1117152006
> 
> Following is a copy of MESSAGE/DELIVERY-STATUS format section below.
> It is copied here in case your email client is unable to show it to you.
> The information here below is in  Internet Standard  format designed to
> assist automatic, and accurate presentation and usage of said information.
> In case you need human assistance from the Postmaster(s) of the system which
> sent you this report, please include this information in your question!
> 
>    Virtually Yours,
>        Automatic Email Delivery Software
> 
> Reporting-MTA: dns; mail1002.centrum.cz
> Arrival-Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:35 +0200
> Local-Spool-ID: S42566115AbVHMOyf
> 
> Original-Recipient: rfc822;ronja at lists.pointless.net
> Final-Recipient: RFC822;ronja at lists.pointless.net
> Action: failed
> Status: 5.1.1 (bad destination mailbox)
> Remote-MTA: dns; thingy.pointless.net (195.82.99.78|25|213.29.7.174|55549)
> Last-Attempt-Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:47 +0200
> Diagnostic-Code: smtp; 550 (spam source -- 1117152006)
> 
> 
> Following is copy of the message headers. Original message content may
> be in subsequent parts of this MESSAGE/DELIVERY-STATUS structure.
> 
> Received: by mail255.centrum.cz id S42566115AbVHMOyf;
> Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:35 +0200
> Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:35 +0200
> From: "-=RYS=-" <cd930 at centrum.cz>
> To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> X-Mailer: Centrum Mail 1.0
> MIME-Version: 1.0
> X-Priority: 3
> Message-ID: <200508131654.19205 at centrum.cz>
> Subject: Re: Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
> 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------
> P?edm?t: Re: Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
> Od: "-=RYS=-" <cd930 at centrum.cz>
> Pro: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> 
> > Od: anmic at fmg.sk
> > Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > CC: 
> > Datum: 13.08.2005 09:05
> > P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
> >
> > >> Pokud bych opt. hlavy napajel z jineho +12 stab. zdroje nez twister,
> > >> zabrani
> > >> to zminenemu ruseni, co vychazi z twisteru?
> > >90% ruseni jde z RX
> > >Melo by pomoci, ale neznam konkretni Vasi situaci.
> > 
> > A co kdybych zabalil RX i jeho svod do alobalu?
>                                                                               
> Tim se dobre ladi VF propust...delal bys z toho dokonale ladenej VF obvod.
> Takze to nepomuze.
>                                                                                           
> > 
> > >> Pomuze mi, kdyz potahnu koax uvnitr antenniho stozaru?
> > >Na 80% ne.
> > Myslel jsem, ze kdyz bude ten stozar dobre uzemneny, bude se chovat jako
> > uzemnene stineni u koaxu nebo nejak tak.
> > 
> > 
> > Mam Ronju postavenou podle navodu - muzu nahradit koaxy primo UTPckem bez
> > zmen v elektronice? Potreboval bych, aby to tak bezelo na asi 20 m. Jak to
> > bude vypadat s vyzarovanim v tomto pripade?
> > Nacrtek: http://ronja.ic.cz/ronja_utp.gif
>                                                                                                      
> Zkousel jsem to na 60m , tak jak to mas nakreslene to nepujde.
> Je treba VF signal "zdiferenciovat", pomohl by i jeden operak co maka do 15MHz (vyhoda...protoze operak
> neumi vic jak 15MHz zesilit, tak tam facha jako utlum...cili dolni propust rulez).
> Neco jako klasicke UTP...to je taky diferencialni a mezi dvema zivejma VF je impedance 100 ohmu.
> Testoval jsem to po kabelu UTP a vyzarovani pri ceste bylo prijatelne.
> Na spektrometru byl signal do 150cm od kabelaze. Takze tuto vzdalenost od TV/R zarizeni a koaxu je treba
> dodrzet. Horsi to bylo s "injekci" VF signalu, VF pole od CB (27MHz) bylo siroke 15m a narusovalo signal v UTP.
> A to bylo jen 4W PA do 5/8. Jeste horsi byla ant G5RV a do ni paleno 100W PA od 1.5 do 30MHz.
> VF signal se nainjektoval i ze vzdalenosti 50m a zrusil puvodni uzitecnej signal.
> -=RYS=-
>                                                                                                    
> > 
> > Diky, anMic
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> > 
> 
> 
> ========================================
> 
> Nejlepsi by bylo to takhle okopirovat a poslat na mail.list ronja rovnou, at to Clock zaridi.
> 
> 
> Zatim ahoj Martin   -=RYS=-
> 
> 
> 
> ______________________________________________________________
> > Od: srnkap at extranetplus.cz
> > Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > CC: 
> > Datum: 13.08.2005 13:26
> > P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] cocky 130
> >
> > muzes mi prosim napsat , jakou maji ohniskovou vzdalenost a presny prumer
> > ? 
> > napsal bys co si myslis o tom vedeni kabelu k hlavicim jak jsem ho
> > popisoval, potreboval bych vedet procentuelne na kolik to bude ucine,
> > anMic urcite taky :)
> > 
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: -=RYS=- 
> > To: ronja at lists.pointless.net 
> > Sent: Saturday, August 13, 2005 4:34 AM
> > Subject: Re: [Ronja] cocky 130
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > D 032 - LCH RB13 G
> > 
> > Tyhle mam i ty A mam.
> > 
> > G je sklenena (je lepsi s fokusem) , A je plast...uplne na ho....o
> > 
> > 
> > Cena asi 300,- a dodak tyden.
> > 
> > -=RYS=-
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ______________________________________________________________
> > > Od: srnkap at extranetplus.cz
> > > Komu: "Petr Salek" , "Twibright Ronja"
> > 
> > > CC: 
> > > Datum: 13.08.2005 00:08
> > > P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] cocky 130
> > >
> > > Jelikoz taky nemuzu sehnat cocky , napadlo me koupit lupy v
> > dioptre.Akorat
> > > nevim jake nejlepe.
> > > V uvahu pripada
> > > D 032 - LCH RB13 G
> > > 
> > > D 036 - LCH RB13 A
> > > 
> > > asi to bude jedno
> > > 
> > > zdroj www.dioptra.cz
> > > 
> > > Kupoval odsud nekdo neco ? mate predstavu kolik stoji, jake ma ohnisko
> > a
> > > jaka je dodaci lhuta ??
> > > 
> > > kvalitni by byt meli, a hlavne je predpoklad ze budou vsechny stejne !
> > > 
> > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Petr Salek" 
> > > To: 
> > > Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 11:30 PM
> > > Subject: [Ronja] cocky 130
> > > 
> > > 
> > > > Ty cocky co ted maj rakosky, to je fakt hruza, i za ty prachy.
> > > > Kupoval jsem to nadvakrat, nejdriv ty v cerveny krabicce a pak ty v
> > >
> > > zeleny.
> > > > Ty v cerveny byly docela fajn, teda az na to ze jsou vetsi a do moji
> > >
> > > konstrukce bez upravy nesly, ohnisko jakztakz snesitelny, cca 330mm,
> > ty v
> > > > zeleny do moji konstrukce pasly, mel jsem radost, nez jsem zjistil
> > ze
> > > maj > ohnisko cca 370.
> > > > Nakonec jsem to vyresil tak ze jsem dal ty s kratsim na tx a delsim
> > na
> > > rx, > kazdopadne opruz.
> > > >
> > > > Kdyz jsem stavel ronje loni, tak jsem kupoval taky v cerveny
> > krabicce, >
> > > stejny jako letos, ale meli prumer 125, ohnisko asi 310 akorat byla
> > kazda >
> > > jinak tlusta(tak pul napul, tenky, tlusty).
> > > >
> > > > A tak se ptam, nevite nahodou nekdo kde sehnat tyhle "spravny"
> > cocky?? >
> > > Kupoval jsem to ve stanku hned u vchodu, jak tam ma ty "kill bill"
> > mece, >
> > > tak jestli tam neni jeste nejakej "ronja verified" stanek.
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Ronja mailing list
> > > > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
> > > 
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Ronja mailing list
> > > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> > > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > 
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> > 
> > 

> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Tue Sep  6 19:47:14 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Tue,  6 Sep 2005 20:47:14 +0200
Subject: [Ronja]=?windows-1250?B?IFN0cuFua3kgcHI=?=ojektu spider
In-Reply-To: <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <1126032434.431de432df2e8@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

> zupa, mi to staci :) .... jaka je sehnatelnost soucastek ve firmach ges 
> a GM ? 50?% :) doufam ze vic :) ... nebylo by na skodu dat veci pro 
> vyrobu TS horkemu, nebo proste to udelat tak, aby se u neho daly 
> obednavat tistaky jako na tiwstra ... budiz mu brzo lehka zem :P ...
> 

Xilinxe vedou tady http://www.asix.cz/
A twisteru hned tak lehka zem nebude. Ke svemu staronovemu novemu RX dodelavam
pridavnou desticku pro twister za ucelem ucuneni toho co Clock kdysi nazval
Interpolisem.

> pak jak se divam na to schema, zda se ze po pridani 3 7404, ledky 
> oriznuti TS je z toho kombinovany TX+iface ...nicht wahr?
> 

Jeste musis kompenzovat dosvit LEDky, takze budes muset neco priprogramovat do
Xilinxu.

> Jakub Ladman napsal(a):
> > Tak tady jsou narychlo sp?chnut? str?nky v?novan? Spiderovi.
> > http://bleesmrt.hopto.org/~ladmanj/spider/
> > P?esto ?e jsou opravdu narychlo, str?vil jsem t?m asi p?t hodin, ne? jsem
> 
> > v?echno dal dohromady.
> > 
> > Zat?m je tam probl?m se zobrazov?n?m diakritiky, proto?e server nechce 
> > pochopit ?e jsou str?nky v iso-8859-2.
> > 
> > Zat?m tak? pouze ?e?tina. 
> > Na anglick? verzi bude muset zapracovat n?kdo jinej, proto?e j? se nem?n?m
> 
> > prezentovat svoj? k?ov??tinou.
> > 
> > Tak s t?m zach?zejte jak nejl?p um?te.
> > Jakub Ladman
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> > 
> > 
> > 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 





From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 19:47:58 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 20:47:58 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] re
In-Reply-To: <42FE3386.6000101@wifistar.net>
References: <005301c5a01b$e73664f0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<42FE3386.6000101@wifistar.net>
Message-ID: <20050906184758.GE24989@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sat, Aug 13, 2005 at 05:53:10PM +0000, David Sedl??ek wrote:
> Ano, na nas mailserver si z centra take nikdo neskrtne, a dobre jim tak.
> 
>  /550-rejected because 213.29.7.174 is in a black list at dnsbl.njabl.org /

Blacklist is bullshit. It's just bullying people. People should use
Bayesian filtering. What if I want to send an e-mail from blacklisted
IP? What if someone mistakenly blacklists me? What if someone spoofs
spams from my IP and my IP gets blacklisted for that?


CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 19:50:03 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 20:50:03 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <001001c5a0c3$33fd91d0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <20050814111403.GD22748@kestrel>
	<001001c5a0c3$33fd91d0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050906185003.GF24989@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Aug 14, 2005 at 01:27:49PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> And that will be only rx or tx too ? The VF interference from modules and 
> wire is fixed in this version of PCB?s ?

This is TX only. But now it's only 6241 CZK remaining :)

I don't know which interference you mean. An interference was reported
on Twister. I debugged it and that's already fixed.

CL<
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Karel Kulhavy" <clock at twibright.com>
> To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Sent: Sunday, August 14, 2005 1:14 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] problem
> 
> 
> >On Fri, Jul 15, 2005 at 11:22:45PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> >>tak se mi zda ze mi trosku usla pointa, nicmene, zajimalo by me, kolik by
> >>nekoho (treba jako me) stalo, dostat se ke kvalitnim plosnakum na ronju
> >>trebas od clocka (aby se mu tedy vratily naklady na vyvoj (verim ze to 
> >>neni
> >>pr*** ).Preci jenom kdyz nekdo potrebuje par optospoju a musi volit
> >>varianty typu crusader za 39k a vic tak se to celkem prodrazi :)) btw pry
> >>uz alphavawe dela 100mbit za 50k vcetne instalace ???
> >
> >If you want to have it immediately, 11 242.19 CZK.
> >
> >CL<
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Ronja mailing list
> >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 19:57:11 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 20:57:11 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] paketlos - chyba v navodu
In-Reply-To: <430061F6.1060808@katka.biz>
References: <42E74624.4060004@centrum.cz> <42E764E3.3010704@seznam.cz>
	<42E765A8.2020002@seznam.cz>
	<000801c5929b$518935a0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<42E7931C.6030506@katka.biz> <20050815070250.GE8856@kestrel>
	<430061F6.1060808@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <20050906185711.GA25178@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 09:35:50AM +0000, Martin Polehla wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> 
> >>>
> >> sem tekda tak zbezne koukal na navod na tetraposli
> >> installing&aiming a nikde sem poznamu o prebuzeni nenasel, i kdyz
> >> je to dost znama vec. chtelo by to do navodu doplnit.
> >
> >
> > It's written as minimum distance, or did I forget to put it there?
> >
> > CL<
> >
> I haven't found this there. Maximum RSSI value is also usefull for

http://localhost/tetrapolis/spec.php
Minimum operating distance 1/15 of nominal range. Further manual
reduction possible by change of two passive components in receiver.

> testing on the floor, I think. It shold be written on testing page and

That's obvious when you put RX and TX together isn't? Why do you think
it's useful?

CL<
> maybe on installing&aiming to.
> 
> p0l0us
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
> Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
> 
> iD8DBQFDAGGWYo9JRD7EbFIRAq5kAKCCpZnPG5BGlaeUuZpJe8MDiVuomwCgoxFB
> dPkmsz4JtJCbZew+BjkNYeA=
> =zYKS
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep  6 19:58:06 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 20:58:06 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SFH-203 - directional characteristics
In-Reply-To: <200508151158.15513.klapek@kki.net.pl>
References: <200508151158.15513.klapek@kki.net.pl>
Message-ID: <20050906185806.GB25178@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Mon, Aug 15, 2005 at 11:58:15AM +0200, Tomasz Koprowski wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I've been doing some RSSI and packet loss measurements for an optics-less link 
> and observed a weird phenomenon. 
> 
> When the receiver was rotated in such a way that the optical axis of the SFH 
> was about 30 degrees away in both dimensions from the optical axis of the 
> transmitter, the RSSI readings ware considerably higher than for the case 
> when the axes were parallel. This stands in contradiction to the directional 
> characteristics found in the datasheet.

> 
> Has anyone else observed such a behavior, or is it just a crapy molded 
> microlens in this particular piece of SFH?

You have just a piece with deformed lens. I think I have seen a bit of
this behaviour too once but am not completely sure.

CL<


From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Tue Sep  6 20:00:34 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 21:00:34 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?ISO-8859-2?Q?Str=E1nky_projektu_spider?=
In-Reply-To: <1126032434.431de432df2e8@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
	<1126032434.431de432df2e8@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <431DE752.7040203@centrum.cz>



Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
>>zupa, mi to staci :) .... jaka je sehnatelnost soucastek ve firmach ges 
>>a GM ? 50?% :) doufam ze vic :) ... nebylo by na skodu dat veci pro 
>>vyrobu TS horkemu, nebo proste to udelat tak, aby se u neho daly 
>>obednavat tistaky jako na tiwstra ... budiz mu brzo lehka zem :P ...
>>
> 
> 
> Xilinxe vedou tady http://www.asix.cz/
> A twisteru hned tak lehka zem nebude. Ke svemu staronovemu novemu RX dodelavam
> pridavnou desticku pro twister za ucelem ucuneni toho co Clock kdysi nazval
> Interpolisem.

tzn?

> 
> 
>>pak jak se divam na to schema, zda se ze po pridani 3 7404, ledky 
>>oriznuti TS je z toho kombinovany TX+iface ...nicht wahr?
>>
> 
> 
> Jeste musis kompenzovat dosvit LEDky, takze budes muset neco priprogramovat do
> Xilinxu.

coze? dyt dosavadni tx nic nekompenzuje co ja vim, tak co priprogramovavat?!

> 
> 
>>Jakub Ladman napsal(a):
>>
>>>Tak tady jsou narychlo sp?chnut? str?nky v?novan? Spiderovi.
>>>http://bleesmrt.hopto.org/~ladmanj/spider/
>>>P?esto ?e jsou opravdu narychlo, str?vil jsem t?m asi p?t hodin, ne? jsem
>>
>>>v?echno dal dohromady.
>>>
>>>Zat?m je tam probl?m se zobrazov?n?m diakritiky, proto?e server nechce 
>>>pochopit ?e jsou str?nky v iso-8859-2.
>>>
>>>Zat?m tak? pouze ?e?tina. 
>>>Na anglick? verzi bude muset zapracovat n?kdo jinej, proto?e j? se nem?n?m
>>
>>>prezentovat svoj? k?ov??tinou.
>>>
>>>Tak s t?m zach?zejte jak nejl?p um?te.
>>>Jakub Ladman
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Ronja mailing list
>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 


From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Tue Sep  6 20:08:36 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Tue,  6 Sep 2005 21:08:36 +0200
Subject: [Ronja]=?windows-1250?B?IFN0cuFua3kgcHI=?=ojektu spider
In-Reply-To: <431DE752.7040203@centrum.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
	<1126032434.431de432df2e8@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<431DE752.7040203@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <1126033716.431de934d7dd0@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

> 
> 
> Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
> >>zupa, mi to staci :) .... jaka je sehnatelnost soucastek ve firmach ges 
> >>a GM ? 50?% :) doufam ze vic :) ... nebylo by na skodu dat veci pro 
> >>vyrobu TS horkemu, nebo proste to udelat tak, aby se u neho daly 
> >>obednavat tistaky jako na tiwstra ... budiz mu brzo lehka zem :P ...
> >>
> > 
> > 
> > Xilinxe vedou tady http://www.asix.cz/
> > A twisteru hned tak lehka zem nebude. Ke svemu staronovemu novemu RX
> dodelavam
> > pridavnou desticku pro twister za ucelem ucuneni toho co Clock kdysi
> nazval
> > Interpolisem.
> 
> tzn?
> 

Tj.: neco sestavene z ronja komponent s dosahem kolem 3km.
Ted zrovna koukam ze ta desticka pude v pohode nasadit i na spidera.

> > 
> > 
> >>pak jak se divam na to schema, zda se ze po pridani 3 7404, ledky 
> >>oriznuti TS je z toho kombinovany TX+iface ...nicht wahr?
> >>
> > 
> > 
> > Jeste musis kompenzovat dosvit LEDky, takze budes muset neco priprogramovat
> do
> > Xilinxu.
> 
> coze? dyt dosavadni tx nic nekompenzuje co ja vim, tak co
> priprogramovavat?!

kdyz to tam pustis rovnou vznikne PWD zkresleni. To byl duvod proc RYSova infra
verze chodila tak blbe. Rychlosti jaxe ledka rozsviti a znasne nejsou stejne.
Rozdil je tak 10-20ns podle typu.
V Clockove TX se to kompenzuje pomoci delice 27k a 47k a prvni trojice hradel u
budice.

> 
> > 
> > 
> >>Jakub Ladman napsal(a):
> >>
> >>>Tak tady jsou narychlo sp?chnut? str?nky v?novan? Spiderovi.
> >>>http://bleesmrt.hopto.org/~ladmanj/spider/
> >>>P?esto ?e jsou opravdu narychlo, str?vil jsem t?m asi p?t hodin, ne?
> jsem



From sith at wifistar.net  Tue Sep  6 22:18:10 2005
From: sith at wifistar.net (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?David_Sedl=E1=E8ek?=)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 21:18:10 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] re
In-Reply-To: <20050906184758.GE24989@kestrel.twibright.com>
References: <005301c5a01b$e73664f0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<42FE3386.6000101@wifistar.net>
	<20050906184758.GE24989@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <431E0792.60106@wifistar.net>

Nic. A v praxi jsem se s tim setkal jen poskromnu.
Blacklist je podle mne naopak uzitecna vec /pokud se do nej dostane
nekdo nahodou, samozrejme se tomu uz v drtive vetsine pripadu nijak
neubrani/. V dnesni dobe je velmi ucinny v pripadech, kdy na server
prichazi x desitek/stovek mailu denne (e.g. spam).

-Bayes rozpozna spam mimojine az kdyz ho precte
-blacklist je sice "brutus" a velmi neohrabany, ale na druhou stranu s
nim odfiltruji odchozi spam uz pri pokusu o spojeni s mta = zbytecne
plytvani konektivitou. A to pak maji samozrejme potencialni, nic
netusici uzivatele smulu.

Ostatne, /je to vas nazor/ :)))

Blacklist pouzivam a v kombinaci s Bayesianem je to neprustrelna ochrana.

} dost ot, gratuluji k fcnimu Spiderovi a tesim se az ho otestuji.

Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> On Sat, Aug 13, 2005 at 05:53:10PM +0000, David Sedl??ek wrote:
> 
>>Ano, na nas mailserver si z centra take nikdo neskrtne, a dobre jim tak.
>>
>> /550-rejected because 213.29.7.174 is in a black list at dnsbl.njabl.org /
> 
> 
> Blacklist is bullshit. It's just bullying people. People should use
> Bayesian filtering. What if I want to send an e-mail from blacklisted
> IP? What if someone mistakenly blacklists me? What if someone spoofs
> spams from my IP and my IP gets blacklisted for that?
> 
> 
> CL<

-- 
Regards,
David Sedl??ek
WiFiStar.net, o.s.
skype: sith_cz


From kendy at hkfree.org  Tue Sep  6 20:19:39 2005
From: kendy at hkfree.org (Kendy - HKFree)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 21:19:39 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?windows-1250?Q?Str=E1nky_projektu_spider?=
In-Reply-To: <200509061654.42932.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<200509061654.42932.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <431DEBCB.2030602@hkfree.org>

Super !

Uz se tesim na prvni kousky co pujdou k nam do site.


Kendy
HKfree

Jakub Ladman napsal(a):

> Co vy na to?
> 
> Dne ?t 6. z??? 2005 16:35 Jakub Ladman napsal(a):
> 
>>Tak tady jsou narychlo sp?chnut? str?nky v?novan? Spiderovi.
>>http://bleesmrt.hopto.org/~ladmanj/spider/
>>P?esto ?e jsou opravdu narychlo, str?vil jsem t?m asi p?t hodin, ne? jsem
>>v?echno dal dohromady.
>>
>>Zat?m je tam probl?m se zobrazov?n?m diakritiky, proto?e server nechce
>>pochopit ?e jsou str?nky v iso-8859-2.
>>
>>Zat?m tak? pouze ?e?tina.
>>Na anglick? verzi bude muset zapracovat n?kdo jinej, proto?e j? se nem?n?m
>>prezentovat svoj? k?ov??tinou.
>>
>>Tak s t?m zach?zejte jak nejl?p um?te.
>>Jakub Ladman
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 


From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Tue Sep  6 20:25:08 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 21:25:08 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?ISO-8859-2?Q?Str=E1nky_projektu_spider?=
In-Reply-To: <1126033716.431de934d7dd0@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>	<1126032434.431de432df2e8@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<431DE752.7040203@centrum.cz>
	<1126033716.431de934d7dd0@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <431DED14.7010406@centrum.cz>



Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
>>
>>Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
>>
>>>>zupa, mi to staci :) .... jaka je sehnatelnost soucastek ve firmach ges 
>>>>a GM ? 50?% :) doufam ze vic :) ... nebylo by na skodu dat veci pro 
>>>>vyrobu TS horkemu, nebo proste to udelat tak, aby se u neho daly 
>>>>obednavat tistaky jako na tiwstra ... budiz mu brzo lehka zem :P ...
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Xilinxe vedou tady http://www.asix.cz/
>>>A twisteru hned tak lehka zem nebude. Ke svemu staronovemu novemu RX
>>
>>dodelavam
>>
>>>pridavnou desticku pro twister za ucelem ucuneni toho co Clock kdysi
>>
>>nazval
>>
>>>Interpolisem.
>>
>>tzn?
>>
> 
> 
> Tj.: neco sestavene z ronja komponent s dosahem kolem 3km.
> Ted zrovna koukam ze ta desticka pude v pohode nasadit i na spidera.
> 
> 
>>>
>>>>pak jak se divam na to schema, zda se ze po pridani 3 7404, ledky 
>>>>oriznuti TS je z toho kombinovany TX+iface ...nicht wahr?
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Jeste musis kompenzovat dosvit LEDky, takze budes muset neco priprogramovat
>>
>>do
>>
>>>Xilinxu.
>>
>>coze? dyt dosavadni tx nic nekompenzuje co ja vim, tak co
>>priprogramovavat?!
> 
> 
> kdyz to tam pustis rovnou vznikne PWD zkresleni. To byl duvod proc RYSova infra
> verze chodila tak blbe. Rychlosti jaxe ledka rozsviti a znasne nejsou stejne.
> Rozdil je tak 10-20ns podle typu.
> V Clockove TX se to kompenzuje pomoci delice 27k a 47k a prvni trojice hradel u
> budice.

aha,takze to urizlo kus obdelniku. zkratilo/prodlouzilo ho to, nebo to 
chapu blbe? a co tak to tam pridat i s tim delicem :) ?

> 
> 
>>>
>>>>Jakub Ladman napsal(a):
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Tak tady jsou narychlo sp?chnut? str?nky v?novan? Spiderovi.
>>>>>http://bleesmrt.hopto.org/~ladmanj/spider/
>>>>>P?esto ?e jsou opravdu narychlo, str?vil jsem t?m asi p?t hodin, ne?
>>
>>jsem
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Tue Sep  6 21:37:32 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 22:37:32 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?q?Str=E1nky_projektu?= spider
In-Reply-To: <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <200509062237.33225.ladmanj@volny.cz>

On Tuesday 06 of September 2005 20:40, Jakub Michn?k wrote:
> zupa, mi to staci :) .... jaka je sehnatelnost soucastek ve firmach ges
> a GM ? 50?% :) doufam ze vic :) ... nebylo by na skodu dat veci pro

www.asix.cz mne pekne nasral, priste asi budu objednavat u www.mespraha.cz
Nektery ty shottkyho diody a transily taky normalne nejdou koupit, ale mam v 
planu jich obednat pakl a rozprodavat.

> vyrobu TS horkemu, nebo proste to udelat tak, aby se u neho daly

Nevim kdo to je.

> obednavat tistaky jako na tiwstra ... budiz mu brzo lehka zem :P ...
>
> pak jak se divam na to schema, zda se ze po pridani 3 7404, ledky
> oriznuti TS je z toho kombinovany TX+iface ...nicht wahr?
Xilinx by to mohlutahnout sam jeden pin umi 20mA a je jich tam volnych hafo, 
jen nemam provereno, jaky je maximalni vystupni proud v souctu.
>
Jeste na webu chybi navod, jak namotat to trafo a mozna jeste neco.
Jakub


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Tue Sep  6 21:40:25 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Tue, 6 Sep 2005 22:40:25 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?q?Str=E1nky_projektu?= spider
In-Reply-To: <200509062237.33225.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
	<200509062237.33225.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <200509062240.25517.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Jo a ctyri TP trafa ted budu kupovat za 380,- penez, takze komu se nechce je 
pacit ze sitovek, taky se z toho neposere.
Jakub


From daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz  Tue Sep  6 23:48:24 2005
From: daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz (Daniel Strnad)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 22:48:24 -0000
Subject: =?utf-8?Q?=5BRonja=5D_Str=C3=A1nky_projektu_spider?=
In-Reply-To: <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <opswpdmyggn6qjls@daman>

On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 20:40:59 +0200, Jakub Michn?k  
<jakub.michnik at centrum.cz> wrote:


> pak jak se divam na to schema, zda se ze po pridani 3 7404, ledky
> oriznuti TS je z toho kombinovany TX+iface ...nicht wahr?
>
Na necem takovym uz nejakou chvili delam.. Melo by to byt uvolneny tak do  
mesice, nanejvys do  dvou.


From daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz  Tue Sep  6 23:56:06 2005
From: daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz (Daniel Strnad)
Date: Tue, 06 Sep 2005 22:56:06 -0000
Subject: =?utf-8?Q?=5BRonja=5D_Str=C3=A1nky_projektu_spider?=
In-Reply-To: <200509062240.25517.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
	<200509062237.33225.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<200509062240.25517.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <opswpdzse9n6qjls@daman>

No to si radsi vypacim. Jinak kde si koupil SMD verze tech mc3487 a mc3786?

> Jo a ctyri TP trafa ted budu kupovat za 380,- penez, takze komu se  
> nechce je
> pacit ze sitovek, taky se z toho neposere.
> Jakub
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Tue Sep  6 23:13:17 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2005 00:13:17 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-1?q?Str=E1nky_projektu?= spider
In-Reply-To: <opswpdzse9n6qjls@daman>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<200509062240.25517.ladmanj@volny.cz> <opswpdzse9n6qjls@daman>
Message-ID: <200509070013.17952.ladmanj@volny.cz>

On Wednesday 07 of September 2005 00:56, Daniel Strnad wrote:
> No to si radsi vypacim.
Kdyz jich pro vsechny objednam vic, budou znatelne levnejsi.
> Jinak kde si koupil SMD verze tech mc3487 a mc3786? 
Dostal jsem je jako vzorky od www.national.com
Ty taky chci hromadne objednat.
Sepisu ty problematicke soucastky na ten web vcetne informaci o tom odkud je 
brat.
Jakub
>
> > Jo a ctyri TP trafa ted budu kupovat za 380,- penez, takze komu se
> > nechce je
> > pacit ze sitovek, taky se z toho neposere.
> > Jakub
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From Korda.M at seznam.cz  Wed Sep  7 05:43:55 2005
From: Korda.M at seznam.cz (=?us-ascii?Q?Milan=20Korda?=)
Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2005 06:43:55 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: =?iso-8859-2?Q?Re=3A=20=5BRonja=5D=20Str=E1nky=20projektu=20spider?=
In-Reply-To: <200509070013.17952.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <1337.2075-15192-170232286-1126068235@seznam.cz>

Gratuluji k uspechu. Nevis kolik bude priblizne cena soucastek na jednoho spidera? Aby to nebylo zase moc drahy oproti Twisteru..
> ------------ Puvodni zprava ------------
> Od: Jakub Ladman <ladmanj at volny.cz>
> Predmet: Re: [Ronja] Str?nky projektu spider
> Datum: 07.9.2005 01:13:12
> ----------------------------------------
> On Wednesday 07 of September 2005 00:56, Daniel Strnad wrote:
> > No to si radsi vypacim.
> Kdyz jich pro vsechny objednam vic, budou znatelne levnejsi.
> > Jinak kde si koupil SMD verze tech mc3487 a mc3786? 
> Dostal jsem je jako vzorky od www.national.com
> Ty taky chci hromadne objednat.
> Sepisu ty problematicke soucastky na ten web vcetne informaci o tom odkud je 
> brat.
> Jakub
> >
> > > Jo a ctyri TP trafa ted budu kupovat za 380,- penez, takze komu se
> > > nechce je
> > > pacit ze sitovek, taky se z toho neposere.
> > > Jakub
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Ronja mailing list
> > > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 


From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Wed Sep  7 08:52:01 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Wed,  7 Sep 2005 09:52:01 +0200
Subject: [Ronja]=?windows-1250?B?IFN0csOhbmt5IHA=?=rojektu spider
In-Reply-To: <opswpdmyggn6qjls@daman>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz> <opswpdmyggn6qjls@daman>
Message-ID: <1126079521.431e9c21f2851@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

Cituji z emailu od Daniel Strnad <daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz>:

> On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 20:40:59 +0200, Jakub Michn??k  
> <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz> wrote:
> 
> 
> > pak jak se divam na to schema, zda se ze po pridani 3 7404, ledky
> > oriznuti TS je z toho kombinovany TX+iface ...nicht wahr?
> >
> Na necem takovym uz nejakou chvili delam.. Melo by to byt uvolneny tak do  
> mesice, nanejvys do  dvou.
> 

Jaxes s tim daleko?
Mas osetreno PWD zkresleni od LEDky? Aby to nedopadlo jako puvodni TXface od Sylvie?

A byl by problem udelat vstup od RXu jako UTP konektor se zapojenim:
1 - RX- prijde zapojit na pin 6. 26LS32, resp. mozno propojkou prepojit na GND
2 - RX+ v twisteru zapojeno na pin 7. 26LS32
3 - RSSI GND
4 - +12V
5 - GND
6 - RSSI
7 - GND
8 - +12V
Mam nachystany plosnaky pro RX kde je mozno zapojit vystup bud na koaxy, nebo
diferencialne na UTP cimz se naplno vyuzije moznosti primace. Je to ta vec na
http://laser.webpark.cz/work.html nebo
http://twiki.twibright.com/bin/view/Main/RxPcbSeligr , pristi tyden osadim
prototypovou varku od verze1 a behem vykendu to bude podrobeno kritice a za cca
14 dni budou data na webu podobne jako od spideru.

P.Seliger



From ladmanj at volny.cz  Wed Sep  7 08:57:10 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2005 09:57:10 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?q?Str=E1nky_projektu?= spider
In-Reply-To: <200509070013.17952.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <opswpdzse9n6qjls@daman>
	<200509070013.17952.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <200509070957.11141.ladmanj@volny.cz>

> > > Jo a ctyri TP trafa ted budu kupovat za 380,- penez, takze komu se
Omyl, cena je 350 za cty?i.


From daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz  Wed Sep  7 11:10:33 2005
From: daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz (Daniel Strnad)
Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2005 10:10:33 -0000
Subject: =?utf-8?B?W1JvbmphXSBTdHLEgsuHbmt5IHByb2pla3R1IHNwaWRlcg==?=
In-Reply-To: <1126079521.431e9c21f2851@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz> <opswpdmyggn6qjls@daman>
	<1126079521.431e9c21f2851@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <opswp87vd6n6qjls@daman>

No tak v podstate staci par veci doladit... PWD zkresleni osetreny mam,  
nicmene stejne se me to buzeni ledky pomoci 3x 74HC04 moc nelibi. Misto  
nich tam dam neco jinyho(jeste nevim co) a bude to cely. Zbytek funguje  
OK. Propojeni mezi RX je reseny UTPckem uz ted a trochu to poupravit podle  
toho co si napsal neni problem.

On Wed,  7 Sep 2005 09:52:01 +0200, <Seligr at sh.cvut.cz> wrote:
> Jaxes s tim daleko?
> Mas osetreno PWD zkresleni od LEDky? Aby to nedopadlo jako puvodni  
> TXface od Sylvie?
>
> A byl by problem udelat vstup od RXu jako UTP konektor se zapojenim:
> 1 - RX- prijde zapojit na pin 6. 26LS32, resp. mozno propojkou prepojit  
> na GND
> 2 - RX+ v twisteru zapojeno na pin 7. 26LS32
> 3 - RSSI GND
> 4 - +12V
> 5 - GND
> 6 - RSSI
> 7 - GND
> 8 - +12V
> Mam nachystany plosnaky pro RX kde je mozno zapojit vystup bud na koaxy,  
> nebo
> diferencialne na UTP cimz se naplno vyuzije moznosti primace. Je to ta  
> vec na
> http://laser.webpark.cz/work.html nebo
> http://twiki.twibright.com/bin/view/Main/RxPcbSeligr , pristi tyden  
> osadim
> prototypovou varku od verze1 a behem vykendu to bude podrobeno kritice a  
> za cca
> 14 dni budou data na webu podobne jako od spideru.
>
> P.Seliger
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



-- 
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Wed Sep  7 09:13:34 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2005 10:13:34 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-2?q?Str=C3=B7nky_projektu?= spider
In-Reply-To: <1126079521.431e9c21f2851@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <opswpdmyggn6qjls@daman>
	<1126079521.431e9c21f2851@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <200509071013.34550.ladmanj@volny.cz>

>
> A byl by problem udelat vstup od RXu jako UTP konektor se zapojenim:
> 1 - RX- prijde zapojit na pin 6. 26LS32, resp. mozno propojkou prepojit na
> GND 2 - RX+ v twisteru zapojeno na pin 7. 26LS32
> 3 - RSSI GND
> 4 - +12V
> 5 - GND
> 6 - RSSI
> 7 - GND
> 8 - +12V

Mne se to nelibi, kvuli zamenitelnosti ethernet a rx tx kabelu v konektorech, 
radsi bych na tvem miste pouzil sestipinove RJcko navic jak samec tak samice 
je v GM vyrazne levnejsi (coz neni rozhodujici, ale ...).
Na RX a TX modulech bych pak pouzil samorezne svorkovnice co jsou napriklad na 
deskach v patch panelech, pripojeni pomoci specialniho ondone je veci 
vteriny. A ne posrana cokolada grrrrr, ve ktery se kabel jenom lame.
Jakub Ladman


From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Wed Sep  7 10:01:49 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Wed,  7 Sep 2005 11:01:49 +0200
Subject: [Ronja]=?windows-1250?B?IFN0csQmIzY1NTM=?==?windows-1250?B?MzvLJiM2NTUzMzs=?=nky
	projektu spider
In-Reply-To: <opswp87vd6n6qjls@daman>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz> <opswpdmyggn6qjls@daman>
	<1126079521.431e9c21f2851@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<opswp87vd6n6qjls@daman>
Message-ID: <1126083709.431eac7d8f5d8@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

> No tak v podstate staci par veci doladit... PWD zkresleni osetreny mam,  
> nicmene stejne se me to buzeni ledky pomoci 3x 74HC04 moc nelibi. Misto  

Dej tam 2* 74AC04 SMD, tady neni co resit i profici to tak delaj.

> nich tam dam neco jinyho(jeste nevim co) a bude to cely. Zbytek funguje  
> OK. Propojeni mezi RX je reseny UTPckem uz ted a trochu to poupravit podle 
> 

To tam mas par UTP - jeden drat GND, druhej signal + vymeneny odpor 75R na
vystupu RX za 100R? Takhle jsem to puvodne udelal taky, a proto bych na nozicku
1. nize popsanou dal jeste volitelne propojku na zem. Kdyz se do da s puvodnim
zapojenim. Nicmene plne diferncialni par je prece jen o necem jinem.
 
> toho co si napsal neni problem.
> 
> On Wed,  7 Sep 2005 09:52:01 +0200, <Seligr at sh.cvut.cz> wrote:
> > Jaxes s tim daleko?
> > Mas osetreno PWD zkresleni od LEDky? Aby to nedopadlo jako puvodni  
> > TXface od Sylvie?
> >
> > A byl by problem udelat vstup od RXu jako UTP konektor se zapojenim:
> > 1 - RX- prijde zapojit na pin 6. 26LS32, resp. mozno propojkou prepojit  
> > na GND
> > 2 - RX+ v twisteru zapojeno na pin 7. 26LS32
> > 3 - RSSI GND
> > 4 - +12V
> > 5 - GND
> > 6 - RSSI
> > 7 - GND
> > 8 - +12V
> > Mam nachystany plosnaky pro RX kde je mozno zapojit vystup bud na koaxy, 
> 
> > nebo
> > diferencialne na UTP cimz se naplno vyuzije moznosti primace. Je to ta  
> > vec na
> > http://laser.webpark.cz/work.html nebo
> > http://twiki.twibright.com/bin/view/Main/RxPcbSeligr , pristi tyden  
> > osadim
> > prototypovou varku od verze1 a behem vykendu to bude podrobeno kritice a 
> 
> > za cca
> > 14 dni budou data na webu podobne jako od spideru.
> >
> > P.Seliger
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 





From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep  7 10:09:10 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2005 11:09:10 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] [srnkap@extranetplus.cz:  re]
In-Reply-To: <Pine.NEB.4.62.0509062342110.758@jellycat.home.pointless.net>
References: <20050906184624.GC24989@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<Pine.NEB.4.62.0509062342110.758@jellycat.home.pointless.net>
Message-ID: <20050907090910.GC28621@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Tue, Sep 06, 2005 at 11:47:14PM +0100, Jasper Wallace wrote:

Thanks Jasper.

CL<
> On Tue, 6 Sep 2005, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> 
> >Hi Jasper
> >
> >Is this e-mail blocking already fixed please?
> 
> This is a different case - the mail1002.centrum.cz (213.29.7.174)
> is listed in the dnsbl.njabl.org dns block list, (It's also listed in the
> spamcop block list).
> 
> Since my server uses the dnsbl.njabl.org list to block email, it got
> rejected.
> 
> I've whitelisted it on my mailserver, but they need to find out why spamcop
> and njabl have listed them and stop doing it (e.g. kick the spammer from
> there service etc).
> 
> There is an example of the spam here:
> 
> http://www.njabl.org/cgi-bin/lookup.cgi?query=213.29.7.174
> 
> >----- Forwarded message from Pavel Srnka <srnkap at extranetplus.cz> -----
> >
> >Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 17:30:15 +0200
> >From: Pavel Srnka <srnkap at extranetplus.cz>
> >To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >Subject: [Ronja] re
> >X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 6.00.2900.2180
> >
> >Re:
> >
> >Ahoj Pavle, prosim te napis do konfery, ze z postovniho serveru centrum.cz 
> >nelze odeslat
> >
> >msg na ronja at list.pointless.net, takze jsem nemohl mnoha lidem odpovedet.
> >
> >Ad Clock odblokuje domenu  centrum.cz  , protoze tohle mi prislo jako 
> >odpoved kdyz jsem
> >
> >chtel odpovidat:
> >
> >=================
> >
> >     Od: The Post Office postmaster at centrum.cz
> >
> >
> >     P?edm?t: Returned mail: see the transcript [FAILED(1)]
> >
> >
> >-----------------------
> >
> >
> >This is a collection of reports about email delivery
> >process concerning a message you originated.
> >
> >Some explanations/translations for these reports
> >can be found at:
> >    http://zmailer.org/delivery-report-decoding.html
> >
> >If you are our customer, further help is available
> >at email address: ____ @ ______  (TO BE FILLED IN)
> >Reporting-MTA: dns; mail1002.centrum.cz
> >Return-Path: <cd930 at centrum.cz>
> >Arrival-Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:35 +0200
> >Local-Spool-ID: S42566115AbVHMOyf
> >
> >
> >FAILED:
> >Original Recipient:
> >    rfc822;ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >Final Recipient:
> >    RFC822;ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >Status:
> >    5.1.1 (bad destination mailbox)
> >Remote MTA:
> >    dns; thingy.pointless.net (195.82.99.78|25|213.29.7.174|55549)
> >Last Attempt Date:
> >    Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:47 +0200
> >X-ZTAID:
> >    smtp[14678]
> >Diagnostic Code:
> >    smtp; 550 (spam source -- 1117152006)
> >Control data:
> >    smtp lists.pointless.net ronja at lists.pointless.net 65534
> >Diagnostic texts:
> >    <<- MAIL From:<cd930 at centrum.cz> SIZE=2861
> >   ->> 250 OK
> >   <<- RCPT To:<ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >   ->> 550-rejected because 213.29.7.174 is in a black list at 
> >   dnsbl.njabl.org :
> >   ->> 550 spam source -- 1117152006
> >
> >Following is a copy of MESSAGE/DELIVERY-STATUS format section below.
> >It is copied here in case your email client is unable to show it to you.
> >The information here below is in  Internet Standard  format designed to
> >assist automatic, and accurate presentation and usage of said information.
> >In case you need human assistance from the Postmaster(s) of the system 
> >which
> >sent you this report, please include this information in your question!
> >
> >  Virtually Yours,
> >      Automatic Email Delivery Software
> >
> >Reporting-MTA: dns; mail1002.centrum.cz
> >Arrival-Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:35 +0200
> >Local-Spool-ID: S42566115AbVHMOyf
> >
> >Original-Recipient: rfc822;ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >Final-Recipient: RFC822;ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >Action: failed
> >Status: 5.1.1 (bad destination mailbox)
> >Remote-MTA: dns; thingy.pointless.net (195.82.99.78|25|213.29.7.174|55549)
> >Last-Attempt-Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:47 +0200
> >Diagnostic-Code: smtp; 550 (spam source -- 1117152006)
> >
> >
> >Following is copy of the message headers. Original message content may
> >be in subsequent parts of this MESSAGE/DELIVERY-STATUS structure.
> >
> >Received: by mail255.centrum.cz id S42566115AbVHMOyf;
> >Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:35 +0200
> >Date: Sat, 13 Aug 2005 16:54:35 +0200
> >From: "-=RYS=-" <cd930 at centrum.cz>
> >To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >X-Mailer: Centrum Mail 1.0
> >MIME-Version: 1.0
> >X-Priority: 3
> >Message-ID: <200508131654.19205 at centrum.cz>
> >Subject: Re: Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
> >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1250"
> >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
> >
> >
> >-------------------------------------------------
> >P?edm?t: Re: Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
> >Od: "-=RYS=-" <cd930 at centrum.cz>
> >Pro: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >
> >>Od: anmic at fmg.sk
> >>Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>CC:
> >>Datum: 13.08.2005 09:05
> >>P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
> >>
> >>>>Pokud bych opt. hlavy napajel z jineho +12 stab. zdroje nez twister,
> >>>>zabrani
> >>>>to zminenemu ruseni, co vychazi z twisteru?
> >>>90% ruseni jde z RX
> >>>Melo by pomoci, ale neznam konkretni Vasi situaci.
> >>
> >>A co kdybych zabalil RX i jeho svod do alobalu?
> >
> >Tim se dobre ladi VF propust...delal bys z toho dokonale ladenej VF obvod.
> >Takze to nepomuze.
> >
> >>
> >>>>Pomuze mi, kdyz potahnu koax uvnitr antenniho stozaru?
> >>>Na 80% ne.
> >>Myslel jsem, ze kdyz bude ten stozar dobre uzemneny, bude se chovat jako
> >>uzemnene stineni u koaxu nebo nejak tak.
> >>
> >>
> >>Mam Ronju postavenou podle navodu - muzu nahradit koaxy primo UTPckem bez
> >>zmen v elektronice? Potreboval bych, aby to tak bezelo na asi 20 m. Jak to
> >>bude vypadat s vyzarovanim v tomto pripade?
> >>Nacrtek: http://ronja.ic.cz/ronja_utp.gif
> >
> >Zkousel jsem to na 60m , tak jak to mas nakreslene to nepujde.
> >Je treba VF signal "zdiferenciovat", pomohl by i jeden operak co maka do 
> >15MHz (vyhoda...protoze operak
> >neumi vic jak 15MHz zesilit, tak tam facha jako utlum...cili dolni propust 
> >rulez).
> >Neco jako klasicke UTP...to je taky diferencialni a mezi dvema zivejma VF 
> >je impedance 100 ohmu.
> >Testoval jsem to po kabelu UTP a vyzarovani pri ceste bylo prijatelne.
> >Na spektrometru byl signal do 150cm od kabelaze. Takze tuto vzdalenost od 
> >TV/R zarizeni a koaxu je treba
> >dodrzet. Horsi to bylo s "injekci" VF signalu, VF pole od CB (27MHz) bylo 
> >siroke 15m a narusovalo signal v UTP.
> >A to bylo jen 4W PA do 5/8. Jeste horsi byla ant G5RV a do ni paleno 100W 
> >PA od 1.5 do 30MHz.
> >VF signal se nainjektoval i ze vzdalenosti 50m a zrusil puvodni uzitecnej 
> >signal.
> >-=RYS=-
> >
> >>
> >>Diky, anMic
> >>
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Ronja mailing list
> >>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>
> >
> >
> >========================================
> >
> >Nejlepsi by bylo to takhle okopirovat a poslat na mail.list ronja rovnou, 
> >at to Clock zaridi.
> >
> >
> >Zatim ahoj Martin   -=RYS=-
> >
> >
> >
> >______________________________________________________________
> >>Od: srnkap at extranetplus.cz
> >>Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>CC:
> >>Datum: 13.08.2005 13:26
> >>P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] cocky 130
> >>
> >>muzes mi prosim napsat , jakou maji ohniskovou vzdalenost a presny prumer
> >>?
> >>napsal bys co si myslis o tom vedeni kabelu k hlavicim jak jsem ho
> >>popisoval, potreboval bych vedet procentuelne na kolik to bude ucine,
> >>anMic urcite taky :)
> >>
> >>----- Original Message -----
> >>From: -=RYS=-
> >>To: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>Sent: Saturday, August 13, 2005 4:34 AM
> >>Subject: Re: [Ronja] cocky 130
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>D 032 - LCH RB13 G
> >>
> >>Tyhle mam i ty A mam.
> >>
> >>G je sklenena (je lepsi s fokusem) , A je plast...uplne na ho....o
> >>
> >>
> >>Cena asi 300,- a dodak tyden.
> >>
> >>-=RYS=-
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>______________________________________________________________
> >>>Od: srnkap at extranetplus.cz
> >>>Komu: "Petr Salek" , "Twibright Ronja"
> >>
> >>>CC:
> >>>Datum: 13.08.2005 00:08
> >>>P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] cocky 130
> >>>
> >>>Jelikoz taky nemuzu sehnat cocky , napadlo me koupit lupy v
> >>dioptre.Akorat
> >>>nevim jake nejlepe.
> >>>V uvahu pripada
> >>>D 032 - LCH RB13 G
> >>>
> >>>D 036 - LCH RB13 A
> >>>
> >>>asi to bude jedno
> >>>
> >>>zdroj www.dioptra.cz
> >>>
> >>>Kupoval odsud nekdo neco ? mate predstavu kolik stoji, jake ma ohnisko
> >>a
> >>>jaka je dodaci lhuta ??
> >>>
> >>>kvalitni by byt meli, a hlavne je predpoklad ze budou vsechny stejne !
> >>>
> >>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Petr Salek"
> >>>To:
> >>>Sent: Friday, August 12, 2005 11:30 PM
> >>>Subject: [Ronja] cocky 130
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Ty cocky co ted maj rakosky, to je fakt hruza, i za ty prachy.
> >>>>Kupoval jsem to nadvakrat, nejdriv ty v cerveny krabicce a pak ty v
> >>>
> >>>zeleny.
> >>>>Ty v cerveny byly docela fajn, teda az na to ze jsou vetsi a do moji
> >>>
> >>>konstrukce bez upravy nesly, ohnisko jakztakz snesitelny, cca 330mm,
> >>ty v
> >>>>zeleny do moji konstrukce pasly, mel jsem radost, nez jsem zjistil
> >>ze
> >>>maj > ohnisko cca 370.
> >>>>Nakonec jsem to vyresil tak ze jsem dal ty s kratsim na tx a delsim
> >>na
> >>>rx, > kazdopadne opruz.
> >>>>
> >>>>Kdyz jsem stavel ronje loni, tak jsem kupoval taky v cerveny
> >>krabicce, >
> >>>stejny jako letos, ale meli prumer 125, ohnisko asi 310 akorat byla
> >>kazda >
> >>>jinak tlusta(tak pul napul, tenky, tlusty).
> >>>>
> >>>>A tak se ptam, nevite nahodou nekdo kde sehnat tyhle "spravny"
> >>cocky?? >
> >>>Kupoval jsem to ve stanku hned u vchodu, jak tam ma ty "kill bill"
> >>mece, >
> >>>tak jestli tam neni jeste nejakej "ronja verified" stanek.
> >>>>
> >>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Ronja mailing list
> >>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Ronja mailing list
> >>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>
> >>
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Ronja mailing list
> >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> >
> >----- End forwarded message -----
> >
> >
> 
> -- 
> [http://pointless.net/]                                   [0x2ECA0975]



From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Wed Sep  7 10:10:35 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Wed,  7 Sep 2005 11:10:35 +0200
Subject: [Ronja]=?windows-1250?B?IFN0csO3bmt5IHA=?=rojektu spider
In-Reply-To: <200509071013.34550.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <opswpdmyggn6qjls@daman>
	<1126079521.431e9c21f2851@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<200509071013.34550.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <1126084235.431eae8bd8208@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

Cituji z emailu od Jakub Ladman <ladmanj at volny.cz>:

> >
> > A byl by problem udelat vstup od RXu jako UTP konektor se zapojenim:
> > 1 - RX- prijde zapojit na pin 6. 26LS32, resp. mozno propojkou prepojit
> na
> > GND 2 - RX+ v twisteru zapojeno na pin 7. 26LS32
> > 3 - RSSI GND
> > 4 - +12V
> > 5 - GND
> > 6 - RSSI
> > 7 - GND
> > 8 - +12V
> 
> Mne se to nelibi, kvuli zamenitelnosti ethernet a rx tx kabelu v konektorech,
> radsi bych na tvem miste pouzil sestipinove RJcko navic jak samec tak samice
> 

Jo to me se to taky nelibi /to tam umi dat kazdej x* SMA kdyz to nebude muset
platit/, jenze do tech 6pin RJcek nenacvakas kabel UTP Cat.5 na ktery ma kazdej
kleste a konektory. To je oc tu bezi.
Navic zapojeni konektoru je navrzeno aby se nic nestalo kdyz se to strci do PoE
zdroje.

> je v GM vyrazne levnejsi (coz neni rozhodujici, ale ...).
> Na RX a TX modulech bych pak pouzil samorezne svorkovnice co jsou napriklad
> na 
> deskach v patch panelech, pripojeni pomoci specialniho ondone je veci 
> vteriny. A ne posrana cokolada grrrrr, ve ktery se kabel jenom lame.

To se bude resit v RX v.1,1 nebo RX v.2,0 jestli vubec.  Tohle bylo navrzeno na
zamontovani BNC konektoru, resp. pohodlne zapajeni jak koaxu tak UTPcka pri
zachovani zpetne kompatibility s Clockovym RX.

P.Seliger

> Jakub Ladman
> 



From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Wed Sep  7 10:12:09 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?UTF-8?B?SmFrdWIgTWljaG7DrWs=?=)
Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2005 11:12:09 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?UTF-8?B?U3RyxILLh25reSBwcm9qZWt0dSBzcGlkZXI=?=
In-Reply-To: <opswp87vd6n6qjls@daman>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>	<431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
	<opswpdmyggn6qjls@daman>	<1126079521.431e9c21f2851@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<opswp87vd6n6qjls@daman>
Message-ID: <431EAEE9.7020307@centrum.cz>

co tam mas pouzite jako interface? twister,spider nebo neco vlastniho? 
byl by strucny popis? myslim tim jestli je pouzite nake CPLD atp...

Daniel Strnad napsal(a):
> No tak v podstate staci par veci doladit... PWD zkresleni osetreny mam,  
> nicmene stejne se me to buzeni ledky pomoci 3x 74HC04 moc nelibi. Misto  
> nich tam dam neco jinyho(jeste nevim co) a bude to cely. Zbytek funguje  
> OK. Propojeni mezi RX je reseny UTPckem uz ted a trochu to poupravit podle  
> toho co si napsal neni problem.
> 
> On Wed,  7 Sep 2005 09:52:01 +0200, <Seligr at sh.cvut.cz> wrote:
> 
>>Jaxes s tim daleko?
>>Mas osetreno PWD zkresleni od LEDky? Aby to nedopadlo jako puvodni  
>>TXface od Sylvie?
>>
>>A byl by problem udelat vstup od RXu jako UTP konektor se zapojenim:
>>1 - RX- prijde zapojit na pin 6. 26LS32, resp. mozno propojkou prepojit  
>>na GND
>>2 - RX+ v twisteru zapojeno na pin 7. 26LS32
>>3 - RSSI GND
>>4 - +12V
>>5 - GND
>>6 - RSSI
>>7 - GND
>>8 - +12V
>>Mam nachystany plosnaky pro RX kde je mozno zapojit vystup bud na koaxy,  
>>nebo
>>diferencialne na UTP cimz se naplno vyuzije moznosti primace. Je to ta  
>>vec na
>>http://laser.webpark.cz/work.html nebo
>>http://twiki.twibright.com/bin/view/Main/RxPcbSeligr , pristi tyden  
>>osadim
>>prototypovou varku od verze1 a behem vykendu to bude podrobeno kritice a  
>>za cca
>>14 dni budou data na webu podobne jako od spideru.
>>
>>P.Seliger
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 
> 


From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Wed Sep  7 10:16:56 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2005 11:16:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Str=F7nky_projektu_spider?=
In-Reply-To: <1126084235.431eae8bd8208@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<opswpdmyggn6qjls@daman>	<1126079521.431e9c21f2851@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<200509071013.34550.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<1126084235.431eae8bd8208@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <431EB008.2040804@centrum.cz>



Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
> Cituji z emailu od Jakub Ladman <ladmanj at volny.cz>:
> 
> 
>>>A byl by problem udelat vstup od RXu jako UTP konektor se zapojenim:
>>>1 - RX- prijde zapojit na pin 6. 26LS32, resp. mozno propojkou prepojit
>>
>>na
>>
>>>GND 2 - RX+ v twisteru zapojeno na pin 7. 26LS32
>>>3 - RSSI GND
>>>4 - +12V
>>>5 - GND
>>>6 - RSSI
>>>7 - GND
>>>8 - +12V
>>
>>Mne se to nelibi, kvuli zamenitelnosti ethernet a rx tx kabelu v konektorech,
>>radsi bych na tvem miste pouzil sestipinove RJcko navic jak samec tak samice
>>
> 
> 
> Jo to me se to taky nelibi /to tam umi dat kazdej x* SMA kdyz to nebude muset
> platit/, jenze do tech 6pin RJcek nenacvakas kabel UTP Cat.5 na ktery ma kazdej
> kleste a konektory. To je oc tu bezi.
> Navic zapojeni konektoru je navrzeno aby se nic nestalo kdyz se to strci do PoE
> zdroje.

taky si myslim, navic pokud se konektory oznaci barvickama jako napr. 
mys a klavesnice neni mozne aby se naslo tolik lam kere to prehodi....

> 
> 
>>je v GM vyrazne levnejsi (coz neni rozhodujici, ale ...).
>>Na RX a TX modulech bych pak pouzil samorezne svorkovnice co jsou napriklad
>>na 
>>deskach v patch panelech, pripojeni pomoci specialniho ondone je veci 
>>vteriny. A ne posrana cokolada grrrrr, ve ktery se kabel jenom lame.
> 
> 
> To se bude resit v RX v.1,1 nebo RX v.2,0 jestli vubec.  Tohle bylo navrzeno na
> zamontovani BNC konektoru, resp. pohodlne zapajeni jak koaxu tak UTPcka pri
> zachovani zpetne kompatibility s Clockovym RX.
> 
> P.Seliger
> 
> 
>>Jakub Ladman
>>
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 


From daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz  Wed Sep  7 12:31:35 2005
From: daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz (Daniel Strnad)
Date: Wed, 07 Sep 2005 11:31:35 -0000
Subject: =?utf-8?B?W1JvbmphXSBTdHLEgsuHbmt5IHByb2pla3R1IHNwaWRlcg==?=
In-Reply-To: <431EAEE9.7020307@centrum.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>	<431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
	<opswpdmyggn6qjls@daman>	<1126079521.431e9c21f2851@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<opswp87vd6n6qjls@daman> <431EAEE9.7020307@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <opswqcyxb0n6qjls@daman>

Je tam pouzit xilinx jako ve Spiderovi(XC9572XL) s firmwarem psanym ve  
VHDL.

On Wed, 07 Sep 2005 11:12:09 +0200, Jakub Michn?k  
<jakub.michnik at centrum.cz> wrote:

> co tam mas pouzite jako interface? twister,spider nebo neco vlastniho?
> byl by strucny popis? myslim tim jestli je pouzite nake CPLD atp...


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Wed Sep  7 13:56:33 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2005 14:56:33 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?utf-8?q?Str=C4=82=C2=B7nky_projektu?= spider
In-Reply-To: <1126084235.431eae8bd8208@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<200509071013.34550.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<1126084235.431eae8bd8208@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <200509071456.34382.ladmanj@volny.cz>

> Jo to me se to taky nelibi /to tam umi dat kazdej x* SMA kdyz to nebude
> muset platit/, jenze do tech 6pin RJcek nenacvakas kabel UTP Cat.5 na ktery
Nacvakam, jen tam misto ctyrech nacpu jenom tri pary.
> ma kazdej kleste a konektory. To je oc tu bezi.

Na to bych se vysral, kleste co umi vsechny tri velikosti bejvaj kvalitnejsi 
takze doporucuju nakup tehle.

> Navic zapojeni konektoru je navrzeno aby se nic nestalo kdyz se to strci do
> PoE zdroje.
>
> > je v GM vyrazne levnejsi (coz neni rozhodujici, ale ...).
> > Na RX a TX modulech bych pak pouzil samorezne svorkovnice co jsou
> > napriklad na
> > deskach v patch panelech, pripojeni pomoci specialniho ondone je veci
> > vteriny. A ne posrana cokolada grrrrr, ve ktery se kabel jenom lame.
>
> To se bude resit v RX v.1,1 nebo RX v.2,0 jestli vubec.  Tohle bylo
> navrzeno na zamontovani BNC konektoru, resp. pohodlne zapajeni jak koaxu
> tak UTPcka pri zachovani zpetne kompatibility s Clockovym RX.
>
> P.Seliger
>
> > Jakub Ladman
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Wed Sep  7 13:59:44 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Wed, 7 Sep 2005 14:59:44 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] SPIDER WEB UPDATE
Message-ID: <200509071459.44488.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Na pavou??m webu p?ibyla str?nka s n?kter?mi specifikacemi. V podstat? z?sady 
bezpe?n?ho pou?it?, tak abyste si spidera hned nevodpr?skli a nebo se 
nedivili, ?e v?m to nefach??.
Jakub


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep  9 10:25:56 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:25:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
Message-ID: <20050909092556.GC27699@kestrel>

Hello

Would it be possible to do following changes to improve usability? About
3 people now want to help the Ronja project and explaining them gEDA and
PCB is a pain in the ass. They get stuck on something every couple of
hours when trying to work with gEDA and PCB.

All contributions to Ronja are in Eagle, because people say "sorry, gEDA
is unusable for me".

So Ronja has unofficial RX TMD PCB, unofficial RX SMD PCB, unofficial
TX TMD PCB, unofficial TX SMD PCB, unofficial CPLD Twister, but these
cannot be merged into the development, because the former 4 were
designed in Protel and the latter one in Eagle, because gEDA is pain
in the ass for them to learn and use.

Would it be possible to do the following changes to increase usability?
1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
   PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
   possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
   it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
   and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
   spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
   download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
   PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
4) Update the PCB documentation so the format is described correctly
   (one needed to edit solderstrip symbol source but I told him this URL
    describes the internal format, but sorry, it's obsolete and not true
    anymore, there is different number of fields, they are shuffled
    around, and the resolution is now also 100 times higher)
5) Put into PCB library that every time you select a package, it writes
   "put bla_bla into footprint= attribute if you want this package in
    gschem"
6) If 5 is not possible, put a trained monkey algorithm into PCB doc
   which would enable one to translate PCB library entry as seen on
   the library menu into footprint= attribute.
7) Make gEDA and PCB stop complaining 100 error messages every time the
   version changes slightly. It's like Microsoft Word - even two
   neighbour versions are mutually incompatible.

Thanks,

CL<


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Fri Sep  9 10:33:23 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:33:23 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
In-Reply-To: <20050909092556.GC27699@kestrel>
References: <20050909092556.GC27699@kestrel>
Message-ID: <200509091133.23565.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Tleskam :-)

Dne p? 9. z??? 2005 11:25 Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> Hello
>
> Would it be possible to do following changes to improve usability? About
> 3 people now want to help the Ronja project and explaining them gEDA and
> PCB is a pain in the ass. They get stuck on something every couple of
> hours when trying to work with gEDA and PCB.
>
> All contributions to Ronja are in Eagle, because people say "sorry, gEDA
> is unusable for me".
>
> So Ronja has unofficial RX TMD PCB, unofficial RX SMD PCB, unofficial
> TX TMD PCB, unofficial TX SMD PCB, unofficial CPLD Twister, but these
> cannot be merged into the development, because the former 4 were
> designed in Protel and the latter one in Eagle, because gEDA is pain
> in the ass for them to learn and use.
>
> Would it be possible to do the following changes to increase usability?
> 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
>    PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
>    possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
>    it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
>    and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
>    spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
>    download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
>    PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> 4) Update the PCB documentation so the format is described correctly
>    (one needed to edit solderstrip symbol source but I told him this URL
>     describes the internal format, but sorry, it's obsolete and not true
>     anymore, there is different number of fields, they are shuffled
>     around, and the resolution is now also 100 times higher)
> 5) Put into PCB library that every time you select a package, it writes
>    "put bla_bla into footprint= attribute if you want this package in
>     gschem"
> 6) If 5 is not possible, put a trained monkey algorithm into PCB doc
>    which would enable one to translate PCB library entry as seen on
>    the library menu into footprint= attribute.
> 7) Make gEDA and PCB stop complaining 100 error messages every time the
>    version changes slightly. It's like Microsoft Word - even two
>    neighbour versions are mutually incompatible.
>
> Thanks,
>
> CL<
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep  9 10:44:02 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:44:02 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mind the user
Message-ID: <20050909094402.GA27849@kestrel>

When a user comes to geda.seul.org, in 90% cases he wants to
draw schematics and make printed boards from them. If he didn't work
with gEDA before, what he wants to do in 90% is draw a simple schematic
with resistor, LED and connector, make a PCB from it and generate
Gerber RS274-X and netlist from that.

So please keep optimizng the website and the software for that. How many
users are there and how many developers?  If the user comes and is not
able to make Gerber RS274-X within hour, something is wrong. In the
current state it takes like 14 days until he learns to skip over all the
unnecessary hurdles.

Like: I go to http://geda.seul.org/download.html. There should be
instruction what the user should do to download the software. Is
there such one? Isn't. There is like 200 various links to various pieces
of the software. Everytime I visit that page I never know what I should
download!

What the heck did you expect the user wants to do when he comes to
Download? Plant potatoes in his garden? And where do you think he should
take the information how to download gEDA? Decode it from cosmic
background radiation using Arecribo radiotelescope?

Can't you write instructions like that?
http://links.twibright.com/download.php
If I was able to write them, why can't you?

For a first-time visitor, this is a stumbling block.
For a many years experienced user like me, this is *still* stumbling
block! How quickly do you think the first-time visitor will be able to
install the software when it's a stumbling block even for me, who
already designed 4 PCB's in gEDA+PCB?

Everywhere I go to software X it's Download: download
software-x-1.2.3.tgz. Period. Why does it have to be so complicated
in case of gEDA? And if there are technical reasons for complication,
why there cannot be a clear guide what to do to download it all?

Please change the download page so it's "to download gEDA do this and
this.".

Then the bottom of the page should read
"Now you can proceed with <a href="...">Installation</a>.

And the Install page should be the same: tell the user what he should do
to install. I didn't find any install page. And install
complete environment to make Gerber RS274-X and part shopping list
from circuit idea in the head, not just a half of it (schematic editor).

What's the point of 100 people wasting each 14 days trying to install
and learn basic usage of gEDA when they could do it in 1 hour and invest
those 14*100 days into developing some other free software project?

CL<


From zajio1am at artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz  Fri Sep  9 10:48:55 2005
From: zajio1am at artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Ondrej Zajicek)
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:48:55 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
In-Reply-To: <20050909092556.GC27699@kestrel>
References: <20050909092556.GC27699@kestrel>
Message-ID: <20050909094855.GA980@elros>

On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
>    PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
>    possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
>    it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
>    and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
>    spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
>    download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
>    PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian

After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I entered (under root):
apt-get install geda pcb
And after 1-2 minutes (of downloading packages from Internet)
both geda and pcb were installed.

I use Debian stable (Sarge).

So i think that people inexperienced in installing software from sources
should use binary packages from their distribution.

-- 
Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo

Ondrej 'SanTiago' Zajicek (email: santiago at mail.cz, jabber: santiago at njs.netlab.cz)
OpenPGP encrypted e-mails preferred (KeyID 0x11DEADC3, wwwkeys.pgp.net)
"To err is human -- to blame it on a computer is even more so."
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From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep  9 11:23:06 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 12:23:06 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
In-Reply-To: <20050909094855.GA980@elros>
References: <20050909092556.GC27699@kestrel> <20050909094855.GA980@elros>
Message-ID: <20050909102306.GA29715@kestrel>

On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:48:55AM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> >    PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> >    possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> >    it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> >    and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> >    spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> >    download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> >    PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> 
> After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I entered (under root):
> apt-get install geda pcb
> And after 1-2 minutes (of downloading packages from Internet)
> both geda and pcb were installed.
> 
> I use Debian stable (Sarge).
> 
> So i think that people inexperienced in installing software from sources
> should use binary packages from their distribution.

But if you need new version because of some important features were
missing in the old one, you still need to install from sources.

And anyway pcb should be part of gEDA ;-) So you would type just
apt-get install geda.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep  9 11:23:38 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 12:23:38 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
In-Reply-To: <20050909094855.GA980@elros>
References: <20050909092556.GC27699@kestrel> <20050909094855.GA980@elros>
Message-ID: <20050909102338.GB29715@kestrel>

On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:48:55AM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> >    PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> >    possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> >    it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> >    and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> >    spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> >    download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> >    PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> 
> After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I entered (under root):
> apt-get install geda pcb

Show me some commercial program which sells schematic and PCB programs
separaterly.

CL<


From polous at katka.biz  Fri Sep  9 20:22:10 2005
From: polous at katka.biz (Martin Polehla)
Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 19:22:10 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
In-Reply-To: <20050909092556.GC27699@kestrel>
References: <20050909092556.GC27699@kestrel>
Message-ID: <4321E0E2.7060106@katka.biz>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

hi,
I haven't seen errors when i was installing complete gEDA under
gentoo, I used only "emerge geda" and it works. It only need to unmask
~x86 versions of following packages in /etc/portage/package.keywords,
becose they are not marked as stable in gentoo portage tree.


sci-electronics/geda ~x86
sci-electronics/gwave ~x86
x11-libs/guile-gtk ~x86
sci-electronics/ng-spice-rework ~x86
sci-electronics/gerbv ~x86
sci-electronics/gnetman ~x86
sci-libs/libgdgeda ~x86
sci-libs/libgeda ~x86

- ---

Tutorial how to make simple scheme and pcb in gEDA tools:
http://www.geda.seul.org/docs/current/tutorials/gsch2pcb/tutorial.html

p0l0us

Karel Kulhavy wrote:

> Hello
>
> Would it be possible to do following changes to improve usability?
> About 3 people now want to help the Ronja project and explaining
> them gEDA and PCB is a pain in the ass. They get stuck on something
> every couple of hours when trying to work with gEDA and PCB.
>
> All contributions to Ronja are in Eagle, because people say "sorry,
> gEDA is unusable for me".
>
> So Ronja has unofficial RX TMD PCB, unofficial RX SMD PCB,
> unofficial TX TMD PCB, unofficial TX SMD PCB, unofficial CPLD
> Twister, but these cannot be merged into the development, because
> the former 4 were designed in Protel and the latter one in Eagle,
> because gEDA is pain in the ass for them to learn and use.
>
> Would it be possible to do the following changes to increase
> usability? 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once.
> If installing PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install
> if possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days
> because it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions
> correctly and if you fail, you have to retry etc. 3) Make a gEDA
> install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to spend 2
> hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's PITA
> to install gtk 2.2 in debian 4) Update the PCB documentation so the
> format is described correctly (one needed to edit solderstrip
> symbol source but I told him this URL describes the internal
> format, but sorry, it's obsolete and not true anymore, there is
> different number of fields, they are shuffled around, and the
> resolution is now also 100 times higher) 5) Put into PCB library
> that every time you select a package, it writes "put bla_bla into
> footprint= attribute if you want this package in gschem" 6) If 5 is
> not possible, put a trained monkey algorithm into PCB doc which
> would enable one to translate PCB library entry as seen on the
> library menu into footprint= attribute. 7) Make gEDA and PCB stop
> complaining 100 error messages every time the version changes
> slightly. It's like Microsoft Word - even two neighbour versions
> are mutually incompatible.
>
> Thanks,
>
> CL<
>
> _______________________________________________ Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>

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From quintusmurray at yahoo.com  Fri Sep  9 22:08:17 2005
From: quintusmurray at yahoo.com (Quintus Murray)
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 14:08:17 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
Message-ID: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>

Hi this is quintus murray and I would like to know if the Links web browser (all versions of Links) can be installed on the nintendo DS if the NDS has linux kernal 2.6 which doesn't have a built-in web browser? or any nintendo ds? If yes how do I do this?

ronja-request at lists.pointless.net wrote: Send Ronja mailing list submissions to
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Ronja digest..."


Today's Topics:

1. Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Karel Kulhavy)
2. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Jakub Ladman)
3. Mind the user (Karel Kulhavy)
4. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Ondrej Zajicek)
5. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Karel Kulhavy)
6. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Karel Kulhavy)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:25:56 +0200
From: Karel Kulhavy 
Subject: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
To: geda-user at seul.org
Cc: Twibright Ronja 
Message-ID: <20050909092556.GC27699 at kestrel>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

Hello

Would it be possible to do following changes to improve usability? About
3 people now want to help the Ronja project and explaining them gEDA and
PCB is a pain in the ass. They get stuck on something every couple of
hours when trying to work with gEDA and PCB.

All contributions to Ronja are in Eagle, because people say "sorry, gEDA
is unusable for me".

So Ronja has unofficial RX TMD PCB, unofficial RX SMD PCB, unofficial
TX TMD PCB, unofficial TX SMD PCB, unofficial CPLD Twister, but these
cannot be merged into the development, because the former 4 were
designed in Protel and the latter one in Eagle, because gEDA is pain
in the ass for them to learn and use.

Would it be possible to do the following changes to increase usability?
1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
4) Update the PCB documentation so the format is described correctly
(one needed to edit solderstrip symbol source but I told him this URL
describes the internal format, but sorry, it's obsolete and not true
anymore, there is different number of fields, they are shuffled
around, and the resolution is now also 100 times higher)
5) Put into PCB library that every time you select a package, it writes
"put bla_bla into footprint= attribute if you want this package in
gschem"
6) If 5 is not possible, put a trained monkey algorithm into PCB doc
which would enable one to translate PCB library entry as seen on
the library menu into footprint= attribute.
7) Make gEDA and PCB stop complaining 100 error messages every time the
version changes slightly. It's like Microsoft Word - even two
neighbour versions are mutually incompatible.

Thanks,

CL<



------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:33:23 +0200
From: Jakub Ladman 
Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
To: Twibright Ronja 
Message-ID: <200509091133.23565.ladmanj at volny.cz>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2"

Tleskam :-)

Dne p? 9. z??? 2005 11:25 Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> Hello
>
> Would it be possible to do following changes to improve usability? About
> 3 people now want to help the Ronja project and explaining them gEDA and
> PCB is a pain in the ass. They get stuck on something every couple of
> hours when trying to work with gEDA and PCB.
>
> All contributions to Ronja are in Eagle, because people say "sorry, gEDA
> is unusable for me".
>
> So Ronja has unofficial RX TMD PCB, unofficial RX SMD PCB, unofficial
> TX TMD PCB, unofficial TX SMD PCB, unofficial CPLD Twister, but these
> cannot be merged into the development, because the former 4 were
> designed in Protel and the latter one in Eagle, because gEDA is pain
> in the ass for them to learn and use.
>
> Would it be possible to do the following changes to increase usability?
> 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> 4) Update the PCB documentation so the format is described correctly
> (one needed to edit solderstrip symbol source but I told him this URL
> describes the internal format, but sorry, it's obsolete and not true
> anymore, there is different number of fields, they are shuffled
> around, and the resolution is now also 100 times higher)
> 5) Put into PCB library that every time you select a package, it writes
> "put bla_bla into footprint= attribute if you want this package in
> gschem"
> 6) If 5 is not possible, put a trained monkey algorithm into PCB doc
> which would enable one to translate PCB library entry as seen on
> the library menu into footprint= attribute.
> 7) Make gEDA and PCB stop complaining 100 error messages every time the
> version changes slightly. It's like Microsoft Word - even two
> neighbour versions are mutually incompatible.
>
> Thanks,
>
> CL<
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:44:02 +0200
From: Karel Kulhavy 
Subject: [Ronja] Mind the user
To: geda-user at seul.org
Cc: Twibright Ronja 
Message-ID: <20050909094402.GA27849 at kestrel>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

When a user comes to geda.seul.org, in 90% cases he wants to
draw schematics and make printed boards from them. If he didn't work
with gEDA before, what he wants to do in 90% is draw a simple schematic
with resistor, LED and connector, make a PCB from it and generate
Gerber RS274-X and netlist from that.

So please keep optimizng the website and the software for that. How many
users are there and how many developers? If the user comes and is not
able to make Gerber RS274-X within hour, something is wrong. In the
current state it takes like 14 days until he learns to skip over all the
unnecessary hurdles.

Like: I go to http://geda.seul.org/download.html. There should be
instruction what the user should do to download the software. Is
there such one? Isn't. There is like 200 various links to various pieces
of the software. Everytime I visit that page I never know what I should
download!

What the heck did you expect the user wants to do when he comes to
Download? Plant potatoes in his garden? And where do you think he should
take the information how to download gEDA? Decode it from cosmic
background radiation using Arecribo radiotelescope?

Can't you write instructions like that?
http://links.twibright.com/download.php
If I was able to write them, why can't you?

For a first-time visitor, this is a stumbling block.
For a many years experienced user like me, this is *still* stumbling
block! How quickly do you think the first-time visitor will be able to
install the software when it's a stumbling block even for me, who
already designed 4 PCB's in gEDA+PCB?

Everywhere I go to software X it's Download: download
software-x-1.2.3.tgz. Period. Why does it have to be so complicated
in case of gEDA? And if there are technical reasons for complication,
why there cannot be a clear guide what to do to download it all?

Please change the download page so it's "to download gEDA do this and
this.".

Then the bottom of the page should read
"Now you can proceed with Installation.

And the Install page should be the same: tell the user what he should do
to install. I didn't find any install page. And install
complete environment to make Gerber RS274-X and part shopping list
from circuit idea in the head, not just a half of it (schematic editor).

What's the point of 100 people wasting each 14 days trying to install
and learn basic usage of gEDA when they could do it in 1 hour and invest
those 14*100 days into developing some other free software project?

CL<



------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:48:55 +0200
From: Ondrej Zajicek 
Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
To: Twibright Ronja 
Message-ID: <20050909094855.GA980 at elros>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian

After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I entered (under root):
apt-get install geda pcb
And after 1-2 minutes (of downloading packages from Internet)
both geda and pcb were installed.

I use Debian stable (Sarge).

So i think that people inexperienced in installing software from sources
should use binary packages from their distribution.

-- 
Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo

Ondrej 'SanTiago' Zajicek (email: santiago at mail.cz, jabber: santiago at njs.netlab.cz)
OpenPGP encrypted e-mails preferred (KeyID 0x11DEADC3, wwwkeys.pgp.net)
"To err is human -- to blame it on a computer is even more so."
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------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 12:23:06 +0200
From: Karel Kulhavy 
Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
To: Twibright Ronja 
Message-ID: <20050909102306.GA29715 at kestrel>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:48:55AM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> > PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> > possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> > it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> > and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> > spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> > download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> > PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> 
> After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I entered (under root):
> apt-get install geda pcb
> And after 1-2 minutes (of downloading packages from Internet)
> both geda and pcb were installed.
> 
> I use Debian stable (Sarge).
> 
> So i think that people inexperienced in installing software from sources
> should use binary packages from their distribution.

But if you need new version because of some important features were
missing in the old one, you still need to install from sources.

And anyway pcb should be part of gEDA ;-) So you would type just
apt-get install geda.

CL<



------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 12:23:38 +0200
From: Karel Kulhavy 
Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
To: Twibright Ronja 
Message-ID: <20050909102338.GB29715 at kestrel>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:48:55AM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> > PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> > possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> > it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> > and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> > spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> > download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> > PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> 
> After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I entered (under root):
> apt-get install geda pcb

Show me some commercial program which sells schematic and PCB programs
separaterly.

CL<



------------------------------

_______________________________________________
Ronja mailing list
Ronja at lists.pointless.net
http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


End of Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21
*************************************



		
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From krepa at seznam.cz  Fri Sep  9 22:29:31 2005
From: krepa at seznam.cz (Pavel Krejci)
Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 23:29:31 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21
In-Reply-To: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4321FEBB.1010703@seznam.cz>

Hi this is krepa and krepa thinks that quintus should not be so 
ignorant. Many times other users asked quintus not to copy whole digest 
back to mailing list. Specially when the question does not have anything 
common to the digest. In quintus's post there is even nothing common to 
the topic of this mailing list...

Hey man, try to think about it a little bit. Thanks.

krepa

Quintus Murray wrote:

> Hi this is quintus murray and I would like to know if the Links web 
> browser (all versions of Links) can be installed on the nintendo DS if 
> the NDS has linux kernal 2.6 which doesn't have a built-in web browser? 
> or any nintendo ds? If yes how do I do this?
> 
> */ronja-request at lists.pointless.net/* wrote:
> 
>     Send Ronja mailing list submissions to
>     ronja at lists.pointless.net
> 
>     To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>     http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>     or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>     ronja-request at lists.pointless.net
> 
>     You can reach the person managing the list at
>     ronja-owner at lists.pointless.net
> 
>     When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>     than "Re: Contents of Ronja digest..."
> 
> 
>     Today's Topics:
> 
>     1. Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Karel Kulhavy)
>     2. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Jakub Ladman)
>     3. Mind the user (Karel Kulhavy)
>     4. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Ondrej Zajicek)
>     5. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Karel Kulhavy)
>     6. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Karel Kulhavy)
> 
> 
>     ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
>     Message: 1
>     Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:25:56 +0200
>     From: Karel Kulhavy
>     Subject: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
>     To: geda-user at seul.org
>     Cc: Twibright Ronja
>     Message-ID: <20050909092556.GC27699 at kestrel>
>     Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
>     Hello
> 
>     Would it be possible to do following changes to improve usability? About
>     3 people now want to help the Ronja project and explaining them gEDA and
>     PCB is a pain in the ass. They get stuck on something every couple of
>     hours when trying to work with gEDA and PCB.
> 
>     All contributions to Ronja are in Eagle, because people say "sorry, gEDA
>     is unusable for me".
> 
>     So Ronja has unofficial RX TMD PCB, unofficial RX SMD PCB, unofficial
>     TX TMD PCB, unofficial TX SMD PCB, unofficial CPLD Twister, but these
>     cannot be merged into the development, because the former 4 were
>     designed in Protel and the latter one in Eagle, because gEDA is pain
>     in the ass for them to learn and use.
> 
>     Would it be possible to do the following changes to increase usability?
>     1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
>     PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
>     2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
>     possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
>     it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
>     and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
>     3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
>     spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
>     download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
>     PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
>     4) Update the PCB documentation so the format is described correctly
>     (one needed to edit solderstrip symbol source but I told him this URL
>     describes the internal format, but sorry, it's obsolete and not true
>     anymore, there is different number of fields, they are shuffled
>     around, and the resolution is now also 100 times higher)
>     5) Put into PCB library that every time you select a package, it writes
>     "put bla_bla into footprint= attribute if you want this package in
>     gschem"
>     6) If 5 is not possible, put a trained monkey algorithm into PCB doc
>     which would enable one to translate PCB library entry as seen on
>     the library menu into footprint= attribute.
>     7) Make gEDA and PCB stop complaining 100 error messages every time the
>     version changes slightly. It's like Microsoft Word - even two
>     neighbour versions are mutually incompatible.
> 
>     Thanks,
> 
>     CL<
> 
> 
> 
>     ------------------------------
> 
>     Message: 2
>     Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:33:23 +0200
>     From: Jakub Ladman
>     Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
>     To: Twibright Ronja
>     Message-ID: <200509091133.23565.ladmanj at volny.cz>
>     Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2"
> 
>     Tleskam :-)
> 
>     Dne p? 9. z??? 2005 11:25 Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
>      > Hello
>      >
>      > Would it be possible to do following changes to improve
>     usability? About
>      > 3 people now want to help the Ronja project and explaining them
>     gEDA and
>      > PCB is a pain in the ass. They get stuck on something every couple of
>      > hours when trying to work with gEDA and PCB.
>      >
>      > All contributions to Ronja are in Eagle, because people say
>     "sorry, gEDA
>      > is unusable for me".
>      >
>      > So Ronja has unofficial RX TMD PCB, unofficial RX SMD PCB, unofficial
>      > TX TMD PCB, unofficial TX SMD PCB, unofficial CPLD Twister, but these
>      > cannot be merged into the development, because the former 4 were
>      > designed in Protel and the latter one in Eagle, because gEDA is pain
>      > in the ass for them to learn and use.
>      >
>      > Would it be possible to do the following changes to increase
>     usability?
>      > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If
>     installing
>      > PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
>      > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make
>     install if
>      > possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
>      > it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
>      > and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
>      > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't
>     have to
>      > spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
>      > download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
>      > PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
>      > 4) Update the PCB documentation so the format is described correctly
>      > (one needed to edit solderstrip symbol source but I told him this URL
>      > describes the internal format, but sorry, it's obsolete and not true
>      > anymore, there is different number of fields, they are shuffled
>      > around, and the resolution is now also 100 times higher)
>      > 5) Put into PCB library that every time you select a package, it
>     writes
>      > "put bla_bla into footprint= attribute if you want this package in
>      > gschem"
>      > 6) If 5 is not possible, put a trained monkey algorithm into PCB doc
>      > which would enable one to translate PCB library entry as seen on
>      > the library menu into footprint= attribute.
>      > 7) Make gEDA and PCB stop complaining 100 error messages every
>     time the
>      > version changes slightly. It's like Microsoft Word - even two
>      > neighbour versions are mutually incompatible.
>      >
>      > Thanks,
>      >
>      > CL<
>      >
>      > _______________________________________________
>      > Ronja mailing list
>      > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>      > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 
>     ------------------------------
> 
>     Message: 3
>     Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:44:02 +0200
>     From: Karel Kulhavy
>     Subject: [Ronja] Mind the user
>     To: geda-user at seul.org
>     Cc: Twibright Ronja
>     Message-ID: <20050909094402.GA27849 at kestrel>
>     Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
>     When a user comes to geda.seul.org, in 90% cases he wants to
>     draw schematics and make printed boards from them. If he didn't work
>     with gEDA before, what he wants to do in 90% is draw a simple schematic
>     with resistor, LED and connector, make a PCB from it and generate
>     Gerber RS274-X and netlist from that.
> 
>     So please keep optimizng the website and the software for that. How many
>     users are there and how many developers? If the user comes and is not
>     able to make Gerber RS274-X within hour, something is wrong. In the
>     current state it takes like 14 days until he learns to skip over all the
>     unnecessary hurdles.
> 
>     Like: I go to http://geda.seul.org/download.html. There should be
>     instruction what the user should do to download the software. Is
>     there such one? Isn't. There is like 200 various links to various pieces
>     of the software. Everytime I visit that page I never know what I should
>     download!
> 
>     What the heck did you expect the user wants to do when he comes to
>     Download? Plant potatoes in his garden? And where do you think he should
>     take the information how to download gEDA? Decode it from cosmic
>     background radiation using Arecribo radiotelescope?
> 
>     Can't you write instructions like that?
>     http://links.twibright.com/download.php
>     If I was able to write them, why can't you?
> 
>     For a first-time visitor, this is a stumbling block.
>     For a many years experienced user like me, this is *still* stumbling
>     block! How quickly do you think the first-time visitor will be able to
>     install the software when it's a stumbling block even for me, who
>     already designed 4 PCB's in gEDA+PCB?
> 
>     Everywhere I go to software X it's Download: download
>     software-x-1.2.3.tgz. Period. Why does it have to be so complicated
>     in case of gEDA? And if there are technical reasons for complication,
>     why there cannot be a clear guide what to do to download it all?
> 
>     Please change the download page so it's "to download gEDA do this and
>     this.".
> 
>     Then the bottom of the page should read
>     "Now you can proceed with Installation
>     <http://us.f534.mail.yahoo.com/ym/...>.
> 
>     And the Install page should be the same: tell the user what he should do
>     to install. I didn't find any install page. And install
>     complete environment to make Gerber RS274-X and part shopping list
>     from circuit idea in the head, not just a half of it (schematic editor).
> 
>     What's the point of 100 people wasting each 14 days trying to install
>     and learn basic usage of gEDA when they could do it in 1 hour and invest
>     those 14*100 days into developing some other free software project?
> 
>     CL<
> 
> 
> 
>     ------------------------------
> 
>     Message: 4
>     Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:48:55 +0200
>     From: Ondrej Zajicek
>     Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
>     To: Twibright Ronja
>     Message-ID: <20050909094855.GA980 at elros>
>     Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
>     On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
>      > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If
>     installing
>      > PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
>      > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make
>     install if
>      > possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
>      > it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
>      > and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
>      > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't
>     have to
>      > spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
>      > download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
>      > PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> 
>     After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I
>     entered (under root):
>     apt-get install geda pcb
>     And after 1-2 minutes (of downloading packages from Internet)
>     both geda and pcb were installed.
> 
>     I use Debian stable (Sarge).
> 
>     So i think that people inexperienced in installing software from sources
>     should use binary packages from their distribution.
> 
>     -- 
>     Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo
> 
>     Ondrej 'SanTiago' Zajicek (email: santiago at mail.cz, jabber:
>     santiago at njs.netlab.cz)
>     OpenPGP encrypted e-mails preferred (KeyID 0x11DEADC3, wwwkeys.pgp.net)
>     "To err is human -- to blame it on a computer is even more so."
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>     Url :
>     http://pointless.net/pipermail/ronja/attachments/20050909/112ac1e3/attachment-0001.bin
> 
>     ------------------------------
> 
>     Message: 5
>     Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 12:23:06 +0200
>     From: Karel Kulhavy
>     Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
>     To: Twibright Ronja
>     Message-ID: <20050909102306.GA29715 at kestrel>
>     Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
>     On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:48:55AM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
>      > On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
>      > > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If
>     installing
>      > > PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
>      > > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make
>     install if
>      > > possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days
>     because
>      > > it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions
>     correctly
>      > > and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
>      > > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't
>     have to
>      > > spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they
>     should
>      > > download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
>      > > PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
>      >
>      > After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I
>     entered (under root):
>      > apt-get install geda pcb
>      > And after 1-2 minutes (of downloading packages from Internet)
>      > both geda and pcb were installed.
>      >
>      > I use Debian stable (Sarge).
>      >
>      > So i think that people inexperienced in installing software from
>     sources
>      > should use binary packages from their distribution.
> 
>     But if you need new version because of some important features were
>     missing in the old one, you still need to install from sources.
> 
>     And anyway pcb should be part of gEDA ;-) So you would type just
>     apt-get install geda.
> 
>     CL<
> 
> 
> 
>     ------------------------------
> 
>     Message: 6
>     Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 12:23:38 +0200
>     From: Karel Kulhavy
>     Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
>     To: Twibright Ronja
>     Message-ID: <20050909102338.GB29715 at kestrel>
>     Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
>     On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:48:55AM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
>      > On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
>      > > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If
>     installing
>      > > PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
>      > > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make
>     install if
>      > > possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days
>     because
>      > > it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions
>     correctly
>      > > and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
>      > > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't
>     have to
>      > > spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they
>     should
>      > > download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
>      > > PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
>      >
>      > After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I
>     entered (under root):
>      > apt-get install geda pcb
> 
>     Show me some commercial program which sells schematic and PCB programs
>     separaterly.
> 
>     CL<
> 
> 
> 
>     ------------------------------
> 
>     _______________________________________________
>     Ronja mailing list
>     Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>     http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
>     End of Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21
>     *************************************
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. 
> <http://store.yahoo.com/redcross-donate3/>
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From krepa at seznam.cz  Fri Sep  9 22:31:08 2005
From: krepa at seznam.cz (Pavel Krejci)
Date: Fri, 09 Sep 2005 23:31:08 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21
In-Reply-To: <4321FEBB.1010703@seznam.cz>
References: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<4321FEBB.1010703@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <4321FF1C.3080706@seznam.cz>

Shit, and krepa left it there as well ;o)
Sorry.

Pavel Krejci wrote:

> Hi this is krepa and krepa thinks that quintus should not be so 
> ignorant. Many times other users asked quintus not to copy whole digest 
> back to mailing list. Specially when the question does not have anything 
> common to the digest. In quintus's post there is even nothing common to 
> the topic of this mailing list...
> 
> Hey man, try to think about it a little bit. Thanks.
> 
> krepa



From jojo at matfyz.cz  Fri Sep  9 22:44:14 2005
From: jojo at matfyz.cz (Marian Cerny)
Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 23:44:14 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21
In-Reply-To: <4321FEBB.1010703@seznam.cz>
References: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<4321FEBB.1010703@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <20050909214414.GA15866@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz>

On 2005-09-09 23:29 +0200, Pavel Krejci wrote:
> Hi this is krepa and krepa thinks that quintus should not be so 
> ignorant. Many times other users asked quintus not to copy whole digest 
> back to mailing list. Specially when the question does not have anything 
> common to the digest.

YES! I send him a message, that he should not include the digest in
reply about 10-20 times off-list. He ignores that :-(.

-- 
Marian Cerny <jojo at matfyz.cz>
Jabber: jojo at njs.netlab.cz

[ UNIX is user friendly. It's just selective about who its friends are. ]


From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Fri Sep  9 23:22:15 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 00:22:15 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mind the user
Message-ID: <mailman.0.1126304559.13231.ronja@lists.pointless.net>


Hi,

 >Like: I go to http://geda.seul.org/download.html. There should be
   >instruction what the user should do to download the software. Is
   >there such one? Isn't. There is like 200 various links to various pieces
   >of the software. Everytime I visit that page I never know what I should
   >download!
   >
   >What the heck did you expect the user wants to do when he comes to
   >Download? Plant potatoes in his garden? And where do you think he should
   >take the information how to download gEDA? Decode it from cosmic
   >background radiation using Arecribo radiotelescope?
   >

I especially don?t like the fact, that there isn?t any Package with all the gedatools inside.

   >Can't you write instructions like that?
   >http://links.twibright.com/download.php
   >If I was able to write them, why can't you?
   >
But I unfortunately I have to do that, the latest testing debian package even doesn?t have gtk...

lucas



From asteri_x at freemail.hu  Sat Sep 10 13:32:44 2005
From: asteri_x at freemail.hu (Gy Martin)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 14:32:44 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21
In-Reply-To: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4322D26C.6050402@freemail.hu>

Quintus Murray wrote:
> Hi this is quintus murray and I would like to know if the Links web
> browser (all versions of Links) can be installed on the nintendo DS if
> the NDS has linux kernal 2.6 which doesn't have a built-in web browser?
> or any nintendo ds? If yes how do I do this?

Hi!

We are SOOO GLAD to hear from you again!

Here some answers to your questions:

1. Don't dare to ask a question with the whole posting of the digest
letter ever again, or something bad happens to your Nintendo DS.
2. Your Nintendo operating system and browser installing question has
nothing to do with Ronja, so ask your questions on a Linux _beginner_ list!
3. Google is your friend...
4. It is totally unimportant, wether you setup your switches from a PC
or a Nintendo. It is easier to use a PC.

Bye,
Martin


"Live long and prosper"


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 10 18:01:52 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 19:01:52 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <20050816085849.AA1F956803C@serverlinux.chrudim-city.cz>
References: <20050816085849.AA1F956803C@serverlinux.chrudim-city.cz>
Message-ID: <20050910170152.GB15086@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 10:58:46AM +0200, Hashi wrote:
> 
> By -=RYS=-
>  > Je to asi mesic a pul, kdy jsem byl na Berounce u Hashiho a na stole mi
> poustel loop Twister - TX - RX.
>  > Ja vytahl spektroskop do 2.5GHz a to bylo "bordelu".
>  > Mel to jen na "dratkach", ale nektere harmoniky bylo slyset za S9 na
> vzdalenost 10m.
> ---
> 
> Jo, je to tak, ale na koaxu ;-).
> Byla to konfigurace - twister (v medeny krabce) a Rx a Tx od Skontorpa (v
> tusim AH102) spojeny asi 3m RG58.

Skontorp -> sorry, no support. I can't be even sure that the grounds
were connected correctly and not with some unreliable connector like RCA
or BNC. Grounding quality has big influence on radiation.

If anyone has the problem with Ronja built according to the guide please
tell.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 10 18:02:49 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 19:02:49 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <001201c5a254$f2bbe580$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <20050816085849.AA1F956803C@serverlinux.chrudim-city.cz>
	<001201c5a254$f2bbe580$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050910170248.GC15086@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 01:23:38PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> Bordel to asi dela dost a  samotny obvod ronji, treba kdyz je to kousek od 
> pc, tak je to rusene harddiskem (co jsem tak vypozoroval).Kdyz to ale 

Which part did you put next to PC? RX? TX? Twister? AUI Forte?

Was it according to the guide? Was it shielded? Was the shielding box
closed?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 10 18:07:50 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 19:07:50 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Fwd: odpov
In-Reply-To: <200508161847.4221@centrum.cz>
References: <200508161847.4221@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050910170750.GD15086@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 06:47:11PM +0200, -=RYS=- wrote:
> To by mel spis Clock, vybral si no-free nesvobodnou konferu do ktere
> muze prispivat jen vyvoleny.  -=RYS=-

I unfrotunately don't have a root server and I don't want to pester
Jezek owning ronja.twibright.com server with setting up mailing list.
He's doing enough things for me for free.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 10 18:08:30 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 19:08:30 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <200508161849.4548@centrum.cz>
References: <200508161849.4548@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050910170830.GE15086@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 06:49:37PM +0200, -=RYS=- wrote:
> Az dodelam Ronju, tak si to omerim a nafotim TFT spektroskopu at je to "videt".

Please make a photo of your measurement setup too for me to know what
device was exactly measured.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 10 18:28:19 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 19:28:19 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <20050819105058.GA16167@feanor>
References: <200508180940.9422@centrum.cz>
	<20050819095918.GB11888@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<20050819105058.GA16167@feanor>
Message-ID: <20050910172818.GA19191@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 12:50:58PM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 11:59:18AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> > On Thu, Aug 18, 2005 at 09:40:38AM +0200, Rasken at centrum.cz wrote:
> > > to Clock:
> > > Nemyslys ze by tokovehle zapojeni je vyhodnejsi nez koax a draty zapajene primo do vrabciho hnizda?
> > > - F konektor:  je rychlejsi na odmontovani, pri vymnene modulu v
> > > pripade poruchy, nez lozit na strechu s prodluzkou uvazanou za pasem a
> > > trafopajkou v ruce, a ne kazdy ma pristup k e sve RONJE aby se tam moh
> > > pohodlne usadit a pajet.........
> > 
> > No F is unreliable.
> 
> Why do you think F connector is unreliable (if it is used correcty,
> especially is needed to use F-connector with inner diameter matching
> to outer diameter of coaxial cable and use cable with thick (1 mm)
> central wire)?

Because the wire is copper. Copper is not gold. And the wire is just
plugged into socket, no permanent reliable plastic deformation is
performed. Copper oxide forms on the copper wire everywhere else except
the microscopic place the wire touches the socket.

When the wire moves against the socket due to thermal expansion,
vibration, ageing or touching the cable, the microscopic unoxidized spot
is moved away and replaced with oxidized place. The contact then
vanishes.

The xopper oxide may flake off (be scratched off by the socket) in
microscopic fashion. The connection then seems to be "intelligent" and
changes randomly between conductive, insulating, and semiconductive
state as those patches of oxide move due to termal expansion or
mechanical stress, vibrations etc.

Solutions are only 2 known to me:
1) use metal that doesn't oxidize on *both* ends of the joint: gold
2) brute force the metals together so their crystallic lattices
plastically melt together and make it so robust way that it survives even
mechanical stress. This is how terminal block for electricians works.

> I think it is much more reliable - i tried to build connectors
> based on your design and, according to my experience, they are
> very susceptible to cable breakage.

What did break? Cable? Or the soldered joint? Did you use the new 29mm
copper stubs which are soldered in the middle and did you tie the
conductor to the stub with tape?

> 
> And with wire nut (svorkovnice - je wire nut anglicky spravne?) inside
> optical head it is impossible to observe instructions for applying
> silicone sealant (several hours after apply without contact with water).

I don't understand this. You install the electronics, connect the
terminal block, then take pistol with sealant and you can seal it
immediately. That's how I did it. What's the problem in your case?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 10 18:29:40 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 19:29:40 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <200508191551.2191@centrum.cz>
References: <200508191551.2191@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050910172940.GB19191@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 03:51:45PM +0200, Rasken at centrum.cz wrote:
> A jaky je rozdil kdyz mas na dne  tubusu cokoladu a nebo mas svorky primo na krabicce??
> Podle mne sou svorky primo na modulu prakticstejsi.

You cannot unscrew a cable from terminal block on the box without taking
the box away from the pipe. Which will kill the optical alignment ->
mega pain in the ass (waiting for the night to realign the link).

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 10 18:31:16 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 19:31:16 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Podivny Twister
In-Reply-To: <001001c5a4db$48d88670$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <001001c5a4db$48d88670$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050910173116.GC19191@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 06:29:00PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> Dobry den,
> 
> mam tady divne chovajici se twister. Postaveny podle navodu na DPS. Zapojen
> do sitovky rtl8139. Twister podle vseho korektne vysila link-integrity pulzy
> a OS pripojenou sit detekuje.
> Skrz tento twister pakety nekdy prochazeji, nekdy ne. Kdyz neprochazeji,
> neblika ani cervena Tx LED.

Didn't you use AM26LS32 instead of AM26LS32A?

Can you send photo of internals of the affected Twister?

> 
> Zdalo se to jako vadny UTP kabel, ale ten jsem zkousel na loopback a jede
> OK. Prozkousel jsem i konektor pripojujici utp do DPS, taky v poradku.
> Chvili pakety prochazeji a chvili ne. Prosim, pomozte.

This looks like a faulty contact or soldered joint. I'll see what
feeling I get from the photo.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 10 18:35:26 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 19:35:26 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <4306264F.3090604@katka.biz>
References: <200508191551.2191@centrum.cz> <4306264F.3090604@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <20050910173526.GD19191@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Fri, Aug 19, 2005 at 06:34:55PM +0000, Martin Polehla wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> to nevim - zajmalo me, proc ze chces lezt na strechu s pajkou ?

Ronja 115 Metropolis was having originally the wires soldered on the
boxes and that was mega pain in the ass.

When you have failure in winter or rain, you are rolling 20m extension
cord on the roof and the 220V sockets are on rain or in sleet -> high
risk of being killed by electric shock.

If you try gas soldering iron, it doesn't work in wind. Only in still
air. Wind cools it down too quickly to get to temperature.

If there's freezing outside in the winter, you don't have chance even
with 100W soldering gun. Which means that in case of failure, instead
of replacing module in 30 minutes and having 1 hour downtime, you can
have downtime like 1 month if the weather is bad.

CL<
> 
> p0l0us
> 
> Rasken at centrum.cz wrote:
> 
> > A jaky je rozdil kdyz mas na dne tubusu cokoladu a nebo mas svorky
> > primo na krabicce?? Podle mne sou svorky primo na modulu
> > prakticstejsi.
> >
> > Rasken
> >
> > ______________________________________________________________
> >
> >> Od: polous at katka.biz Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net Datum:
> >> 18.08.2005 10:30 P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] problem
> >>
> 
> > Rasken at centrum.cz wrote:
> >
> >> to Clock: Nemyslys ze by tokovehle zapojeni je vyhodnejsi nez
> >> koax a draty zapajene primo do vrabciho hnizda? - F konektor: je
> >> rychlejsi na odmontovani, pri vymnene modulu v pripade poruchy,
> >> nez lozit na strechu s prodluzkou uvazanou za pasem a trafopajkou
> >> v ruce, a ne kazdy ma pristup k e sve RONJE aby se tam moh
> >> pohodlne usadit a pajet.........
> >
> > vsak na odmontovani modulu ti staci sroubovak - moduli sou
> > pridelany na cokoladach, k cemu pajka ?
> >
> >> - Svorkovnice: je taky rychlejsi na odmontovani, stejne by to
> >> chctelo RONJU kapku upravit, a nenapajet ji po stineni koaxu, ale
> >> natanout nejakou dvoulinku zaroven s koaxem, ta 100,- navic uz
> >> nikoho nezabije/ nevytrhne, a pak jen propojit Tx s Rx a je to.
> >> Zrusi se tim "interference" do Tv rozvodu atd. atd. .....
> >
> > p0l0us
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 
> > _______________________________________________ Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
> Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
> 
> iD8DBQFDBiZPYo9JRD7EbFIRAjZrAKCTdFuigK/SDbYc55z6Sjkdw7FAogCcDkuZ
> TJxnNR8n2amIrSIwlVNjsHk=
> =gE5m
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 10 18:36:27 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 19:36:27 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Podivny Twister
In-Reply-To: <000901c5a562$e57cb320$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <001001c5a4db$48d88670$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<4306BD96.4020709@hkfree.org>
	<000901c5a562$e57cb320$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050910173627.GE19191@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sat, Aug 20, 2005 at 10:40:44AM +0200, anMic wrote:
> Jak jsem jiznil, twister je postaven podle navodu tzn. 1 m UTP, zakrytovano
> v kovove krabicce. (btw, dokud byl ten twister jeste OK, testoval jsem ho i
> s 20 m UTP a fungoval.)
> 
> Pridavam jeste par informaci, co by mohly pomoci. Vypadky paketu s tim, ze
> ledky ani nebliknou, se take spolehlive dostavi, kdyz pripojim na vystup Rx
> a Tx kus dratu jako loopback. Pokud mam pripojene Rx a Tx moduly a zastinim
> z blizka zcela rx fotodiodu, zelena rx led na twisteru se rozsviti na max.
> Ty same rx a tx moduly funguji s Aui_forte bez problemu a testpointy jsou +-
> ok.

Do you have full duplex network card and are you sure the network card
is set to full duplex?

CL<


From quintusmurray at yahoo.com  Sat Sep 10 21:40:18 2005
From: quintusmurray at yahoo.com (Quintus Murray)
Date: Sat, 10 Sep 2005 13:40:18 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Ronja] nintendo ds internet
In-Reply-To: <mailman.1.1126350001.14703.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
Message-ID: <20050910204018.62404.qmail@web53415.mail.yahoo.com>

Hi this is quintus murray and I would like to know if the Links web browser (all versions)including graphic modes can be installed on the nintendo DS if it has linux kernel 2.6 which doesn't have a built-in web browser due to the NDS' specs if this is possible can you tell me how to do this?

		
---------------------------------
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From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 11 08:01:59 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2005 09:01:59 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 2x 74AC04 misto 3x 74HC04
In-Reply-To: <a3bf093b050824102950507ac4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <a3bf093b050824102950507ac4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050911070159.GB8442@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Wed, Aug 24, 2005 at 07:29:49PM +0200, Milan Korda wrote:
> Mam doma par 74AC04 a tak se ptam jestli je mozna vyse uvedena nahrada.
> Dik moc za odpoved

Yes.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 11 08:24:56 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2005 09:24:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100Mbit/s Ronja?
In-Reply-To: <430D7A27.2030203@freemail.hu>
References: <430C9EE5.2040909@freemail.hu>
	<1124903008.2751.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<430D7A27.2030203@freemail.hu>
Message-ID: <20050911072456.GG8442@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 25, 2005 at 09:58:31AM +0200, Martin wrote:
> Hi!
> I found a very interesting IC:
> http://www.microlinear.com/downloads/DS/DS6652.pdf
> It has autonegotiation, etc.
> I don't know the price. Maybe it's worth not to fuzz around with
> discrete things.

The don't have it in distrele.ch nor in gme.cz. Ronja has to be made
portable, from widely available components. Don't you know about a
portable equivalent?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 11 08:26:47 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2005 09:26:47 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] FULL DUPLEX
In-Reply-To: <2FD938AF54EB574CA0320F210526F395DBF363@EXCHANGE.skrivanek.cz.local>
References: <2FD938AF54EB574CA0320F210526F395DBF363@EXCHANGE.skrivanek.cz.local>
Message-ID: <20050911072647.GH8442@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Thu, Aug 25, 2005 at 03:35:27PM +0200, S?kora Honza wrote:
> Zdarec mam takovy problem ronja mi jede ale jen v half duplexu a to
> tak ze najedne strane ji mam v 3com509b a na druhe strane ve switchi
> kdyz to vyndam a dam ji do sitovky az uz 3com509 nebo 3com905c nebo
> realtek 8139d tak link sice je ale ping neprojde ani zaboha a nevim
> cim to muze byt kdyz to napojim na notebook tak to jede i ve full
> diplexu jinak 3c509b nastavuju do full duplexu pomoci ethtool tak samo
> i na druhe strane ale linux linux nefacha a linux switch ze seothce do
> linuxu facha linux XP taky facha.  Jeste me napadlo kdyz mam nekrizeny
> kabel na kazde strane jestli to neni tim jestli na ronje nema byt
> jedna strana jako krizeny a druha nekrizeny kabel. Diky za rady 

Nastav obe strany manualne na 10Mbps full duplex.

CL<


From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Sun Sep 11 09:23:29 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2005 10:23:29 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Fwd: odpov
Message-ID: <mailman.1.1126427035.13231.ronja@lists.pointless.net>

Hi,
I didn?t understand the message inCZ, but if you want to move your mailing list to another server, my webhoster is a friend from school which has 2 debian rootserver where one could install mailman.

Lucas

----- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht -----
   >Von: "Karel Kulhavy"<clock at twibright.com>
   >Gesendet: 10.09.05 19:07:50
   >An: "Twibright Ronja"<ronja at lists.pointless.net>
   >Betreff: Re: [Ronja] Fwd: odpov
   >
   >On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 06:47:11PM +0200, -=RYS=- wrote:
   >> To by mel spis Clock, vybral si no-free nesvobodnou konferu do ktere
   >> muze prispivat jen vyvoleny.  -=RYS=-
   >
   >I unfrotunately don't have a root server and I don't want to pester
   >Jezek owning ronja.twibright.com server with setting up mailing list.
   >He's doing enough things for me for free.
   >
   >CL<
   >
   >_______________________________________________
   >Ronja mailing list
   >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
   >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
   >



From anmic at fmg.sk  Sun Sep 11 10:52:46 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2005 11:52:46 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Podivny Twister
References: <001001c5a4db$48d88670$0101a8c0@anmic><4306BD96.4020709@hkfree.org><000901c5a562$e57cb320$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050910173627.GE19191@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <000301c5b70c$85c7edd0$0101a8c0@anmic>

This problem has been already solved.
(Bad joint which caused the 22p capacitor was only in touch with the PCB. It
was sometimes conductive and sometimes not, so the twister occasionally
worked. Resoldered and now ok.)

anMic


> On Sat, Aug 20, 2005 at 10:40:44AM +0200, anMic wrote:
> > Jak jsem jiznil, twister je postaven podle navodu tzn. 1 m UTP,
zakrytovano
> > v kovove krabicce. (btw, dokud byl ten twister jeste OK, testoval jsem
ho i
> > s 20 m UTP a fungoval.)
> >
> > Pridavam jeste par informaci, co by mohly pomoci. Vypadky paketu s tim,
ze
> > ledky ani nebliknou, se take spolehlive dostavi, kdyz pripojim na vystup
Rx
> > a Tx kus dratu jako loopback. Pokud mam pripojene Rx a Tx moduly a
zastinim
> > z blizka zcela rx fotodiodu, zelena rx led na twisteru se rozsviti na
max.
> > Ty same rx a tx moduly funguji s Aui_forte bez problemu a testpointy
jsou +-
> > ok.
>
> Do you have full duplex network card and are you sure the network card
> is set to full duplex?
>
> CL<
>



From anmic at fmg.sk  Sun Sep 11 10:47:02 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Sun, 11 Sep 2005 11:47:02 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
References: <200508180940.9422@centrum.cz><20050819095918.GB11888@kestrel.twibright.com><20050819105058.GA16167@feanor>
	<20050910172818.GA19191@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <000201c5b70c$850931b0$0101a8c0@anmic>

> > I think it is much more reliable - i tried to build connectors
> > based on your design and, according to my experience, they are
> > very susceptible to cable breakage.
>
> What did break? Cable? Or the soldered joint? Did you use the new 29mm
> copper stubs which are soldered in the middle and did you tie the
> conductor to the stub with tape?
>

It is difficult or nearly impossible to solder copper stubs to a coaxial
shielding as described in the guide. I only managed to do it with a very old
coaxial cable with unreliable copper shielding (no foil there). Shielding of
the RG6 coax I'm using now is absolutely non-solderable.

anMic



From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 12 08:08:33 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 09:08:33 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org>
	<001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050912070833.GB6869@kestrel>

On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 07:02:24PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z 
> dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je 
> skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
> Prumer je pravych 130mm

It shouldn't be a problem.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 12 08:10:16 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 09:10:16 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <000401c5ae6d$1903e0c0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<000401c5ae6d$1903e0c0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050912071016.GC6869@kestrel>

On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 10:46:44PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> mam dotaz tohle :
> 
> http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/installing.php
> 
> zejmena zaostrovani krystalu a hledani ohniskove vzdalenosti se dela az 
> primo na strese nebo lze vyzkouset v tubusech i doma ?

You can do it at home and you don't need the pipes. Just the lens.

> 
> podle tohohle  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Focal_length
> 
> jsem pochopil , ze kdyz umistim LEDku do F, tak by sirka paprsku mela byt 
> stejne velka at uz na 10 tak na 300metru ?
> sorry ze se ptam tak hloupe, ale na 3m nejsem schopnej na zdi krystal 
> zaostrit pohybem v tubusu, na 10uz to jde, ale kdyz nehejbu s ledkou a jen 

Measure the lens itself, don't use LED but a table lamp. Put the lens
next to wall and table lamp away.

I already put it into FAQ.

CL<

> prodlouzim vzdalenost, cely se to rozostri a navic je to kolecko vetsi, neni 
> mi teda jasny jak se to zameruje na 300m kdyz to kolo bude mit v prumeru 
> treba 3metry ?? A uz vubec si to nedovedu predstavut u RX.
> Doted jsem byl presvedcenej ze kdystal na HPWT si zaostrim treba na 3 metry, 
> posvitim s tim do RX a budu hejbat dokud tam nebude nejvetsi napeti, ale asi 
> to bude uplne jinak.
> Poradite prosim nekdo ??
> Moc diky :/
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> 
> From: "Pavel Srnka" <srnkap at extranetplus.cz>
> To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> 
> 
> stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
> vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm , nicmene
> kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
> To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> 
> 
> > je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
> > neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc dobre
> > :) kolik ty cocky staly?
> >
> > Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >> Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
> >> dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
> >> skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
> >> Prumer je pravych 130mm
> >>
> >> Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale prekvapilo
> >> nas
> >> tohle :(((
> >>
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message ----- 
> >> From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
> >> To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >> Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
> >> Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem miste a
> >>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda ohnisko
> >>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 4kusy a
> >>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
> >>>>
> >>>>dik
> >>>>
> >>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat jestli je
> >>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
> >>>>
> >>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
> >>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
> >>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
> >>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
> >>>>
> >>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja tubuse
> >>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
> >>>>   nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim do
> >>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
> >>>>
> >>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
> >>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
> >>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
> >>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala
> >>>>>50kc,
> >>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny
> >>>>>pumer
> >>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro TX.
> >>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu, kdezto
> >>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
> >>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca polovina
> >>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v prstenci
> >>>>>o
> >>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna jen
> >>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a podstatne
> >>>>>tak
> >>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
> >>>>>106mm.
> >>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby byly obe
> >>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
> >>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) a
> >>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
> >>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
> >>>>>
> >>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Ronja mailing list
> >> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 12 12:13:39 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 13:13:39 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21
In-Reply-To: <4322D26C.6050402@freemail.hu>
References: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<4322D26C.6050402@freemail.hu>
Message-ID: <20050912111339.GC12755@kestrel>

On Sat, Sep 10, 2005 at 02:32:44PM +0200, Gy Martin wrote:
> Quintus Murray wrote:
> > Hi this is quintus murray and I would like to know if the Links web
> > browser (all versions of Links) can be installed on the nintendo DS if
> > the NDS has linux kernal 2.6 which doesn't have a built-in web browser?

If the Nintendo runs Linux, Links should run on it. It's suitable for
embedded systems.

Go to http://links.twibright.com that's homepage of Links and post
into that mailing list if you have questions like this, not into Ronja.

CL<

> > or any nintendo ds? If yes how do I do this?
> 
> Hi!
> 
> We are SOOO GLAD to hear from you again!
> 
> Here some answers to your questions:
> 
> 1. Don't dare to ask a question with the whole posting of the digest
> letter ever again, or something bad happens to your Nintendo DS.
> 2. Your Nintendo operating system and browser installing question has
> nothing to do with Ronja, so ask your questions on a Linux _beginner_ list!
 3. Google is your friend...
> 4. It is totally unimportant, wether you setup your switches from a PC
> or a Nintendo. It is easier to use a PC.
> 
> Bye,
> Martin
> 
> 
> "Live long and prosper"
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From sith at wifistar.net  Mon Sep 12 16:51:59 2005
From: sith at wifistar.net (=?UTF-8?B?RGF2aWQgU2VkbMOhxI1law==?=)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 15:51:59 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] Cocky v Pze
In-Reply-To: <20050912111339.GC12755@kestrel>
References: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>	<4322D26C.6050402@freemail.hu>
	<20050912111339.GC12755@kestrel>
Message-ID: <4325A41F.4060107@wifistar.net>

Zdravim. Chtel bych v Holesovicich (prazske trznici) koupit par 130mm
cocek, neznate nekdo cenu za ks?


-- 
Regards,
David Sedl??ek
WiFiStar.net, o.s.
skype: sith_cz


From supermaster at seznam.cz  Mon Sep 12 15:20:31 2005
From: supermaster at seznam.cz (SuperMaster)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 16:20:31 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <20050912070833.GB6869@kestrel>
References: <42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org>	<001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<20050912070833.GB6869@kestrel>
Message-ID: <43258EAF.5070803@seznam.cz>

Az na to ze se vyuzije jen cca 30-40% z vyzarene energie z ty LED to je 
uplne vpohode :))

Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):

>On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 07:02:24PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
>  
>
>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z 
>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je 
>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>    
>>
>
>It shouldn't be a problem.
>
>CL<
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>  
>



From srnkap at extranetplus.cz  Mon Sep 12 15:30:02 2005
From: srnkap at extranetplus.cz (Pavel Srnka)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 16:30:02 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
References: <42F7C0B5.2050902@hkfree.org>	<001101c5ae4d$c2a78340$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><20050912070833.GB6869@kestrel>
	<43258EAF.5070803@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <001301c5b7a6$7603c5a0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>

tak oprava, na 340m se ohnisko jevi kolem 32-34cm
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "SuperMaster" <supermaster at seznam.cz>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Monday, September 12, 2005 4:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX


> Az na to ze se vyuzije jen cca 30-40% z vyzarene energie z ty LED to je 
> uplne vpohode :))
> 
> Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> 
>>On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 07:02:24PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
>>  
>>
>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z 
>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je 
>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
>>>    
>>>
>>
>>It shouldn't be a problem.
>>
>>CL<
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>  
>>
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From asteri_x at freemail.hu  Mon Sep 12 17:19:18 2005
From: asteri_x at freemail.hu (Martin)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 18:19:18 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 130 mm lenses "fang da jing" :)
Message-ID: <4325AA86.5040903@freemail.hu>

Hi Everybody!

I made a research about magnifying glasses, and wanted to find the
manufacturers of the 130 cm lens. This is what i found:
www.formosa-translation.com/chinese/m/mz08.html

So the "fang da jing" means actually "magnifying glass"
That means nobody can tell, what type of glasses you are using, and can
by at the Praha market.

My problem is, that glasses in this size get horribly expensive if they
are really good.

Can anybody tell me a supplier, where to get cheap but good lenses about
110..130mm size in Austria or Germany?

Are Fresnel-lenses also good for long distance?
Any experiences with them?
I bought 2 reading aids made of fresnel lenses, but they are not rigid
acryl lenses, so they bend, and the collimated spot is also horrible...

Bye
Martin


From djbobr.ronja at seznam.cz  Mon Sep 12 18:10:08 2005
From: djbobr.ronja at seznam.cz (dj-bobr)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 19:10:08 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Cocky v Pze
In-Reply-To: <4325A41F.4060107@wifistar.net>
References: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>	<4322D26C.6050402@freemail.hu>	<20050912111339.GC12755@kestrel>
	<4325A41F.4060107@wifistar.net>
Message-ID: <4325B670.6000206@seznam.cz>

To zalezi na tom, jak ukecas prodavace :)
Ja kupoval 4 kousky a usmlouval jsem je za 50Kc/kus

B.

> Zdravim. Chtel bych v Holesovicich (prazske trznici) koupit par 130mm
> cocek, neznate nekdo cenu za ks?


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 12 19:05:17 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 20:05:17 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Cocky v Pze
In-Reply-To: <4325A41F.4060107@wifistar.net>
References: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<4322D26C.6050402@freemail.hu> <20050912111339.GC12755@kestrel>
	<4325A41F.4060107@wifistar.net>
Message-ID: <20050912180517.GA12943@kestrel>

On Mon, Sep 12, 2005 at 03:51:59PM +0000, David Sedl??ek wrote:
> Zdravim. Chtel bych v Holesovicich (prazske trznici) koupit par 130mm
> cocek, neznate nekdo cenu za ks?

Look at Wiki first:
http://twiki.twibright.com/bin/view/Main/GettingRonjaOptics

CL<


From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Mon Sep 12 19:30:26 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 20:30:26 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Cocky v Pze
In-Reply-To: <20050912180517.GA12943@kestrel>
References: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>	<4322D26C.6050402@freemail.hu>
	<20050912111339.GC12755@kestrel>	<4325A41F.4060107@wifistar.net>
	<20050912180517.GA12943@kestrel>
Message-ID: <4325C942.4080902@centrum.cz>

ja bych potreboval jestli by mi nejaky hodny clovek par tech 130mm cocek 
neposlal...mala odmena ho nemine ... (mala :))... diky moc

Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> On Mon, Sep 12, 2005 at 03:51:59PM +0000, David Sedl??ek wrote:
> 
>>Zdravim. Chtel bych v Holesovicich (prazske trznici) koupit par 130mm
>>cocek, neznate nekdo cenu za ks?
> 
> 
> Look at Wiki first:
> http://twiki.twibright.com/bin/view/Main/GettingRonjaOptics
> 
> CL<
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 12 19:33:36 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 20:33:36 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 130 mm lenses "fang da jing" :)
In-Reply-To: <4325AA86.5040903@freemail.hu>
References: <4325AA86.5040903@freemail.hu>
Message-ID: <20050912183336.GC13855@kestrel>

On Mon, Sep 12, 2005 at 06:19:18PM +0200, Martin wrote:
> Hi Everybody!
> 
> I made a research about magnifying glasses, and wanted to find the
> manufacturers of the 130 cm lens. This is what i found:
> www.formosa-translation.com/chinese/m/mz08.html
> 
> So the "fang da jing" means actually "magnifying glass"
> That means nobody can tell, what type of glasses you are using, and can
> by at the Praha market.
> 
> My problem is, that glasses in this size get horribly expensive if they
> are really good.
> 
> Can anybody tell me a supplier, where to get cheap but good lenses about
> 110..130mm size in Austria or Germany?

Dioptra CZ, they send by post to Ausland too.
http://twiki.twibright.com/bin/view/Main/GettingRonjaOptics

> 
> Are Fresnel-lenses also good for long distance?

Yes.

> Any experiences with them?

Fogtown development :) 3.0km measurement-predicted range in 4km
atmospheric visibility.

CL<


From archaopttrx at arcor.de  Mon Sep 12 21:22:04 2005
From: archaopttrx at arcor.de (Daniel Berger)
Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 22:22:04 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Are plastic lenses usable?
Message-ID: <4325E36C.70005@arcor.de>

Hello list!

I have found a source for 130mm plastic loupes in Germany:
http://makroshopping.de/index.php?m=shop_artikel_detail:modul_artikel_det&shop_katnr=79&anr=1632&child=&submenu_child=&subsubmenu_child=&PHPSESSID=3f79982c36e43ecc0b4a452525734f00
They cost only 2 Euro per piece.
The distance for my intended link would be about 500 metres.
Can I use plastic lenses, or must they be made of glass?

Regards, Daniel.


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 07:09:01 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 08:09:01 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <000801c5b0c4$09a11f40$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>
	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>
	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<431AD460.8030606@seznam.cz>
	<000801c5b0c4$09a11f40$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050913060900.GC16279@kestrel>

On Sat, Sep 03, 2005 at 10:14:06PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> co se tyce zapojeni s utp, tak je to docela perfektni, z moji zkusenosti 
> nedochazi k ruseni tv (ronja cca 1m od tv anten), nicmene nevim na jakym to 
> chytam kmitoctu, takze se muze jednat jenom o stesti :)
> jinak posilam slibenou fotodokumentci ( crusader dole ronja (asi prvni sveho 
> druhu v techto koncinach)  nahore), na 340m  4,02 a 4,16V, takze to snad 
> pojede i za mlhy.
> Jenom mam takovy dotaz, uz kdyz jsem je mel na stole a pingal jsem mezi 
> sebou, bylo videt ze jedna strana lakoby pohasinala a znovu se rozsvecela, 
> na prenosy to nema vliv (v obou smerech 1150kB) ale pri uploadu jsou pri 
> plne rychlosti pingy 5-7ms (coz by slo) , pri downloadu nad cca 900kB to ale 
> skoci reba i lehce pres 50ms, netusi nekdo cim by to mohlo byt ??

Thats incorrectly set LED preemphasis.
http://ronja.twibright.com/tetrapolis/testing.php
Preemphasis setting

CL<
> 
> http://ronja.pavel.extranetplus.cz
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "SuperMaster" <supermaster at seznam.cz>
> To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 1:02 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> 
> 
> Super! Konecne jsem se nekde docetl, jak pouzit to UTP misto koaxu, diky
> za link. Mechanicky to chci udelat tak, ze to bude ctyrboky jehlan
> svareny z poradnych vinglu, ve vrcholu budou kolejnie pro RX modul. Cele
> to bude derzet minimalne o 100% zvetseny puvodni clockuv drzak,
> pravdepodobne jeste lehce modifikovany pro vetsi tuhost. Cele to bude
> vazit klidne 20kg. Ted mi jeste poradte: premyslim nad 310x310 s 330mm,
> coz dava dopadovy uhel priblizne 25 stupnu, nebo ta 320x400 s 550, ktera
> dava uhel delsi strany 20 stupnu. Delsi ohnisko je lepsi pro vetsi
> citlivost fotodiody, ale zaroven bude nachylnejsi na presnost zamereni i
> pripadne krouceni budovy/drzaku. Cena je 15 resp. 28 dolaru, takze to
> neni primarni problem. Dalsi moznost je ze koupim tu 310x310 a oriznu ji
> na prumer 210 a dam ji do te nejvesi odpadove roury, kterou uz mam
> koupenou. Myslite ze tech 310x310 resp 320x400 je overkill na 1.6km?
> mame tu dost casto mlhy, je to nad hostivari, takze bych to chtel mit co
> mozna nejlepsi.
> 
> Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
> 
> >To by te mohlo zajimat tohle http://laser.webpark.cz/work.html , ozivil 
> >jsem
> >Clockovu Interpolis s vyuzitim stavajicich dilu s 13cm sikmovokejma 
> >cockama.
> >Zatim si to brousi zuby na cca 3km.
> >Prvni testy na 2,5km dopadly nadejne.
> >
> >
> >
> >>Bude to na 1.6km, ale chtel bych aby to jelo co nejlepe i v mlze,
> >>snezeni a tak. Pri silne mlze nemam sanci, ale pri slabe doufam ze jo. A
> >>prepsal jsem se, maj rozmer 320x400 s 550, nebo 310x310 s 330mm
> >>ohniskem, jeste uvidim, pro co se rozhodnu.
> >>
> >>Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>Kam chtej s takovym kanonem mirit?
> >>>13cm cocky od sikmovokejch v pohode staci na 2km.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>1)Ohnisko se meri podle toho vzorecku uvedeneho v FAQ, uz to se pisu
> >>>>podruhe.
> >>>>2)Dlouha ohniskova vzdalenost je super pro RX, protoze prijimaci
> >>>>fotodioda SFH203 ma dost uzky prijimaci uhel s docela ostrym maximem v
> >>>>ose a cim vice mimo osu, tim rychleji pada, takze idelani je dosahnout
> >>>>reknmeme 10 stupnu od osy, coz je pomerne hodne malo, takze cim delsi
> >>>>ohnisko, tim lepe. Presne obracene to je u TX, protoze ta F LEDka vysila
> >>>>cca 30-35 stupnu, takze na 130mm cocku je ideal rekneme 180mm, tedy
> >>>>pomerne dost malo. Ja to budu resit fresnelkama, pro RX budu nakonec
> >>>>muset dat naprosto silenou 500x420mm z www.3dlens.com , ktera ma ohnisko
> >>>>550, na TX jeste nevim, ale doufam ze sezenu nejakou jinou fresnelku.
> >>>>
> >>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>stala asi 240 sevsim vsudy, jde mi o to jestli to pri takove ohniskoe
> >>>>>vzdalenosti bude mit dostatecny vykon, na slunku vyslo kolem 34cm ,
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>nicmene
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>kdyz s tim zkousim zamerit krystal, tak je to ostry az na 37cm
> >>>>>
> >>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
> >>>>>From: "Jakub Michn?k" <jakub.michnik at centrum.cz>
> >>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>>>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2005 7:33 PM
> >>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>je to mozne. jesis to meril na slunku, tak je to spravna hodnota, ale
> >>>>>>neni to zadna super, nicmene ti to fachcit bude.. aotazka jak moc 
> >>>>>>dobre
> >>>>>>:) kolik ty cocky staly?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Chci se zeptat , na doporuceni jsem koupil 130mm sklenene (G) cocky z
> >>>>>>>dioptry, ale byl jsem nemile prekvapen ze maji ohnisko kolem 37cm, je
> >>>>>>>skutecne mozne ze je to tolik ?? bude to nejak vadit u TX nebo RX ???
> >>>>>>>Prumer je pravych 130mm
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>Diky za rychlou odpoved, prave jsme to chteli testovat, ale 
> >>>>>>>prekvapilo
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>nas
> >>>>>>>tohle :(((
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- 
> >>>>>>>From: "Kendy - HKFree" <kendy at hkfree.org>
> >>>>>>>To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>>>>>Sent: Monday, August 08, 2005 10:29 PM
> >>>>>>>Subject: Re: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>Ohnisko je vzdy od zdi k cocce, protoze zkus mit cocku na stejnem
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>miste
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>a
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>>pohnout se zdrojem svetla dal. Spravne by se to nemelo moc hnout.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>Pavel Srnka napsal(a):
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>tak mam pcit ze jsme koupii stejyn cocky za 49 navic ma kazda
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>ohnisko
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>jinde, chtel bych nekoho poprosit , jestli ma nejake ozkousene 
> >>>>>>>>>4kusy
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>a
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>byl by ochotny za nejakou castku poslat ?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>dik
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>P.S. Moc mi neni jasne mereni toho ohniska, chci se tedy optat
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>jestli
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>je
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>>>nasledujici postup spravny ??
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>1) Na krabicku pridelam zdroj svetla (malou batercicku)
> >>>>>>>>>2) mezi krabicku a zed vlozim cocku
> >>>>>>>>>3) pohybuju cockou nebo zdrojem svetla dokud se na zdi neobjevi co
> >>>>>>>>>nejmensi nejostrejsi tecka ?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>4) vzdalenost mezi zdrojem svetla a cockou je ohnisko,  a v ronja
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>tubuse
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>>>tedy pouziju tuhle vzdalenost mezi prijmaci i vysilaci led
> >>>>>>>>>nebo zmerim vzdalenost zed-cocka a cocka - zdroj svetla , dosadim
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>do
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>vzorce a pak tuhle velikost pouziju v tubuse ?
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "super master"
> >>>>>>>>><supermaster at seznam.cz>
> >>>>>>>>>To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> >>>>>>>>>Sent: Sunday, July 24, 2005 5:11 PM
> >>>>>>>>>Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>ahoj, vcera jsem koupil v prazske trznici 130mm cocky, jedna stala
> >>>>>>>>>>50kc,
> >>>>>>>>>>ale problem je, ze maji ohniskovou vzdalenost cca 374mm a skutecny
> >>>>>>>>>>pumer
> >>>>>>>>>>je jen 123mm, coz je pouzitelne pro RX, ale v zadnem pripade pro
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>TX.
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>Vysilaci LED HPWT-BD00-F4000 ma vyzarovaci uhel cca 30 stupnu,
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>kdezto
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>ohniskova vzdalenost 374 pri prumeru cocky 123 dava uhel pouze 18
> >>>>>>>>>>stupnu, coz je zalostne malo, takze by se  vyuzila jen cca 
> >>>>>>>>>>polovina
> >>>>>>>>>>vyzarene energie. Navic potiz je, ze ta LEDka sviti nejvice v
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>prstenci
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>o
> >>>>>>>>>>uhlu cca 20 stupnu, takze s pouzitim te cocky by se vyuzilo mozna
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>jen
> >>
> >>
> >>>>>>>>>>30% energie. Napadlo me proto dat dve tyto cocky za sebe a 
> >>>>>>>>>>podstatne
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>tak
> >>>>>>>>>>snizit ohniskovou vzdalenost, ktera by mela byt pro 30 stupnu cca
> >>>>>>>>>>106mm.
> >>>>>>>>>>Ma nekdo neco proti? Problem bude sestavit TX hlavici tak, aby 
> >>>>>>>>>>byly
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>obe
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>cocky presne kolmo k opticke ose, ale to se snad vyresi pouzitim
> >>>>>>>>>>presneho prstence, ktery vlozim mezi obe cocky ( na jejich obvod) 
> >>>>>>>>>>a
> >>>>>>>>>>zafixiju tak jejich vzajemnou polohu. Ted uz jen spocitat jejich
> >>>>>>>>>>vzdalenost a udelat to :)
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>_______________________________________________
> >>>Ronja mailing list
> >>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>Ronja mailing list
> >>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Ronja mailing list
> >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> >
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 07:52:53 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 08:52:53 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] ronja@twibright.com unreachable:
	[MAILER-DAEMON@dodo.freenetproject.org: Undelivered Mail
	Returned to Sender]
In-Reply-To: <20050831205216.GA5887@amphibian.dyndns.org>
References: <20050831205216.GA5887@amphibian.dyndns.org>
Message-ID: <20050913065253.GD18865@kestrel>

On Wed, Aug 31, 2005 at 09:52:16PM +0100, Matthew Toseland wrote:
> ----- Forwarded message from Mail Delivery System <MAILER-DAEMON at dodo.freenetproject.org> -----
> 
> From: Mail Delivery System <MAILER-DAEMON at dodo.freenetproject.org>
> Subject: Undelivered Mail Returned to Sender
> To: toad at amphibian.dyndns.org
> 
> Content-Description: Notification
> This is the Postfix program at host dodo.freenetproject.org.
> 
> I'm sorry to have to inform you that your message could not be
> be delivered to one or more recipients. It's attached below.
> 
> For further assistance, please send mail to <postmaster>
> 
> If you do so, please include this problem report. You can
> delete your own text from the attached returned message.
> 
> 			The Postfix program
> 
> <ronja at twibright.com>: host twin.jikos.cz[213.151.79.26] said: 550 5.1.1
>     <ronja at twibright.com>... User unknown (in reply to RCPT TO command)
> 
> Content-Description: Delivery report
> Reporting-MTA: dns; dodo.freenetproject.org
> X-Postfix-Queue-ID: 40FF9180B5
> X-Postfix-Sender: rfc822; toad at amphibian.dyndns.org
> Arrival-Date: Wed, 31 Aug 2005 21:42:23 +0100 (BST)
> 
> Final-Recipient: rfc822; ronja at twibright.com
> Action: failed
> Status: 5.0.0
> Diagnostic-Code: X-Postfix; host twin.jikos.cz[213.151.79.26] said: 550 5.1.1
>     <ronja at twibright.com>... User unknown (in reply to RCPT TO command)
> 
> Content-Description: Undelivered Message
> To: ronja at twibright.com
> Subject: Donation options
> From: Matthew Toseland <toad at amphibian.dyndns.org>
> 
> I'm considering donating (I might wait until after WSFII). Do you have a

Do you go to WSFII? I am planning to go there. I was invited there.
If yes, you can give me it in raw form :)

> Moneybookers account? It is an alternative to paypal which several people

How much does Moneybookers strip down? And how much do they pester your
privacy?

> recommended to me when we (freenetproject.org) got temporarily banned from
> paypal. International wire transfers are *expensive*, but it would be more

There is also Western Union but I don't know how expensive it is.

> convenient even for Czech citizens. I'd be interested in donating at
> least ?10. PS thanks for providing english designs (the list is almost
> exclusively in Czech).

Thanks,

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 08:14:09 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:14:09 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <431AD460.8030606@seznam.cz>
References: <4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>
	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>
	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz>
	<1125687929.4318a279914a7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<431AD460.8030606@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <20050913071409.GA21474@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 01:02:56PM +0200, SuperMaster wrote:
> Super! Konecne jsem se nekde docetl, jak pouzit to UTP misto koaxu, diky 
> za link. Mechanicky to chci udelat tak, ze to bude ctyrboky jehlan 
> svareny z poradnych vinglu, ve vrcholu budou kolejnie pro RX modul. Cele 
> to bude derzet minimalne o 100% zvetseny puvodni clockuv drzak, 
> pravdepodobne jeste lehce modifikovany pro vetsi tuhost. Cele to bude 
> vazit klidne 20kg. Ted mi jeste poradte: premyslim nad 310x310 s 330mm, 
> coz dava dopadovy uhel priblizne 25 stupnu, nebo ta 320x400 s 550, ktera 
> dava uhel delsi strany 20 stupnu. Delsi ohnisko je lepsi pro vetsi 

You are wasting effort. We have already done it here in Zurich.

> citlivost fotodiody, ale zaroven bude nachylnejsi na presnost zamereni i 
> pripadne krouceni budovy/drzaku. Cena je 15 resp. 28 dolaru, takze to 
> neni primarni problem. Dalsi moznost je ze koupim tu 310x310 a oriznu ji 
> na prumer 210 a dam ji do te nejvesi odpadove roury, kterou uz mam 
> koupenou. Myslite ze tech 310x310 resp 320x400 je overkill na 1.6km? 

Our prototype was measured to have range of 3.0km.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 08:17:44 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:17:44 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] RSSI indikator
In-Reply-To: <431B2C0F.30409@seznam.cz>
References: <537.1353-2643-1864264518-1123586535@seznam.cz>
	<1123592617.42f8a9a9e6733@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<20050904100021.GA30019@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<431B2C0F.30409@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <20050913071743.GB21474@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 07:17:03PM +0200, Pavel Krejci wrote:
> See bellow.
> krepa
> 
> 
> > I would ask for 10-bit ADC with input analogue compressor which would
> > eliminate the response of the RSSI circuit with the two Schottky diodes.
> > The response can be determined by measurement or simulation and will be
> > similar for all diodes.
> 
> What exactly do you mean by elimination of the RSSI response?

The RSSI doesn't respond linearly to number of decibels received, but
can be viewed as number of decibels and some function applied
afterwards. Eliminate the function so the ADC samples data close to
number of decibels (it can be twisted a bit, but not significantly
to lose precision).

> 
> > 
> > So 0...255 would increase as decibels of input optical (not electrical!)
> > signal would increase.
> 
> Why do you need 10bit ADC for 0..255 range? ;o)) BTW ATMEGA8 which I 
> inted has integrated 10bit successive aproximation ADC.
> What dynamic range (in dB) you expect?

Hmm, that's a good question. Ronja 10M Metropolis RX almost doesn't
have any dynamic range ;-)

> 10bit ADC is ideally ~60dB so if there is enough computational power of 
> the microcontroller the result in dB can be calculated inside.
> 
> > 
> > Let the interface between PC and measurement device has these properties:
> > 1) Runs over single coaxial cable with virtually unlimited length
> 
> RS485 is twisted pair and can be run with pretty long distance. More 
> than several hundreds meters. RS232 possibly can be run on coax but my 
> idea was that the device will have both way communication -> at least 3 

You can have 2-way communication on coax, easily. The waves can spread
in 2 directions. You use one direction for one way and the other for the
other way.

> wires on RS232. RS485 is single pair differential 
> transmission/reception. See here for comparison. 
> http://www.rs485.com/rs485spec.html
> > 2) Doesn't radiate and is immune to radiation
> > 3) Supports at least 1000 measurements per second
> > 4) Allows the inner conductor of the coax to be used for 5-48V carriage
> > 5) 
> > 
> > Let the measurement device has mean time between SW crashes even under
> > external EM spikes generated by ordinary means (except lightning) 10^3
> > years.
> I'll wait till you measure 10^3 years :o)

No, design it for 10^3 years :)

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 08:18:51 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:18:51 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV aneb provedeni kabelaze od hlavic s RX TX
In-Reply-To: <002001c5b17c$67bfa0c0$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>
References: <20050904165820.GI9336@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<002001c5b17c$67bfa0c0$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>
Message-ID: <20050913071850.GC21474@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 08:13:51PM +0200, Cipis wrote:
> Mno, neni problem sehnat lowdrop stabilizatory, ty potrebuji akorat 0,65V
> navic.

Anyway, you would need 12.65V power source, and sometimes you get like
11V only.

> Myslim, ze doplnit stabilizatory a zvetsit napajeni neni vubec spatny napad.

What's next ordinary gettable power source above 12V? I think there is
already a bit problem.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 08:20:18 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:20:18 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <20050904163547.GG9336@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050913072018.GD21474@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 09:12:55PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> 1) Situace na nodu "anMic"
> ----
> Opt. hlavy jsem testoval na strese jeste pred bugfixem twisteru s tim, ze
> napajeni bylo tazeno primo ze zdroje po samostatne dvojlince a oba koaxy
> (RG6, 2x 6 m) byly stineny na GND boxu twisteru.
> 
> Funkcnost OK, ale ruseni TV Nova - vertikalni pruhy na obrazovce. Ruseni
> prokazatelne zpusobuje Ronja - pri vypnuti napajeni pruhy zmizi.
> (Nezasveceny clovek by to hned asi nezaregistroval, ale technik by si jiste
> vsiml okamzite a sel by na jisto na Ronju. Nemuzu si dovolit neco rusit,
> protoze sousede si vsichni vsimli nove nainstalovanych tubusu na strese a
> pripadne ruseni by si jiste spojili prave s Ronjou).
> 
> Nevim, jestli ma toto ruseni co do cineni primo se zminovanym bugem v
> twisteru. Mozna vyzaruje primo neco z opt. hlavy (nahradit svorkovnice F
> konektory?). Uvidime, jak se situace vyvine, az zapojim opraveny twister -
> budu informovat.
> 
> 2) Situace na nodu "Tony"
> ----
> Na protistanici je zapojeno Aui Forte, signal je tazen k PC RG6 2x 27m
> koaxem.
> 
> Pri standartnim zapojeni podle navodu (stineni TX=GND, stineni RX=+12) se
> projevilo ruseni TV Prima. Nemame moznost zjistit blizsi info. (Vybehla na
> nas zenska z 30m vzdaleneho baraku, ze jim nejak "lita" tv Prima. Ruseni si
> vsak nastesi nespojila s Ronjou, ale s CB transceiverem, ktery jsem mel
> zrovna v ruce.)
> 
> Podle vseho nam bude asi +12 z Aui Forte vyzarovat vice nez napajeni z
> Twisteru a tezko rict, na kterych frekvencich.
> 
> Navrhli jsme reseni:
> - stinit oba koaxy na GND
> - napajeni vest k opt. hlavam samostatne
> - primo do aui konektoru napajet filracni 100n kondenzator (zamezi pripadne
> sireni rusivych kmitu do +12 vetve zdroje pc?)
> - casem prechod na twister

Can you send images of your electronics or can you point to existing
ones in Ronja gallery?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 08:21:02 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:21:02 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <20050904163547.GG9336@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050913072102.GE21474@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 09:12:55PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> 1) Situace na nodu "anMic"
> ----
> Opt. hlavy jsem testoval na strese jeste pred bugfixem twisteru s tim, ze
> napajeni bylo tazeno primo ze zdroje po samostatne dvojlince a oba koaxy
> (RG6, 2x 6 m) byly stineny na GND boxu twisteru.
> 
> Funkcnost OK, ale ruseni TV Nova - vertikalni pruhy na obrazovce. Ruseni
> prokazatelne zpusobuje Ronja - pri vypnuti napajeni pruhy zmizi.
> (Nezasveceny clovek by to hned asi nezaregistroval, ale technik by si jiste
> vsiml okamzite a sel by na jisto na Ronju. Nemuzu si dovolit neco rusit,
> protoze sousede si vsichni vsimli nove nainstalovanych tubusu na strese a
> pripadne ruseni by si jiste spojili prave s Ronjou).
> 
> Nevim, jestli ma toto ruseni co do cineni primo se zminovanym bugem v
> twisteru. Mozna vyzaruje primo neco z opt. hlavy (nahradit svorkovnice F
> konektory?). Uvidime, jak se situace vyvine, az zapojim opraveny twister -
> budu informovat.
> 
> 2) Situace na nodu "Tony"
> ----
> Na protistanici je zapojeno Aui Forte, signal je tazen k PC RG6 2x 27m
> koaxem.
> 
> Pri standartnim zapojeni podle navodu (stineni TX=GND, stineni RX=+12) se
> projevilo ruseni TV Prima. Nemame moznost zjistit blizsi info. (Vybehla na
> nas zenska z 30m vzdaleneho baraku, ze jim nejak "lita" tv Prima. Ruseni si
> vsak nastesi nespojila s Ronjou, ale s CB transceiverem, ktery jsem mel
> zrovna v ruce.)
> 
> Podle vseho nam bude asi +12 z Aui Forte vyzarovat vice nez napajeni z
> Twisteru a tezko rict, na kterych frekvencich.
> 
> Navrhli jsme reseni:
> - stinit oba koaxy na GND
> - napajeni vest k opt. hlavam samostatne
> - primo do aui konektoru napajet filracni 100n kondenzator (zamezi pripadne
> sireni rusivych kmitu do +12 vetve zdroje pc?)
> - casem prechod na twister
> 
> ----
> Prosim o komentar a o (konstruktivni) kritiku.
> Diky.

yes - and do you have RX or TX on unofficial PCB's?
Can you send pictures of the connectorings?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 08:23:14 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:23:14 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <000c01c5b188$cd45cee0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
References: <006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<000c01c5b188$cd45cee0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
Message-ID: <20050913072314.GF21474@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 09:42:36PM +0200, Pavel Srnka wrote:
> Z ceho mas opticke hlavy ? je to z plastaku nebo plechovy ? mam rx plosnak 
> od skontropa (ktery pry rusi nejvic) v 130 at 0,2mm plechu (konstrukce 
> samozr.uzemena) svorkovnice v malych pvc krabickach za tubusy a svod asi 
> 2*15m UTP nestinenym, do racku kde je twister (jestli neco vyzaruje tak ten 
> plehovej rack to snad pohlti a kdyz ne tak zelezobetonovy zdi toho panelaku 

Metal is not absorbing radiation. It's reflecting as mirror.

> :)) ) zapojeni dratku dle schematka co tu nekdo posilal a hlavne je to asi 
> metr od stozaru s televiznima antenama (kterej jsme navic ovencili wifi 
> sejtama :)) a nerusi to jediny program (zpocatku jsem mel strach kdyz se 
> objevili pruhy horizontalni na prime, ale dela to jenom nekdy (a i pred 
> instalaci) a mam 100% overeny ze to nedela ronja.Jinak instalace vypada asi 
> takto http://ronja.pavel.extranetplus.cz   (dole crusader nahore ronja) 

I can't see anything on the web :(

> (jeste podotykam, ze utpcka mam po cely delce (asi 2m) tazeny v husim krku a 
> zbytek v plechovy lavce spolu s RLkama od wifin a dalsima UTP.
> Docela by me zajimalo, jestli by ti zapojeni pres to UTP pomohlo.

I doubt. UTP is totally unshielded. I think better would be to fix
Ronja, if it's Ronja problem.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 08:24:08 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:24:08 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <000401c5b18e$a2e24f60$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <000c01c5b188$cd45cee0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<000401c5b18e$a2e24f60$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050913072408.GG21474@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 10:24:15PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> ronja je postavena podle navodu, tzn.
> - tubusy kovove (z kourove trubky)
> - rx je airwire

And tx?

CL<
> - svorkovnice v tubusech
> 
> vzdalenost od tv anten asi 1,5 m (tv Nova ma u nas relativne slaby signal,
> proto se mozna ruseni vic projevuje)
> 
> zapojeni pres UTP zvazuji, ale chtel bych pokud mozno vyuzit jiz zakoupeny
> koax, hlavne na protistanici, kde je ho pres 50 m
> 
> anMic
> 
> > Z ceho mas opticke hlavy ? je to z plastaku nebo plechovy ? mam rx plosnak
> > od skontropa (ktery pry rusi nejvic) v 130 at 0,2mm plechu (konstrukce
> > samozr.uzemena) svorkovnice v malych pvc krabickach za tubusy a svod asi
> > 2*15m UTP nestinenym, do racku kde je twister (jestli neco vyzaruje tak
> ten
> > plehovej rack to snad pohlti a kdyz ne tak zelezobetonovy zdi toho
> panelaku
> > :)) ) zapojeni dratku dle schematka co tu nekdo posilal a hlavne je to asi
> > metr od stozaru s televiznima antenama (kterej jsme navic ovencili wifi
> > sejtama :)) a nerusi to jediny program (zpocatku jsem mel strach kdyz se
> > objevili pruhy horizontalni na prime, ale dela to jenom nekdy (a i pred
> > instalaci) a mam 100% overeny ze to nedela ronja.Jinak instalace vypada
> asi
> > takto http://ronja.pavel.extranetplus.cz   (dole crusader nahore ronja)
> > (jeste podotykam, ze utpcka mam po cely delce (asi 2m) tazeny v husim krku
> a
> > zbytek v plechovy lavce spolu s RLkama od wifin a dalsima UTP.
> > Docela by me zajimalo, jestli by ti zapojeni pres to UTP pomohlo.
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message ----- 
> > From: "anMic" <anmic at fmg.sk>
> > To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> > Sent: Sunday, September 04, 2005 9:12 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
> >
> >
> > > 1) Situace na nodu "anMic"
> > > ----
> > > Opt. hlavy jsem testoval na strese jeste pred bugfixem twisteru s tim,
> ze
> > > napajeni bylo tazeno primo ze zdroje po samostatne dvojlince a oba koaxy
> > > (RG6, 2x 6 m) byly stineny na GND boxu twisteru.
> > >
> > > Funkcnost OK, ale ruseni TV Nova - vertikalni pruhy na obrazovce. Ruseni
> > > prokazatelne zpusobuje Ronja - pri vypnuti napajeni pruhy zmizi.
> > > (Nezasveceny clovek by to hned asi nezaregistroval, ale technik by si
> > > jiste
> > > vsiml okamzite a sel by na jisto na Ronju. Nemuzu si dovolit neco rusit,
> > > protoze sousede si vsichni vsimli nove nainstalovanych tubusu na strese
> a
> > > pripadne ruseni by si jiste spojili prave s Ronjou).
> > >
> > > Nevim, jestli ma toto ruseni co do cineni primo se zminovanym bugem v
> > > twisteru. Mozna vyzaruje primo neco z opt. hlavy (nahradit svorkovnice F
> > > konektory?). Uvidime, jak se situace vyvine, az zapojim opraveny
> twister -
> > > budu informovat.
> > >
> > > 2) Situace na nodu "Tony"
> > > ----
> > > Na protistanici je zapojeno Aui Forte, signal je tazen k PC RG6 2x 27m
> > > koaxem.
> > >
> > > Pri standartnim zapojeni podle navodu (stineni TX=GND, stineni RX=+12)
> se
> > > projevilo ruseni TV Prima. Nemame moznost zjistit blizsi info. (Vybehla
> na
> > > nas zenska z 30m vzdaleneho baraku, ze jim nejak "lita" tv Prima. Ruseni
> > > si
> > > vsak nastesi nespojila s Ronjou, ale s CB transceiverem, ktery jsem mel
> > > zrovna v ruce.)
> > >
> > > Podle vseho nam bude asi +12 z Aui Forte vyzarovat vice nez napajeni z
> > > Twisteru a tezko rict, na kterych frekvencich.
> > >
> > > Navrhli jsme reseni:
> > > - stinit oba koaxy na GND
> > > - napajeni vest k opt. hlavam samostatne
> > > - primo do aui konektoru napajet filracni 100n kondenzator (zamezi
> > > pripadne
> > > sireni rusivych kmitu do +12 vetve zdroje pc?)
> > > - casem prechod na twister
> > >
> > > ----
> > > Prosim o komentar a o (konstruktivni) kritiku.
> > > Diky.
> > >
> > > pekny den preje anMic
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >> On Thu, Aug 11, 2005 at 08:14:07PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> > >> > Popisovanou situaci prave ted taky promyslim - o vikendu se chystam
> na
> > >> > instalaci spoje s 90mm hlavicemi, ktere budou na strese pobliz tel.
> > > anten. Z
> > >> > pripadneho ruseni mam obavu.
> > >> >
> > >> > Navrhnul jsem to jednoduse: stineni obou koaxu pripojit na gnd a
> > > uzemnit,
> > >> > napajeni +12 pak privedu po samostatne dvojlince. Co si o tom
> myslite?
> > >> > a) Predstavuje takto stineny koax problem, co se tyka ruseni?
> > >>
> > >> No.
> > >>
> > >> > b) Muze vyzarovat napajeci vodic +12 z twisteru? (Jde o to, jestli
> > >> > primo
> > > z
> > >> > twisteru nejdou harmoniky po +12 napajeni.)
> > >>
> > >> Before patch it radiated, now it practically shouldn't.
> > >>
> > >> But by splitting the 12V apart you don't get anything, the
> > >> filters remain the same.
> > >>
> > >> > c) Musim opt. hlavy napajet z vystupu na twisteru nebo muzu pouzit
> jiny
> > >> > stab. zdroj?
> > >>
> > >> You can use a different power supply.
> > >>
> > >> CL<
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Ronja mailing list
> > > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 08:24:36 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:24:36 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <000f01c5b194$a554c740$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>
References: <000401c5b18e$a2e24f60$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<000f01c5b194$a554c740$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>
Message-ID: <20050913072436.GH21474@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 11:07:21PM +0200, Cipis wrote:
> hmm, jenze to muze byt prave taky tema antenama na TV

No it cannot. Ronja shouldn't emit anything.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 08:25:25 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:25:25 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] jenom takova kravina...
In-Reply-To: <431B6387.8070206@centrum.cz>
References: <431B6387.8070206@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050913072525.GI21474@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 11:13:43PM +0200, Jakub Michn?k wrote:
> jak izolujete RXovy konektor na interfacu od plechove krabice? myslim 

No way. I use the terminal blocks according to the guide ;-)

> tim BNCaky Fka  Cinche a tak... ja delam takove papirove podlozky, je to 
> funkcni ale dosti neelegantni... nemate nekdo neco lepsiho?

Do it according to the guide and if it doesn't work, report a bug.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 08:26:22 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:26:22 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <20050905072943.7A71414801C@relay.sattnet.cz>
References: <20050905072943.7A71414801C@relay.sattnet.cz>
Message-ID: <20050913072622.GJ21474@kestrel>

On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 09:29:43AM +0200, Jan ?ustr - OK2ZAW wrote:
> Zdravim, setkal sem se s rusenim TV, kter? pochyzi z 10Mbit site na UTP,
> vyleci se to feritama t?eba z monitorovejch kablu, staci tak 2x-3x provlict
> UPT, to samy bych udelal na obou koncich koaxu k RX a TX co nejbliz modulum
> a interfejsu. Nebylo by to spatny i na tom propojeni napajeni. 
> 
> Pokud tam mas polsky sito, tak si jeden z tech stovek nestastnych a
> proklinanych lidi, co normalnim lidem rusi TV:o)) Ale jim to nevysvetlis, ze
> maj na strese smejd..

How does Polish grid interfere with TV? Is there some oscillator inside
that generates harmonics or what?

CL<

> 
>  
> 
> S pozdravem Jan ?ustr / best Regards, Jan ?ustr
> 
> | HYPERLINK "mailto:ok2zaw at seznam.cz"ok2zaw at seznam.cz | ICQ: 337068178 |
> HYPERLINK "http://www.ok2zaw.com"www.ok2zaw.com |
> 
>  
> 
> 
> -- 
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.18/89 - Release Date: 2.9.2005
>  

> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Tue Sep 13 08:44:28 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:44:28 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <20050913072436.GH21474@kestrel>
References: <000401c5b18e$a2e24f60$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<000f01c5b194$a554c740$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>
	<20050913072436.GH21474@kestrel>
Message-ID: <1126597468.4326835ceb105@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

Cituji z emailu od Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com>:

> On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 11:07:21PM +0200, Cipis wrote:
> > hmm, jenze to muze byt prave taky tema antenama na TV
> 
> No it cannot. Ronja shouldn't emit anything.
> 
> CL<
> 

It should not but emit until +12V is going trought coax shileding. Connect
osciloscope across +12V and GND at coaxes going out twister or RX. Get RSSI
signal above 1V a see what it do. It can not be patched easily and satisfactory
in today design.

Petr



From ok2zaw at seznam.cz  Tue Sep 13 08:50:01 2005
From: ok2zaw at seznam.cz (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Jan_=A9ustr_-_OK2ZAW?=)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:50:01 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <20050913072622.GJ21474@kestrel>
Message-ID: <20050913075001.B82BF1480AB@relay.sattnet.cz>

Yes.
http://www.ctu.cz/main.php?pageid=142&page_content_id=77
It could be fine wide band oscillator.
The amplifire has very wide frequency spectrum so another strong frequency
could mixed into TV signals...

S pozdravem Jan ?ustr / best Regards, Jan ?ustr
| ok2zaw at seznam.cz | ICQ: 337068178 | www.ok2zaw.com |


-----Original Message-----
From: ronja-bounces+ok2zaw=seznam.cz at lists.pointless.net
[mailto:ronja-bounces+ok2zaw=seznam.cz at lists.pointless.net] On Behalf Of
Karel Kulhavy
Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2005 9:26 AM
To: Twibright Ronja
Subject: Re: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi

On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 09:29:43AM +0200, Jan ?ustr - OK2ZAW wrote:
> Zdravim, setkal sem se s rusenim TV, kter? pochyzi z 10Mbit site na UTP,
> vyleci se to feritama t?eba z monitorovejch kablu, staci tak 2x-3x
provlict
> UPT, to samy bych udelal na obou koncich koaxu k RX a TX co nejbliz
modulum
> a interfejsu. Nebylo by to spatny i na tom propojeni napajeni. 
> 
> Pokud tam mas polsky sito, tak si jeden z tech stovek nestastnych a
> proklinanych lidi, co normalnim lidem rusi TV:o)) Ale jim to nevysvetlis,
ze
> maj na strese smejd..

How does Polish grid interfere with TV? Is there some oscillator inside
that generates harmonics or what?

CL<

> 
>  
> 
> S pozdravem Jan ?ustr / best Regards, Jan ?ustr
> 
> | HYPERLINK "mailto:ok2zaw at seznam.cz"ok2zaw at seznam.cz | ICQ: 337068178 |
> HYPERLINK "http://www.ok2zaw.com"www.ok2zaw.com |
> 
>  
> 
> 
> -- 
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.18/89 - Release Date: 2.9.2005
>  

> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


_______________________________________________
Ronja mailing list
Ronja at lists.pointless.net
http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja

-- 
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.22/97 - Release Date: 12.9.2005
 

-- 
No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.22/97 - Release Date: 12.9.2005
 



From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 13 14:39:38 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 15:39:38 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] review of BRL-CAD from geda-user mailing list :)
Message-ID: <20050913133938.GA2777@kestrel>

----- Forwarded message from Marvin Dickens <marvindickens at bellsouth.net> -----

Date: Mon, 12 Sep 2005 18:59:57 -0400
From: Marvin Dickens <marvindickens at bellsouth.net>
To: geda-user at seul.org
Subject: Re: gEDA-user: OT: Mechanical Cad for Linux
User-Agent: KMail/1.7.1

I've worked about 2/3's of the way through the Volume II Introduction
tutorial for BRL-CAD. After you get it installed, this is the document I'd 
start with. So far, BRL-CAD seems to be as powerful of a CAD package as I've 
ever worked with. In fact, many of it's abilities are awesome. The learning 
curve is steep, but easily manageable. The tutorial has been excellent for 
far and has taken the edge off the curve (In other words, the application 
behaves as described in the tutorial. Also, the tutorial itself is concise 
and easy to understand and there have been no ugly surprises). So far, I'm 
extremely impressed.

The gui graphics window sits right on top of the command window with little
or no layers between the two. You can use either the gui window or the command 
window to manipulate your drawing. I have found the command window to be 
extremely useful when fine tuning. Further, the command window is several 
orders to magnitude faster than the gui regarding the use of some commands. 
As is obvious, the command window gives bare metal access to your drawing.

The speed at which the application executes commands (Including non trivial 
commands such as raytracing) is absolutely blinding. I don't think I've seen 
a faster raytracer (Commercial or otherwise...). 

Oh yeah, before I forget: There are lots of keyboard short cuts - I recommend 
downloading the ShiftGrips.pdf from the BRL-CAD homepage and sticking it
to your monitor. 

Regards

Marvin



----- End forwarded message -----


From supermaster at seznam.cz  Tue Sep 13 16:11:59 2005
From: supermaster at seznam.cz (SuperMaster)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 17:11:59 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <20050913071409.GA21474@kestrel>
References: <4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz>	<1125687929.4318a279914a7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>	<431AD460.8030606@seznam.cz>
	<20050913071409.GA21474@kestrel>
Message-ID: <4326EC3F.6000600@seznam.cz>

hm tak z tech tvych pripominek moc moudny nejsem... proc jako wasting 
efford?

Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):

>On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 01:02:56PM +0200, SuperMaster wrote:
>  
>
>>Super! Konecne jsem se nekde docetl, jak pouzit to UTP misto koaxu, diky 
>>za link. Mechanicky to chci udelat tak, ze to bude ctyrboky jehlan 
>>svareny z poradnych vinglu, ve vrcholu budou kolejnie pro RX modul. Cele 
>>to bude derzet minimalne o 100% zvetseny puvodni clockuv drzak, 
>>pravdepodobne jeste lehce modifikovany pro vetsi tuhost. Cele to bude 
>>vazit klidne 20kg. Ted mi jeste poradte: premyslim nad 310x310 s 330mm, 
>>coz dava dopadovy uhel priblizne 25 stupnu, nebo ta 320x400 s 550, ktera 
>>dava uhel delsi strany 20 stupnu. Delsi ohnisko je lepsi pro vetsi 
>>    
>>
>
>You are wasting effort. We have already done it here in Zurich.
>
>  
>
>>citlivost fotodiody, ale zaroven bude nachylnejsi na presnost zamereni i 
>>pripadne krouceni budovy/drzaku. Cena je 15 resp. 28 dolaru, takze to 
>>neni primarni problem. Dalsi moznost je ze koupim tu 310x310 a oriznu ji 
>>na prumer 210 a dam ji do te nejvesi odpadove roury, kterou uz mam 
>>koupenou. Myslite ze tech 310x310 resp 320x400 je overkill na 1.6km? 
>>    
>>
>
>Our prototype was measured to have range of 3.0km.
>
>CL<
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>  
>



From chowwaileong at yahoo.com  Tue Sep 13 17:16:53 2005
From: chowwaileong at yahoo.com (waileong chow)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 09:16:53 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Ronja] more simple Ronja circuit?
Message-ID: <20050913161653.90555.qmail@web50612.mail.yahoo.com>

hi, i am an undergraduate from Malaysia, i have to complete a thesis on wireless optical link and i am interesting in Ronja..but the overall circuit is too complicated for me...i just need to transmit data for around 10 foots...if i just wan to use the Ronja 10m transmitter and Ronja 10M receiver circuit only, is this possible? what i mean here is without AUI circuit, twister circuit, and any other complicated circuits...any suggestions for me? thanks in advance..



		
---------------------------------
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 Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. 
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From anmic at fmg.sk  Tue Sep 13 17:15:56 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 18:15:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
References: <20050904163547.GG9336@kestrel.twibright.com><006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050913072018.GD21474@kestrel>
Message-ID: <003f01c5b87f$7c84ea10$0101a8c0@anmic>

We are currently working to complete the documentation and I'll give you a
link to a complete gallery.

We made some changes and tweaks according users' advices on the mailling
list. The optical link is working now, but there still remains an
interference (but the current situation is much better than before).

anMic


> On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 09:12:55PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> > 1) Situace na nodu "anMic"
> > ----
> > Opt. hlavy jsem testoval na strese jeste pred bugfixem twisteru s tim,
ze
> > napajeni bylo tazeno primo ze zdroje po samostatne dvojlince a oba koaxy
> > (RG6, 2x 6 m) byly stineny na GND boxu twisteru.
> >
> > Funkcnost OK, ale ruseni TV Nova - vertikalni pruhy na obrazovce. Ruseni
> > prokazatelne zpusobuje Ronja - pri vypnuti napajeni pruhy zmizi.
> > (Nezasveceny clovek by to hned asi nezaregistroval, ale technik by si
jiste
> > vsiml okamzite a sel by na jisto na Ronju. Nemuzu si dovolit neco rusit,
> > protoze sousede si vsichni vsimli nove nainstalovanych tubusu na strese
a
> > pripadne ruseni by si jiste spojili prave s Ronjou).
> >
> > Nevim, jestli ma toto ruseni co do cineni primo se zminovanym bugem v
> > twisteru. Mozna vyzaruje primo neco z opt. hlavy (nahradit svorkovnice F
> > konektory?). Uvidime, jak se situace vyvine, az zapojim opraveny
twister -
> > budu informovat.
> >
> > 2) Situace na nodu "Tony"
> > ----
> > Na protistanici je zapojeno Aui Forte, signal je tazen k PC RG6 2x 27m
> > koaxem.
> >
> > Pri standartnim zapojeni podle navodu (stineni TX=GND, stineni RX=+12)
se
> > projevilo ruseni TV Prima. Nemame moznost zjistit blizsi info. (Vybehla
na
> > nas zenska z 30m vzdaleneho baraku, ze jim nejak "lita" tv Prima. Ruseni
si
> > vsak nastesi nespojila s Ronjou, ale s CB transceiverem, ktery jsem mel
> > zrovna v ruce.)
> >
> > Podle vseho nam bude asi +12 z Aui Forte vyzarovat vice nez napajeni z
> > Twisteru a tezko rict, na kterych frekvencich.
> >
> > Navrhli jsme reseni:
> > - stinit oba koaxy na GND
> > - napajeni vest k opt. hlavam samostatne
> > - primo do aui konektoru napajet filracni 100n kondenzator (zamezi
pripadne
> > sireni rusivych kmitu do +12 vetve zdroje pc?)
> > - casem prechod na twister
>
> Can you send images of your electronics or can you point to existing
> ones in Ronja gallery?
>
> CL<
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>



From anmic at fmg.sk  Tue Sep 13 17:17:58 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 18:17:58 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
References: <20050904163547.GG9336@kestrel.twibright.com><006301c5b184$b183a000$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050913072102.GE21474@kestrel>
Message-ID: <004201c5b87f$7d7823b0$0101a8c0@anmic>


> yes - and do you have RX or TX on unofficial PCB's?
> Can you send pictures of the connectorings?
>

our ronja is built according the guide => rx+tx airwire on the both sides,
using wire nuts for connectig coax



From anmic at fmg.sk  Tue Sep 13 17:19:01 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 18:19:01 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
References: <000c01c5b188$cd45cee0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0><000401c5b18e$a2e24f60$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050913072408.GG21474@kestrel>
Message-ID: <004301c5b87f$7e1a3010$0101a8c0@anmic>

> On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 10:24:15PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> > ronja je postavena podle navodu, tzn.
> > - tubusy kovove (z kourove trubky)
> > - rx je airwire
> 
> And tx?
> 
airwire too



From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Tue Sep 13 17:58:47 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Tue, 13 Sep 2005 18:58:47 +0200
Subject: [Ronja]  more simple Ronja circuit?
Message-ID: <mailman.2.1126630732.13231.ronja@lists.pointless.net>

Greetings from switzerland....

I am even less than an undergraduate... Twister isn?t that complex, you have to learn to solder anyway. But you won?t have to use such big lenses.

I think it is good enough explained, to understand it. But if you have any particular questiin just ask.

Lucas

----- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht -----
Von: "waileong chow"<chowwaileong at yahoo.com>
Gesendet: 13.09.05 18:16:53
An: "ronja at lists.pointless.net"<ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Betreff: [Ronja] more simple Ronja circuit?

hi, i am an undergraduate from Malaysia, i have to complete a thesis on wireless optical link and i am interesting in Ronja..but the overall circuit is too complicated for me...i just need to transmit data for around 10 foots...if i just wan to use the Ronja 10m transmitter and Ronja 10M receiver circuit only, is this possible? what i mean here is without AUI circuit, twister circuit, and any other complicated circuits...any suggestions for me? thanks in advance..



		
---------------------------------
Yahoo! for Good
 Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. 



From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 09:30:49 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 10:30:49 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Fwd: odpov
In-Reply-To: <200509110824.j8B8O0B12292@twin.jikos.cz>
References: <200509110824.j8B8O0B12292@twin.jikos.cz>
Message-ID: <20050914083049.GC11533@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 11, 2005 at 10:23:29AM +0200, Lucas Vogelsang wrote:
> Hi,
> I didn?t understand the message inCZ, but if you want to move your
> mailing list to another server, my webhoster is a friend from school
> which has 2 debian rootserver where one could install mailman.

One would have to ask pointless to make a forwarding there and to notify
people to change their e-mail addresses, right?

What if it turns out there is a problem with the debian servers too?
People would have to change addresses again...

Or do you know some better solutions without changing addresses?

CL<
> 
> Lucas
> 
> ----- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht -----
>    >Von: "Karel Kulhavy"<clock at twibright.com>
>    >Gesendet: 10.09.05 19:07:50
>    >An: "Twibright Ronja"<ronja at lists.pointless.net>
>    >Betreff: Re: [Ronja] Fwd: odpov
>    >
>    >On Tue, Aug 16, 2005 at 06:47:11PM +0200, -=RYS=- wrote:
>    >> To by mel spis Clock, vybral si no-free nesvobodnou konferu do ktere
>    >> muze prispivat jen vyvoleny.  -=RYS=-
>    >
>    >I unfrotunately don't have a root server and I don't want to pester
>    >Jezek owning ronja.twibright.com server with setting up mailing list.
>    >He's doing enough things for me for free.
>    >
>    >CL<
>    >
>    >_______________________________________________
>    >Ronja mailing list
>    >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>    >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>    >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 09:32:00 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 10:32:00 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <000201c5b70c$850931b0$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <20050910172818.GA19191@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<000201c5b70c$850931b0$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050914083200.GD11533@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 11, 2005 at 11:47:02AM +0200, anMic wrote:
> > > I think it is much more reliable - i tried to build connectors
> > > based on your design and, according to my experience, they are
> > > very susceptible to cable breakage.
> >
> > What did break? Cable? Or the soldered joint? Did you use the new 29mm
> > copper stubs which are soldered in the middle and did you tie the
> > conductor to the stub with tape?
> >
> 
> It is difficult or nearly impossible to solder copper stubs to a coaxial
> shielding as described in the guide. I only managed to do it with a very old
> coaxial cable with unreliable copper shielding (no foil there). Shielding of
> the RG6 coax I'm using now is absolutely non-solderable.

What is the shield of RG6 coax made from? Foil with a thin braid of
copper?

Why is copper shielding unreliable? I find it reliable.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 11:15:39 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 12:15:39 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] more simple Ronja circuit?
In-Reply-To: <20050913161653.90555.qmail@web50612.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050913161653.90555.qmail@web50612.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20050914101539.GA15873@kestrel>

On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 09:16:53AM -0700, waileong chow wrote:
> hi, i am an undergraduate from Malaysia, i have to complete a thesis
> on wireless optical link and i am interesting in Ronja..but the
> overall circuit is too complicated for me...i just need to transmit
> data for around 10 foots...if i just wan to use the Ronja 10m
> transmitter and Ronja 10M receiver circuit only, is this possible?
> what i mean here is without AUI circuit, twister circuit, and any
> other complicated circuits...any suggestions for me? thanks in
> advance..

If you have a ready data interface that accepts optical ethernet
format at 700mVpp and 75 ohm asymmetric impedance, then you can
use it, otherwise not.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 14:01:57 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 15:01:57 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21
In-Reply-To: <20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>

On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 02:08:17PM -0700, Quintus Murray wrote:
> Hi this is quintus murray and I would like to know if the Links web
> browser (all versions of Links) can be installed on the nintendo DS if
> the NDS has linux kernal 2.6 which doesn't have a built-in web
> browser? or any nintendo ds? If yes how do I do this?

My experience shows this kind of behaviour is correlated with pretty
face and nice body... Quintus, could you please post your photos
(preferrably with limited clothing)? I am gay and I am really interested
when I read these posts.

(I just hope Quintus is not a female name).

CL<
> 
> ronja-request at lists.pointless.net wrote: Send Ronja mailing list submissions to
> ronja at lists.pointless.net
> 
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> ronja-request at lists.pointless.net
> 
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> ronja-owner at lists.pointless.net
> 
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Ronja digest..."
> 
> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
> 1. Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Karel Kulhavy)
> 2. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Jakub Ladman)
> 3. Mind the user (Karel Kulhavy)
> 4. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Ondrej Zajicek)
> 5. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Karel Kulhavy)
> 6. Re: Usability issues of gEDA + PCB (Karel Kulhavy)
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Message: 1
> Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:25:56 +0200
> From: Karel Kulhavy 
> Subject: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
> To: geda-user at seul.org
> Cc: Twibright Ronja 
> Message-ID: <20050909092556.GC27699 at kestrel>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> Hello
> 
> Would it be possible to do following changes to improve usability? About
> 3 people now want to help the Ronja project and explaining them gEDA and
> PCB is a pain in the ass. They get stuck on something every couple of
> hours when trying to work with gEDA and PCB.
> 
> All contributions to Ronja are in Eagle, because people say "sorry, gEDA
> is unusable for me".
> 
> So Ronja has unofficial RX TMD PCB, unofficial RX SMD PCB, unofficial
> TX TMD PCB, unofficial TX SMD PCB, unofficial CPLD Twister, but these
> cannot be merged into the development, because the former 4 were
> designed in Protel and the latter one in Eagle, because gEDA is pain
> in the ass for them to learn and use.
> 
> Would it be possible to do the following changes to increase usability?
> 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> 4) Update the PCB documentation so the format is described correctly
> (one needed to edit solderstrip symbol source but I told him this URL
> describes the internal format, but sorry, it's obsolete and not true
> anymore, there is different number of fields, they are shuffled
> around, and the resolution is now also 100 times higher)
> 5) Put into PCB library that every time you select a package, it writes
> "put bla_bla into footprint= attribute if you want this package in
> gschem"
> 6) If 5 is not possible, put a trained monkey algorithm into PCB doc
> which would enable one to translate PCB library entry as seen on
> the library menu into footprint= attribute.
> 7) Make gEDA and PCB stop complaining 100 error messages every time the
> version changes slightly. It's like Microsoft Word - even two
> neighbour versions are mutually incompatible.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> CL<
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 2
> Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:33:23 +0200
> From: Jakub Ladman 
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
> To: Twibright Ronja 
> Message-ID: <200509091133.23565.ladmanj at volny.cz>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-2"
> 
> Tleskam :-)
> 
> Dne p? 9. z??? 2005 11:25 Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> > Hello
> >
> > Would it be possible to do following changes to improve usability? About
> > 3 people now want to help the Ronja project and explaining them gEDA and
> > PCB is a pain in the ass. They get stuck on something every couple of
> > hours when trying to work with gEDA and PCB.
> >
> > All contributions to Ronja are in Eagle, because people say "sorry, gEDA
> > is unusable for me".
> >
> > So Ronja has unofficial RX TMD PCB, unofficial RX SMD PCB, unofficial
> > TX TMD PCB, unofficial TX SMD PCB, unofficial CPLD Twister, but these
> > cannot be merged into the development, because the former 4 were
> > designed in Protel and the latter one in Eagle, because gEDA is pain
> > in the ass for them to learn and use.
> >
> > Would it be possible to do the following changes to increase usability?
> > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> > PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> > possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> > it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> > and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> > spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> > download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> > PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> > 4) Update the PCB documentation so the format is described correctly
> > (one needed to edit solderstrip symbol source but I told him this URL
> > describes the internal format, but sorry, it's obsolete and not true
> > anymore, there is different number of fields, they are shuffled
> > around, and the resolution is now also 100 times higher)
> > 5) Put into PCB library that every time you select a package, it writes
> > "put bla_bla into footprint= attribute if you want this package in
> > gschem"
> > 6) If 5 is not possible, put a trained monkey algorithm into PCB doc
> > which would enable one to translate PCB library entry as seen on
> > the library menu into footprint= attribute.
> > 7) Make gEDA and PCB stop complaining 100 error messages every time the
> > version changes slightly. It's like Microsoft Word - even two
> > neighbour versions are mutually incompatible.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > CL<
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 3
> Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:44:02 +0200
> From: Karel Kulhavy 
> Subject: [Ronja] Mind the user
> To: geda-user at seul.org
> Cc: Twibright Ronja 
> Message-ID: <20050909094402.GA27849 at kestrel>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> When a user comes to geda.seul.org, in 90% cases he wants to
> draw schematics and make printed boards from them. If he didn't work
> with gEDA before, what he wants to do in 90% is draw a simple schematic
> with resistor, LED and connector, make a PCB from it and generate
> Gerber RS274-X and netlist from that.
> 
> So please keep optimizng the website and the software for that. How many
> users are there and how many developers? If the user comes and is not
> able to make Gerber RS274-X within hour, something is wrong. In the
> current state it takes like 14 days until he learns to skip over all the
> unnecessary hurdles.
> 
> Like: I go to http://geda.seul.org/download.html. There should be
> instruction what the user should do to download the software. Is
> there such one? Isn't. There is like 200 various links to various pieces
> of the software. Everytime I visit that page I never know what I should
> download!
> 
> What the heck did you expect the user wants to do when he comes to
> Download? Plant potatoes in his garden? And where do you think he should
> take the information how to download gEDA? Decode it from cosmic
> background radiation using Arecribo radiotelescope?
> 
> Can't you write instructions like that?
> http://links.twibright.com/download.php
> If I was able to write them, why can't you?
> 
> For a first-time visitor, this is a stumbling block.
> For a many years experienced user like me, this is *still* stumbling
> block! How quickly do you think the first-time visitor will be able to
> install the software when it's a stumbling block even for me, who
> already designed 4 PCB's in gEDA+PCB?
> 
> Everywhere I go to software X it's Download: download
> software-x-1.2.3.tgz. Period. Why does it have to be so complicated
> in case of gEDA? And if there are technical reasons for complication,
> why there cannot be a clear guide what to do to download it all?
> 
> Please change the download page so it's "to download gEDA do this and
> this.".
> 
> Then the bottom of the page should read
> "Now you can proceed with Installation.
> 
> And the Install page should be the same: tell the user what he should do
> to install. I didn't find any install page. And install
> complete environment to make Gerber RS274-X and part shopping list
> from circuit idea in the head, not just a half of it (schematic editor).
> 
> What's the point of 100 people wasting each 14 days trying to install
> and learn basic usage of gEDA when they could do it in 1 hour and invest
> those 14*100 days into developing some other free software project?
> 
> CL<
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 4
> Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 11:48:55 +0200
> From: Ondrej Zajicek 
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
> To: Twibright Ronja 
> Message-ID: <20050909094855.GA980 at elros>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> > PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> > possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> > it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> > and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> > spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> > download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> > PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> 
> After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I entered (under root):
> apt-get install geda pcb
> And after 1-2 minutes (of downloading packages from Internet)
> both geda and pcb were installed.
> 
> I use Debian stable (Sarge).
> 
> So i think that people inexperienced in installing software from sources
> should use binary packages from their distribution.
> 
> -- 
> Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo
> 
> Ondrej 'SanTiago' Zajicek (email: santiago at mail.cz, jabber: santiago at njs.netlab.cz)
> OpenPGP encrypted e-mails preferred (KeyID 0x11DEADC3, wwwkeys.pgp.net)
> "To err is human -- to blame it on a computer is even more so."
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> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 5
> Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 12:23:06 +0200
> From: Karel Kulhavy 
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
> To: Twibright Ronja 
> Message-ID: <20050909102306.GA29715 at kestrel>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:48:55AM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> > On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> > > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> > > PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> > > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> > > possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> > > it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> > > and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> > > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> > > spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> > > download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> > > PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> > 
> > After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I entered (under root):
> > apt-get install geda pcb
> > And after 1-2 minutes (of downloading packages from Internet)
> > both geda and pcb were installed.
> > 
> > I use Debian stable (Sarge).
> > 
> > So i think that people inexperienced in installing software from sources
> > should use binary packages from their distribution.
> 
> But if you need new version because of some important features were
> missing in the old one, you still need to install from sources.
> 
> And anyway pcb should be part of gEDA ;-) So you would type just
> apt-get install geda.
> 
> CL<
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> Message: 6
> Date: Fri, 9 Sep 2005 12:23:38 +0200
> From: Karel Kulhavy 
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Usability issues of gEDA + PCB
> To: Twibright Ronja 
> Message-ID: <20050909102338.GB29715 at kestrel>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> 
> On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:48:55AM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> > On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 11:25:56AM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> > > 1) Merge PCB into gEDA so it gets installed all at once. If installing
> > > PCB is an issue, add --disable-pcb into ./configure
> > > 2) Make the install process one ./configure && make && make install if
> > > possible. Installing gEDA fresh always takes me like 1-2 days because
> > > it's like 20 libraries where you have to guess the versions correctly
> > > and if you fail, you have to retry etc.
> > > 3) Make a gEDA install guide for trained monkeys, so they don't have to
> > > spend 2 hours figuring out what combinations of libraries they should
> > > download, and then it won't work for them anyway, because it's
> > > PITA to install gtk 2.2 in debian
> > 
> > After reading of your mail i tried to install gEDA and PCB. I entered (under root):
> > apt-get install geda pcb
> 
> Show me some commercial program which sells schematic and PCB programs
> separaterly.
> 
> CL<
> 
> 
> 
> ------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> End of Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21
> *************************************
> 
> 
> 
> 		
> ---------------------------------
>  Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From jdb at lartmaker.nl  Wed Sep 14 14:27:39 2005
From: jdb at lartmaker.nl (J.D. Bakker)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 15:27:39 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Trolls (was Re:  Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21)
In-Reply-To: <20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>
References: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>
Message-ID: <a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>

>On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 02:08:17PM -0700, Quintus Murray wrote:
>>  Hi this is quintus murray and I would like to know if the Links web
>>  browser (all versions of Links) can be installed on the nintendo DS if
>>  the NDS has linux kernal 2.6 which doesn't have a built-in web
>>  browser? or any nintendo ds? If yes how do I do this?
>
>My experience shows this kind of behaviour is correlated with pretty
>face and nice body...

*My* experience shows this kind of behaviour is trolling[1]. I 
wouldn't call any kind of troll pretty myself ;-)

JDB
[just finished a 5ns IR pulse detector with associated 25W pulse 
laser driver for Work, looking into using a similar design for a 
50..100Mbit/s Open Hardware optical link]


[1] Trolling: see

http://www.urban75.com/Mag/troll.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internet_troll
-- 
LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files.
http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/


From asteri_x at freemail.hu  Wed Sep 14 15:32:40 2005
From: asteri_x at freemail.hu (Martin)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 16:32:40 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100Mbit/s Ronja?
In-Reply-To: <20050911072456.GG8442@kestrel.twibright.com>
References: <430C9EE5.2040909@freemail.hu>
	<1124903008.2751.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<430D7A27.2030203@freemail.hu>
	<20050911072456.GG8442@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <43283488.8070503@freemail.hu>

Karel Kulhavy ?rta:
>>http://www.microlinear.com/downloads/DS/DS6652.pdf
> 
> The don't have it in distrele.ch nor in gme.cz. Ronja has to be made
> portable, from widely available components. Don't you know about a
> portable equivalent?

No, but I am convinced, we don't need it at all.
Currently I'm trying to build a transmitter completely from discrete
elements.
MLT-3 signaling rulez. :)

Bye,
Martin




From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 15:49:34 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 16:49:34 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Trolls (was Re:  Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21)
In-Reply-To: <a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>
References: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>
	<a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>
Message-ID: <20050914144934.GA24675@kestrel>

On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 03:27:39PM +0200, J.D. Bakker wrote:
> LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files.
> http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/

You're the one who did LART, right? Did you design it in gschem+PCB?
I could find only the pdfs, not schematics/PCB sources.

I looked at PLEB but it even doesn't have PCB .pdfs.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 16:07:51 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 17:07:51 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Transmitter PCB being released (official Twibright Ronja)
Message-ID: <20050914150751.GA25038@kestrel>

Hello everyone

Official Twibright Ronja Transmitter PCB .zip file is attached.

HKfree.org just paid the rest of PCB transmitter. Before I manage to
upload all the things to the web, I am attaching just the .zip file for
the factory. It's the same as I sent and they made it from it OK, so the
file should be OK.

Jakub, you can start mass production if you want ;-)

Thanks to all contributors,

CL<
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From asteri_x at freemail.hu  Wed Sep 14 15:29:20 2005
From: asteri_x at freemail.hu (Martin)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 16:29:20 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100Mbit/s
In-Reply-To: <a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>
References: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>
	<a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>
Message-ID: <432833C0.2050104@freemail.hu>

> [just finished a 5ns IR pulse detector with associated 25W pulse 
> laser driver for Work, looking into using a similar design for a 
> 50..100Mbit/s Open Hardware optical link]

That sounds great.
Tell us more about it.

Martin



From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 16:33:41 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 17:33:41 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100Mbit/s Ronja?
In-Reply-To: <43283488.8070503@freemail.hu>
References: <430C9EE5.2040909@freemail.hu>
	<1124903008.2751.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<430D7A27.2030203@freemail.hu>
	<20050911072456.GG8442@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<43283488.8070503@freemail.hu>
Message-ID: <20050914153341.GA26864@kestrel>

On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 04:32:40PM +0200, Martin wrote:
> Karel Kulhavy ?rta:
> >>http://www.microlinear.com/downloads/DS/DS6652.pdf
> > 
> > The don't have it in distrele.ch nor in gme.cz. Ronja has to be made
> > portable, from widely available components. Don't you know about a
> > portable equivalent?
> 
> No, but I am convinced, we don't need it at all.
> Currently I'm trying to build a transmitter completely from discrete
> elements.
> MLT-3 signaling rulez. :)

LOL :) Are you sure it rulez? Do you have any schematics of your
proposals?

CL<


From jdb at lartmaker.nl  Wed Sep 14 17:29:16 2005
From: jdb at lartmaker.nl (J.D. Bakker)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 18:29:16 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Trolls (was Re:  Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21)
In-Reply-To: <20050914144934.GA24675@kestrel>
References: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>	<a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>
	<20050914144934.GA24675@kestrel>
Message-ID: <a0623090bbf4df8da256f@[130.161.115.44]>

>On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 03:27:39PM +0200, J.D. Bakker wrote:
>>  LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files.
>>  http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/
>
>You're the one who did LART, right?

Yes.

>  Did you design it in gschem+PCB?
>I could find only the pdfs, not schematics/PCB sources.

No. At the time (six, seven years ago) gschem and PCB were (even?) 
less usable than they are now. Best I could do was to supply 
PDF/Gerbers, although I sent the design database (in EDWin) to anyone 
who asked.

In the meantime I have used gschem for (work) projects, where the 
lay-out was handled by others. I have frequently looked at PCB (a few 
weeks back at the latest), and simply find it WAY too cumbersome to 
use.

Clock, I understand your drive to have Open Hardware use Open 
Software CAD tools. I have a lot of respect for you trying to get 
gEDA in a workable state (I'm on the gEDA lists, too). However, my 
own definition of OH is to have the schematics & PCB in open, 
readable formats.

If there was a viable Open CAD package, I'd use it (especially since 
my proprietary tools only run on Win98). I love open, text-based CAD 
file formats: I have written a small tool for gschem which generates 
parts from PDF data sheets (with a lot of user intervention, 
naturally). As I said, I regularly look at the status of PCB, and for 
me it Just Isn't There Yet. With all due respect to Harry Eaton, I 
think PCB should have been rewritten from scratch three years ago 
(when the influx of new developers started). Many features which I 
use heavily, such as back-annotation and ground planes, are iffy or 
nonexistant. A few years ago I might have had the time to add these 
features myself, but not now.

As it is, I could do a medium-complexity design with my tools in two 
to three days, whereas with PCB it would take as many weeks. I have 
days to spare, not weeks.

>I looked at PLEB but it even doesn't have PCB .pdfs.

Adam Wiggins did them in Orcad, as far as I can recall.

PLEB is a good data point. Adam and I have co-operated a lot on our 
respective StrongARM designs, but it has never bothered me that his 
designs were read-only to me. That's the way I use manufacturer's 
reference designs, too. And if I were to build a Ronja, I'd probably 
re-do the schematics in my design tools (or buy a pre-fabbed PCB, if 
available).

JDB.
-- 
LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files.
http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 17:45:26 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 18:45:26 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja at WSFII 1st Oct
Message-ID: <20050914164525.GA2883@kestrel>

I am going to hold a presentation of Ronja in London on World Summit on
Free Information Infrastructures (WSFII) (http://www.okfn.org/wsfii/) on
1st October 2005.

It's within the "Open Hardware" part:
http://www.okfn.org/wsfii/programme.html

I thought maybe someone is from that area or considering visiting
the event so I am posting the information here.

Regards,

CL<


From jdb at lartmaker.nl  Wed Sep 14 17:52:03 2005
From: jdb at lartmaker.nl (J.D. Bakker)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 18:52:03 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100Mbit/s
In-Reply-To: <432833C0.2050104@freemail.hu>
References: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>	<a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>
	<432833C0.2050104@freemail.hu>
Message-ID: <a0623090cbf4e007cef79@[130.161.115.44]>

>  > [just finished a 5ns IR pulse detector with associated 25W pulse
>>  laser driver for Work, looking into using a similar design for a
>>  50..100Mbit/s Open Hardware optical link]
>
>That sounds great.

The work project was fun. The design can send and receive pulses over 
several hundred meters without any lenses. Of course, this uses the 
abovementioned 25W pulse laser ;-) Driving that one 
was...interesting, seeing that I needed to switch 30Amps with edge 
rates of a few nanoseconds. Inductance really sucks.

>Tell us more about it.

I intend to use the optical link for a local volunteer 
mesh-networking project. The plan is to have it rate-limited by the 
SNR of the link. Rough sketch:

Tx:

100Base-T->PHY->FIFO->FEC->Luxeon/laser

Rx:

PIN->Cascode amp->Detector->Sync/FEC->FIFO->PHY->100Base-T

The FEC is an error correcting block code implemented in a CPLD and a 
ROM. This FEC is also responsible for creating state transitions on 
the link (to avoid baseline wander). The SNR determines the 
transmission of the FEC.

Target is to have all components SMD, but as solderable as possible 
(ie no BGA or finer pitch than necessary), and available from 
international distributors such as DigiKey.

Schematics and PCB will be available as PS/PDF/Gerber, and ABEL/VHDL 
for the CPLD. I won't be using gschem/PCB, as I described in the 
other thread, sorry (although if I have enough time I may redo the 
schematics in gschem).

As with all volunteer projects, this may take a while to materialize. 
Work is especially busy nowadays, so don't hold your breath.

JDB.
-- 
Life. In order of importance: food, shelter and a pair of very loud speakers.


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 18:02:33 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 19:02:33 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Trolls (was Re:  Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 21)
In-Reply-To: <a0623090bbf4df8da256f@[130.161.115.44]>
References: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>
	<a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>
	<20050914144934.GA24675@kestrel>
	<a0623090bbf4df8da256f@[130.161.115.44]>
Message-ID: <20050914170233.GA3311@kestrel>

On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 06:29:16PM +0200, J.D. Bakker wrote:
> >On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 03:27:39PM +0200, J.D. Bakker wrote:
> >>  LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files.
> >>  http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/
> >
> >You're the one who did LART, right?
> 
> Yes.
> 
> >  Did you design it in gschem+PCB?
> >I could find only the pdfs, not schematics/PCB sources.
> 
> No. At the time (six, seven years ago) gschem and PCB were (even?) 
> less usable than they are now. Best I could do was to supply 
> PDF/Gerbers, although I sent the design database (in EDWin) to anyone 
> who asked.
> 
> In the meantime I have used gschem for (work) projects, where the 
> lay-out was handled by others. I have frequently looked at PCB (a few 
> weeks back at the latest), and simply find it WAY too cumbersome to 
> use.
> 
> Clock, I understand your drive to have Open Hardware use Open 
> Software CAD tools. I have a lot of respect for you trying to get 
> gEDA in a workable state (I'm on the gEDA lists, too). However, my 

I am not trying at all. The others are trying. I am just bitching about
gEDA and PCB ;-)

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 18:57:18 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 19:57:18 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100Mbit/s
In-Reply-To: <a0623090cbf4e007cef79@[130.161.115.44]>
References: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>
	<a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>
	<432833C0.2050104@freemail.hu>
	<a0623090cbf4e007cef79@[130.161.115.44]>
Message-ID: <20050914175718.GB4137@kestrel>

On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 06:52:03PM +0200, J.D. Bakker wrote:
> >  > [just finished a 5ns IR pulse detector with associated 25W pulse
> >>  laser driver for Work, looking into using a similar design for a
> >>  50..100Mbit/s Open Hardware optical link]
> >
> >That sounds great.
> 
> The work project was fun. The design can send and receive pulses over 
> several hundred meters without any lenses. Of course, this uses the 
> abovementioned 25W pulse laser ;-) Driving that one 
> was...interesting, seeing that I needed to switch 30Amps with edge 
> rates of a few nanoseconds. Inductance really sucks.

What circuit do you use for your 30Amp spikes?

We are preparing with Lucas to use a pair of BD139 and BD140 in l33t
t0t3m p0l3 for Ronja Aisha. They don't have problem charging the luxeon
with 10A spikes with the same slew rates. At least according to gnucap
simulation on SPICE models.

CL<


From jdb at lartmaker.nl  Wed Sep 14 19:32:59 2005
From: jdb at lartmaker.nl (J.D. Bakker)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 20:32:59 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100Mbit/s
In-Reply-To: <20050914175718.GB4137@kestrel>
References: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>	<a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>
	<432833C0.2050104@freemail.hu>	<a0623090cbf4e007cef79@[130.161.115.44]>
	<20050914175718.GB4137@kestrel>
Message-ID: <a06230900bf4e1937bb48@[130.161.115.44]>

>  > The work project was fun. The design can send and receive pulses over
>>  several hundred meters without any lenses. Of course, this uses the
>>  abovementioned 25W pulse laser ;-) Driving that one
>>  was...interesting, seeing that I needed to switch 30Amps with edge
>>  rates of a few nanoseconds. Inductance really sucks.
>
>What circuit do you use for your 30Amp spikes?

Initially a low-inductance SMD FET with a 9-Amp gate driver (forgot 
the part #s, can look them up if you want me to). Later a precharged 
28nH inductor with turn-on and turn-off FETs on the anode and cathode 
of the laser.

>We are preparing with Lucas to use a pair of BD139 and BD140 in l33t
>t0t3m p0l3 for Ronja Aisha. They don't have problem charging the luxeon
>with 10A spikes with the same slew rates. At least according to gnucap
>simulation on SPICE models.

The main question: how much wire inductance did you model for ?

If I recall correctly, 1mm of wire is ~1nH, depending on proximity of 
the current return path (amongst many other things). Also,

V = L * (dI/dt).

Say you have (=want) a turn-on time of 2ns. As a first order 
approximation, each  mm of wiring will drop 1nH * (10A/2ns) = 5V 
during turn-on. So how long are the legs of your BD1xxs ?

To stay in the terminology, this really suxx0rz.

JDB.
-- 
Three of your friends throw up after eating chicken salad.  Do you think
"I should find more robust friends" or "we should check that refrigerator".
          -- Donald Becker, on vortex-bug, suspecting a network-wide problem.


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 14 20:18:53 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 21:18:53 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] PCB TX is online (without images)
Message-ID: <20050914191853.GA18709@kestrel>

PCB TX is online. Without images. Please wait a while until I sort
out and upload the images.

Ti??????kov?? vys??la?? je online. Bez obr??zk??. Pros??m po??kejte trochu dokud
nevyt????d??m a neuploaduju ty obr??zky.

http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/pcb.php
http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/building_pcb.php
http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/

CL<


From jojo at matfyz.cz  Wed Sep 14 20:20:36 2005
From: jojo at matfyz.cz (Marian Cerny)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 21:20:36 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] PCB TX is online (without images)
In-Reply-To: <20050914191853.GA18709@kestrel>
References: <20050914191853.GA18709@kestrel>
Message-ID: <20050914192036.GA24013@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz>

On 2005-09-14 21:18 +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> Ti??????kov?? vys??la?? je online. Bez obr??zk??. Pros??m po??kejte trochu dokud
> nevyt????d??m a neuploaduju ty obr??zky.

#$%@)T@)T)#$T)AERT#$TJ aejf93j49f 3$AF IA)#$AT)#F ak3 fa943 faf
a4f#F#f3.

f#F$#F($ 4fj94 3$F #$)334a dfja?

-- 
Marian Cerny <jojo at matfyz.cz>
Jabber: jojo at njs.netlab.cz

[ UNIX is user friendly. It's just selective about who its friends are. ]


From quintusmurray at yahoo.com  Wed Sep 14 22:59:16 2005
From: quintusmurray at yahoo.com (Quintus Murray)
Date: Wed, 14 Sep 2005 14:59:16 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 31
In-Reply-To: <mailman.828.1126710489.2010.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
Message-ID: <20050914215916.72488.qmail@web53408.mail.yahoo.com>




 

Hi this is Quintus murray and sorry Karel Kulhavy I am not gay and I like girls and enjoy watching naked girls with wet pussy and big boobs and I am about to get a girlfriend. So what problem do you have with girls & females. And No I am not a bi. 


		
---------------------------------
Yahoo! for Good
 Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. 
-------------- next part --------------
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From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 15 06:09:03 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 07:09:03 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100Mbit/s
In-Reply-To: <a06230900bf4e1937bb48@[130.161.115.44]>
References: <mailman.1.1126263600.8773.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050909210817.83174.qmail@web53410.mail.yahoo.com>
	<20050914130157.GC16876@kestrel>
	<a06230904bf4dd45d97bd@[130.161.115.44]>
	<432833C0.2050104@freemail.hu>
	<a0623090cbf4e007cef79@[130.161.115.44]>
	<20050914175718.GB4137@kestrel>
	<a06230900bf4e1937bb48@[130.161.115.44]>
Message-ID: <20050915050903.GA8213@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 08:32:59PM +0200, J.D. Bakker wrote:
> >  > The work project was fun. The design can send and receive pulses over
> >>  several hundred meters without any lenses. Of course, this uses the
> >>  abovementioned 25W pulse laser ;-) Driving that one
> >>  was...interesting, seeing that I needed to switch 30Amps with edge
> >>  rates of a few nanoseconds. Inductance really sucks.
> >
> >What circuit do you use for your 30Amp spikes?
> 
> Initially a low-inductance SMD FET with a 9-Amp gate driver (forgot 
> the part #s, can look them up if you want me to). Later a precharged 
> 28nH inductor with turn-on and turn-off FETs on the anode and cathode 
> of the laser.
> 
> >We are preparing with Lucas to use a pair of BD139 and BD140 in l33t
> >t0t3m p0l3 for Ronja Aisha. They don't have problem charging the luxeon
> >with 10A spikes with the same slew rates. At least according to gnucap
> >simulation on SPICE models.
> 
> The main question: how much wire inductance did you model for ?

Zero. :)

> 
> If I recall correctly, 1mm of wire is ~1nH, depending on proximity of 
> the current return path (amongst many other things). Also,
> 
> V = L * (dI/dt).
> 
> Say you have (=want) a turn-on time of 2ns. As a first order 
> approximation, each  mm of wiring will drop 1nH * (10A/2ns) = 5V 
> during turn-on. So how long are the legs of your BD1xxs ?

lol :) Probably the legs will have to be cut off and replaced with
copper sheet metal ;-)

Looks like we are building a railgun here ;-)

CL<


From petr.cipis at tiscali.cz  Thu Sep 15 06:28:23 2005
From: petr.cipis at tiscali.cz (Cipis)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 07:28:23 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 31
References: <20050914215916.72488.qmail@web53408.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <003401c5b9b6$4add9830$3701a8c0@pwech01>

Whups.
Tady si nekdo koleduje o zarazeni na blacklist.
Tohle prece s ronjou nema uz vubec nic spolecneho, ostatne i predchozi veci
od nej.

Cipis


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Quintus Murray" <quintusmurray at yahoo.com>
To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Wednesday, September 14, 2005 11:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 31


>
>
>
>
>
> Hi this is Quintus murray and sorry Karel Kulhavy I am not gay and I like
girls and enjoy watching naked girls with wet pussy and big boobs and I am
about to get a girlfriend. So what problem do you have with girls & females.
And No I am not a bi.
>
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Yahoo! for Good
>  Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----


> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>



From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 15 07:37:22 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 08:37:22 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] P105 Rx
In-Reply-To: <431C0B6D.4080105@centrum.cz>
References: <431C0B6D.4080105@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050915063722.GA29480@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 11:10:05AM +0200, Jakub Michn?k wrote:
> Na P105 na Rxu mam 1,4V. kdyz odpajim R109 (680R) tak se tam tech 5V 
> obevi. usoudil jsem vadnym NE592. vymenil - nic. vymenil sem za jiny, 
> zas nic. dycky to same. kdyz merim I pres ten R109 do 14. pinu NE592 je 
> tam 1mA. pres R108 tece 4,5uA. U dobreho Rx tece pres R109 aji R108 
> 4,5uA. Uz me nenapada nic jineho nez vadny NE592ka, ale mel sem tam 
> SNDcko, vymenil sem ho a ted sem tam dal este obyc v dilu a porad nic 
> ... furt to same... poradi mi nekdo?

Maybe the NE592 doesn't have power.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 15 07:37:46 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 08:37:46 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] P105 Rx
In-Reply-To: <431C0B6D.4080105@centrum.cz>
References: <431C0B6D.4080105@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050915063746.GB29480@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 11:10:05AM +0200, Jakub Michn?k wrote:
> Na P105 na Rxu mam 1,4V. kdyz odpajim R109 (680R) tak se tam tech 5V 
> obevi. usoudil jsem vadnym NE592. vymenil - nic. vymenil sem za jiny, 
> zas nic. dycky to same. kdyz merim I pres ten R109 do 14. pinu NE592 je 
> tam 1mA. pres R108 tece 4,5uA. U dobreho Rx tece pres R109 aji R108 
> 4,5uA. Uz me nenapada nic jineho nez vadny NE592ka, ale mel sem tam 
> SNDcko, vymenil sem ho a ted sem tam dal este obyc v dilu a porad nic 
> ... furt to same... poradi mi nekdo?

Or 4 or 11 of NE592 is shorted to ground...

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 15 07:39:26 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 08:39:26 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <1125920397.431c2e8dbfbee@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <20050905072943.7A71414801C@relay.sattnet.cz>
	<1125920397.431c2e8dbfbee@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050915063926.GC29480@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 01:39:57PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Cituji z emailu od Jan ?ustr - OK2ZAW <ok2zaw at seznam.cz>:
> 
> > Zdravim, setkal sem se s rusenim TV, kter? pochyzi z 10Mbit site na UTP,
> > vyleci se to feritama t?eba z monitorovejch kablu, staci tak 2x-3x provlict
> > UPT, to samy bych udelal na obou koncich koaxu k RX a TX co nejbliz modulum
> > a interfejsu. Nebylo by to spatny i na tom propojeni napajeni. 
> > 
> 
> Bohuzel samotny ferit to neresi. Koaxy je potreba pekne smotat jako pary v
> UTPcku a pridat kondiky jak psal clock. Ale stejne porad zari stineni koaxu k RX
> protoze je blbe zablokovany. Kdyz je signal dost silny, tak se dostane na

You mean the blocking in RX module is bad?

Why do you think is bad? How do you suggest to change it to fix it?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 15 07:42:55 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 08:42:55 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] RX PCB design - coils
In-Reply-To: <1125920888.431c3078625b2@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <200508111431.24123@centrum.cz>
	<005c01c59e94$153ced30$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<1123785278.42fb9a3e5fc9a@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<42FBABF5.70306@seznam.cz>
	<1123792740.42fbb764395c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<20050904171227.GK9336@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<1125920888.431c3078625b2@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050915064254.GD29480@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 01:48:08PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Pokud to budes brat ciste jako civku /coz neni presne tento pripad/, tak: Doc.
> Ing. Karel Hoffmann, "Planarni mikrovlnne obvody", Vydavatelstvi CVUT, 2001, str.78.

Thanks, but OMG, isn't it somewhere on WWW? Or how is this kind of coil
called, at least? :)

I am interested basically if this type of coil is capable of efficiently
using PCB area to make inductance. It's like 2x inductance of two
parallel wires with area between wires the same as area of the PCB
coil, isn't it? 

CL<

> 
> > You are using S-shaped coils on your PCB design
> > http://twiki.twibright.com/bin/view/Main/RxPcbSeligr
> > 
> > How did you determine their inductance? Do you have
> > some formula for it's calculation?
> > 
> > CL<
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 15 07:46:29 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 08:46:29 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <431C587F.9070605@katka.biz>
References: <20050905072943.7A71414801C@relay.sattnet.cz>
	<1125920397.431c2e8dbfbee@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<431C587F.9070605@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <20050915064629.GE29480@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 02:38:55PM +0000, Martin Polehla wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> 
> > Cituji z emailu od Jan ?ustr - OK2ZAW <ok2zaw at seznam.cz>:
> >
> >> Zdravim, setkal sem se s rusenim TV, kter? pochyzi z 10Mbit site
> >> na UTP, vyleci se to feritama t?eba z monitorovejch kablu, staci
> >> tak 2x-3x provlict UPT, to samy bych udelal na obou koncich koaxu
> >> k RX a TX co nejbliz modulum a interfejsu. Nebylo by to spatny i
> >> na tom propojeni napajeni.
> >>
> >
> > Bohuzel samotny ferit to neresi. Koaxy je potreba pekne smotat jako
> > pary v UTPcku a pridat kondiky jak psal clock. Ale stejne porad
> > zari stineni koaxu k RX protoze je blbe zablokovany. Kdyz je signal
> > dost silny, tak se dostane na opleteni jako by bylo pripojeno pres
> > kapacitni delic proti zemi.
> >
> Jak mam upravit stavajci prijmac aby to bylo spravne ? rad bych si to
> opravil pokud to jde, nez postavim dalsich x modulu

I don't know - the fix from Twister like already is in the design of
RX - a capacitor over the shield where the cable leaves the box.

Also I doubt the problem exists - because the (nonideal) capacitors are
being fed over the 75 ohm impedance of the cable, therefore this 75 ohm
impedance with their capacitance works as lowpass and doesn't allow high
frequency interference.

And I don't have a RX here to power it and hook to oscilloscope :( Can
someone else do it for me please, shine a strong signal and tell what
garbage is on the coax shield? I have just Twister and TX at the moment
here.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 15 07:47:38 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 08:47:38 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <20050905152054.375DA148025@relay.sattnet.cz>
References: <431C587F.9070605@katka.biz>
	<20050905152054.375DA148025@relay.sattnet.cz>
Message-ID: <20050915064738.GF29480@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 05:20:55PM +0200, Jan ?ustr - OK2ZAW wrote:
> No prave ony ferity funguju jako proudovy balun, ov?em de o frekvenci jaka
> po pleteni putuje, pokud je nizka, tak jeden ferit muze byt malo, vytvori
> malou indukcnost, rozhodne tim nic nezkazis, ale vyzarovani na vyssich
> frekvencich tim rozhodne zblokujes.. teda aspon trochu. Jinak se spravnym
> zablokovanim souhlasim, slozit keramiky od 1n, 10n a 100n..

What's the point? The parasitic inductance of all three is about the
same. It should behave rouhly like 3x100n in parallel :) Or am I wrong?

CL<


From jakub.michnik at centrum.cz  Thu Sep 15 07:48:27 2005
From: jakub.michnik at centrum.cz (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jakub_Michn=EDk?=)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 08:48:27 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] P105 Rx
In-Reply-To: <20050915063746.GB29480@kestrel.twibright.com>
References: <431C0B6D.4080105@centrum.cz>
	<20050915063746.GB29480@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <4329193B.2000404@centrum.cz>



Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> On Mon, Sep 05, 2005 at 11:10:05AM +0200, Jakub Michn?k wrote:
> 
>>Na P105 na Rxu mam 1,4V. kdyz odpajim R109 (680R) tak se tam tech 5V 
>>obevi. usoudil jsem vadnym NE592. vymenil - nic. vymenil sem za jiny, 
>>zas nic. dycky to same. kdyz merim I pres ten R109 do 14. pinu NE592 je 
>>tam 1mA. pres R108 tece 4,5uA. U dobreho Rx tece pres R109 aji R108 
>>4,5uA. Uz me nenapada nic jineho nez vadny NE592ka, ale mel sem tam 
>>SNDcko, vymenil sem ho a ted sem tam dal este obyc v dilu a porad nic 
>>... furt to same... poradi mi nekdo?
> 
> 
> Or 4 or 11 of NE592 is shorted to ground...

jj,tim to bylo

> 
> CL<
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 15 07:53:51 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 08:53:51 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] =?iso-8859-1?Q?Str=E1nk?=
	=?iso-8859-1?Q?y?= projektu spider
In-Reply-To: <431DE752.7040203@centrum.cz>
References: <200509061635.51441.ladmanj@volny.cz> <431DE2BB.6090401@centrum.cz>
	<1126032434.431de432df2e8@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<431DE752.7040203@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050915065351.GH29480@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Tue, Sep 06, 2005 at 09:00:34PM +0200, Jakub Michn?k wrote:
> 
> 
> Seligr at sh.cvut.cz napsal(a):
> >>zupa, mi to staci :) .... jaka je sehnatelnost soucastek ve firmach ges 
> >>a GM ? 50?% :) doufam ze vic :) ... nebylo by na skodu dat veci pro 
> >>vyrobu TS horkemu, nebo proste to udelat tak, aby se u neho daly 
> >>obednavat tistaky jako na tiwstra ... budiz mu brzo lehka zem :P ...
> >>
> > 
> > 
> > Xilinxe vedou tady http://www.asix.cz/
> > A twisteru hned tak lehka zem nebude. Ke svemu staronovemu novemu RX dodelavam
> > pridavnou desticku pro twister za ucelem ucuneni toho co Clock kdysi nazval
> > Interpolisem.
> 
> tzn?
> 
> > 
> > 
> >>pak jak se divam na to schema, zda se ze po pridani 3 7404, ledky 
> >>oriznuti TS je z toho kombinovany TX+iface ...nicht wahr?
> >>
> > 
> > 
> > Jeste musis kompenzovat dosvit LEDky, takze budes muset neco priprogramovat do
> > Xilinxu.
> 
> coze? dyt dosavadni tx nic nekompenzuje co ja vim, tak co priprogramovavat?!

Existing TX *does* compensate for LED response asymmetry.

CL<


From sorin at bz.ines.ro  Thu Sep 15 09:21:18 2005
From: sorin at bz.ines.ro (Sorin Popa)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 11:21:18 +0300
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja RX PCB still in development?
Message-ID: <000901c5b9ce$72870520$0d13320a@sorin>

anyone maded an good RX PCB design ?
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From srnkap at extranetplus.cz  Thu Sep 15 09:18:26 2005
From: srnkap at extranetplus.cz (Pavel Srnka)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 10:18:26 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja RX PCB still in development?
References: <000901c5b9ce$72870520$0d13320a@sorin>
Message-ID: <001001c5b9ce$0c4bc160$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>

I have one nonsmd betaversion :)  but it is not tested yet.

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Sorin Popa 
  To: ronja at lists.pointless.net 
  Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 10:21 AM
  Subject: [Ronja] Ronja RX PCB still in development?


  anyone maded an good RX PCB design ?


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  http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
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From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 15 09:38:34 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 10:38:34 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 31
In-Reply-To: <20050914215916.72488.qmail@web53408.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <mailman.828.1126710489.2010.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050914215916.72488.qmail@web53408.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20050915083834.GA31728@kestrel>

On Wed, Sep 14, 2005 at 02:59:16PM -0700, Quintus Murray wrote:

> > > Hi this is quintus murray and I would like to know if the Links web
> > > browser (all versions of Links) can be installed on the nintendo DS
> > > if
> > > the NDS has linux kernal 2.6 which doesn't have a built-in web
> > > browser? or any nintendo ds? If yes how do I do this?
> > 
> > My experience shows this kind of behaviour is correlated with pretty
> > face and nice body... Quintus, could you please post your photos
> > (preferrably with limited clothing)? I am gay and I am really
> > interested
> > when I read these posts.
> > 
> > (I just hope Quintus is not a female name).

> Hi this is Quintus murray and sorry Karel Kulhavy I am not gay and I
> like girls and enjoy watching naked girls with wet pussy and big boobs
> and I am about to get a girlfriend. So what problem do you have with
> girls & females. And No I am not a bi. 

Anyway, your style of posts is different from the others.

Please keep in mind to keep the posts at least a bit relevant to Ronja,
i. e. not ask how to connect Nintendo console to switch, Wireless AP,
or questions regarding Links web browser on Nintendo console.

Please do not post copy of the whole mail digest. If you don't want
digest, please change your e-mail option in the list interface and
if it's not possible tell me I'll change it.

Posts in style "how do I connect Ronja to switch xxx or network card
yyy" are OK because sometimes there are issues with autonegotation, full
duplex etc.

CL<


From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Thu Sep 15 13:19:40 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 14:19:40 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja RX PCB still in development?
In-Reply-To: <000901c5b9ce$72870520$0d13320a@sorin>
References: <000901c5b9ce$72870520$0d13320a@sorin>
Message-ID: <1126786780.432966dc7f43c@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

Pre-release SMD RX design is being populated and tomorrow will be tested.
If no problems will occur documentation & gerber data shall be released next
week. (Alfa version worked fairly well and thus only minor modifications were
done.) 

Petr

> anyone maded an good RX PCB design ?





From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Thu Sep 15 15:42:25 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 16:42:25 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja RX PCB still in development?
Message-ID: <mailman.4.1126795384.13231.ronja@lists.pointless.net>

Hi,

I am currently designing an official tx smd with clock. It uses free software, like pcb and gschem. I didn?t have time to finish it by now, but I hope I will be able to etch the first prototype next week.

Lucas
   >anyone maded an good RX PCB design ?




From anmic at fmg.sk  Thu Sep 15 19:50:06 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 20:50:06 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
References: <20050910172818.GA19191@kestrel.twibright.com><000201c5b70c$850931b0$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050914083200.GD11533@kestrel>
Message-ID: <000401c5ba26$716c3e50$0101a8c0@anmic>


> > It is difficult or nearly impossible to solder copper stubs to a coaxial
> > shielding as described in the guide. I only managed to do it with a very
old
> > coaxial cable with unreliable copper shielding (no foil there).
Shielding of
> > the RG6 coax I'm using now is absolutely non-solderable.
>
> What is the shield of RG6 coax made from? Foil with a thin braid of
> copper?


RG6: Aluminium foil + very thin braid made of something absolutely
solder-resistant.


>
> Why is copper shielding unreliable? I find it reliable.
>
> CL<

I think the old coaxes which are shielded only with the thin copper braid
with no foil are not suitable for high-frequency devices.

One electrician working with TV/SAT technics offered me hundreds meters of
that coax for free to use as a clothesline.

anMic



From quintusmurray at yahoo.com  Thu Sep 15 22:51:57 2005
From: quintusmurray at yahoo.com (Quintus Murray)
Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 14:51:57 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbps ronja &portable ronja
In-Reply-To: <mailman.863.1126772308.2010.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
Message-ID: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>


HI I would like to know if the 100Mbps ronja and the portable ronja are available and if so what is the cost of each and what parts are needed and price for each?

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 
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From krepa at seznam.cz  Thu Sep 15 23:21:33 2005
From: krepa at seznam.cz (Pavel Krejci)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 00:21:33 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbps ronja &portable ronja
In-Reply-To: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4329F3ED.1060506@seznam.cz>

Hele on na to ma snad robota, kterej posila stejnou otazku kazdy mesic...

Quintus Murray wrote:

> 
>     HI I would like to know if the 100Mbps ronja and the portable ronja
>     are available and if so what is the cost of each and what parts are
>     needed and price for each?
> 
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From jdb at lartmaker.nl  Fri Sep 16 00:53:54 2005
From: jdb at lartmaker.nl (J.D. Bakker)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 01:53:54 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbps ronja &portable ronja
In-Reply-To: <4329F3ED.1060506@seznam.cz>
References: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>
	<4329F3ED.1060506@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <a06230900bf4fb93cf7d6@[130.161.115.44]>

>Hele on na to ma snad robota, kterej posila stejnou otazku kazdy mesic...
>
>Quintus Murray wrote:
>
>>
>>      HI I would like to know if the 100Mbps ronja and the portable ronja
>>      are available and if so what is the cost of each and what parts are
>  >     needed and price for each?

At least he's posting in English.

JDB
[which, according to http://ronja.twibright.com/mlist.php is the 
primary language of this list]
-- 
LART. 250 MIPS under one Watt. Free hardware design files.
http://www.lart.tudelft.nl/


From krepa at seznam.cz  Fri Sep 16 00:58:42 2005
From: krepa at seznam.cz (Pavel Krejci)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 01:58:42 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbps ronja &portable ronja
In-Reply-To: <a06230900bf4fb93cf7d6@[130.161.115.44]>
References: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>	<4329F3ED.1060506@seznam.cz>
	<a06230900bf4fb93cf7d6@[130.161.115.44]>
Message-ID: <432A0AB2.4010404@seznam.cz>

He must have an robot which sends the same question every month.

J.D. Bakker wrote:

>>Hele on na to ma snad robota, kterej posila stejnou otazku kazdy mesic...
>>
>>Quintus Murray wrote:
>>
>>
>>>     HI I would like to know if the 100Mbps ronja and the portable ronja
>>>     are available and if so what is the cost of each and what parts are
>>
>> >     needed and price for each?
> 
> 
> At least he's posting in English.
> 
> JDB
> [which, according to http://ronja.twibright.com/mlist.php is the 
> primary language of this list]



From jdb at lartmaker.nl  Fri Sep 16 01:10:16 2005
From: jdb at lartmaker.nl (J.D. Bakker)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 02:10:16 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbps ronja &portable ronja
In-Reply-To: <432A0AB2.4010404@seznam.cz>
References: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>
	<4329F3ED.1060506@seznam.cz>	<a06230900bf4fb93cf7d6@[130.161.115.44]>
	<432A0AB2.4010404@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <a06230901bf4fbc4baf40@[130.161.115.44]>

Thank you for the translation.

Pavel Krejci wrote:
>  >>Quintus Murray wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>      HI I would like to know if the 100Mbps ronja and the portable ronja
>>>>      are available and if so what is the cost of each and what parts are
>>>
>>>  >     needed and price for each?
>  >
>He must have an robot which sends the same question every month.

I'd say it's the impatience and cluelessness of youth. Googling on 
him gives a hit on a forum for...not very mature audiences.

Oh well. At least he's not copying the entire digest anymore.

JDB
[semi-related link: http://www.despair.com/demotivators/cluelessness.html ]
-- 
"A satisfied customer ? We ought to have him stuffed !"
     -- Basil Fawlty


From kubajz at kbx.cz  Fri Sep 16 08:57:25 2005
From: kubajz at kbx.cz (Jakub Sykora)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 09:57:25 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbps ronja &portable ronja
In-Reply-To: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <432A7AE5.90909@kbx.cz>

What about permanent ban? He's even not trying to understand basic 
things and I guess he never looked at the pages of Ronja project.

The answer:
No

Quintus Murray wrote:
> 
>     HI I would like to know if the 100Mbps ronja and the portable ronja
>     are available and if so what is the cost of each and what parts are
>     needed and price for each?
> 
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja

-- 
Jakub S?kora
email: kubajz at kbx.cz       <')
ICQ: 68976632               ( =-
mobil: +420 777 594 201      ''
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From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep 16 09:10:40 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 10:10:40 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbps ronja &portable ronja
In-Reply-To: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <mailman.863.1126772308.2010.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20050916081040.GC10258@kestrel>

On Thu, Sep 15, 2005 at 02:51:57PM -0700, Quintus Murray wrote:
> 
> HI I would like to know if the 100Mbps ronja and the portable ronja
> are available and if so what is the cost of each and what parts are
> needed and price for each?

No, no kind of 100Mbps Ronja is available, and no kind of portable
Ronja is available.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep 16 09:14:21 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 10:14:21 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbps ronja &portable ronja
In-Reply-To: <a06230901bf4fbc4baf40@[130.161.115.44]>
References: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>
	<4329F3ED.1060506@seznam.cz>
	<a06230900bf4fb93cf7d6@[130.161.115.44]>
	<432A0AB2.4010404@seznam.cz>
	<a06230901bf4fbc4baf40@[130.161.115.44]>
Message-ID: <20050916081421.GD10258@kestrel>

On Fri, Sep 16, 2005 at 02:10:16AM +0200, J.D. Bakker wrote:
> Thank you for the translation.
> 
> Pavel Krejci wrote:
> >  >>Quintus Murray wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>      HI I would like to know if the 100Mbps ronja and the portable ronja
> >>>>      are available and if so what is the cost of each and what parts are
> >>>
> >>>  >     needed and price for each?
> >  >
> >He must have an robot which sends the same question every month.
> 
> I'd say it's the impatience and cluelessness of youth. Googling on 

And if you retain that for your whole life, you become a good
developer :)

(It's being said that opensource developers like Eric Raymond are
behaving like pubertal teenagers. According to his latest letter to
Microsoft I think he definitely behaves... I guess maybe that's the key
to free technology... If you start thinking like an adult you're not
gonna create anything worhwhile...)

Anyway I guess Quintus must be like 10 years old or so ;-)

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep 16 09:26:58 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 10:26:58 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja RX PCB still in development?
In-Reply-To: <200509151443.j8FEhKX23469@twin.jikos.cz>
References: <200509151443.j8FEhKX23469@twin.jikos.cz>
Message-ID: <20050916082658.GB13836@kestrel>

On Thu, Sep 15, 2005 at 04:42:25PM +0200, Lucas Vogelsang wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I am currently designing an official tx smd with clock. It uses free
> software, like pcb and gschem. I didn?t have time to finish it by now,
> but I hope I will be able to etch the first prototype next week.

You meant rx instead of tx, didn't you?



From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep 16 09:39:29 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 10:39:29 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja RX PCB still in development?
In-Reply-To: <1126786780.432966dc7f43c@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <000901c5b9ce$72870520$0d13320a@sorin>
	<1126786780.432966dc7f43c@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050916083929.GA16901@kestrel>

On Thu, Sep 15, 2005 at 02:19:40PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Pre-release SMD RX design is being populated and tomorrow will be tested.
> If no problems will occur documentation & gerber data shall be released next
> week. (Alfa version worked fairly well and thus only minor modifications were
> done.) 

It's done in something proprietary, isn't?

Do you think it would be less work to redraw your design into PCB?
I think it would be faster do design it straight away new.

CL<


From kubajz at kbx.cz  Fri Sep 16 09:56:13 2005
From: kubajz at kbx.cz (Jakub Sykora)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 10:56:13 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbps ronja &portable ronja
In-Reply-To: <20050916081421.GD10258@kestrel>
References: <20050915215157.54621.qmail@web53401.mail.yahoo.com>	<4329F3ED.1060506@seznam.cz>	<a06230900bf4fb93cf7d6@[130.161.115.44]>	<432A0AB2.4010404@seznam.cz>	<a06230901bf4fbc4baf40@[130.161.115.44]>
	<20050916081421.GD10258@kestrel>
Message-ID: <432A88AD.8020600@kbx.cz>

Therefore he could be very good developer :))

Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 16, 2005 at 02:10:16AM +0200, J.D. Bakker wrote:
> 
>>Thank you for the translation.
>>
>>Pavel Krejci wrote:
>>
>>> >>Quintus Murray wrote:
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>     HI I would like to know if the 100Mbps ronja and the portable ronja
>>>>>>     are available and if so what is the cost of each and what parts are
>>>>>
>>>>> >     needed and price for each?
>>>
>>> >
>>>He must have an robot which sends the same question every month.
>>
>>I'd say it's the impatience and cluelessness of youth. Googling on 
> 
> 
> And if you retain that for your whole life, you become a good
> developer :)
> 
> (It's being said that opensource developers like Eric Raymond are
> behaving like pubertal teenagers. According to his latest letter to
> Microsoft I think he definitely behaves... I guess maybe that's the key
> to free technology... If you start thinking like an adult you're not
> gonna create anything worhwhile...)
> 
> Anyway I guess Quintus must be like 10 years old or so ;-)
> 
> CL<
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja

-- 
Jakub S?kora
email: kubajz at kbx.cz       <')
ICQ: 68976632               ( =-
mobil: +420 777 594 201      ''
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From vitek.jedlicka at tiscali.cz  Fri Sep 16 10:22:05 2005
From: vitek.jedlicka at tiscali.cz (Vit Jedlicka)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 11:22:05 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ordering Films of TX PCB at Pragoboards
Message-ID: <432A8EBD.7080303@tiscali.cz>

Im wondering, has somebody ordered production of films for TX PCB design 
yet?
If yes, would it be possible to use it?
If not, who would be willing to join the funds?

Jsem zvedavy jestli uz nekdo objednal filmy na PCB TX u Pragoboardsu.
Pokud ano, bylo by mozne ho pouzit?
Pokud ne, kdo by byl ochotny spojit fondy?

Vitek (Hkfree.org)


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep 16 10:54:40 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 11:54:40 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <000401c5ba26$716c3e50$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <20050914083200.GD11533@kestrel>
	<000401c5ba26$716c3e50$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050916095440.GA18468@kestrel>

On Thu, Sep 15, 2005 at 08:50:06PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> 
> > > It is difficult or nearly impossible to solder copper stubs to a coaxial
> > > shielding as described in the guide. I only managed to do it with a very
> old
> > > coaxial cable with unreliable copper shielding (no foil there).
> Shielding of
> > > the RG6 coax I'm using now is absolutely non-solderable.
> >
> > What is the shield of RG6 coax made from? Foil with a thin braid of
> > copper?
> 
> 
> RG6: Aluminium foil + very thin braid made of something absolutely
> solder-resistant.

The brain must be well solderable because it's its purpose: to connect
the foil when you need to solder.

Isn't the cable excessively old? Did you try ample amounts of
colophonium?

Does anyone else know the RG6 cable? Is it really solder resistant
even when bought new?

If yes I have to exclude this cable from the guide :)

CL<


From asteri_x at freemail.hu  Fri Sep 16 12:11:56 2005
From: asteri_x at freemail.hu (Martin)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 13:11:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem OFF
In-Reply-To: <20050916095440.GA18468@kestrel>
References: <20050914083200.GD11533@kestrel>
	<000401c5ba26$716c3e50$0101a8c0@anmic> <20050916095440.GA18468@kestrel>
Message-ID: <432AA87C.5090501@freemail.hu>

> The brain must be well solderable because it's its purpose: to connect
> the foil when you need to solder.

Hehe... :)
Soldering brains must be fun!!! :)
Who was your first victim?

Martin


From asteri_x at freemail.hu  Fri Sep 16 12:16:07 2005
From: asteri_x at freemail.hu (Martin)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 13:16:07 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100Mbit/s Ronja?
In-Reply-To: <20050914153341.GA26864@kestrel>
References: <430C9EE5.2040909@freemail.hu>
	<1124903008.2751.4.camel@localhost.localdomain>
	<430D7A27.2030203@freemail.hu>
	<20050911072456.GG8442@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<43283488.8070503@freemail.hu> <20050914153341.GA26864@kestrel>
Message-ID: <432AA977.4020100@freemail.hu>

>>MLT-3 signaling rulez. :)
> 
> 
> LOL :) Are you sure it rulez? Do you have any schematics of your
> proposals?

Not yet. I'm trying to draw it on this weekend.
I'm searching for cheap but good SMD amplifying and power transistors.
Tell me some transistors, wich work well till 500MHz.

Martin


From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Fri Sep 16 12:48:15 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 13:48:15 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [Ronja] Ordering Films of TX PCB at Pragoboards
References: <432A8EBD.7080303@tiscali.cz>
Message-ID: <13703.1126871295@www76.gmx.net>

HI

I will order 2 PCB at pragoboard. I need them for my self.
Jakub Horky will probably sell them in his onlineshop. But if you want we
could order together. Or I would like to use yours.

Lucas 


> Im wondering, has somebody ordered production of films for TX PCB design 
> yet?
> If yes, would it be possible to use it?
> If not, who would be willing to join the funds?
> 
> Jsem zvedavy jestli uz nekdo objednal filmy na PCB TX u Pragoboardsu.
> Pokud ano, bylo by mozne ho pouzit?
> Pokud ne, kdo by byl ochotny spojit fondy?
> 
> Vitek (Hkfree.org)
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 

-- 
5 GB Mailbox, 50 FreeSMS http://www.gmx.net/de/go/promail
+++ GMX - die erste Adresse für Mail, Message, More +++


From djbobr.ronja at seznam.cz  Fri Sep 16 20:53:45 2005
From: djbobr.ronja at seznam.cz (dj-bobr)
Date: Fri, 16 Sep 2005 21:53:45 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <20050916095440.GA18468@kestrel>
References: <20050914083200.GD11533@kestrel>	<000401c5ba26$716c3e50$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050916095440.GA18468@kestrel>
Message-ID: <432B22C9.5020806@seznam.cz>

Problem of RG6 is that RG6 is not a type of cable. RG6 is family of 
cables. Some of them are solderable, some not.
Visit http://www.fantomas.cz/koaxrg6.htm for more information about 
types of RG6 cables.
My experience is that CA5075 bought in RASEL shop (Prague 1, 
Francouzska) is solder resistant.

> Does anyone else know the RG6 cable? Is it really solder resistant
> even when bought new?
> 
> If yes I have to exclude this cable from the guide :)


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 17 09:41:14 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 10:41:14 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Upload finished: PCB TX guide
Message-ID: <20050917084114.GA30197@kestrel>

Now it's there with all the numerous photographs.
http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/building_pcb.php
http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/pcb.php

CL<


From strohel at hotmail.com  Sat Sep 17 11:35:54 2005
From: strohel at hotmail.com (Matej Laitl)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 10:35:54 +0000
Subject: [Ronja]  Choosing power supply
In-Reply-To: <20050917084114.GA30197@kestrel>
Message-ID: <BAY18-F23EB27036016FFB3AE9ACB4900@phx.gbl>

Hi folks,
I have a few (probably stupid) questions concenring ronja and power supply.

1. Is possible to use a [separate / in-use by computer] computer (AT/ATX) 
power source for Ronja Heating?

2. Is possible to use a [separate / in-use by computer] computer (AT/ATX) 
power source for Ronja Twister, Rx, Tx?

Thaks in advance, Matej Laitl alias strohel




From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 17 12:26:02 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 13:26:02 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Choosing power supply
In-Reply-To: <BAY18-F23EB27036016FFB3AE9ACB4900@phx.gbl>
References: <20050917084114.GA30197@kestrel>
	<BAY18-F23EB27036016FFB3AE9ACB4900@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <20050917112602.GB32238@kestrel>

On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 10:35:54AM +0000, Matej Laitl wrote:
> Hi folks,
> I have a few (probably stupid) questions concenring ronja and power supply.
> 
> 1. Is possible to use a [separate / in-use by computer] computer (AT/ATX) 
> power source for Ronja Heating?
> 
> 2. Is possible to use a [separate / in-use by computer] computer (AT/ATX) 
> power source for Ronja Twister, Rx, Tx?

Yes both is possible but put there a Polyswitch, otherwise it could
burn if a short circuit happens on the roof.

If someone writes a .php page (guide) how to attach a polyswitch to
PC AT/ATX supply to get a Ronja-compliant supply, I can upload it to
Ronja.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 17 12:42:19 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 13:42:19 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Are plastic lenses usable?
In-Reply-To: <4325E36C.70005@arcor.de>
References: <4325E36C.70005@arcor.de>
Message-ID: <20050917114219.GA366@kestrel>

On Mon, Sep 12, 2005 at 10:22:04PM +0200, Daniel Berger wrote:
> Hello list!
> 
> I have found a source for 130mm plastic loupes in Germany:
> http://makroshopping.de/index.php?m=shop_artikel_detail:modul_artikel_det&shop_katnr=79&anr=1632&child=&submenu_child=&subsubmenu_child=&PHPSESSID=3f79982c36e43ecc0b4a452525734f00
> They cost only 2 Euro per piece.
> The distance for my intended link would be about 500 metres.
> Can I use plastic lenses, or must they be made of glass?

They don't have to be from glass if the plastic is weatherproof.

Do you have photo of the product?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 17 12:43:43 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 13:43:43 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <1126597468.4326835ceb105@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <000401c5b18e$a2e24f60$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<000f01c5b194$a554c740$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>
	<20050913072436.GH21474@kestrel>
	<1126597468.4326835ceb105@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050917114343.GB366@kestrel>

On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 09:44:28AM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Cituji z emailu od Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com>:
> 
> > On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 11:07:21PM +0200, Cipis wrote:
> > > hmm, jenze to muze byt prave taky tema antenama na TV
> > 
> > No it cannot. Ronja shouldn't emit anything.
> > 
> > CL<
> > 
> 
> It should not but emit until +12V is going trought coax shileding. Connect
> osciloscope across +12V and GND at coaxes going out twister or RX. Get RSSI
> signal above 1V a see what it do. It can not be patched easily and satisfactory
> in today design.

It's already fixed in Twister (down to 2mV). To fix it more the Twister
mechanics needs to be redesigned. Is 2mV enough for you? Do you see any
interference?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 17 12:46:34 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 13:46:34 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] nepouzitelne 130mm cocky z trznice pro TX
In-Reply-To: <4326EC3F.6000600@seznam.cz>
References: <4315E9E0.5030402@centrum.cz>
	<004801c5ae53$319823e0$f2464d3e@s566mzp1m0>
	<43181213.5060009@seznam.cz>
	<1125575062.4316e9962b5c4@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<43185D66.1080208@seznam.cz>
	<1125687929.4318a279914a7@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
	<431AD460.8030606@seznam.cz> <20050913071409.GA21474@kestrel>
	<4326EC3F.6000600@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <20050917114634.GC366@kestrel>

On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 05:11:59PM +0200, SuperMaster wrote:
> hm tak z tech tvych pripominek moc moudny nejsem... proc jako wasting 
> efford?

Because we already developed the mechanics.

CL<
> 
> Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> 
> >On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 01:02:56PM +0200, SuperMaster wrote:
> >  
> >
> >>Super! Konecne jsem se nekde docetl, jak pouzit to UTP misto koaxu, diky 
> >>za link. Mechanicky to chci udelat tak, ze to bude ctyrboky jehlan 
> >>svareny z poradnych vinglu, ve vrcholu budou kolejnie pro RX modul. Cele 
> >>to bude derzet minimalne o 100% zvetseny puvodni clockuv drzak, 
> >>pravdepodobne jeste lehce modifikovany pro vetsi tuhost. Cele to bude 
> >>vazit klidne 20kg. Ted mi jeste poradte: premyslim nad 310x310 s 330mm, 
> >>coz dava dopadovy uhel priblizne 25 stupnu, nebo ta 320x400 s 550, ktera 
> >>dava uhel delsi strany 20 stupnu. Delsi ohnisko je lepsi pro vetsi 
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >You are wasting effort. We have already done it here in Zurich.
> >
> >  
> >
> >>citlivost fotodiody, ale zaroven bude nachylnejsi na presnost zamereni i 
> >>pripadne krouceni budovy/drzaku. Cena je 15 resp. 28 dolaru, takze to 
> >>neni primarni problem. Dalsi moznost je ze koupim tu 310x310 a oriznu ji 
> >>na prumer 210 a dam ji do te nejvesi odpadove roury, kterou uz mam 
> >>koupenou. Myslite ze tech 310x310 resp 320x400 je overkill na 1.6km? 
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >Our prototype was measured to have range of 3.0km.
> >
> >CL<
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Ronja mailing list
> >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> >  
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 17 12:47:33 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 13:47:33 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <003f01c5b87f$7c84ea10$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <20050913072018.GD21474@kestrel>
	<003f01c5b87f$7c84ea10$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050917114733.GD366@kestrel>

On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 06:15:56PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> We are currently working to complete the documentation and I'll give you a
> link to a complete gallery.
> 
> We made some changes and tweaks according users' advices on the mailling
> list. The optical link is working now, but there still remains an
> interference (but the current situation is much better than before).

Is current situation after Twister bugfix and situation before before
Twister bugfix? Or are both situation without Twister bugfix?

CL<
> 
> anMic
> 
> 
> > On Sun, Sep 04, 2005 at 09:12:55PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> > > 1) Situace na nodu "anMic"
> > > ----
> > > Opt. hlavy jsem testoval na strese jeste pred bugfixem twisteru s tim,
> ze
> > > napajeni bylo tazeno primo ze zdroje po samostatne dvojlince a oba koaxy
> > > (RG6, 2x 6 m) byly stineny na GND boxu twisteru.
> > >
> > > Funkcnost OK, ale ruseni TV Nova - vertikalni pruhy na obrazovce. Ruseni
> > > prokazatelne zpusobuje Ronja - pri vypnuti napajeni pruhy zmizi.
> > > (Nezasveceny clovek by to hned asi nezaregistroval, ale technik by si
> jiste
> > > vsiml okamzite a sel by na jisto na Ronju. Nemuzu si dovolit neco rusit,
> > > protoze sousede si vsichni vsimli nove nainstalovanych tubusu na strese
> a
> > > pripadne ruseni by si jiste spojili prave s Ronjou).
> > >
> > > Nevim, jestli ma toto ruseni co do cineni primo se zminovanym bugem v
> > > twisteru. Mozna vyzaruje primo neco z opt. hlavy (nahradit svorkovnice F
> > > konektory?). Uvidime, jak se situace vyvine, az zapojim opraveny
> twister -
> > > budu informovat.
> > >
> > > 2) Situace na nodu "Tony"
> > > ----
> > > Na protistanici je zapojeno Aui Forte, signal je tazen k PC RG6 2x 27m
> > > koaxem.
> > >
> > > Pri standartnim zapojeni podle navodu (stineni TX=GND, stineni RX=+12)
> se
> > > projevilo ruseni TV Prima. Nemame moznost zjistit blizsi info. (Vybehla
> na
> > > nas zenska z 30m vzdaleneho baraku, ze jim nejak "lita" tv Prima. Ruseni
> si
> > > vsak nastesi nespojila s Ronjou, ale s CB transceiverem, ktery jsem mel
> > > zrovna v ruce.)
> > >
> > > Podle vseho nam bude asi +12 z Aui Forte vyzarovat vice nez napajeni z
> > > Twisteru a tezko rict, na kterych frekvencich.
> > >
> > > Navrhli jsme reseni:
> > > - stinit oba koaxy na GND
> > > - napajeni vest k opt. hlavam samostatne
> > > - primo do aui konektoru napajet filracni 100n kondenzator (zamezi
> pripadne
> > > sireni rusivych kmitu do +12 vetve zdroje pc?)
> > > - casem prechod na twister
> >
> > Can you send images of your electronics or can you point to existing
> > ones in Ronja gallery?
> >
> > CL<
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 17 12:56:03 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 13:56:03 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <432B22C9.5020806@seznam.cz>
References: <20050914083200.GD11533@kestrel>
	<000401c5ba26$716c3e50$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050916095440.GA18468@kestrel> <432B22C9.5020806@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <20050917115603.GA3107@kestrel>

On Fri, Sep 16, 2005 at 09:53:45PM +0200, dj-bobr wrote:
> Problem of RG6 is that RG6 is not a type of cable. RG6 is family of 
> cables. Some of them are solderable, some not.
> Visit http://www.fantomas.cz/koaxrg6.htm for more information about 
> types of RG6 cables.
> My experience is that CA5075 bought in RASEL shop (Prague 1, 
> Francouzska) is solder resistant.

Can you describe what metal the braid is made from and what is the
surface made from, please?

CL<

> 
> > Does anyone else know the RG6 cable? Is it really solder resistant
> > even when bought new?
> > 
> > If yes I have to exclude this cable from the guide :)
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From archaopttrx at arcor.de  Sat Sep 17 13:02:58 2005
From: archaopttrx at arcor.de (Daniel Berger)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 14:02:58 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Are plastic lenses usable?
In-Reply-To: <20050917114219.GA366@kestrel>
References: <4325E36C.70005@arcor.de> <20050917114219.GA366@kestrel>
Message-ID: <432C05F2.90304@arcor.de>

Karel Kulhavy schrieb:

> On Mon, Sep 12, 2005 at 10:22:04PM +0200, Daniel Berger wrote:
> 
>>Hello list!
>>
>>I have found a source for 130mm plastic loupes in Germany:
>>http://makroshopping.de/index.php?m=shop_artikel_detail:modul_artikel_det&shop_katnr=79&anr=1632&child=&submenu_child=&subsubmenu_child=&PHPSESSID=3f79982c36e43ecc0b4a452525734f00
>>They cost only 2 Euro per piece.
>>The distance for my intended link would be about 500 metres.
>>Can I use plastic lenses, or must they be made of glass?
> 
> 
> They don't have to be from glass if the plastic is weatherproof.
> 
> Do you have photo of the product?
> 
> CL<
> 

Nope, just this generic picture from the website.
Quite unprecise, I think. :-D
I sent an eMail concerning the material to their support
and was answered they were made from plastics.
I am afraid the shape could be not exact enough in plastic loupes,
due to cheap compression-moulding production,
or heat conductance could be insufficient for heating the whole lens.
Please scatter my concern, I don't want to spend much money. ;-)

Regards, Daniel.

-- 
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From kendy at hkfree.org  Sat Sep 17 15:48:51 2005
From: kendy at hkfree.org (Kendy - HKFree)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 16:48:51 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Upload finished: PCB TX guide
In-Reply-To: <20050917084114.GA30197@kestrel>
References: <20050917084114.GA30197@kestrel>
Message-ID: <432C2CD3.3030706@hkfree.org>

Bude pak i cesky preklad ?

Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> Now it's there with all the numerous photographs.
> http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/building_pcb.php
> http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/pcb.php
> 
> CL<
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 17 18:54:36 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 19:54:36 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Are plastic lenses usable?
In-Reply-To: <432C05F2.90304@arcor.de>
References: <4325E36C.70005@arcor.de> <20050917114219.GA366@kestrel>
	<432C05F2.90304@arcor.de>
Message-ID: <20050917175436.GA4054@kestrel>

On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 02:02:58PM +0200, Daniel Berger wrote:
> Karel Kulhavy schrieb:
> 
> >On Mon, Sep 12, 2005 at 10:22:04PM +0200, Daniel Berger wrote:
> >
> >>Hello list!
> >>
> >>I have found a source for 130mm plastic loupes in Germany:
> >>http://makroshopping.de/index.php?m=shop_artikel_detail:modul_artikel_det&shop_katnr=79&anr=1632&child=&submenu_child=&subsubmenu_child=&PHPSESSID=3f79982c36e43ecc0b4a452525734f00
> >>They cost only 2 Euro per piece.
> >>The distance for my intended link would be about 500 metres.
> >>Can I use plastic lenses, or must they be made of glass?
> >
> >
> >They don't have to be from glass if the plastic is weatherproof.
> >
> >Do you have photo of the product?
> >
> >CL<
> >
> 
> Nope, just this generic picture from the website.
> Quite unprecise, I think. :-D
> I sent an eMail concerning the material to their support
> and was answered they were made from plastics.
> I am afraid the shape could be not exact enough in plastic loupes,
> due to cheap compression-moulding production,
> or heat conductance could be insufficient for heating the whole lens.
> Please scatter my concern, I don't want to spend much money. ;-)

The Chinese do the glass ones obviously with molding too.

Heat conductivity is not necessary. The glass doesn't have any anyway
;-)

It should work. The only concern is cracking and blinding on weather but
modern PMMA shouldn't theoretically have problem with that.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sat Sep 17 19:16:49 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 20:16:49 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Upload finished: PCB TX guide
In-Reply-To: <432C2CD3.3030706@hkfree.org>
References: <20050917084114.GA30197@kestrel> <432C2CD3.3030706@hkfree.org>
Message-ID: <20050917181649.GA4938@kestrel>

On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 04:48:51PM +0200, Kendy - HKFree wrote:
> Bude pak i cesky preklad ?

I didn't do any as part of the development. But if anyone doesn't mind
translating building_pcb.php into building_pcb_cz.php I can upload it.

CL<

> 
> Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> > Now it's there with all the numerous photographs.
> > http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/building_pcb.php
> > http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/pcb.php


From quintusmurray at yahoo.com  Sat Sep 17 23:45:29 2005
From: quintusmurray at yahoo.com (Quintus Murray)
Date: Sat, 17 Sep 2005 15:45:29 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 37
In-Reply-To: <mailman.3.1126954801.18027.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
Message-ID: <20050917224529.95211.qmail@web53409.mail.yahoo.com>

this is quintus and I would like to know how to get into links web browser e-mail lists or contact twibright links web browser and I can't find anything on the links website.
 

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 
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From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 18 07:38:44 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 08:38:44 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 37
In-Reply-To: <20050917224529.95211.qmail@web53409.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <mailman.3.1126954801.18027.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<20050917224529.95211.qmail@web53409.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <20050918063844.GA14209@kestrel>

On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 03:45:29PM -0700, Quintus Murray wrote:
> this is quintus and I would like to know how to get into links web
> browser e-mail lists or contact twibright links web browser and I
> can't find anything on the links website.

http://linuxfromscratch.org/mailman/listinfo/links-list

Sorry there were bad links, I fixed them.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 18 07:48:05 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 08:48:05 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] your mail
In-Reply-To: <000801c5bbc2$5a2b8be0$9664000a@max>
References: <000801c5bbc2$5a2b8be0$9664000a@max>
Message-ID: <20050918064805.GB14247@kestrel>

On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 09:59:30PM +0200, Max wrote:
> Ahoj dival jsem se na tve PCB TX vypada pekne bude se dat objednat dps
> nekde jako desky na Twister jeste by to chtelo RX na tistak a bylo by
> to parada(delaji se nejblbeji v hnizde) :)

ask jakub at horky.net I expect him to start selling it...

> 
> ps: na ty fotce to mas pripojeny pres UTP kabel  musi byt GND + TX
> (data) v 1 kroucenym paru ze. Pristi ronju bych udelal s UTP pokud to
> chodi dobre jako s koaxem odpadne hodne kabelu. MAX

No it's not connected over UTP on the photos.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 18 15:43:11 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 16:43:11 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Radioactivity?
Message-ID: <20050918144311.GA18206@kestrel>

I am looking on this picture:
http://images.twibright.com/images/ronja/installations/hungary/kecskemet/Csova2.jpg
And I am having feeling that the pictures shows radioactivity - there is
amount of pixels which have R, G, or B component set to maximum,
which suggests a particle hitting them.

Do you think it may be something else? Otherwise I think I should send
the author an e-mail to check it, maybe he has some contaminated
item at home about which he doesn't know...

The normal noise of the CCD can be seen in background...

CL<


From buh at bubakov.net  Sun Sep 18 16:26:14 2005
From: buh at bubakov.net (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Maty=E1=B9_Prokop?=)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 17:26:14 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
Message-ID: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net>

Ahoj,
mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem rychlost se 
zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX a TX tak proste 
vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem kontroloval a jsou 
100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze 
Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile je to takhle neco mezi tak 
fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....

Predem diky za odpoved
Maty


From polous at katka.biz  Sun Sep 18 18:38:38 2005
From: polous at katka.biz (Martin Polehla)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 17:38:38 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net>
Message-ID: <432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Maty?? Prokop wrote:

> Ahoj, mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem
> rychlost se zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX
> a TX tak proste vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem
> kontroloval a jsou 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je
> chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile
> je to takhle neco mezi tak fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny
> problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....
>
> Predem diky za odpoved Maty
>
je nejaky packetloss ?

rx/tx je konstrukce ve vzduchu nebo na tistakach (jakych ?) ?

p0l0us
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iD8DBQFDLaYdYo9JRD7EbFIRAkSeAJwOB4LXZnUetTp305dd4ReusOwi2ACgiEDB
Qz94RYmSWLDorfm/DkRdEOw=
=99uo
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From buh at bubakov.net  Sun Sep 18 16:45:06 2005
From: buh at bubakov.net (=?windows-1252?Q?Maty=E1=9A_Prokop?=)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 17:45:06 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net> <432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>

Martin Polehla napsal(a):

>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>Hash: SHA1
>
>Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>
>  
>
>>Ahoj, mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem
>>rychlost se zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX
>>a TX tak proste vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem
>>kontroloval a jsou 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je
>>chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile
>>je to takhle neco mezi tak fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny
>>problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....
>>
>>Predem diky za odpoved Maty
>>
>>    
>>
>je nejaky packetloss ?
>  
>
prakticky neni.akorat se ztrati treba 3 pakety z 10000 pri floodu.mozna 
co my dela trochu starost je to ze se pakety jakoby "stosujou"Vypada to 
tak ze behem floodu se postupne pridavaji tecky;)Doufame ze se da 
pochopit co sem napsal;)

>rx/tx je konstrukce ve vzduchu nebo na tistakach (jakych ?) ?
>  
>
konstrukce je presne podle schemat z webu zadne modifikace.akorat sem 
pouzil jakoby pomocna schemata ktera se tady kdysi objevila 
http://www.pointless.net/pipermail/ronja/2005-July/006922.html a je 
normal ve vzduchu.

>p0l0us
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
>Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
>
>iD8DBQFDLaYdYo9JRD7EbFIRAkSeAJwOB4LXZnUetTp305dd4ReusOwi2ACgiEDB
>Qz94RYmSWLDorfm/DkRdEOw=
>=99uo
>-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>  
>



From ronja at hansmi.ch  Sun Sep 18 17:20:26 2005
From: ronja at hansmi.ch (Michael Hanselmann)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 18:20:26 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Radioactivity?
In-Reply-To: <20050918144311.GA18206@kestrel>
References: <20050918144311.GA18206@kestrel>
Message-ID: <20050918162026.GA17145@hansmi.ch>

Hello Karel

> And I am having feeling that the pictures shows radioactivity - there is
> amount of pixels which have R, G, or B component set to maximum,
> which suggests a particle hitting them.

> Do you think it may be something else?

I'm not too sure, but I think radioactivity generates white spots. At
least it does with analogue video cameras (can be seen, for example, on
video shots from Chernobyl). Is it possible that CCDs also have failure
pixels like TFT panels do? Can you ask the author wether the colour
pixels rustle? If not, they're just failure pixels. If they do, yes,
then something is in the air.

Greets,
Michael

-- 
Gentoo Linux Developer using m0n0wall | http://hansmi.ch/
Computers are like air conditioners.  Both stop working, if you open 
windows.
    -- Adam Heath
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From zajio1am at artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz  Sun Sep 18 19:05:20 2005
From: zajio1am at artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Ondrej Zajicek)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:05:20 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <20050910172818.GA19191@kestrel.twibright.com>
References: <200508180940.9422@centrum.cz>
	<20050819095918.GB11888@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<20050819105058.GA16167@feanor>
	<20050910172818.GA19191@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <20050918180520.GB3261@elros>

> > > No F is unreliable.
> > 
> > Why do you think F connector is unreliable (if it is used correcty,
> > especially is needed to use F-connector with inner diameter matching
> > to outer diameter of coaxial cable and use cable with thick (1 mm)
> > central wire)?
> 
> Because the wire is copper. Copper is not gold. And the wire is just
> plugged into socket, no permanent reliable plastic deformation is
> performed. Copper oxide forms on the copper wire everywhere else except
> the microscopic place the wire touches the socket.

...

I don't know about importance of that argument. But it is strange that this is
not considered to be problem in SAT cabling, where F connectors in outdoor are
almost exclusively used.

> > I think it is much more reliable - i tried to build connectors
> > based on your design and, according to my experience, they are
> > very susceptible to cable breakage.
> 
> What did break? Cable? Or the soldered joint? Did you use the new 29mm
> copper stubs which are soldered in the middle and did you tie the
> conductor to the stub with tape?

I use copper stubs and cable breakage happens on wire at first place not
mechanically firmly connected to stub - where wire is mechanically stressed.
In my case (contrary to your guide) this place was not covered with insulation
- i found that it is not possible solder just next to insulation - insulation
is quickly damaged by heat.

> > And with wire nut (svorkovnice - je wire nut anglicky spravne?) inside
> > optical head it is impossible to observe instructions for applying
> > silicone sealant (several hours after apply without contact with water).
> 
> I don't understand this. You install the electronics, connect the
> terminal block, then take pistol with sealant and you can seal it
> immediately. That's how I did it. What's the problem in your case?

I suppose that connecting cables to terminal block must be done on the roof
(near final position of Ronja) - because cable ends there. Then applying
silicone sealant must be done on the roof too. This is almost impossible on
classical (skewed) roofs. And instructions for sealant says that 24 hours
after applying sealant shouldn't be in contact with wetness - but it is
exposed to weather (rain).

-- 
Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo

Ondrej 'SanTiago' Zajicek (email: santiago at mail.cz, jabber: santiago at njs.netlab.cz)
OpenPGP encrypted e-mails preferred (KeyID 0x11DEADC3, wwwkeys.pgp.net)
"To err is human -- to blame it on a computer is even more so."


From zajio1am at artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz  Sun Sep 18 19:08:26 2005
From: zajio1am at artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Ondrej Zajicek)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:08:26 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <20050917115603.GA3107@kestrel>
References: <20050914083200.GD11533@kestrel>
	<000401c5ba26$716c3e50$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050916095440.GA18468@kestrel> <432B22C9.5020806@seznam.cz>
	<20050917115603.GA3107@kestrel>
Message-ID: <20050918180826.GC3261@elros>

On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 01:56:03PM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 16, 2005 at 09:53:45PM +0200, dj-bobr wrote:
> > Problem of RG6 is that RG6 is not a type of cable. RG6 is family of 
> > cables. Some of them are solderable, some not.
> > Visit http://www.fantomas.cz/koaxrg6.htm for more information about 
> > types of RG6 cables.
> > My experience is that CA5075 bought in RASEL shop (Prague 1, 
> > Francouzska) is solder resistant.
> 
> Can you describe what metal the braid is made from and what is the
> surface made from, please?

Often from aluminium, but it is possible to get RG6 (or RG6U) cables
with dense CuSn braids.

-- 
Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo

Ondrej 'SanTiago' Zajicek (email: santiago at mail.cz, jabber: santiago at njs.netlab.cz)
OpenPGP encrypted e-mails preferred (KeyID 0x11DEADC3, wwwkeys.pgp.net)
"To err is human -- to blame it on a computer is even more so."


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 18 19:16:34 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:16:34 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Radioactivity?
In-Reply-To: <20050918162026.GA17145@hansmi.ch>
References: <20050918144311.GA18206@kestrel> <20050918162026.GA17145@hansmi.ch>
Message-ID: <20050918181634.GA8841@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 06:20:26PM +0200, Michael Hanselmann wrote:
> Hello Karel
> 
> > And I am having feeling that the pictures shows radioactivity - there is
> > amount of pixels which have R, G, or B component set to maximum,
> > which suggests a particle hitting them.
> 
> > Do you think it may be something else?
> 
> I'm not too sure, but I think radioactivity generates white spots. At
> least it does with analogue video cameras (can be seen, for example, on
> video shots from Chernobyl). Is it possible that CCDs also have failure
> pixels like TFT panels do? Can you ask the author wether the colour
> pixels rustle? If not, they're just failure pixels. If they do, yes,
> then something is in the air.

I think the spots should be coloured because the particle is small and
it hits always only one sub-pixel from each pixel (R, G, or B).

I have seen other pictures from the gallery, some of them taken by
(http://images.twibright.com/tns/3e7.html)
night, and none of them exhibit the effect. Only the one showing
Ronja from close on long exposure has this - maybe the steel from
which Ronja has been made was contaminated by incident similar to
Algeciras June 9 1998.

In Algeciras, Spain someone threw medical instrument containing Cesium
137 into scrap iron noone noticed - when they smelted the metal in steel
mill, it went into air and Swiss monitoring network got 1000x background
radiation. The mill itself detected the incident considerably later.

http://www.llnl.gov/str/Baskett.html

I remember the incident well Greenpeace was reporting 10x background in
Czech Republic (!)

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 18 19:17:17 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:17:17 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net>
Message-ID: <20050918181717.GB8841@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 05:26:14PM +0200, Maty?? Prokop wrote:
> Ahoj,
> mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem rychlost se 
> zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX a TX tak proste 
> vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem kontroloval a jsou 
> 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze 
> Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile je to takhle neco mezi tak 
> fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....

Does Ronja exhibit a packet loss?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 18 19:18:19 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:18:19 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net> <432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>
	<432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>
Message-ID: <20050918181819.GC8841@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 05:45:06PM +0200, Maty?? Prokop wrote:
> Martin Polehla napsal(a):
> 
> >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> >Hash: SHA1
> >
> >Maty?? Prokop wrote:
> >
> >  
> >
> >>Ahoj, mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem
> >>rychlost se zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX
> >>a TX tak proste vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem
> >>kontroloval a jsou 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je
> >>chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile
> >>je to takhle neco mezi tak fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny
> >>problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....
> >>
> >>Predem diky za odpoved Maty
> >>
> >>    
> >>
> >je nejaky packetloss ?
> >  
> >
> prakticky neni.akorat se ztrati treba 3 pakety z 10000 pri floodu.mozna 
> co my dela trochu starost je to ze se pakety jakoby "stosujou"Vypada to 
> tak ze behem floodu se postupne pridavaji tecky;)Doufame ze se da 
> pochopit co sem napsal;)

Ping flood is not a reliable tool. Use ronjaping -c and report result again
please.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 18 19:32:04 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:32:04 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <20050918180520.GB3261@elros>
References: <200508180940.9422@centrum.cz>
	<20050819095918.GB11888@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<20050819105058.GA16167@feanor>
	<20050910172818.GA19191@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<20050918180520.GB3261@elros>
Message-ID: <20050918183204.GA9381@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 08:05:20PM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> > > > No F is unreliable.
> > > 
> > > Why do you think F connector is unreliable (if it is used correcty,
> > > especially is needed to use F-connector with inner diameter matching
> > > to outer diameter of coaxial cable and use cable with thick (1 mm)
> > > central wire)?
> > 
> > Because the wire is copper. Copper is not gold. And the wire is just
> > plugged into socket, no permanent reliable plastic deformation is
> > performed. Copper oxide forms on the copper wire everywhere else except
> > the microscopic place the wire touches the socket.
> 
> ...
> 
> I don't know about importance of that argument. But it is strange that this is
> not considered to be problem in SAT cabling, where F connectors in outdoor are
> almost exclusively used.

SAT cabling runs on 900MHz where a layer of oxide between copper acts
like capacitor and allows the signal through anyway. Moreover the
receiver is built for fading signals so that if there's suddenly 10dB
more attenuation in the connector it will probably work anyway.

Ronja runs down to only 1MHz and doesn't expect any fading on
connectors.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 18 19:33:00 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:33:00 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <20050918180826.GC3261@elros>
References: <20050914083200.GD11533@kestrel>
	<000401c5ba26$716c3e50$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050916095440.GA18468@kestrel> <432B22C9.5020806@seznam.cz>
	<20050917115603.GA3107@kestrel> <20050918180826.GC3261@elros>
Message-ID: <20050918183300.GB9381@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 08:08:26PM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 01:56:03PM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> > On Fri, Sep 16, 2005 at 09:53:45PM +0200, dj-bobr wrote:
> > > Problem of RG6 is that RG6 is not a type of cable. RG6 is family of 
> > > cables. Some of them are solderable, some not.
> > > Visit http://www.fantomas.cz/koaxrg6.htm for more information about 
> > > types of RG6 cables.
> > > My experience is that CA5075 bought in RASEL shop (Prague 1, 
> > > Francouzska) is solder resistant.
> > 
> > Can you describe what metal the braid is made from and what is the
> > surface made from, please?
> 
> Often from aluminium, but it is possible to get RG6 (or RG6U) cables
> with dense CuSn braids.

Have you ever seen a coaxial with aluminium braid? If yes, I'll forbid
them explicitly in the gude.

CL<


From ok2zaw at seznam.cz  Sun Sep 18 19:40:53 2005
From: ok2zaw at seznam.cz (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Jan_=A9ustr_-_OK2ZAW?=)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:40:53 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <20050918183204.GA9381@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <20050918184053.6FAFC1480BD@relay.sattnet.cz>

Jaky je rozdil mezi Fkem a t?eba BNC, nebo Nkem? 
 Nechapu, proc by m?lo byt Fko spatny pro pouziti na Ronje. Sat konvertory,
10GHz pojitka a jiny v?ci pouzivaji koax zaroven jako napajeni.
Pokud je vse dob?e zaizolovane, nemel by byt preci problem.
Nebo jsem spatne pochopil text?

S pozdravem Jan ?ustr / best Regards, Jan ?ustr
| ok2zaw at seznam.cz | ICQ: 337068178 | www.ok2zaw.com |

-----Original Message-----
From: ronja-bounces+ok2zaw=seznam.cz at lists.pointless.net
[mailto:ronja-bounces+ok2zaw=seznam.cz at lists.pointless.net] On Behalf Of
Karel Kulhavy
Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2005 8:32 PM
To: Twibright Ronja
Subject: Re: [Ronja] problem

On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 08:05:20PM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
> > > > No F is unreliable.
> > > 
> > > Why do you think F connector is unreliable (if it is used correcty,
> > > especially is needed to use F-connector with inner diameter matching
> > > to outer diameter of coaxial cable and use cable with thick (1 mm)
> > > central wire)?
> > 
> > Because the wire is copper. Copper is not gold. And the wire is just
> > plugged into socket, no permanent reliable plastic deformation is
> > performed. Copper oxide forms on the copper wire everywhere else except
> > the microscopic place the wire touches the socket.
> 
> ...
> 
> I don't know about importance of that argument. But it is strange that
this is
> not considered to be problem in SAT cabling, where F connectors in outdoor
are
> almost exclusively used.

SAT cabling runs on 900MHz where a layer of oxide between copper acts
like capacitor and allows the signal through anyway. Moreover the
receiver is built for fading signals so that if there's suddenly 10dB
more attenuation in the connector it will probably work anyway.

Ronja runs down to only 1MHz and doesn't expect any fading on
connectors.

CL<

_______________________________________________
Ronja mailing list
Ronja at lists.pointless.net
http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja

-- 
No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
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From anmic at fmg.sk  Sun Sep 18 19:23:15 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:23:15 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
References: <20050914083200.GD11533@kestrel><000401c5ba26$716c3e50$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050916095440.GA18468@kestrel>
Message-ID: <004401c5bc81$faa7c830$0101a8c0@anmic>

> > RG6: Aluminium foil + very thin braid made of something absolutely
> > solder-resistant.
>
> The brain must be well solderable because it's its purpose: to connect
> the foil when you need to solder.
>
> Isn't the cable excessively old? Did you try ample amounts of
> colophonium?
>

I bought the cable recently. Anyway, it isn't the first piece of coax I
couldn't solder any way.

> Does anyone else know the RG6 cable? Is it really solder resistant
> even when bought new?
>
> If yes I have to exclude this cable from the guide :)

How about use another way to connect a coax to a module? Is there any
reliable connector which can be taken into consideration? Wouldn't it be
better than excluding coaxes from the guide one by one?

>
> CL<
>



From anmic at fmg.sk  Sun Sep 18 19:26:43 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:26:43 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
References: <20050913072018.GD21474@kestrel><003f01c5b87f$7c84ea10$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050917114733.GD366@kestrel>
Message-ID: <004501c5bc81$fd481590$0101a8c0@anmic>

> > list. The optical link is working now, but there still remains an
> > interference (but the current situation is much better than before).
>
> Is current situation after Twister bugfix and situation before before
> Twister bugfix? Or are both situation without Twister bugfix?
>
> CL<

Yes, it is. The situation is a bit better now when the Twister bugfix is
applied.

anMic



From buh at bubakov.net  Mon Sep 19 00:03:17 2005
From: buh at bubakov.net (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Maty=E1=B9_Prokop?=)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 01:03:17 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <20050918181819.GC8841@kestrel.twibright.com>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net>
	<432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>	<432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>
	<20050918181819.GC8841@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net>

Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):

>On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 05:45:06PM +0200, Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>  
>
>>Martin Polehla napsal(a):
>>
>>    
>>
>>>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>Hash: SHA1
>>>
>>>Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>>>Ahoj, mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem
>>>>rychlost se zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX
>>>>a TX tak proste vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem
>>>>kontroloval a jsou 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je
>>>>chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile
>>>>je to takhle neco mezi tak fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny
>>>>problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....
>>>>
>>>>Predem diky za odpoved Maty
>>>>
>>>>   
>>>>
>>>>        
>>>>
>>>je nejaky packetloss ?
>>> 
>>>
>>>      
>>>
>>prakticky neni.akorat se ztrati treba 3 pakety z 10000 pri floodu.mozna 
>>co my dela trochu starost je to ze se pakety jakoby "stosujou"Vypada to 
>>tak ze behem floodu se postupne pridavaji tecky;)Doufame ze se da 
>>pochopit co sem napsal;)
>>    
>>
>
>Ping flood is not a reliable tool. Use ronjaping -c and report result again
>please.
>
>CL<
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>  
>
Takze uz sem prisel v cem byl problem.Pripajel jsem stineni u koaxu na 
RX modulu na druhou stranu namotane cifky nez se melo;)Omlouvam se ze 
sem nejdriv ptal a pak se teprv kontroloval.Jinak se mi ale moc nezda 
dosah.Vic jak 60 cm s min. PL neudelam.Cetl sem nekde ze by mela mit 
dosah vice jak 80 cm bez optiky.Nepise se ale s jakymi LEDkami.Ja mam 
LED koupene z GM (L-TLWR7600) tim padem slabsi nez by meli byt.Jaky by 
mohl by teoreticky dosah s optikou za pouziti tehlech LED?Je vubec 
spravny takhle maly dosah?

Zatim diky za odpovedi.


From sith at wifistar.net  Mon Sep 19 08:00:20 2005
From: sith at wifistar.net (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?David_Sedl=E1=E8ek?=)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 07:00:20 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net>	<432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>	<432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>	<20050918181819.GC8841@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net>
Message-ID: <432E6204.4000601@wifistar.net>

S tema ledkama z GMka to odpovida.

Maty?? Prokop napsal(a):
> Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> 
> 
>>On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 05:45:06PM +0200, Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>> 
>>
>>
>>>Martin Polehla napsal(a):
>>>
>>>   
>>>
>>>
>>>>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>>>Hash: SHA1
>>>>
>>>>Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Ahoj, mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem
>>>>>rychlost se zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX
>>>>>a TX tak proste vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem
>>>>>kontroloval a jsou 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je
>>>>>chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile
>>>>>je to takhle neco mezi tak fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny
>>>>>problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....
>>>>>
>>>>>Predem diky za odpoved Maty
>>>>>
>>>>>  
>>>>>
>>>>>       
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>je nejaky packetloss ?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>     
>>>>
>>>
>>>prakticky neni.akorat se ztrati treba 3 pakety z 10000 pri floodu.mozna 
>>>co my dela trochu starost je to ze se pakety jakoby "stosujou"Vypada to 
>>>tak ze behem floodu se postupne pridavaji tecky;)Doufame ze se da 
>>>pochopit co sem napsal;)
>>>   
>>>
>>
>>Ping flood is not a reliable tool. Use ronjaping -c and report result again
>>please.
>>
>>CL<
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>> 
>>
> 
> Takze uz sem prisel v cem byl problem.Pripajel jsem stineni u koaxu na 
> RX modulu na druhou stranu namotane cifky nez se melo;)Omlouvam se ze 
> sem nejdriv ptal a pak se teprv kontroloval.Jinak se mi ale moc nezda 
> dosah.Vic jak 60 cm s min. PL neudelam.Cetl sem nekde ze by mela mit 
> dosah vice jak 80 cm bez optiky.Nepise se ale s jakymi LEDkami.Ja mam 
> LED koupene z GM (L-TLWR7600) tim padem slabsi nez by meli byt.Jaky by 
> mohl by teoreticky dosah s optikou za pouziti tehlech LED?Je vubec 
> spravny takhle maly dosah?
> 
> Zatim diky za odpovedi.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 

-- 
Regards,
David Sedl??ek
WiFiStar.net, o.s.
skype: sith_cz


From sorin at bz.ines.ro  Mon Sep 19 07:46:44 2005
From: sorin at bz.ines.ro (Sorin Popa)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 09:46:44 +0300
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit start point idea..
References: <mailman.1018.1127068326.2010.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
Message-ID: <000601c5bce5$e65c79c0$0d13320a@sorin>

I found on some russian forum few info about 100mbit.. i understand that 
someone was interested to make it.Maybe will be an good start point..for 
they who know russian language..:))

http://www.lazerlink.ru/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=Avtor;action=display;num=1080353444;start=175



-------------------------------------------
----- Original Message ----- 
From: <ronja-request at lists.pointless.net>
To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Sunday, September 18, 2005 9:32 PM
Subject: Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 40


> Send Ronja mailing list submissions to
> ronja at lists.pointless.net
>
> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> ronja-request at lists.pointless.net
>
> You can reach the person managing the list at
> ronja-owner at lists.pointless.net
>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of Ronja digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
>   1.  Radioactivity? (Karel Kulhavy)
>   2.  Mala rychlost (Maty?? Prokop)
>   3. Re:  Mala rychlost (Martin Polehla)
>   4. Re:  Mala rychlost (Maty?? Prokop)
>   5. Re:  Radioactivity? (Michael Hanselmann)
>   6. Re:  problem (Ondrej Zajicek)
>   7. Re:  problem (Ondrej Zajicek)
>   8. Re:  Radioactivity? (Karel Kulhavy)
>   9. Re:  Mala rychlost (Karel Kulhavy)
>  10. Re:  Mala rychlost (Karel Kulhavy)
>  11. Re:  problem (Karel Kulhavy)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 16:43:11 +0200
> From: Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com>
> Subject: [Ronja] Radioactivity?
> To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Message-ID: <20050918144311.GA18206 at kestrel>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> I am looking on this picture:
> http://images.twibright.com/images/ronja/installations/hungary/kecskemet/Csova2.jpg
> And I am having feeling that the pictures shows radioactivity - there is
> amount of pixels which have R, G, or B component set to maximum,
> which suggests a particle hitting them.
>
> Do you think it may be something else? Otherwise I think I should send
> the author an e-mail to check it, maybe he has some contaminated
> item at home about which he doesn't know...
>
> The normal noise of the CCD can be seen in background...
>
> CL<
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 17:26:14 +0200
> From: Maty?? Prokop <buh at bubakov.net>
> Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
> To: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> Message-ID: <432D8716.5010009 at bubakov.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-2; format=flowed
>
> Ahoj,
> mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem rychlost se
> zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX a TX tak proste
> vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem kontroloval a jsou
> 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze
> Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile je to takhle neco mezi tak
> fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny problem ale nikdo ho 
> nezodpovedel....
>
> Predem diky za odpoved
> Maty
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 17:38:38 +0000
> From: Martin Polehla <polous at katka.biz>
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
> To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Message-ID: <432DA61E.1030709 at katka.biz>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
>
> Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>
>> Ahoj, mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem
>> rychlost se zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX
>> a TX tak proste vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem
>> kontroloval a jsou 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je
>> chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile
>> je to takhle neco mezi tak fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny
>> problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....
>>
>> Predem diky za odpoved Maty
>>
> je nejaky packetloss ?
>
> rx/tx je konstrukce ve vzduchu nebo na tistakach (jakych ?) ?
>
> p0l0us
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
> Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
> Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
>
> iD8DBQFDLaYdYo9JRD7EbFIRAkSeAJwOB4LXZnUetTp305dd4ReusOwi2ACgiEDB
> Qz94RYmSWLDorfm/DkRdEOw=
> =99uo
> -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 17:45:06 +0200
> From: Maty?? Prokop <buh at bubakov.net>
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
> To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Message-ID: <432D8B82.4020009 at bubakov.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
>
> Martin Polehla napsal(a):
>
>>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>>Hash: SHA1
>>
>>Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>Ahoj, mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem
>>>rychlost se zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX
>>>a TX tak proste vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem
>>>kontroloval a jsou 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je
>>>chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile
>>>je to takhle neco mezi tak fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny
>>>problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....
>>>
>>>Predem diky za odpoved Maty
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>je nejaky packetloss ?
>>
>>
> prakticky neni.akorat se ztrati treba 3 pakety z 10000 pri floodu.mozna
> co my dela trochu starost je to ze se pakety jakoby "stosujou"Vypada to
> tak ze behem floodu se postupne pridavaji tecky;)Doufame ze se da
> pochopit co sem napsal;)
>
>>rx/tx je konstrukce ve vzduchu nebo na tistakach (jakych ?) ?
>>
>>
> konstrukce je presne podle schemat z webu zadne modifikace.akorat sem
> pouzil jakoby pomocna schemata ktera se tady kdysi objevila
> http://www.pointless.net/pipermail/ronja/2005-July/006922.html a je
> normal ve vzduchu.
>
>>p0l0us
>>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
>>Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
>>
>>iD8DBQFDLaYdYo9JRD7EbFIRAkSeAJwOB4LXZnUetTp305dd4ReusOwi2ACgiEDB
>>Qz94RYmSWLDorfm/DkRdEOw=
>>=99uo
>>-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 18:20:26 +0200
> From: Michael Hanselmann <ronja at hansmi.ch>
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Radioactivity?
> To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Message-ID: <20050918162026.GA17145 at hansmi.ch>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Hello Karel
>
>> And I am having feeling that the pictures shows radioactivity - there is
>> amount of pixels which have R, G, or B component set to maximum,
>> which suggests a particle hitting them.
>
>> Do you think it may be something else?
>
> I'm not too sure, but I think radioactivity generates white spots. At
> least it does with analogue video cameras (can be seen, for example, on
> video shots from Chernobyl). Is it possible that CCDs also have failure
> pixels like TFT panels do? Can you ask the author wether the colour
> pixels rustle? If not, they're just failure pixels. If they do, yes,
> then something is in the air.
>
> Greets,
> Michael
>
> -- 
> Gentoo Linux Developer using m0n0wall | http://hansmi.ch/
> Computers are like air conditioners.  Both stop working, if you open
> windows.
>    -- Adam Heath
> -------------- next part --------------
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> http://pointless.net/pipermail/ronja/attachments/20050918/5b8055b7/attachment-0001.bin
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:05:20 +0200
> From: Ondrej Zajicek <zajio1am at artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz>
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] problem
> To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Message-ID: <20050918180520.GB3261 at elros>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
>> > > No F is unreliable.
>> >
>> > Why do you think F connector is unreliable (if it is used correcty,
>> > especially is needed to use F-connector with inner diameter matching
>> > to outer diameter of coaxial cable and use cable with thick (1 mm)
>> > central wire)?
>>
>> Because the wire is copper. Copper is not gold. And the wire is just
>> plugged into socket, no permanent reliable plastic deformation is
>> performed. Copper oxide forms on the copper wire everywhere else except
>> the microscopic place the wire touches the socket.
>
> ...
>
> I don't know about importance of that argument. But it is strange that 
> this is
> not considered to be problem in SAT cabling, where F connectors in outdoor 
> are
> almost exclusively used.
>
>> > I think it is much more reliable - i tried to build connectors
>> > based on your design and, according to my experience, they are
>> > very susceptible to cable breakage.
>>
>> What did break? Cable? Or the soldered joint? Did you use the new 29mm
>> copper stubs which are soldered in the middle and did you tie the
>> conductor to the stub with tape?
>
> I use copper stubs and cable breakage happens on wire at first place not
> mechanically firmly connected to stub - where wire is mechanically 
> stressed.
> In my case (contrary to your guide) this place was not covered with 
> insulation
> - i found that it is not possible solder just next to insulation - 
> insulation
> is quickly damaged by heat.
>
>> > And with wire nut (svorkovnice - je wire nut anglicky spravne?) inside
>> > optical head it is impossible to observe instructions for applying
>> > silicone sealant (several hours after apply without contact with 
>> > water).
>>
>> I don't understand this. You install the electronics, connect the
>> terminal block, then take pistol with sealant and you can seal it
>> immediately. That's how I did it. What's the problem in your case?
>
> I suppose that connecting cables to terminal block must be done on the 
> roof
> (near final position of Ronja) - because cable ends there. Then applying
> silicone sealant must be done on the roof too. This is almost impossible 
> on
> classical (skewed) roofs. And instructions for sealant says that 24 hours
> after applying sealant shouldn't be in contact with wetness - but it is
> exposed to weather (rain).
>
> -- 
> Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo
>
> Ondrej 'SanTiago' Zajicek (email: santiago at mail.cz, jabber: 
> santiago at njs.netlab.cz)
> OpenPGP encrypted e-mails preferred (KeyID 0x11DEADC3, wwwkeys.pgp.net)
> "To err is human -- to blame it on a computer is even more so."
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:08:26 +0200
> From: Ondrej Zajicek <zajio1am at artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz>
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] problem
> To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Message-ID: <20050918180826.GC3261 at elros>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> On Sat, Sep 17, 2005 at 01:56:03PM +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
>> On Fri, Sep 16, 2005 at 09:53:45PM +0200, dj-bobr wrote:
>> > Problem of RG6 is that RG6 is not a type of cable. RG6 is family of
>> > cables. Some of them are solderable, some not.
>> > Visit http://www.fantomas.cz/koaxrg6.htm for more information about
>> > types of RG6 cables.
>> > My experience is that CA5075 bought in RASEL shop (Prague 1,
>> > Francouzska) is solder resistant.
>>
>> Can you describe what metal the braid is made from and what is the
>> surface made from, please?
>
> Often from aluminium, but it is possible to get RG6 (or RG6U) cables
> with dense CuSn braids.
>
> -- 
> Elen sila lumenn' omentielvo
>
> Ondrej 'SanTiago' Zajicek (email: santiago at mail.cz, jabber: 
> santiago at njs.netlab.cz)
> OpenPGP encrypted e-mails preferred (KeyID 0x11DEADC3, wwwkeys.pgp.net)
> "To err is human -- to blame it on a computer is even more so."
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:16:34 +0200
> From: Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com>
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Radioactivity?
> To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Message-ID: <20050918181634.GA8841 at kestrel.twibright.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 06:20:26PM +0200, Michael Hanselmann wrote:
>> Hello Karel
>>
>> > And I am having feeling that the pictures shows radioactivity - there 
>> > is
>> > amount of pixels which have R, G, or B component set to maximum,
>> > which suggests a particle hitting them.
>>
>> > Do you think it may be something else?
>>
>> I'm not too sure, but I think radioactivity generates white spots. At
>> least it does with analogue video cameras (can be seen, for example, on
>> video shots from Chernobyl). Is it possible that CCDs also have failure
>> pixels like TFT panels do? Can you ask the author wether the colour
>> pixels rustle? If not, they're just failure pixels. If they do, yes,
>> then something is in the air.
>
> I think the spots should be coloured because the particle is small and
> it hits always only one sub-pixel from each pixel (R, G, or B).
>
> I have seen other pictures from the gallery, some of them taken by
> (http://images.twibright.com/tns/3e7.html)
> night, and none of them exhibit the effect. Only the one showing
> Ronja from close on long exposure has this - maybe the steel from
> which Ronja has been made was contaminated by incident similar to
> Algeciras June 9 1998.
>
> In Algeciras, Spain someone threw medical instrument containing Cesium
> 137 into scrap iron noone noticed - when they smelted the metal in steel
> mill, it went into air and Swiss monitoring network got 1000x background
> radiation. The mill itself detected the incident considerably later.
>
> http://www.llnl.gov/str/Baskett.html
>
> I remember the incident well Greenpeace was reporting 10x background in
> Czech Republic (!)
>
> CL<
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:17:17 +0200
> From: Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com>
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
> To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Message-ID: <20050918181717.GB8841 at kestrel.twibright.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2
>
> On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 05:26:14PM +0200, Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>> Ahoj,
>> mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem rychlost se
>> zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX a TX tak proste
>> vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem kontroloval a jsou
>> 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze
>> Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile je to takhle neco mezi tak
>> fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny problem ale nikdo ho 
>> nezodpovedel....
>
> Does Ronja exhibit a packet loss?
>
> CL<
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:18:19 +0200
> From: Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com>
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
> To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Message-ID: <20050918181819.GC8841 at kestrel.twibright.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-2
>
> On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 05:45:06PM +0200, Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>> Martin Polehla napsal(a):
>>
>> >-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>> >Hash: SHA1
>> >
>> >Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >>Ahoj, mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem
>> >>rychlost se zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX
>> >>a TX tak proste vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem
>> >>kontroloval a jsou 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je
>> >>chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile
>> >>je to takhle neco mezi tak fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny
>> >>problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....
>> >>
>> >>Predem diky za odpoved Maty
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >je nejaky packetloss ?
>> >
>> >
>> prakticky neni.akorat se ztrati treba 3 pakety z 10000 pri floodu.mozna
>> co my dela trochu starost je to ze se pakety jakoby "stosujou"Vypada to
>> tak ze behem floodu se postupne pridavaji tecky;)Doufame ze se da
>> pochopit co sem napsal;)
>
> Ping flood is not a reliable tool. Use ronjaping -c and report result 
> again
> please.
>
> CL<
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Sun, 18 Sep 2005 20:32:04 +0200
> From: Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com>
> Subject: Re: [Ronja] problem
> To: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Message-ID: <20050918183204.GA9381 at kestrel.twibright.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 08:05:20PM +0200, Ondrej Zajicek wrote:
>> > > > No F is unreliable.
>> > >
>> > > Why do you think F connector is unreliable (if it is used correcty,
>> > > especially is needed to use F-connector with inner diameter matching
>> > > to outer diameter of coaxial cable and use cable with thick (1 mm)
>> > > central wire)?
>> >
>> > Because the wire is copper. Copper is not gold. And the wire is just
>> > plugged into socket, no permanent reliable plastic deformation is
>> > performed. Copper oxide forms on the copper wire everywhere else except
>> > the microscopic place the wire touches the socket.
>>
>> ...
>>
>> I don't know about importance of that argument. But it is strange that 
>> this is
>> not considered to be problem in SAT cabling, where F connectors in 
>> outdoor are
>> almost exclusively used.
>
> SAT cabling runs on 900MHz where a layer of oxide between copper acts
> like capacitor and allows the signal through anyway. Moreover the
> receiver is built for fading signals so that if there's suddenly 10dB
> more attenuation in the connector it will probably work anyway.
>
> Ronja runs down to only 1MHz and doesn't expect any fading on
> connectors.
>
> CL<
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>
> End of Ronja Digest, Vol 29, Issue 40
> ************************************* 



From polous at katka.biz  Mon Sep 19 10:42:39 2005
From: polous at katka.biz (Martin Polehla)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 09:42:39 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net>	<432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>	<432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>	<20050918181819.GC8841@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net>
Message-ID: <432E880F.20708@katka.biz>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Maty?? Prokop wrote:

> Takze uz sem prisel v cem byl problem.Pripajel jsem stineni u koaxu
> na RX modulu na druhou stranu namotane cifky nez se melo;)Omlouvam
> se ze sem nejdriv ptal a pak se teprv kontroloval.Jinak se mi ale
> moc nezda dosah.Vic jak 60 cm s min. PL neudelam.Cetl sem nekde ze
> by mela mit dosah vice jak 80 cm bez optiky.Nepise se ale s jakymi
> LEDkami.Ja mam LED koupene z GM (L-TLWR7600) tim padem slabsi nez
> by meli byt.Jaky by mohl by teoreticky dosah s optikou za pouziti
> tehlech LED?Je vubec spravny takhle maly dosah?
>
> Zatim diky za odpovedi.
>
> _______________________________________________ Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
TLWR co davaj v GM jako nahrady za HPWT xx00 jsou naprosto
nevyhovujci, sezen si ty spravny. Znam spoustu lidi co se na to
nechali v GMku takhle nachytat (i ja jich mam par doma) a pak resili
proc jim to nejede aspno na metr. Imho by na webu melo byt specialne
upozorneni ze tyhle led maji nizky dosah (pokud to tam uz nejni).

p0l0us
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Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iD8DBQFDLogPYo9JRD7EbFIRApYhAJ9CmoQ8Yvd829DOGdnoePyGTaq3lgCfdMJg
64DhaWXuwZHnQ9pLuo2lM74=
=mHMh
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From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 19 09:16:40 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 10:16:40 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net> <432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>
	<432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>
	<20050918181819.GC8841@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net>
Message-ID: <20050919081640.GC22094@kestrel>

On Mon, Sep 19, 2005 at 01:03:17AM +0200, Maty?? Prokop wrote:
> Karel Kulhavy napsal(a):
> 
> >On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 05:45:06PM +0200, Maty?? Prokop wrote:
> >  
> >
> >>Martin Polehla napsal(a):
> >>
> >>    
> >>
> >>>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> >>>Hash: SHA1
> >>>
> >>>Maty?? Prokop wrote:
> >>>
> >>> 
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>>>Ahoj, mam docela problem;)Pokud propojim Twistery primo kablikem
> >>>>rychlost se zda OK okolo 1000 kbytes/s.Pokud ale pripojim moduly RX
> >>>>a TX tak proste vic jak 500 kbytes/s z toho nedostanu.Sitovky jsem
> >>>>kontroloval a jsou 100% nastaveny na 10mbit FD.Otazka je kde je
> >>>>chyba;)Mel sem dojem ze Ronja bud to funguje a nebo ne ale jakmile
> >>>>je to takhle neco mezi tak fakt nevim;)Ve foru jsem nasel podobny
> >>>>problem ale nikdo ho nezodpovedel....
> >>>>
> >>>>Predem diky za odpoved Maty
> >>>>
> >>>>   
> >>>>
> >>>>        
> >>>>
> >>>je nejaky packetloss ?
> >>> 
> >>>
> >>>      
> >>>
> >>prakticky neni.akorat se ztrati treba 3 pakety z 10000 pri floodu.mozna 
> >>co my dela trochu starost je to ze se pakety jakoby "stosujou"Vypada to 
> >>tak ze behem floodu se postupne pridavaji tecky;)Doufame ze se da 
> >>pochopit co sem napsal;)
> >>    
> >>
> >
> >Ping flood is not a reliable tool. Use ronjaping -c and report result again
> >please.
> >
> >CL<
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >Ronja mailing list
> >Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> >http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> >  
> >
> Takze uz sem prisel v cem byl problem.Pripajel jsem stineni u koaxu na 
> RX modulu na druhou stranu namotane cifky nez se melo;)Omlouvam se ze 
> sem nejdriv ptal a pak se teprv kontroloval.Jinak se mi ale moc nezda 
> dosah.Vic jak 60 cm s min. PL neudelam.Cetl sem nekde ze by mela mit 
> dosah vice jak 80 cm bez optiky.Nepise se ale s jakymi LEDkami.Ja mam 
> LED koupene z GM (L-TLWR7600) tim padem slabsi nez by meli byt.Jaky by 
> mohl by teoreticky dosah s optikou za pouziti tehlech LED?Je vubec 
> spravny takhle maly dosah?

TLWR7600 is weak. I am not surprised it has only 60cm.
Is the TLWR7600 range written on the Ronja webpage among other ranges?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 19 09:20:09 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 10:20:09 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <20050918184053.6FAFC1480BD@relay.sattnet.cz>
References: <20050918183204.GA9381@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<20050918184053.6FAFC1480BD@relay.sattnet.cz>
Message-ID: <20050919082009.GD22094@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 08:40:53PM +0200, Jan ?ustr - OK2ZAW wrote:
> Jaky je rozdil mezi Fkem a t?eba BNC, nebo Nkem? 
>  Nechapu, proc by m?lo byt Fko spatny pro pouziti na Ronje. Sat konvertory,
> 10GHz pojitka a jiny v?ci pouzivaji koax zaroven jako napajeni.
> Pokud je vse dob?e zaizolovane, nemel by byt preci problem.
> Nebo jsem spatne pochopil text?

Sorry I don't have time to conduct endless discussions on the theme
"what is better, B or C?" when A is prescribed in Ronja guide.

Put whatever you want there but if it won't work, it's not guaranteed
that you get support. And if you get it and the problems are caused by
what you put there, you are wasting my time which could have been
otherwise spent on development (I don't have much time).

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 19 09:47:56 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 10:47:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <004201c5b87f$7d7823b0$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <20050913072102.GE21474@kestrel>
	<004201c5b87f$7d7823b0$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050919084756.GA22820@kestrel>

On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 06:17:58PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> 
> > yes - and do you have RX or TX on unofficial PCB's?
> > Can you send pictures of the connectorings?
> >
> 
> our ronja is built according the guide => rx+tx airwire on the both sides,
> using wire nuts for connectig coax

I am currently building an RX and when I finish it I'll connect it to
oscilloscope and look if it's emanating any radiation. I have put into
my Ronja buglist. I'll also look at the TX.

Can you send photos of your electrical construction please?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 19 09:50:41 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 10:50:41 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <004401c5bc81$faa7c830$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <20050916095440.GA18468@kestrel>
	<004401c5bc81$faa7c830$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050919085041.GB22820@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 18, 2005 at 08:23:15PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> > > RG6: Aluminium foil + very thin braid made of something absolutely
> > > solder-resistant.
> >
> > The brain must be well solderable because it's its purpose: to connect
> > the foil when you need to solder.
> >
> > Isn't the cable excessively old? Did you try ample amounts of
> > colophonium?
> >
> 
> I bought the cable recently. Anyway, it isn't the first piece of coax I
> couldn't solder any way.
> 
> > Does anyone else know the RG6 cable? Is it really solder resistant
> > even when bought new?
> >
> > If yes I have to exclude this cable from the guide :)
> 
> How about use another way to connect a coax to a module? Is there any
> reliable connector which can be taken into consideration? Wouldn't it be
> better than excluding coaxes from the guide one by one?

The only reliable way how to connect aluminium braid is to use special
aluminium soldering process that is not available to general public.
Other ways are unfortunately all unreliable.

I have put into buglist that I should scan the guide and wherever
a coaxial is mentioned to put a note it must be a type with shield
accomodated for soldering.

CL<


From asteri_x at freemail.hu  Mon Sep 19 09:51:16 2005
From: asteri_x at freemail.hu (Martin)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 10:51:16 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit start point idea..
In-Reply-To: <000601c5bce5$e65c79c0$0d13320a@sorin>
References: <mailman.1018.1127068326.2010.ronja@lists.pointless.net>
	<000601c5bce5$e65c79c0$0d13320a@sorin>
Message-ID: <432E7C04.3020704@freemail.hu>

Sorin Popa ?rta:
> I found on some russian forum few info about 100mbit.. i understand that 
> someone was interested to make it.Maybe will be an good start point..for 
> they who know russian language..:))
> 
> http://www.lazerlink.ru/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?board=Avtor;action=display;num=1080353444;start=175
> 
Hi!

Exactly that's what I need.
(but i dont know russian)

But i want to do it with few discrete SMD transistors, because they need
less space.
Did anyone succed to use BC847 at 125MHz?
The transition point of Infineons BC847 is 250 MHz.
That would be enough.

I found some others, but these are cheaper. :)

Bye,
Martin



From p.deelman at hccnet.nl  Mon Sep 19 10:00:38 2005
From: p.deelman at hccnet.nl (Patrick Deelman)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 11:00:38 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <20050919082009.GD22094@kestrel>
References: <20050918183204.GA9381@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<20050918184053.6FAFC1480BD@relay.sattnet.cz>
	<20050919082009.GD22094@kestrel>
Message-ID: <432E7E36.1030109@hccnet.nl>

Sorry I don't have time to conduct endless discussions on the theme

>"what is better, B or C?" when A is prescribed in Ronja guide.
>
>Put whatever you want there but if it won't work, it's not guaranteed
>that you get support. And if you get it and the problems are caused by
>what you put there, you are wasting my time which could have been
>otherwise spent on development (I don't have much time).
>
>CL<
>
To be honest clock, it took some time of asking when you finally gave an 
answer that made sense about the discussion "f-connector". Well actually 
you gave 2 answers

first answer was a larger area of contact by the terminal block and the 
second answer was about the higher frequencies that go around sat systems.

But then the following question, what about N-connector ? that's used in 
27MHz systems :) And also vulcanic tape is used to weatherproof such 
systems and prevent oxidation.

Also when one uses a terminal block with oxidiced wires and has to 
disconnect it. How would ronja behave if one would reconnect the wires 
again ? Personally i think i makes more sense to weatherproof such 
systems so that oxidation wouldn't occur.

Personally this is what i think and that many ronja users have the same 
problem. It's an discussion, that's all. But it seems that the only 
thing in your mind is "how you solved it". I also don't see any 
testresults proofing the idea of using any other connector wrong.

What would the capacity be when the wire would be oxidiced ? <1pF ? What 
would the impact be ? Would the same occur when using an oxidiced wire 
on a terminal block ? etc etc.

Patrick


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 19 12:29:17 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 13:29:17 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] problem
In-Reply-To: <432E7E36.1030109@hccnet.nl>
References: <20050918183204.GA9381@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<20050918184053.6FAFC1480BD@relay.sattnet.cz>
	<20050919082009.GD22094@kestrel> <432E7E36.1030109@hccnet.nl>
Message-ID: <20050919112917.GB28003@kestrel>

On Mon, Sep 19, 2005 at 11:00:38AM +0200, Patrick Deelman wrote:
> Sorry I don't have time to conduct endless discussions on the theme
> 
> >"what is better, B or C?" when A is prescribed in Ronja guide.
> >
> >Put whatever you want there but if it won't work, it's not guaranteed
> >that you get support. And if you get it and the problems are caused by
> >what you put there, you are wasting my time which could have been
> >otherwise spent on development (I don't have much time).
> >
> >CL<
> >
> To be honest clock, it took some time of asking when you finally gave an 
> answer that made sense about the discussion "f-connector". Well actually 
> you gave 2 answers
> 
> first answer was a larger area of contact by the terminal block and the 
> second answer was about the higher frequencies that go around sat systems.
> 
> But then the following question, what about N-connector ? that's used in 
> 27MHz systems :) And also vulcanic tape is used to weatherproof such 
> systems and prevent oxidation.

I don't know I have no experience with N connectors.

> 
> Also when one uses a terminal block with oxidiced wires and has to 
> disconnect it. How would ronja behave if one would reconnect the wires 
> again ? Personally i think i makes more sense to weatherproof such 

Correctly. The screw cuts into the copper again and all the oxide is
stripped down.

> systems so that oxidation wouldn't occur.

They are already weatherproofed. All the connectors (=terminal blocks)
in Ronja are hermetically shielded from weather or are inside the building.

> 
> Personally this is what i think and that many ronja users have the same 
> problem. It's an discussion, that's all. But it seems that the only 
> thing in your mind is "how you solved it". I also don't see any 
> testresults proofing the idea of using any other connector wrong.

I had BNC shielded from weather (not hermetically) and it fell apart.
The gold plating flaked away.

> 
> What would the capacity be when the wire would be oxidiced ? <1pF ? What 

Every time different.

> would the impact be ? Would the same occur when using an oxidiced wire 
> on a terminal block ? etc etc.

No. In teterminal block the screw cuts through into the metal. You can
see it's trace there when you disconnect it.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 19 12:37:08 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 13:37:08 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432E880F.20708@katka.biz>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net> <432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>
	<432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>
	<20050918181819.GC8841@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net> <432E880F.20708@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <20050919113708.GA28551@kestrel>

On Mon, Sep 19, 2005 at 09:42:39AM +0000, Martin Polehla wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Maty?? Prokop wrote:
> 
> > Takze uz sem prisel v cem byl problem.Pripajel jsem stineni u koaxu
> > na RX modulu na druhou stranu namotane cifky nez se melo;)Omlouvam
> > se ze sem nejdriv ptal a pak se teprv kontroloval.Jinak se mi ale
> > moc nezda dosah.Vic jak 60 cm s min. PL neudelam.Cetl sem nekde ze
> > by mela mit dosah vice jak 80 cm bez optiky.Nepise se ale s jakymi
> > LEDkami.Ja mam LED koupene z GM (L-TLWR7600) tim padem slabsi nez
> > by meli byt.Jaky by mohl by teoreticky dosah s optikou za pouziti
> > tehlech LED?Je vubec spravny takhle maly dosah?

Fixed.

CL<


From buh at bubakov.net  Mon Sep 19 13:48:16 2005
From: buh at bubakov.net (=?ISO-8859-2?Q?Maty=E1=B9_Prokop?=)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 14:48:16 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432E880F.20708@katka.biz>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net>	<432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>	<432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>	<20050918181819.GC8841@kestrel.twibright.com>	<432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net>
	<432E880F.20708@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <432EB390.9040908@bubakov.net>

Martin Polehla napsal(a):

>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
>Hash: SHA1
>
>Maty?? Prokop wrote:
>
>  
>
>>Takze uz sem prisel v cem byl problem.Pripajel jsem stineni u koaxu
>>na RX modulu na druhou stranu namotane cifky nez se melo;)Omlouvam
>>se ze sem nejdriv ptal a pak se teprv kontroloval.Jinak se mi ale
>>moc nezda dosah.Vic jak 60 cm s min. PL neudelam.Cetl sem nekde ze
>>by mela mit dosah vice jak 80 cm bez optiky.Nepise se ale s jakymi
>>LEDkami.Ja mam LED koupene z GM (L-TLWR7600) tim padem slabsi nez
>>by meli byt.Jaky by mohl by teoreticky dosah s optikou za pouziti
>>tehlech LED?Je vubec spravny takhle maly dosah?
>>
>>Zatim diky za odpovedi.
>>
>>_______________________________________________ Ronja mailing list
>>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>>
>>    
>>
>TLWR co davaj v GM jako nahrady za HPWT xx00 jsou naprosto
>nevyhovujci, sezen si ty spravny. Znam spoustu lidi co se na to
>nechali v GMku takhle nachytat (i ja jich mam par doma) a pak resili
>proc jim to nejede aspno na metr. Imho by na webu melo byt specialne
>upozorneni ze tyhle led maji nizky dosah (pokud to tam uz nejni).
>
>p0l0us
>-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
>Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
>Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org
>
>iD8DBQFDLogPYo9JRD7EbFIRApYhAJ9CmoQ8Yvd829DOGdnoePyGTaq3lgCfdMJg
>64DhaWXuwZHnQ9pLuo2lM74=
>=mHMh
>-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Ronja mailing list
>Ronja at lists.pointless.net
>http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
>  
>
Super.Diky vsem za odpovedi.Ted uz posledni otazka:)Kde bych mohl sehnat 
ty optimalni LEDky?Mam dojem ze v zadnym obchode je nemaji tudiz nemohl 
by nekdo postradat 2 LEDky?Nebo me na nekoho odkazat?

Diky.


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 19 14:50:39 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 15:50:39 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432EB390.9040908@bubakov.net>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net> <432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>
	<432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>
	<20050918181819.GC8841@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net> <432E880F.20708@katka.biz>
	<432EB390.9040908@bubakov.net>
Message-ID: <20050919135039.GA18406@kestrel>

> Super.Diky vsem za odpovedi.Ted uz posledni otazka:)Kde bych mohl sehnat 
> ty optimalni LEDky?Mam dojem ze v zadnym obchode je nemaji tudiz nemohl 
> by nekdo postradat 2 LEDky?Nebo me na nekoho odkazat?

http://ronja.twibright.com
posess a working Ronja
Buy Components
GettingRonjaElectronics
LEDs/LEDky

CL<


From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Mon Sep 19 19:53:03 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 20:53:03 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Mala rychlost
In-Reply-To: <432E880F.20708@katka.biz>
References: <432D8716.5010009@bubakov.net> <432DA61E.1030709@katka.biz>
	<432D8B82.4020009@bubakov.net>
	<20050918181819.GC8841@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<432DF235.9090207@bubakov.net> <432E880F.20708@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <1127155983.432f090ff0cff@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

> 
> > Takze uz sem prisel v cem byl problem.Pripajel jsem stineni u koaxu
> > na RX modulu na druhou stranu namotane cifky nez se melo;)Omlouvam
> > se ze sem nejdriv ptal a pak se teprv kontroloval.Jinak se mi ale
> > moc nezda dosah.Vic jak 60 cm s min. PL neudelam.Cetl sem nekde ze
> > by mela mit dosah vice jak 80 cm bez optiky.Nepise se ale s jakymi
> > LEDkami.Ja mam LED koupene z GM (L-TLWR7600) tim padem slabsi nez
> > by meli byt.Jaky by mohl by teoreticky dosah s optikou za pouziti
> > tehlech LED?Je vubec spravny takhle maly dosah?
> >
> > Zatim diky za odpovedi.
> >
> > _______________________________________________ Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> >
> TLWR co davaj v GM jako nahrady za HPWT xx00 jsou naprosto
> nevyhovujci, sezen si ty spravny. Znam spoustu lidi co se na to
> nechali v GMku takhle nachytat (i ja jich mam par doma) a pak resili
> proc jim to nejede aspno na metr. Imho by na webu melo byt specialne
> upozorneni ze tyhle led maji nizky dosah (pokud to tam uz nejni).
> 
> p0l0us

S TLWR7600 to jede bez optiky tak na 120cm a vic. Jestli to jede na min nez
metr, tak mas neco spatne v RX. To by na RSSI melo ukazovat 20-30mV kdyz to
zacne packetlosit.
Nekde jsem mel graf, jak si ta TLWR vede proti HPWT, zkusim se po nem podivat.
Realne v terenu jsme meli spoj s 65mm cockama a TLWR7600 na 250m a jelo to
docela v pohode.

Petr


From strohel at hotmail.com  Mon Sep 19 19:59:54 2005
From: strohel at hotmail.com (Matej Laitl)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 20:59:54 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Little bug in guide, aggregated mechanics partlist
Message-ID: <BAY18-DAV104A3E0C5358D6570B55CFB4920@phx.gbl>

Hi folks (despite this is intended mainly for Clock - or somebody else who
is allowed edit the guide),
I've found 2 possible little and minor bugs in Ronja building guide:

1.
page: http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/material.php
section Electronics
part "2pcs. cable bushing 6mm inner dia [ (only for airwire)]" is listed
twice.

2.
page: http://ronja.twibright.com/console/chimney/material.php
section Nuts and bolts
part "2pcs. thread bar M10, galvanized [...]" is listed twice.

Also, I've been doing aggregated Tetrapolis mechanics partlist (in M$ Excel,
but I can export it to an open format), and as i buy the parts I fill in the
prices. So when i'm finished, i can post it - IMHO it could make getting
parts easier. (Just a note: I'm from CZ, Prague, so the prices are in CZK
and parts are buyed in Czechia)

Matej Laitl alias strohel.


From anmic at fmg.sk  Mon Sep 19 18:51:45 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Mon, 19 Sep 2005 19:51:45 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
References: <20050913072102.GE21474@kestrel><004201c5b87f$7d7823b0$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050919084756.GA22820@kestrel>
Message-ID: <001a01c5bd53$e4530b30$0101a8c0@anmic>


> On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 06:17:58PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> >
> > > yes - and do you have RX or TX on unofficial PCB's?
> > > Can you send pictures of the connectorings?
> > >
> >
> > our ronja is built according the guide => rx+tx airwire on the both
sides,
> > using wire nuts for connectig coax
>
> I am currently building an RX and when I finish it I'll connect it to
> oscilloscope and look if it's emanating any radiation. I have put into
> my Ronja buglist. I'll also look at the TX.
>
> Can you send photos of your electrical construction please?
>

The photos are available at
http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/01.jpg
http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/02.jpg
http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/03.jpg
http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/04.jpg

I cannot send better photos, because the modules are already mounted in the
heads and sealed with silicone.

It's my first experience with Ronja, so there could be a mistake or some
imprecision in my construction. I was wondering if you could have a look at
it and tell me if there is something wrong in the construction.

anMic

> CL<



From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 20 10:10:44 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 11:10:44 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Soldering tool recommended for Ronja
Message-ID: <20050920091044.GA4457@kestrel>

Hello

I have just received a 125W soldering gun ETP 5-S from Pavel Krejci
(thanks) and tested it and it solders well - lead-free solders melts in
1 second after pressing the button in cold state.

I think this can be recommended soldering tool for Ronja. It can be
ordered from webshop of GES Electronics Prague on
http://www.ges.cz/english/index-a.htm Put "etp 5" into search, the
product name is and art nr. 077 131 72. Costs only 16 EUR incl. VAT.
This tool allows both SMD and shielding boxes to be soldered quickly.
The tip is fine (1.5mm dia.) wire which fits even into the most
difficult airwire construction.

It's for 230V 50Hz and has 2-pole connector which fits also into
German, Swiss and other round-contact sockets. It's specially designed
for lead-free solders (which are modern trend and have higher melt
temperature).

Just be careful with Q101 in receiver every soldering gun generates
electromagnetic discharge when being switched on and off - see 
Fundamentals of manufacturing operations for more details.


From polous at katka.biz  Tue Sep 20 12:46:42 2005
From: polous at katka.biz (Martin Polehla)
Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 11:46:42 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] Soldering tool recommended for Ronja
In-Reply-To: <20050920091044.GA4457@kestrel>
References: <20050920091044.GA4457@kestrel>
Message-ID: <432FF6A2.5040302@katka.biz>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Karel Kulhavy wrote:

> Hello
>
> I have just received a 125W soldering gun ETP 5-S from Pavel Krejci
> (thanks) and tested it and it solders well - lead-free solders
> melts in 1 second after pressing the button in cold state.
>
> I think this can be recommended soldering tool for Ronja. It can be
> ordered from webshop of GES Electronics Prague on
> http://www.ges.cz/english/index-a.htm Put "etp 5" into search, the
> product name is and art nr. 077 131 72. Costs only 16 EUR incl.
> VAT. This tool allows both SMD and shielding boxes to be soldered
> quickly. The tip is fine (1.5mm dia.) wire which fits even into the
> most difficult airwire construction.
>
> It's for 230V 50Hz and has 2-pole connector which fits also into
> German, Swiss and other round-contact sockets. It's specially
> designed for lead-free solders (which are modern trend and have
> higher melt temperature).
>
> Just be careful with Q101 in receiver every soldering gun generates
> electromagnetic discharge when being switched on and off - see
> Fundamentals of manufacturing operations for more details.
>
> _______________________________________________ Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>
I recommend to use *SLP-LL and ** SLP-MH** (search SLP) *solder loops
for this tool from same the shop.

p0l0us
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Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iD8DBQFDL/ahYo9JRD7EbFIRAgqtAKCln+5dcJIfdn5/Xvj3aNmqXBpRDgCfSBzn
/x5HQbfuxE70FwtMLwu9bPE=
=AvHF
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From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 20 16:50:38 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 17:50:38 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] PCB inductor
In-Reply-To: <1127223530.433010eae90ae@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <1127223530.433010eae90ae@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050920155038.GC31116@kestrel>

On Tue, Sep 20, 2005 at 03:38:50PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Zdar,
> v priloze je vypocet indukcnosti na PCB, co jsem daval odkaz do konference.
> V nedeli se me ho asi nepodarilo odeslat, tak to zkousim jeste jednou.

Is the meandre inductor having bigger or smaller inductance than a
classical spiral inductor of the same area and wire and space thickness?

Why was meandre inductor and not spiral one used? Because meandre
inductor's field decays much quicker with distance than spiral
inductor's one?

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 20 16:56:05 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 17:56:05 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Soldering tool recommended for Ronja
In-Reply-To: <432FF6A2.5040302@katka.biz>
References: <20050920091044.GA4457@kestrel> <432FF6A2.5040302@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <20050920155604.GD31116@kestrel>

On Tue, Sep 20, 2005 at 11:46:42AM +0000, Martin Polehla wrote:

> Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> 
> > Hello
> >
> > I have just received a 125W soldering gun ETP 5-S from Pavel Krejci
> > (thanks) and tested it and it solders well - lead-free solders
> > melts in 1 second after pressing the button in cold state.
> >
> I recommend to use *SLP-LL and ** SLP-MH** (search SLP) *solder loops
> for this tool from same the shop.

I have been using ordinary 1.5mm^2 copper wire for solder loops for long
time.  You can obtain it insulated for almost nothing at electrician.

CL<


From marcin.izo at gmail.com  Wed Sep 21 01:00:17 2005
From: marcin.izo at gmail.com (izo)
Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 20:00:17 -0400
Subject: [Ronja] TX & RX distance separation
Message-ID: <c5db698b05092017004a787cd7@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,
Is there a need to separate in distance TX from RX tubes ?
woudn't it be easier to have it in a single box 

here is an picture of commercial laser 100Mbps solution 
http://www.itshop.pl/photo/thumb1_LaczeLaser.jpg

they have a single box solution

regards
m.;


From marcin.izo at gmail.com  Wed Sep 21 01:15:24 2005
From: marcin.izo at gmail.com (izo)
Date: Tue, 20 Sep 2005 20:15:24 -0400
Subject: [Ronja] 130 mm lenses "fang da jing" :)
In-Reply-To: <20050912183336.GC13855@kestrel>
References: <4325AA86.5040903@freemail.hu> <20050912183336.GC13855@kestrel>
Message-ID: <c5db698b050920171547e2fa27@mail.gmail.com>

> > My problem is, that glasses in this size get horribly expensive if they
> > are really good.

how about those 
http://www.anchoroptics.com/


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 21 11:32:52 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 12:32:52 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Bushnell Holosight
Message-ID: <20050921103252.GA12829@kestrel>

Has anyone experience with this (expensive) holographic rifle sight?
That might be good for very easy alignment of Ronja :)

http://www.opticsplanet.net/bushnell-holosight.html#

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 21 11:49:29 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 12:49:29 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] 130 mm lenses "fang da jing" :)
In-Reply-To: <c5db698b050920171547e2fa27@mail.gmail.com>
References: <4325AA86.5040903@freemail.hu> <20050912183336.GC13855@kestrel>
	<c5db698b050920171547e2fa27@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050921104929.GA12866@kestrel>

On Tue, Sep 20, 2005 at 08:15:24PM -0400, izo wrote:
> > > My problem is, that glasses in this size get horribly expensive if they
> > > are really good.
> 
> how about those 
> http://www.anchoroptics.com/

Looks good, 130mm for 15USD and 100mm for 6USD.
Could you please add the link (direct links to webshop entries if
possible) to Ronja wiki, in the section on getting the hardware
components?

CL<
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From marcin.izo at gmail.com  Wed Sep 21 16:16:09 2005
From: marcin.izo at gmail.com (izo)
Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 11:16:09 -0400
Subject: [Ronja] Enclousure/Housing idea - cheap - good ?
Message-ID: <c5db698b05092108166e5d83b1@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,
I just realized that there might be pretty good option for external
enclousure housing for ronja.

Ready to use with lots of lots of options:
- external mouting brackets
- sun shields
- heaters/blowers
etc

Its outdoor housing that is used for CCTV cameras and some of them are
pretty cheap like 30-40 US$.
many different shapes and sizes available and you could adjust focal lenght.


The only thing is most of them have square shape
so the question is would that affect performance ?

regards
m.


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 21 18:25:13 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 19:25:13 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] [ox-en] more on RepRap
In-Reply-To: <opsr1gp0vzbhruzu@host80-47.pool80181.interbusiness.it>
References: <4c4a759468eeb06f76a025f8ee4ff6ce@xs4all.nl>
	<opsr1gp0vzbhruzu@host80-47.pool80181.interbusiness.it>
Message-ID: <20050921172513.GA26223@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Wed, Jun 08, 2005 at 08:38:14AM +0200, magius wrote:
> http://www.blog.speculist.com/archives/000293.html
> http://www.blog.speculist.com/archives/000262.html

I have seen the pictures.

Hmm I want to see how the machine replicates is DC motor and
PVC-insulated wires. Does it include furnace that melts copper at 950
degC, draw it into wires and chemical factory to manufacture PVC
insulation?

Funny plastic gadget replicator alone is pretty useless. What we need is
a universal machine
- machine that is capable to produce any machine (including itself).

> Imho we have to try a way to fund Dr. Bowyer RepRap: ideas?

Hmm I would be delighted if someone funded me so I could work fulltime
on free technology and add a project of universal CNC machine to list of
Twibright Labs projects:

http://twibright.com

Serious replication will be a work full of heavy drilling, precision
mechanics, oil, dirt, lenghty microprocessor programming, feddback loop
systems tuning and generally advanced development in free technology,
not this satisfy-university-diploma-thesis-writers plastic gadget.

Look what free technology involves:
http://ronja.twibright.com/schematics/
http://ronja.twibright.com/drawings/
http://ronja.twibright.com/3d
http://ronja.twibright.com/changelog.php

(my optical datalink project http://ronja.twibright.com on which I am
working in spare time already for 7 years)

Just the source tree is 250MB of data... Ahd that's one primitive stupid
non-replicating optical datalink, which has just 102 registered
installations:
http://ronja.twibright.com/installations.php

If you want something that's really useful for society that must not
have 102 but 1 million of installations... Imagine the work necessary to
make all this work for every inidividual user, portably, hunting down
all the bugs...

Anyway people will develop a replicator even without any funding,
funding will just affect how soon.

CL<
> 
> I dont want to wait 4 years as he predicted for the end of the project ;)  
> Let's abolish the economy as science of scarcity..through money!
> 
> magius
> _________________________________
> Web-Site: http://www.oekonux.org/
> Organization: http://www.oekonux.de/projekt/
> Contact: projekt at oekonux.de


From polous at katka.biz  Wed Sep 21 22:12:24 2005
From: polous at katka.biz (Martin Polehla)
Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 21:12:24 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] [ox-en] more on RepRap -- Twibright dead link
In-Reply-To: <20050921172513.GA26223@kestrel.twibright.com>
References: <4c4a759468eeb06f76a025f8ee4ff6ce@xs4all.nl>	<opsr1gp0vzbhruzu@host80-47.pool80181.interbusiness.it>
	<20050921172513.GA26223@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <4331CCB8.5060100@katka.biz>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Karel Kulhavy wrote:
.....

> Twibright Labs projects:
>
> http://twibright.com

.....

I opened link Twibike
<http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/%7Eclock/twibright/bikelight/index.html>
| bike lighting system
<http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/%7Eclock/twibright/bikelight/index.html>
on http://twibright.com/products.php, but
"http://twibright.com/bikelight/index.html" file was not found on server.

p0l0us
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iD8DBQFDMcy4Yo9JRD7EbFIRAgLUAKCemX3nO/PM52NyKRHxcY6MwQieSACgnYs7
l7zeD3yj04LGaTeExb++Biw=
=bU1P
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----



From jbohac at jikos.cz  Wed Sep 21 22:14:15 2005
From: jbohac at jikos.cz (Jirka Bohac)
Date: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 23:14:15 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] link colour on ronja homepage
Message-ID: <20050921211415.GC15190@twin.jikos.cz>

Hi,

I noticed that all the links on the ronja homepage are black on black
when the mouse is placed over them.

Is this intentional? Not really readable ;-)

Regards,

Jirka


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 22 15:23:06 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 16:23:06 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] link colour on ronja homepage
In-Reply-To: <20050921211415.GC15190@twin.jikos.cz>
References: <20050921211415.GC15190@twin.jikos.cz>
Message-ID: <20050922142306.GA12499@kestrel>

On Wed, Sep 21, 2005 at 11:14:15PM +0200, Jirka Bohac wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> I noticed that all the links on the ronja homepage are black on black
> when the mouse is placed over them.

I forwarded that to Lucas...

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 22 15:24:47 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 16:24:47 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] [ox-en] more on RepRap -- Twibright dead link
In-Reply-To: <4331CCB8.5060100@katka.biz>
References: <4c4a759468eeb06f76a025f8ee4ff6ce@xs4all.nl>
	<opsr1gp0vzbhruzu@host80-47.pool80181.interbusiness.it>
	<20050921172513.GA26223@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<4331CCB8.5060100@katka.biz>
Message-ID: <20050922142447.GB12499@kestrel>

On Wed, Sep 21, 2005 at 09:12:24PM +0000, Martin Polehla wrote:
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA1
> 
> Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> .....
> 
> > Twibright Labs projects:
> >
> > http://twibright.com
> 
> .....
> 
> I opened link Twibike
> <http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/%7Eclock/twibright/bikelight/index.html>
> | bike lighting system
> <http://atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz/%7Eclock/twibright/bikelight/index.html>
> on http://twibright.com/products.php, but
> "http://twibright.com/bikelight/index.html" file was not found on server.

Thanks - put into buglist.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 22 15:26:15 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 16:26:15 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] TX & RX distance separation
In-Reply-To: <c5db698b05092017004a787cd7@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c5db698b05092017004a787cd7@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050922142615.GC12499@kestrel>

On Tue, Sep 20, 2005 at 08:00:17PM -0400, izo wrote:
> Hi,
> Is there a need to separate in distance TX from RX tubes ?

Yes, if you want to install Ronja in confined space or want to do
non-fullduplex topology.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 22 16:37:01 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 17:37:01 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Twister Documentation
In-Reply-To: <d19022fb05092101043ac36fef@mail.gmail.com>
References: <d19022fb05092101043ac36fef@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050922153701.GA13030@kestrel>

On Wed, Sep 21, 2005 at 11:04:40AM +0300, Daudi Morris S wrote:
> Hallo,
> 
> Am an undergraduate engineering student (electrical and communications
> engineering) currently in my final year. I wish to carry out the
> documentation of the twister module for my final year project.
> 
> I kindly request for any documentation/links that have facilitated the
> creation of this module. I find it very innovative hence my querry. I
> have not yet even fully understood it basing my research on it's
> circutry. I will hence be very greatfull for any assistance.

I did some remark by pencil on paper, but they are incomprehensible
after the time even to me. Usual temporary calculations of timing etc.

There is nothing special on Twister. It just implements IEEE 802.3.
If you need to know the timing requirements look into IEEE 802.3

Next time I develop something I'll try to make the notes so it can be
publishable later.

If you have some specific questions ask them I'll answer them when I
have time here:
http://ronja.twibright.com/how.php

If you would like to carry the documentation in a way it could be then
put on Ronja website, please do it in a way compatible with Ronja
website,
http://ronja.twibright.com/editing.php

CL<

> 
> Yours,
> 
> Daudi S. (Kenya)


From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Thu Sep 22 20:00:04 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Thu, 22 Sep 2005 21:00:04 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [Ronja] link colour on ronja homepage
References: <20050921211415.GC15190@twin.jikos.cz>
Message-ID: <13615.1127415604@www6.gmx.net>

Hi,
Sorry this shouldn't be. I am responsible for new design. I will fix it as
soon as possible.

thanks for reporting bug
lucas

> --- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht ---
> Von: Jirka Bohac <jbohac at jikos.cz>
> An: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> Betreff: [Ronja] link colour on ronja homepage
> Datum: Wed, 21 Sep 2005 23:14:15 +0200
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I noticed that all the links on the ronja homepage are black on black
> when the mouse is placed over them.
> 
> Is this intentional? Not really readable ;-)
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Jirka
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 

-- 
GMX DSL = Maximale Leistung zum minimalen Preis!
2000 MB nur 2,99, Flatrate ab 4,99 Euro/Monat: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/dsl


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep 23 14:17:51 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 15:17:51 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] about my final project
In-Reply-To: <353aafeb050909074539f4ad18@mail.gmail.com>
References: <353aafeb05081708375c21ec2@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050819095313.GA11640@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<353aafeb0508210400563ff6bb@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050822090340.GA1891@kestrel>
	<353aafeb05082702013bee6e32@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050827160133.GA13926@kestrel>
	<353aafeb05090206065c8183be@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050902160854.GA31802@kestrel>
	<353aafeb05090801471c88dc8d@mail.gmail.com>
	<353aafeb050909074539f4ad18@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050923131751.GB22706@kestrel>

On Fri, Sep 09, 2005 at 09:45:20AM -0500, vipul kalia wrote:
> hi karel how are you well you did not reply my mail well
> tell how to connect AUI and computer lan card well in 
> circuit diagram of AUI ,I could not locate the input form the computer lan 
> card to the AUI .well we are waiting for your mail.

I replied, I told you to join IRC channel #ronja on freenode IRC network
instead of ICQ or jabber.

The AUI connector is on top right corner of the schematic.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep 23 17:38:58 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 18:38:58 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] about my final project
In-Reply-To: <353aafeb05092307504c460030@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20050822090340.GA1891@kestrel>
	<353aafeb05082702013bee6e32@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050827160133.GA13926@kestrel>
	<353aafeb05090206065c8183be@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050902160854.GA31802@kestrel>
	<353aafeb05090801471c88dc8d@mail.gmail.com>
	<353aafeb050909074539f4ad18@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050923131751.GB22706@kestrel>
	<353aafeb050923071126f10431@mail.gmail.com>
	<353aafeb05092307504c460030@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050923163858.GB11920@kestrel>

On Fri, Sep 23, 2005 at 08:20:55PM +0530, vipul kalia wrote:
> hi karel well tell me in india the is quite bright compared with other

What is quite bright compared with other countries? Day cannot be more
bright than in other countries. If night is brighter than it doesn't
matter.

> countries will this affect the performance of ronja .well i saw the new look
> of ronja webpage it rocks well when are you going to release the pcb layout
> for reciever section well thanks for mailing me back . looking forward for

Official PCB layout for receiver currently doesn't exist but is being
(slowly) worked on.

CL<

> your reply .
>  thank you
> vipul
>  On 9/23/05, vipul kalia <vipulkalia at gmail.com> wrote:
> >


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 25 09:51:47 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 10:51:47 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] about my final project
In-Reply-To: <353aafeb050924091752fb2905@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20050827160133.GA13926@kestrel>
	<353aafeb05090206065c8183be@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050902160854.GA31802@kestrel>
	<353aafeb05090801471c88dc8d@mail.gmail.com>
	<353aafeb050909074539f4ad18@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050923131751.GB22706@kestrel>
	<353aafeb050923071126f10431@mail.gmail.com>
	<353aafeb05092307504c460030@mail.gmail.com>
	<20050923163858.GB11920@kestrel>
	<353aafeb050924091752fb2905@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20050925085147.GA9927@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sat, Sep 24, 2005 at 09:47:19PM +0530, vipul kalia wrote:
> does ronja work in daylight .if yes then the sunlight may have an effect on
> it tell me this

Yes works. Sunlight doesn't have effect on Ronja (unless sun is in the
line of the link, when Ronja dropouts, but this happens very rarely).

CL<


From ladmanj at volny.cz  Sun Sep 25 10:41:28 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 11:41:28 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] www nejedou
Message-ID: <200509251141.28703.ladmanj@volny.cz>

http://ronja.twibright.com z neznamych duvodu nefunguje.
Jakub


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 25 11:49:42 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 12:49:42 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Dribble in Spider
In-Reply-To: <200509251104.00567.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <20050906111411.GA21704@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<200509061503.11352.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<20050915065211.GG29480@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<200509251104.00567.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <20050925104942.GA11035@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Sep 25, 2005 at 11:04:00AM +0200, Jakub Ladman wrote:
> 
> > Bud sis mel precist IEEE 802.3, a nebo to zkopirovat z Twistera jak to je a
> > nevymejslet si ;-)
> Neser me, co tam mohlo zustat z twistera tam zustalo, akorat jsem musel 
> analogove derivatory nahradit digitalnimi a mozna tam je nejaky renonc v 
> dylce nejakyho posuvnyho registru o jeden bit nebo tak nejak. 
> Vcera jsem se vratil z dovoleny, tak jestli to neud?lal mezit?m nikdo jinej, 

Someone else? Hahaha :) People even don't fix such trivial things like
adapting the oscillator footprint in PCB (which I already have in TODO
list) to accomodate both DIL-14 and DIL-8 oscillators and you would
expect them to hack into Verilog code? :)

Anyway I think some kind of TODO or bugfix list should be done on the
Wiki... I am writing it into my non-Wiki TODO list :)
(working on Ronja with almost zero time assigned is real fun ;-P )

> tak se to pokus?m ve zdroj?c?ch opravit.

That sounds good :) The analogue derivators are not critical IIRC, their
task is just to make short impulse on each particular edge.

I calculated the spread of the derivator time constant from datasheets
of various IC vendors (that was really horrible bureaucracy task) and
diode, resistor and capacitor manufacture and temperature spread, and
found out it will work with great margin. The derivators are even not
jitter-critical so if your digital derivators make short enough
impulses, that should be OK (what clock frequency do they work on?)

The result of the horrible bureaucracy is at
http://ronja.twibright.com/datasheets/surveys/hc_hct_spec_survey.sxc
(OpenOffice Calc format)

It would be nevertheless better to make the proof of BugFree(TM) again
for Spider, I wouldn't like to get into the same situation as
my "intuitively designed" AUI where people were experiencing packetloss
rarely because of glitches generated when the component tolerances went
too far away.

Don't forget that Twister/Spider must work not only against other Twisters,
but also against AUI Forte's, where the tolerances are far much more
lax, and possible also against not-much-deviant old AUI's (the AUI's
used to sometimes generate harmless glitches in the optical stream just
behind the packet because the 1MHz oscillator wasn't reset during packet
duration, I implemented resetting the oscillator in AUI Forte later so
the output is neater, maybe for cost of some extra components or wires
I think).

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 25 17:54:22 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 18:54:22 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] www nejedou
In-Reply-To: <200509251141.28703.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <200509251141.28703.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <20050925165422.GC13287@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Sep 25, 2005 at 11:41:28AM +0200, Jakub Ladman wrote:
> http://ronja.twibright.com z neznamych duvodu nefunguje.
> Jakub

I have registered two dropouts... First the HTTPd didn't respond to
request (but was accepting connections), I checked Slashdot but they
didn't write about Ronja, then probably Jezek restarted it, it went
OK, and then second similar dropout happened.

I don't know what it is. Probably Jezek is tuning something on other
webs hosted on that machine and something is wrong and trashes the
Apache.

Taking into account that this all is for free and with good service
(shell, huge space for galleries, reasonably updated system), it's still
excellent :)

CL<


From cd930 at centrum.cz  Sun Sep 25 17:58:33 2005
From: cd930 at centrum.cz (-=RYS=-)
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 18:58:33 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] HELP TWISTER
Message-ID: <200509251858.9172@centrum.cz>

Ahoj Karle,
"nakopni" me. Pred tydnem vse fachalo, jenze jsem si "skrtl" do zkratu.
Zapojeni:
PC (10/FD NIC) <UTP> TWISTER A?< 2 draty TX/RX > TWISTER B <UTP> managment switch (10/FD NIC)
Takze ted je to tak, ze kdyz zapnu elektriku do A i do B, tak na switchi i sitovce v PC
se rozsviti LED, ze je to spojene.
Ale kdyz si z PC pingam do switche, tak na sitovce PC to blika spravne v "rytmu" pingu, ale bohuzel na switchi naproti nic neblika.
Na vystupech TX z TWISTERu je nosna 1MHz v poradku, ale asi nelezou ven
data. Oscilator taky dava 16MHz.
Vim, ze ted postupne musim povymenovat vsechny svaby na TWISTERu (jeste ze
je mam v patici), ale nakopni me s kterejma mam nejdriv zacit. Ktere by mohli
odejit jako prvni.
Diky Martin


------------- dal?? ??st ---------------
HTML p??loha byla odstran?na...
URL: http://pointless.net/pipermail/ronja/attachments/20050925/42548ee4/attachment.html

From martin.stachon at tiscali.cz  Sun Sep 25 18:22:34 2005
From: martin.stachon at tiscali.cz (Martin Stachon)
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 19:22:34 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Web: black text on black bg
Message-ID: <4336DCDA.6030500@tiscali.cz>

Hello,
I noticed that on the official website, links under the mouse cursor are black 
on black background, which is quite unreadable IMO ;)
(at least with Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.10) Gecko/20050919 
Firefox/1.0.6)

How about this?

a:hover {
	background-color:#fff;
	color:#000;
}

Have a nice day,
	Martin



From petr.cipis at tiscali.cz  Sun Sep 25 18:30:13 2005
From: petr.cipis at tiscali.cz (Cipis)
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 19:30:13 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Web: black text on black bg
References: <4336DCDA.6030500@tiscali.cz>
Message-ID: <001001c5c1f6$c9e571a0$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>

Opera 8.02  (WinME) to sam? ...

Cipis


----- Original Message -----
From: "Martin Stachon" <martin.stachon at tiscali.cz>
To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2005 7:22 PM
Subject: [Ronja] Web: black text on black bg


> Hello,
> I noticed that on the official website, links under the mouse cursor are
black
> on black background, which is quite unreadable IMO ;)
> (at least with Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.10)
Gecko/20050919
> Firefox/1.0.6)
>
> How about this?
>
> a:hover {
> background-color:#fff;
> color:#000;
> }
>
> Have a nice day,
> Martin
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Sun Sep 25 18:39:27 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 19:39:27 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [Ronja] Web: black text on black bg
References: <4336DCDA.6030500@tiscali.cz>
Message-ID: <24007.1127669967@www23.gmx.net>

Hi.

I told clock already that he should change it, but he didn't change it by
now.

Lucas


> 
> Hello,
> I noticed that on the official website, links under the mouse cursor are
> black 
> on black background, which is quite unreadable IMO ;)
> (at least with Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.10)
> Gecko/20050919 
> Firefox/1.0.6)
> 
> How about this?
> 
> a:hover {
> 	background-color:#fff;
> 	color:#000;
> }
> 
> Have a nice day,
> 	Martin
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 

-- 
5 GB Mailbox, 50 FreeSMS http://www.gmx.net/de/go/promail
+++ GMX - die erste Adresse für Mail, Message, More +++


From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Sun Sep 25 21:47:06 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 22:47:06 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [Ronja] Web: black text on black bg
References: <001001c5c1f6$c9e571a0$4d46a8c0@cipis.net>
Message-ID: <32235.1127681226@www86.gmx.net>

Hi,

It isn't any browser specific bug. It is just defined wrong in CSS.


Lucas

> --- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht ---
> Von: "Cipis" <petr.cipis at tiscali.cz>
> An: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Betreff: Re: [Ronja] Web: black text on black bg
> Datum: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 19:30:13 +0200
> 
> Opera 8.02  (WinME) to sam? ...
> 
> Cipis
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Martin Stachon" <martin.stachon at tiscali.cz>
> To: <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Sent: Sunday, September 25, 2005 7:22 PM
> Subject: [Ronja] Web: black text on black bg
> 
> 
> > Hello,
> > I noticed that on the official website, links under the mouse cursor are
> black
> > on black background, which is quite unreadable IMO ;)
> > (at least with Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.10)
> Gecko/20050919
> > Firefox/1.0.6)
> >
> > How about this?
> >
> > a:hover {
> > background-color:#fff;
> > color:#000;
> > }
> >
> > Have a nice day,
> > Martin
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 

-- 
5 GB Mailbox, 50 FreeSMS http://www.gmx.net/de/go/promail
+++ GMX - die erste Adresse f?r Mail, Message, More +++


From krepa at seznam.cz  Sun Sep 25 21:48:50 2005
From: krepa at seznam.cz (Pavel Krejci)
Date: Sun, 25 Sep 2005 22:48:50 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] HELP TWISTER
In-Reply-To: <200509251858.9172@centrum.cz>
References: <200509251858.9172@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <43370D32.7050402@seznam.cz>

Cau,

opravoval jsem jeden Bozuv a odneslo to pomerne dost obvodu...
Nejlepe je mit osciloskop a jit po funkci obvodu.
jestli citaj citace, norujou norove a tak... myslim ze na jedno
preskrabnuti jsem to vyresil komplet. Ty to mas ujdednoduseny patici.

Taky si pamatuju, ze tam byl zvysenej odber proudu. Ale uz si nepamatuju
kteri to byly. Je to vic jak pulrok... Mozna Boza by si pamatoval.

Pavel Krejci

-=RYS=- wrote:
> Ahoj Karle,
> 
> "nakopni" me. Pred tydnem vse fachalo, jenze jsem si "skrtl" do zkratu.
> 
> Zapojeni:
> 
> PC (10/FD NIC) <UTP> TWISTER A < 2 draty TX/RX > TWISTER B <UTP> 
> managment switch (10/FD NIC)
> 
> Takze ted je to tak, ze kdyz zapnu elektriku do A i do B, tak na switchi 
> i sitovce v PC
> 
> se rozsviti LED, ze je to spojene.
> 
> Ale kdyz si z PC pingam do switche, tak na sitovce PC to blika spravne v 
> "rytmu" pingu, ale bohuzel na switchi naproti nic neblika.
> 
> Na vystupech TX z TWISTERu je nosna 1MHz v poradku, ale asi nelezou ven
> 
> data. Oscilator taky dava 16MHz.
> 
> Vim, ze ted postupne musim povymenovat vsechny svaby na TWISTERu (jeste ze
> 
> je mam v patici), ale nakopni me s kterejma mam nejdriv zacit. Ktere by 
> mohli
> 
> odejit jako prvni.
> 
> Diky Martin
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From clock at twibright.com  Sun Sep 25 23:09:03 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2005 00:09:03 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Web: black text on black bg
In-Reply-To: <4336DCDA.6030500@tiscali.cz>
References: <4336DCDA.6030500@tiscali.cz>
Message-ID: <20050925220903.GB14593@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Sun, Sep 25, 2005 at 07:22:34PM +0200, Martin Stachon wrote:
> Hello,
> I noticed that on the official website, links under the mouse cursor are black 
> on black background, which is quite unreadable IMO ;)
> (at least with Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.10) Gecko/20050919 
> Firefox/1.0.6)
> 
> How about this?
> 
> a:hover {
> 	background-color:#fff;
> 	color:#000;
> }

Thanks, fixed.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 26 07:36:11 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2005 08:36:11 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] HELP TWISTER
In-Reply-To: <200509251858.9172@centrum.cz>
References: <200509251858.9172@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <20050926063611.GA16139@kestrel>

On Sun, Sep 25, 2005 at 06:58:33PM +0200, -=RYS=- wrote:
> Ahoj Karle,
> "nakopni" me. Pred tydnem vse fachalo, jenze jsem si "skrtl" do zkratu.
> Zapojeni:

It's not clear to me what you short circuited with what.

CL<

> PC (10/FD NIC) <UTP> TWISTER A?< 2 draty TX/RX > TWISTER B <UTP> managment switch (10/FD NIC)
> Takze ted je to tak, ze kdyz zapnu elektriku do A i do B, tak na switchi i sitovce v PC
> se rozsviti LED, ze je to spojene.
> Ale kdyz si z PC pingam do switche, tak na sitovce PC to blika spravne v "rytmu" pingu, ale bohuzel na switchi naproti nic neblika.
> Na vystupech TX z TWISTERu je nosna 1MHz v poradku, ale asi nelezou ven
> data. Oscilator taky dava 16MHz.
> Vim, ze ted postupne musim povymenovat vsechny svaby na TWISTERu (jeste ze
> je mam v patici), ale nakopni me s kterejma mam nejdriv zacit. Ktere by mohli
> odejit jako prvni.
> Diky Martin
> 
> 

> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



From clock at twibright.com  Mon Sep 26 07:41:48 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2005 08:41:48 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
In-Reply-To: <001a01c5bd53$e4530b30$0101a8c0@anmic>
References: <20050919084756.GA22820@kestrel>
	<001a01c5bd53$e4530b30$0101a8c0@anmic>
Message-ID: <20050926064148.GB16153@kestrel>

On Mon, Sep 19, 2005 at 07:51:45PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> 
> > On Tue, Sep 13, 2005 at 06:17:58PM +0200, anMic wrote:
> > >
> > > > yes - and do you have RX or TX on unofficial PCB's?
> > > > Can you send pictures of the connectorings?
> > > >
> > >
> > > our ronja is built according the guide => rx+tx airwire on the both
> sides,
> > > using wire nuts for connectig coax
> >
> > I am currently building an RX and when I finish it I'll connect it to
> > oscilloscope and look if it's emanating any radiation. I have put into
> > my Ronja buglist. I'll also look at the TX.
> >
> > Can you send photos of your electrical construction please?
> >
> 
> The photos are available at
> http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/01.jpg
> http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/02.jpg
> http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/03.jpg
> http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/04.jpg

How can that work? G2 wire of Q101 is touching the metal box :)

Anyway it shouldn't have effect on electromagnetic compatibility. I'll
hook my newly soldered RX to oscilloscope and look if something nasty is
happening on the power wires.

CL<
> 
> I cannot send better photos, because the modules are already mounted in the
> heads and sealed with silicone.
> 
> It's my first experience with Ronja, so there could be a mistake or some
> imprecision in my construction. I was wondering if you could have a look at
> it and tell me if there is something wrong in the construction.
> 
> anMic
> 
> > CL<
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From cd930 at centrum.cz  Mon Sep 26 10:07:13 2005
From: cd930 at centrum.cz (-=RYS=-)
Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2005 11:07:13 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] HELP TWISTER
Message-ID: <200509261107.29659@centrum.cz>

Ale co, kupuji dnes v GME nove ic a ve stredu vse vymenim.
-=RYS=-

______________________________________________________________
> Od: clock at twibright.com
> Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> CC: 
> Datum: 26.09.2005 08:36
> P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] HELP TWISTER
>
> On Sun, Sep 25, 2005 at 06:58:33PM +0200, -=RYS=- wrote:
> > Ahoj Karle,
> > "nakopni" me. Pred tydnem vse fachalo, jenze jsem si "skrtl" do zkratu.
> > Zapojeni:
> 
> It's not clear to me what you short circuited with what.
> 
> CL<
> 
> > PC (10/FD NIC) TWISTER A?< 2 draty TX/RX > TWISTER B 
> managment switch (10/FD NIC)
> > Takze ted je to tak, ze kdyz zapnu elektriku do A i do B, tak na switchi
> i sitovce v PC
> > se rozsviti LED, ze je to spojene.
> > Ale kdyz si z PC pingam do switche, tak na sitovce PC to blika spravne v
> "rytmu" pingu, ale bohuzel na switchi naproti nic neblika.
> > Na vystupech TX z TWISTERu je nosna 1MHz v poradku, ale asi nelezou ven
> > data. Oscilator taky dava 16MHz.
> > Vim, ze ted postupne musim povymenovat vsechny svaby na TWISTERu (jeste
> ze
> > je mam v patici), ale nakopni me s kterejma mam nejdriv zacit. Ktere by
> mohli
> > odejit jako prvni.
> > Diky Martin
> > > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 


------------- dal?? ??st ---------------
HTML p??loha byla odstran?na...
URL: http://pointless.net/pipermail/ronja/attachments/20050926/f3eee228/attachment-0001.html

From anmic at fmg.sk  Mon Sep 26 18:40:38 2005
From: anmic at fmg.sk (anMic)
Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2005 19:40:38 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Ruseni TV - v praxi
References: <20050919084756.GA22820@kestrel><001a01c5bd53$e4530b30$0101a8c0@anmic>
	<20050926064148.GB16153@kestrel>
Message-ID: <000101c5c2c4$a082ea80$0101a8c0@anmic>

> > > > our ronja is built according the guide => rx+tx airwire on the both
> > sides,
> > > > using wire nuts for connectig coax
> > >
> > > I am currently building an RX and when I finish it I'll connect it to
> > > oscilloscope and look if it's emanating any radiation. I have put into
> > > my Ronja buglist. I'll also look at the TX.
> > >
> > > Can you send photos of your electrical construction please?
> > >
> >
> > The photos are available at
> > http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/01.jpg
> > http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/02.jpg
> > http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/03.jpg
> > http://ronja.ic.cz/rx-tx/04.jpg
>
> How can that work? G2 wire of Q101 is touching the metal box :)

I think the wire on G2 is soldered right but it's difficult to recognize it
from the picture.
I can tell you it is working normally and these modules are already parts of
the 250m-long track which goes well. I'm preparing pohotos of the
instalation and you will able to add it to the registered instalation list
soon.

anMic

>
> Anyway it shouldn't have effect on electromagnetic compatibility. I'll
> hook my newly soldered RX to oscilloscope and look if something nasty is
> happening on the power wires.
>
> CL<
> >



From ladmanj at volny.cz  Mon Sep 26 22:05:25 2005
From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman)
Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2005 23:05:25 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] PCB TX is online (without images)
In-Reply-To: <20050914191853.GA18709@kestrel>
References: <20050914191853.GA18709@kestrel>
Message-ID: <200509262305.26055.ladmanj@volny.cz>

Prvn? co m? napad? kdy? se te? kouk?m na TX na PCB:
V??ezy v ti???ku (v m?st? dr?tov?ch v?vod? a v m?st? stabiliz?toru), kter? 
jsou imho zbyte?n?, zbyte?n? prodra?? desku.

Jakub Ladman
On Wednesday 14 of September 2005 21:18, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> PCB TX is online. Without images. Please wait a while until I sort
> out and upload the images.
>
> Ti??????kov?? vys??la?? je online. Bez obr??zk??. Pros??m po??kejte trochu
> dokud nevyt????d??m a neuploaduju ty obr??zky.
>
> http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/pcb.php
> http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/building_pcb.php
> http://ronja.twibright.com/transmitter/
>
> CL<
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 27 09:18:29 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 10:18:29 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] PCB TX is online (without images)
In-Reply-To: <200509262305.26055.ladmanj@volny.cz>
References: <20050914191853.GA18709@kestrel>
	<200509262305.26055.ladmanj@volny.cz>
Message-ID: <20050927081829.GC11614@kestrel.twibright.com>

On Mon, Sep 26, 2005 at 11:05:25PM +0200, Jakub Ladman wrote:
> Prvn? co m? napad? kdy? se te? kouk?m na TX na PCB:
> V??ezy v ti???ku (v m?st? dr?tov?ch v?vod? a v m?st? stabiliz?toru), kter? 
> jsou imho zbyte?n?, zbyte?n? prodra?? desku.

I didn't notice any significant price increase because of the cutouts.

If you have idea how to design the mechanics without the cutouts
then do it please. I wouldn't make them if I found out how to do it
neatly without them.

CL<


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 27 12:19:56 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 13:19:56 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] GNU Arch is total crap
Message-ID: <20050927111956.GA20136@kestrel>

We found out with Lucas that GNU Arch is total crap.
We are getting message "Failed to access file '.archive-version'"
when calling tla tag command (which is command that works with
two different archives)
with tla 1.3.3 while I manually verified that the file
.archive-version is accessible and readable in both archives.

Further investigation on google found this post:
http://lists.penguinppc.org/yaboot-devel/2005/yaboot-devel-200505/msg00022.html

Which shows that GNU Arch is Total Crap (TM).

So now I know that both CVS (with which I worked before) and GNU Arch
are Total Crap (TM).

Does anyone know about some usable revision control to which Ronja
source tree could be moved and which supports
1) 250MB source trees
2) renaming of files
3) has smooth branching
4) archive formats don't change from version to version

?

CL<


From Seligr at sh.cvut.cz  Tue Sep 27 13:06:03 2005
From: Seligr at sh.cvut.cz (Seligr@sh.cvut.cz)
Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 14:06:03 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] PCB TX is online (without images)
In-Reply-To: <20050927081829.GC11614@kestrel.twibright.com>
References: <20050914191853.GA18709@kestrel>
	<200509262305.26055.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<20050927081829.GC11614@kestrel.twibright.com>
Message-ID: <1127822763.433935abf0a41@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>

Cituji z emailu od Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com>:

> On Mon, Sep 26, 2005 at 11:05:25PM +0200, Jakub Ladman wrote:
> > Prvn? co m? napad? kdy? se te? kouk?m na TX na PCB:
> > V??ezy v ti???ku (v m?st? dr?tov?ch v?vod? a v m?st? stabiliz?toru), kter?
> 
> > jsou imho zbyte?n?, zbyte?n? prodra?? desku.
> 
> I didn't notice any significant price increase because of the cutouts.
> 
> If you have idea how to design the mechanics without the cutouts
> then do it please. I wouldn't make them if I found out how to do it
> neatly without them.
> 
> CL<
> 

No, stabilizator by stacilo prisroubovat na pocinovany PCB pobliz okraje. Draty
pripajet na plosky bez der z jedne strany. A u LEDky by se taky neco vymyslelo.

Celkem vzato za tech 10,799.48 moc hubeny vysledek.

Petr


From strohel at hotmail.com  Tue Sep 27 15:04:07 2005
From: strohel at hotmail.com (Matej Laitl)
Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 16:04:07 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] GNU Arch is total crap
References: <20050927111956.GA20136@kestrel>
Message-ID: <BAY18-DAV6666DAF7B4EB45F006868B48A0@phx.gbl>

I think a subversion (aka SVN) would be a good replacement for CVS. See
http://subversion.tigris.org/faq.html#why

----- Original Message -----
From: "Karel Kulhavy" <clock at twibright.com>
To: "Twibright Ronja" <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 1:19 PM
Subject: [Ronja] GNU Arch is total crap


> We found out with Lucas that GNU Arch is total crap.
> We are getting message "Failed to access file '.archive-version'"
> when calling tla tag command (which is command that works with
> two different archives)
> with tla 1.3.3 while I manually verified that the file
> .archive-version is accessible and readable in both archives.
>
> Further investigation on google found this post:
>
http://lists.penguinppc.org/yaboot-devel/2005/yaboot-devel-200505/msg00022.h
tml
>
> Which shows that GNU Arch is Total Crap (TM).
>
> So now I know that both CVS (with which I worked before) and GNU Arch
> are Total Crap (TM).
>
> Does anyone know about some usable revision control to which Ronja
> source tree could be moved and which supports
> 1) 250MB source trees
> 2) renaming of files
> 3) has smooth branching
> 4) archive formats don't change from version to version
>
> ?
>
> CL<
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>


From matt at tmmz.net  Tue Sep 27 17:29:25 2005
From: matt at tmmz.net (Matthew Zahorik)
Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 12:29:25 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Ronja] GNU Arch is total crap
In-Reply-To: <20050927111956.GA20136@kestrel>
References: <20050927111956.GA20136@kestrel>
Message-ID: <Pine.BSF.4.61.0509271141490.20196@locke.tmmz.net>

On Tue, 27 Sep 2005, Karel Kulhavy wrote:

> Does anyone know about some usable revision control to which Ronja
> source tree could be moved and which supports

Many:

- Aegis.  It's a full software change management tool.  It's probably 
overkill, but take a look.

   http://aegis.sourceforge.net/

- Subversion (SVN).  Replacement for CVS.  Well liked.  Overcomes many of 
the limitations of CVS, but has some of the architectural baggage. 
Common server install requires Apache + WebDAV.

   http://subversion.tigris.org/

- Arch.  Well, you have opinions about that.

- Perforce.  Very powerful; from the commercial world; well liked there. 
Free for non-commercial use.  Will be unacceptable if you want pure open 
source tool.

   http://www.perforce.com/

I personally use subversion at home.  It works, and works well.  I don't 
make many demands of it, though.  I know it best, so I can answer your 
requirements relative to SVN.  But take a look at the others.

> 1) 250MB source trees

Sure.  There are two types of repositories in SVN; BDB and FSFS. 
BDB used to be the default, FSFS is the default now.  You'll need to 
decide which is better for you.

> 2) renaming of files

No rename, svn copy then svn delete

> 3) has smooth branching

Define smooth.  It's all depends on what you're used too.  SVN has decent, 
but not spectacular branching.  It's better than CVS IMHO.

> 4) archive formats don't change from version to version

SVN hasn't changed archive format since 1.0.  A simple svnadmin dump and 
load will allow you to upgrade if the archive does change.

- Matt

  "Argue with an idiot and he will drag you down to his level and
beat you with experience" - Dilbert


> 1) 250MB source trees
> 2) renaming of files
> 3) has smooth branching
> 4) archive formats don't change from version to version
>
> ?
>
> CL<
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>


From clock at twibright.com  Tue Sep 27 21:37:08 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 22:37:08 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] LOL Subversion+apache2+gentoo
Message-ID: <20050927203708.GA28257@kestrel>

net-www/apache-2 (is blocking dev-util/subversion-1.2.3)

Looks like Ronja won't be able to be developed on gentoo :)

What should I kick off from Ronja? :)

1) Apache
2) Subversion
3) gentoo

CL<


From polous at katka.biz  Wed Sep 28 00:35:00 2005
From: polous at katka.biz (Martin Polehla)
Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 23:35:00 +0000
Subject: [Ronja] LOL Subversion+apache2+gentoo
In-Reply-To: <20050927203708.GA28257@kestrel>
References: <20050927203708.GA28257@kestrel>
Message-ID: <4339D724.7030004@katka.biz>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Karel Kulhavy wrote:

> net-www/apache-2 (is blocking dev-util/subversion-1.2.3)
>
> Looks like Ronja won't be able to be developed on gentoo :)
>
> What should I kick off from Ronja? :)
>
> 1) Apache 2) Subversion 3) gentoo
>
> CL<
>
> _______________________________________________ Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>

4) Update apache and subversion to latest stable version

http://www.gentoo-portage.com/dev-util/subversion/dep

apache <http://www.gentoo-portage.com/net-www/apache>        >=2.0.54-r30
subversion  1.2.3-r1

p0l0us

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Thunderbird - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iD8DBQFDOdckYo9JRD7EbFIRAvtqAJ4nXaXNTLdg5HAVIm87wR6c/XjoGQCbBGGV
I1mTn+nPBLazuSpaVrj3HRk=
=nmAH
-----END PGP SIGNATURE-----



From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 28 11:00:49 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 12:00:49 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Price for Ronja CD-ROM and other items
Message-ID: <20050928100049.GA19309@kestrel>

Hello

We are thinking about putting Ronja CD into a webshop so people could
order it as a letter and they could use it if their Ronja breaks and
they don't have connectivity, or if their Internet connection is slow.

But it shows that burning CDs takes lots of human time and thus the
resulting CD would be expensive. I would like to know how much would you
be willing to pay for such a CD. 

According to the result we decide if it makes sense to put Ronja CD's
into a webshop at all.

Also we might put Ronja T-shirts into webshop. How much are you willing
to pay for Ronja T-shirt?

And what about a plastic bag with all electronic components necessary
to build Twister (and another bag for RX and another for TX)?

What about a bag for complete Tetrapolis?

This could save substantial time for the user because he doesn't have to
go around various shops and order, but at the same time it could be also
sometimes time-intensive to assemble, which could be a problem
increasing the price, especially in the beginning in small quantities.

CL<



From jbohac at jikos.cz  Wed Sep 28 11:07:23 2005
From: jbohac at jikos.cz (Jirka Bohac)
Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 12:07:23 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Price for Ronja CD-ROM and other items
In-Reply-To: <20050928100049.GA19309@kestrel>
References: <20050928100049.GA19309@kestrel>
Message-ID: <20050928100723.GA24836@twin.jikos.cz>

Hi,

> And what about a plastic bag with all electronic components necessary
> to build Twister (and another bag for RX and another for TX)?

I think this would be great.
Did you also consider selling machine-populated Twister and TX PCBs?
Does anyone have an idea on how much this machine population would cost?

Regards,

Jirka


From jojo at matfyz.cz  Wed Sep 28 11:23:19 2005
From: jojo at matfyz.cz (Marian Cerny)
Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 12:23:19 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Price for Ronja CD-ROM and other items
In-Reply-To: <20050928100049.GA19309@kestrel>
References: <20050928100049.GA19309@kestrel>
Message-ID: <20050928102319.GA7985@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz>

On 2005-09-28 12:00 +0200, Karel Kulhavy wrote:
> I would like to know how much would you be willing to pay for such a
> CD. 

Not a penny.

> Also we might put Ronja T-shirts into webshop. How much are you willing
> to pay for Ronja T-shirt?

Not a penny, too. :-)


If I had slow connection, I would download the site somewhere with
better connection and put it on CD by myself.

I wouldn't by a T-shirt I wouldn't wear. I would rather donate the
money... I'm going to give my second donation after I finish building
ronja... but don't expect that to be soon :-(.

> And what about a plastic bag with all electronic components necessary
> to build Twister (and another bag for RX and another for TX)?
> 
> What about a bag for complete Tetrapolis?

This bag idea sound much more interesting. I have not tried to buy
electronics yet (only have few parts), so I don't know how much
difficult is it to get it all. If it is difficult, I would be willing to
pay 10-15% more. (The last sentence might not be English :-))

-- 
Marian Cerny <jojo at matfyz.cz>
Jabber: jojo at njs.netlab.cz

[ UNIX is user friendly. It's just selective about who its friends are. ]


From shamanu8 at web.de  Wed Sep 28 14:24:45 2005
From: shamanu8 at web.de (shamanu8@web.de)
Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 15:24:45 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Price for Ronja CD-ROM and other items
In-Reply-To: <20050928100049.GA19309@kestrel>
References: <20050928100049.GA19309@kestrel>
Message-ID: <433A999D.2030901@web.de>


>And what about a plastic bag with all electronic components necessary
>to build Twister (and another bag for RX and another for TX)?
>
>What about a bag for complete Tetrapolis?
>
>  
>
This would be great.  Especial if the PCB's would be included too. (for 
the receiver?) 
May be even one version with the needed lenses? In some regions it's not 
easy to get them on a cheap way... 
For me a set with the named stuff for up to 30% more would be ok.


From clock at twibright.com  Wed Sep 28 14:55:33 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 15:55:33 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] PCB TX is online (without images)
In-Reply-To: <1127822763.433935abf0a41@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
References: <20050914191853.GA18709@kestrel>
	<200509262305.26055.ladmanj@volny.cz>
	<20050927081829.GC11614@kestrel.twibright.com>
	<1127822763.433935abf0a41@desitka.sh.cvut.cz>
Message-ID: <20050928135533.GA27706@kestrel>

On Tue, Sep 27, 2005 at 02:06:03PM +0200, Seligr at sh.cvut.cz wrote:
> Cituji z emailu od Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com>:
> 
> > On Mon, Sep 26, 2005 at 11:05:25PM +0200, Jakub Ladman wrote:
> > > Prvn? co m? napad? kdy? se te? kouk?m na TX na PCB:
> > > V??ezy v ti???ku (v m?st? dr?tov?ch v?vod? a v m?st?
> > > stabiliz?toru), kter?
> > 
> > > jsou imho zbyte?n?, zbyte?n? prodra?? desku.
> > 
> > I didn't notice any significant price increase because of the cutouts.
> > 
> > If you have idea how to design the mechanics without the cutouts
> > then do it please. I wouldn't make them if I found out how to do it
> > neatly without them.
> > 
> > CL<
> > 
> 
> No, stabilizator by stacilo prisroubovat na pocinovany PCB pobliz
> okraje. Draty

I don't think the thermal conductivitity of the 35um copper foil is
good enough. The regulator is dissipating quite some power.

I would like to use a switched regulator in subsequent designs to
get rid of this dissipation.

I have tested that Ronja works without problems even when it's painted
dark brown and in the sun in summer when it's 35degC in the shadow and
you cannot hold your hand on the pipe.

I would like this thermal compatibility to be maintained. If Ronja
spreads, someone from areas near equator will want to use it and
it will overheat. I don't want the regulator to activate thermal
shutdown just because we were lazy to give it robust cooling.

Moreover if someone has weak soldering iron he can't solder the whole
rim, just couple of points. In that case passing heat would work badly
too. This is otherwise safe because the two ground planes are shorted
along the rim consistently with a row of vias.

The LED simply doesn't fit there. It has to be in the middle. The
PCB position is determined by component sizes and necessary clearance
for the lid to not short out the pins if pressed externally.

So we have two cutouts. The third is just for convenience.

The soldering pads have intentionally 5 vias which hold the pad together
in case of overheating and peeling off the PCB. It's easy to overheat
because
1) If the wires break by frequent bending you have to change them
2) Often you use very thick wires which require lot of heat to heat up
and that thermally overheats the PCB during soldering
3) I hate all the crappy consumer electronics I had at home (walkmans,
radios etc.) where something always broke off because the PCB was
designed to be easily manufactured and wasn't designed to be robust.
I permanently had to resolder broken-out 3.5mm stereo jacks and other
connectors and cords.

> pripajet na plosky bez der z jedne strany. A u LEDky by se taky neco
> vymyslelo.

You see? You talk like if it could be done without the cutouts but
don't provide actual proposal how to do it. I don't believe you.

> 
> Celkem vzato za tech 10,799.48 moc hubeny vysledek.

You didn't pay anything. So you get it for 0.00 instead of 10,799.48.

If you don't like the style how Ronja is developed, you can go to
proprietary competition or start your own fork. That's why Ronja is free
- to give freedom to the users.

But I should warn you that in proprietary world you get for that price
one piece of device, while here you get one piece of design for that.

If you don't like the cutouts, it's a matter of 15 minutes to fire
up PCB and change it yourself. And then you can manufacture as many
pieces of changed design as you want.

CL<


From giuseppe at arachne.cz  Thu Sep 29 12:03:12 2005
From: giuseppe at arachne.cz (giuseppe@arachne.cz)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 13:03:12 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: [Ronja] Problemik....   :o)
Message-ID: <48680.212.24.150.227.1127991792.squirrel@ssl.arachne.cz>

Zdravim...
Potrebujem radu, lebo som uz z toho mojho problemiku docela nestastny....
Na zemi dosahujem o% paket los na vzdialenost 2,1 m    na strehe to mam na
vzdialenost 1,2 Km ...  po zamerani nameriam na oboch prijimacoch signal i
s rezervou....   jediny rozdiel je, ze twister mam umiestneny v hlavici
priamo za vysielacom, napajanie mam urobene po ethernete....  na jednej
strane je asi tak 5 m ethernetu a na druhej asi tak  12....    akurat
neviem, ci to nebola amaterska chyba, lebo jediny twister nemam v tienenej
krabicke.... teraz ako sa to sprava....   ked sa snazim na streche cez to
pretlacit nejaky paket, tak    na jednej strane krasne blika cervena ledka
na twisterovy, ze vysielac vysiela, na druhej strane to krasne zase blika
zelena ledka, ze prijimac volaco prijima...  aj opacne to tak je....  ale
sucastne sa anedozblikaju....    a paket sa proste ani za boha
nevrati.....    tak teraz neviem, ci ten twister tam chyta nejake rusenie,
alebo, ci tie dlhe ethernety to natolko mozu ovlivnit.....   na zemi som
to prave skusal i s dlhymi ethernetmi, tak som predpokladal ze to bude v
poho....   ak sa niekto s niecim takym uz stretol, tak prosim poradte.....
  este , na jednej strane je to v sietovke( dvojportovy intel a na druhej
strane som to strcil do switcha    skusali sme to zastrcit i do realteku,
ale stale sa to sprava stejne..

s pozdravom giuseppe....   ;)


From daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz  Thu Sep 29 16:49:28 2005
From: daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz (Daniel Strnad)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 15:49:28 -0000
Subject: [Ronja] Problemik....   :o)
In-Reply-To: <48680.212.24.150.227.1127991792.squirrel@ssl.arachne.cz>
References: <48680.212.24.150.227.1127991792.squirrel@ssl.arachne.cz>
Message-ID: <opsxvfkqton6qjls@daman>

Kdyz uz chces pouzivat dlouhy UTPcka tak tam musis dat TP trafko - nejlepe  
vypajet ho z nejake stare sitovky. Je to takovy ten cerny obdelnik  
zpravidla hned za RJ45 konektorem. Bez nej je to sazka do loterie a zalezi  
jen na tom jak to sitovka/switch zkousne. Ten switch do kteryho to mas  
pichly je managovatelny? Obe strany totiz musi byt nastaveny na FD.

On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 13:03:12 +0200 (CEST), <giuseppe at arachne.cz> wrote:

> Zdravim...
> Potrebujem radu, lebo som uz z toho mojho problemiku docela nestastny....
> Na zemi dosahujem o% paket los na vzdialenost 2,1 m    na strehe to mam  
> na
> vzdialenost 1,2 Km ...  po zamerani nameriam na oboch prijimacoch signal  
> i
> s rezervou....   jediny rozdiel je, ze twister mam umiestneny v hlavici
> priamo za vysielacom, napajanie mam urobene po ethernete....  na jednej
> strane je asi tak 5 m ethernetu a na druhej asi tak  12....    akurat
> neviem, ci to nebola amaterska chyba, lebo jediny twister nemam v  
> tienenej
> krabicke.... teraz ako sa to sprava....   ked sa snazim na streche cez to
> pretlacit nejaky paket, tak    na jednej strane krasne blika cervena  
> ledka
> na twisterovy, ze vysielac vysiela, na druhej strane to krasne zase blika
> zelena ledka, ze prijimac volaco prijima...  aj opacne to tak je....  ale
> sucastne sa anedozblikaju....    a paket sa proste ani za boha
> nevrati.....    tak teraz neviem, ci ten twister tam chyta nejake  
> rusenie,
> alebo, ci tie dlhe ethernety to natolko mozu ovlivnit.....   na zemi som
> to prave skusal i s dlhymi ethernetmi, tak som predpokladal ze to bude v
> poho....   ak sa niekto s niecim takym uz stretol, tak prosim  
> poradte.....
>   este , na jednej strane je to v sietovke( dvojportovy intel a na druhej
> strane som to strcil do switcha    skusali sme to zastrcit i do realteku,
> ale stale sa to sprava stejne..
>
> s pozdravom giuseppe....   ;)
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja



-- 
Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/


From cd930 at centrum.cz  Thu Sep 29 15:15:49 2005
From: cd930 at centrum.cz (-=RYS=-)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:15:49 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Problemik....   :o)
Message-ID: <200509291615.6854@centrum.cz>


> ked sa snazim na streche cez to
> pretlacit nejaky paket, tak na jednej strane krasne blika cervena ledka
> na twisterovy, ze vysielac vysiela, na druhej strane to krasne zase blika
> zelena ledka, ze prijimac volaco prijima... aj opacne to tak je.... ale
> sucastne sa anedozblikaju.... a paket sa proste ani za boha
> nevrati..... 
> s pozdravom giuseppe.... ;)

Tohle se mi stalo taky, problem byl v spatne zapojenem kabelu RJ45 , zkus si zkontrolovat jeste jednou.
Ja jsem si prohodil polarity diferencialnich signalu. Jakmile ti to alespon blika, tak je napul vyhrano.
-=RYS=-


------------- dal?? ??st ---------------
HTML p??loha byla odstran?na...
URL: http://pointless.net/pipermail/ronja/attachments/20050929/48db014c/attachment.html

From cd930 at centrum.cz  Thu Sep 29 15:12:46 2005
From: cd930 at centrum.cz (-=RYS=-)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:12:46 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Problemik....   :o)
Message-ID: <200509291612.6371@centrum.cz>

To ja mam vetsi srandu.
240 cm?? .... ping 32, 1450, 4096b v poradku
260 cm??? .... prochazi uz jen pin 32 a 1450b
270 cm ..... prochazi uz jen ping o velikosti 32b
A ted babo rad :)))
Alespon to jede na 240cm.
Jeste se v patek juknu na test pointy v RX, jinak na to ....... .


______________________________________________________________
> Od: giuseppe at arachne.cz
> Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> CC: 
> Datum: 29.09.2005 13:28
> P?edm?t: [Ronja] Problemik.... :o)
>
> Zdravim...
> Potrebujem radu, lebo som uz z toho mojho problemiku docela nestastny....
> Na zemi dosahujem o% paket los na vzdialenost 2,1 m na strehe to mam na
> vzdialenost 1,2 Km ... po zamerani nameriam na oboch prijimacoch signal i
> s rezervou.... jediny rozdiel je, ze twister mam umiestneny v hlavici
> priamo za vysielacom, napajanie mam urobene po ethernete.... na jednej
> strane je asi tak 5 m ethernetu a na druhej asi tak 12....
Ja to mam tak taky, 2 draty plus a 2 draty minus. Jeden UTP kabel 12m a druhej 50m a vse v pohode.
Na Twisteru je "prilepene" LAN trafo.
Mam to pichnute do managment switchu KTI (10/FD) a pri testu na 2 draty (TX/RX) naprosto v pohode.
RX a TX moduly jsem mel u Ondry Tesare na odzkouseni a co..... rikal 4m v pohode.
Jeste trochu podezrivam ten spinanej zdroj. Na RX je normalne?340mV, ale sotva sahnu na krabku rukou, tak najednou
170mV. Nekde blba zem nebo to "plave". Jak rikam, jeste si to prekontroluji.?
-=RYS=-
>?akurat
> neviem, ci to nebola amaterska chyba, lebo jediny twister nemam v tienenej
> krabicke.... teraz ako sa to sprava.... ked sa snazim na streche cez to
> pretlacit nejaky paket, tak na jednej strane krasne blika cervena ledka
> na twisterovy, ze vysielac vysiela, na druhej strane to krasne zase blika
> zelena ledka, ze prijimac volaco prijima... aj opacne to tak je.... ale
> sucastne sa anedozblikaju.... a paket sa proste ani za boha
> nevrati..... tak teraz neviem, ci ten twister tam chyta nejake rusenie,
> alebo, ci tie dlhe ethernety to natolko mozu ovlivnit..... na zemi som
> to prave skusal i s dlhymi ethernetmi, tak som predpokladal ze to bude v
> poho.... ak sa niekto s niecim takym uz stretol, tak prosim poradte.....
> este , na jednej strane je to v sietovke( dvojportovy intel a na druhej
> strane som to strcil do switcha skusali sme to zastrcit i do realteku,
> ale stale sa to sprava stejne..
> 
> s pozdravom giuseppe.... ;)
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 


------------- dal?? ??st ---------------
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URL: http://pointless.net/pipermail/ronja/attachments/20050929/fb9709ac/attachment.html

From daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz  Thu Sep 29 17:30:43 2005
From: daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz (Daniel Strnad)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:30:43 -0000
Subject: [Ronja] Problemik....   :o)
In-Reply-To: <200509291612.6371@centrum.cz>
References: <200509291612.6371@centrum.cz>
Message-ID: <opsxvhhhprn6qjls@daman>

> To ja mam vetsi srandu.
> 240 cm?? .... ping 32, 1450, 4096b v poradku
> 260 cm??? .... prochazi uz jen pin 32 a 1450b
> 270 cm ..... prochazi uz jen ping o velikosti 32b
> A ted babo rad :)))
> Alespon to jede na 240cm.
> Jeste se v patek juknu na test pointy v RX, jinak na to ....... .
A to se ti zda malo?? Ja bych byl za takovy vysledek rad. Ted jsem  
postavil 1 novy set(2x tx, 2x rx) a zatim to jede tak na 190cm. Vsechny  
obvykli veci co zhorsujou dosah mam osetreny - fotodioda zastrcena,  
kondiky maji co nejkratsi nozicky, odpory jsou poladeny, prepazky  
naletovany po celym obvodu, vsechna kabelaz kvalitne zapojena, testpointy  
sedej. Myslim ze je to OK, ne?


From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Thu Sep 29 17:10:10 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 18:10:10 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [Ronja] LOL Subversion+apache2+gentoo
References: <20050927203708.GA28257@kestrel>
Message-ID: <7640.1128010210@www9.gmx.net>

gentoo, get ubuntu !

> --- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht ---
> Von: Karel Kulhavy <clock at twibright.com>
> An: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Betreff: [Ronja] LOL Subversion+apache2+gentoo
> Datum: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 22:37:08 +0200
> 
> net-www/apache-2 (is blocking dev-util/subversion-1.2.3)
> 
> Looks like Ronja won't be able to be developed on gentoo :)
> 
> What should I kick off from Ronja? :)
> 
> 1) Apache
> 2) Subversion
> 3) gentoo
> 
> CL<
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 

-- 
GMX DSL = Maximale Leistung zum minimalen Preis!
2000 MB nur 2,99, Flatrate ab 4,99 Euro/Monat: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/dsl


From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Thu Sep 29 17:19:14 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 18:19:14 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [Ronja] Price for Ronja CD-ROM and other items
References: <20050928100723.GA24836@twin.jikos.cz>
Message-ID: <6710.1128010754@www9.gmx.net>

Hi,

It isn't possible by now to, because they aren't smd. but if there are
enough people who would buy it populated I could design board an get it
populated by some external company.

lucas

> --- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht ---
> Von: Jirka Bohac <jbohac at jikos.cz>
> An: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> Betreff: Re: [Ronja] Price for Ronja CD-ROM and other items
> Datum: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 12:07:23 +0200
> 
> Hi,
> 
> > And what about a plastic bag with all electronic components necessary
> > to build Twister (and another bag for RX and another for TX)?
> 
> I think this would be great.
> Did you also consider selling machine-populated Twister and TX PCBs?
> Does anyone have an idea on how much this machine population would cost?
> 
> Regards,
> 
> Jirka
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 

-- 
Lust, ein paar Euro nebenbei zu verdienen? Ohne Kosten, ohne Risiko!
Satte Provisionen f?r GMX Partner: http://www.gmx.net/de/go/partner


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 29 17:23:29 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 18:23:29 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Problemik....   :o)
In-Reply-To: <opsxvfkqton6qjls@daman>
References: <48680.212.24.150.227.1127991792.squirrel@ssl.arachne.cz>
	<opsxvfkqton6qjls@daman>
Message-ID: <20050929162329.GC19550@kestrel>

On Thu, Sep 29, 2005 at 03:49:28PM -0000, Daniel Strnad wrote:
> Kdyz uz chces pouzivat dlouhy UTPcka tak tam musis dat TP trafko - nejlepe  
> vypajet ho z nejake stare sitovky. Je to takovy ten cerny obdelnik  
> zpravidla hned za RJ45 konektorem. Bez nej je to sazka do loterie a zalezi  
> jen na tom jak to sitovka/switch zkousne. Ten switch do kteryho to mas  
> pichly je managovatelny? Obe strany totiz musi byt nastaveny na FD.

Vono je to sazka do loterie i bez toho - jednou sem koukal co z ty
sitovky leze kdyz se nezatizi tou induktivni zatezi toho trafka
a je to celkem taky hruzka - v jednom miste se to skoro dotyka
nuly, dela to zbytecny jitter par nanosekund.

Navrh Ethernetu je sracka, obzvlast toho TP. Neco jako soutez ve
vertikalnim skateboardingu vozickaru.

To AUI bylo lepsi tam byl aspon poradnej nezkriplenej signal -
obdelniky. Tyhle jejich preemfaze jen aby se dal signal s upocenym
celem protlacit na 100m dvojici zkroucenych zvonkovych dratu to je fakt
hruza.

Proc lidi proste netahaj Ethernet koaxialem, ten de do 800MHz
a nevyzaruje a da se s nim posilat full duplexne, a misto toho
vymyslej takovyhle zmrzaceny sracky? Koax se aspon sezene v 3mm
tloustce tak by se dal instalovat i tam kam TP nelze - do ostrych
rohu a nebo tesne vedle 220V vedeni. A chodilo by to rozhodne na
vic nez 100m.

A jeste tam nasrali spoustu zbytecnych umelych problemu s duplexem.  Ze
half duplex je sracka vidi kazdy maly dite na prvni pohled. Meli to
navrhnout zkraje rovnou full duplexne a nemusely se resit takovy
nesmysly jako je autonegotiation.

Klasicky syndrom snehove koula:
Ethernet == opatchovana Aloha
Windows == opatchovany MS-DOS
Pentium IV == opatchovana 8080

CL<

> 
> On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 13:03:12 +0200 (CEST), <giuseppe at arachne.cz> wrote:
> 
> > Zdravim...
> > Potrebujem radu, lebo som uz z toho mojho problemiku docela nestastny....
> > Na zemi dosahujem o% paket los na vzdialenost 2,1 m    na strehe to mam  
> > na
> > vzdialenost 1,2 Km ...  po zamerani nameriam na oboch prijimacoch signal  
> > i
> > s rezervou....   jediny rozdiel je, ze twister mam umiestneny v hlavici
> > priamo za vysielacom, napajanie mam urobene po ethernete....  na jednej
> > strane je asi tak 5 m ethernetu a na druhej asi tak  12....    akurat
> > neviem, ci to nebola amaterska chyba, lebo jediny twister nemam v  
> > tienenej
> > krabicke.... teraz ako sa to sprava....   ked sa snazim na streche cez to
> > pretlacit nejaky paket, tak    na jednej strane krasne blika cervena  
> > ledka
> > na twisterovy, ze vysielac vysiela, na druhej strane to krasne zase blika
> > zelena ledka, ze prijimac volaco prijima...  aj opacne to tak je....  ale
> > sucastne sa anedozblikaju....    a paket sa proste ani za boha
> > nevrati.....    tak teraz neviem, ci ten twister tam chyta nejake  
> > rusenie,
> > alebo, ci tie dlhe ethernety to natolko mozu ovlivnit.....   na zemi som
> > to prave skusal i s dlhymi ethernetmi, tak som predpokladal ze to bude v
> > poho....   ak sa niekto s niecim takym uz stretol, tak prosim  
> > poradte.....
> >   este , na jednej strane je to v sietovke( dvojportovy intel a na druhej
> > strane som to strcil do switcha    skusali sme to zastrcit i do realteku,
> > ale stale sa to sprava stejne..
> >
> > s pozdravom giuseppe....   ;)
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 29 17:24:47 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 18:24:47 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Problemik....   :o)
In-Reply-To: <opsxvhhhprn6qjls@daman>
References: <200509291612.6371@centrum.cz> <opsxvhhhprn6qjls@daman>
Message-ID: <20050929162447.GD19550@kestrel>

On Thu, Sep 29, 2005 at 04:30:43PM -0000, Daniel Strnad wrote:
> > To ja mam vetsi srandu.
> > 240 cm?? .... ping 32, 1450, 4096b v poradku
> > 260 cm??? .... prochazi uz jen pin 32 a 1450b
> > 270 cm ..... prochazi uz jen ping o velikosti 32b
> > A ted babo rad :)))
> > Alespon to jede na 240cm.
> > Jeste se v patek juknu na test pointy v RX, jinak na to ....... .
> A to se ti zda malo?? Ja bych byl za takovy vysledek rad. Ted jsem  
> postavil 1 novy set(2x tx, 2x rx) a zatim to jede tak na 190cm. Vsechny  
> obvykli veci co zhorsujou dosah mam osetreny - fotodioda zastrcena,  
> kondiky maji co nejkratsi nozicky, odpory jsou poladeny, prepazky  
> naletovany po celym obvodu, vsechna kabelaz kvalitne zapojena, testpointy  
> sedej. Myslim ze je to OK, ne?

Ja sem ted sletoval RX BPW43+BF982+UA733 TO-5-10 +BC547C a jede to s
dosahem 65cm :) LOL :)

(Nemam nastavenou preemfazi na TX ale stejne...)

CL<

> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja


From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Thu Sep 29 17:30:51 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 18:30:51 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [Ronja] Price for Ronja CD-ROM and other items
References: <433A999D.2030901@web.de>
Message-ID: <16048.1128011451@www9.gmx.net>

Hi,

I have the same problem with lenses. Yes that would be good. 

Maybe one could add an article donation 50$ ?
> --- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht ---
> Von: "shamanu8 at web.de" <shamanu8 at web.de>
> An: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Betreff: Re: [Ronja] Price for Ronja CD-ROM and other items
> Datum: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 15:24:45 +0200
> 
> 
> >And what about a plastic bag with all electronic components necessary
> >to build Twister (and another bag for RX and another for TX)?
> >
> >What about a bag for complete Tetrapolis?
> >
> >  
> >
> This would be great.  Especial if the PCB's would be included too. (for 
> the receiver?) 
> May be even one version with the needed lenses? In some regions it's not 
> easy to get them on a cheap way... 
> For me a set with the named stuff for up to 30% more would be ok.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 

-- 
5 GB Mailbox, 50 FreeSMS http://www.gmx.net/de/go/promail
+++ GMX - die erste Adresse f?r Mail, Message, More +++


From clock at twibright.com  Thu Sep 29 19:00:01 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 20:00:01 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Problemik....   :o)
In-Reply-To: <48680.212.24.150.227.1127991792.squirrel@ssl.arachne.cz>
References: <48680.212.24.150.227.1127991792.squirrel@ssl.arachne.cz>
Message-ID: <20050929180001.GE24087@kestrel>

On Thu, Sep 29, 2005 at 01:03:12PM +0200, giuseppe at arachne.cz wrote:
> Zdravim...
> Potrebujem radu, lebo som uz z toho mojho problemiku docela nestastny....
> Na zemi dosahujem o% paket los na vzdialenost 2,1 m    na strehe to mam na
> vzdialenost 1,2 Km ...  po zamerani nameriam na oboch prijimacoch signal i
> s rezervou....   jediny rozdiel je, ze twister mam umiestneny v hlavici
> priamo za vysielacom, napajanie mam urobene po ethernete....  na jednej

Jaky napajeci napeti je v Twisteru? 12V? 10V? 8V?

> strane je asi tak 5 m ethernetu a na druhej asi tak  12....    akurat
> neviem, ci to nebola amaterska chyba, lebo jediny twister nemam v tienenej
> krabicke.... teraz ako sa to sprava....   ked sa snazim na streche cez to
> pretlacit nejaky paket, tak    na jednej strane krasne blika cervena ledka
> na twisterovy, ze vysielac vysiela, na druhej strane to krasne zase blika
> zelena ledka, ze prijimac volaco prijima...  aj opacne to tak je....  ale
> sucastne sa anedozblikaju....    a paket sa proste ani za boha

Tak to je asi slaby signal... Ledky blikaji i kdyz jsou pakety
poskozene.

> nevrati.....    tak teraz neviem, ci ten twister tam chyta nejake rusenie,
> alebo, ci tie dlhe ethernety to natolko mozu ovlivnit.....   na zemi som

No kdyz to udelas proti navodu tak neni divu ze to pak nechodi na velke
vzdalenosti - udelej to podle navodu.

CL<


From cd930 at centrum.cz  Thu Sep 29 19:32:07 2005
From: cd930 at centrum.cz (-=RYS=-)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 20:32:07 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Problemik....   :o)
Message-ID: <200509292032.27176@centrum.cz>

Se vsim musim Karle souhlasit.
Z projektu FSO 100Mbps mi zbylo 500ks ETH traf, odzkousel jsem je i na 80m a v pohode.

http://www.qsl.net/ok1mjo/all/Bothand1.jpg
http://www.qsl.net/ok1mjo/all/Bothand2.jpg
PoE mi taky jede a v patek chci komplet zmerit spektroskopem a zjistit jak moc to "zari".
Docela by mi bodlo od "Prazaku" co maj Ronju-Tetrapolis na strese jestli by si pristi tyden nekdy mezi 17.00 az 20.00h
udelal nekdo cas.....vzal bych spektroskop sebou na strechu a docela rad bych si to premeril jak to vypada jinde
v realu..... Prazaci...ozvete se.
Cus... Martin? -=RYS=-

______________________________________________________________
> Od: clock at twibright.com
> Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> CC: 
> Datum: 29.09.2005 18:24
> P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] Problemik.... :o)
>
> On Thu, Sep 29, 2005 at 03:49:28PM -0000, Daniel Strnad wrote:
> > Kdyz uz chces pouzivat dlouhy UTPcka tak tam musis dat TP trafko -
> nejlepe 
> > vypajet ho z nejake stare sitovky. Je to takovy ten cerny obdelnik 
> > zpravidla hned za RJ45 konektorem. Bez nej je to sazka do loterie a
> zalezi 
> > jen na tom jak to sitovka/switch zkousne. Ten switch do kteryho to mas 
> > pichly je managovatelny? Obe strany totiz musi byt nastaveny na FD.
> 
> Vono je to sazka do loterie i bez toho - jednou sem koukal co z ty
> sitovky leze kdyz se nezatizi tou induktivni zatezi toho trafka
> a je to celkem taky hruzka - v jednom miste se to skoro dotyka
> nuly, dela to zbytecny jitter par nanosekund.
> 
> Navrh Ethernetu je sracka, obzvlast toho TP. Neco jako soutez ve
> vertikalnim skateboardingu vozickaru.
> 
> To AUI bylo lepsi tam byl aspon poradnej nezkriplenej signal -
> obdelniky. Tyhle jejich preemfaze jen aby se dal signal s upocenym
> celem protlacit na 100m dvojici zkroucenych zvonkovych dratu to je fakt
> hruza.
> 
> Proc lidi proste netahaj Ethernet koaxialem, ten de do 800MHz
> a nevyzaruje a da se s nim posilat full duplexne, a misto toho
> vymyslej takovyhle zmrzaceny sracky? Koax se aspon sezene v 3mm
> tloustce tak by se dal instalovat i tam kam TP nelze - do ostrych
> rohu a nebo tesne vedle 220V vedeni. A chodilo by to rozhodne na
> vic nez 100m.
> 
> A jeste tam nasrali spoustu zbytecnych umelych problemu s duplexem. Ze
> half duplex je sracka vidi kazdy maly dite na prvni pohled. Meli to
> navrhnout zkraje rovnou full duplexne a nemusely se resit takovy
> nesmysly jako je autonegotiation.
> 
> Klasicky syndrom snehove koula:
> Ethernet == opatchovana Aloha
> Windows == opatchovany MS-DOS
> Pentium IV == opatchovana 8080
> 
> CL<
> 
> > 
> > On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 13:03:12 +0200 (CEST), wrote:
> > 
> > > Zdravim...
> > > Potrebujem radu, lebo som uz z toho mojho problemiku docela
> nestastny....
> > > Na zemi dosahujem o% paket los na vzdialenost 2,1 m na strehe to
> mam 
> > > na
> > > vzdialenost 1,2 Km ... po zamerani nameriam na oboch prijimacoch
> signal 
> > > i
> > > s rezervou.... jediny rozdiel je, ze twister mam umiestneny v
> hlavici
> > > priamo za vysielacom, napajanie mam urobene po ethernete.... na
> jednej
> > > strane je asi tak 5 m ethernetu a na druhej asi tak 12.... akurat
> > > neviem, ci to nebola amaterska chyba, lebo jediny twister nemam v 
> > > tienenej
> > > krabicke.... teraz ako sa to sprava.... ked sa snazim na streche cez
> to
> > > pretlacit nejaky paket, tak na jednej strane krasne blika cervena 
> > > ledka
> > > na twisterovy, ze vysielac vysiela, na druhej strane to krasne zase
> blika
> > > zelena ledka, ze prijimac volaco prijima... aj opacne to tak je.... 
> ale
> > > sucastne sa anedozblikaju.... a paket sa proste ani za boha
> > > nevrati..... tak teraz neviem, ci ten twister tam chyta nejake 
> > > rusenie,
> > > alebo, ci tie dlhe ethernety to natolko mozu ovlivnit..... na zemi
> som
> > > to prave skusal i s dlhymi ethernetmi, tak som predpokladal ze to bude
> v
> > > poho.... ak sa niekto s niecim takym uz stretol, tak prosim 
> > > poradte.....
> > > este , na jednej strane je to v sietovke( dvojportovy intel a na
> druhej
> > > strane som to strcil do switcha skusali sme to zastrcit i do
> realteku,
> > > ale stale sa to sprava stejne..
> > >
> > > s pozdravom giuseppe.... ;)
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Ronja mailing list
> > > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > -- 
> > Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
> > 
> > _______________________________________________
> > Ronja mailing list
> > Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 


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From cd930 at centrum.cz  Thu Sep 29 19:34:20 2005
From: cd930 at centrum.cz (-=RYS=-)
Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 20:34:20 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Problemik....   :o)
Message-ID: <200509292034.27438@centrum.cz>

Hlavne aby mi to jelo na 934m mezi vytahovejma strojovnama na panelacich.
Jinak jeste jsem poradne nepremeril testpointy, takze v nedeli na ne juknu.
Asi v nedeli to budu montovat na strechu.
Martin

______________________________________________________________
> Od: daniel.strnad at tiscali.cz
> Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> CC: 
> Datum: 29.09.2005 17:07
> P?edm?t: Re: [Ronja] Problemik.... :o)
>
> > To ja mam vetsi srandu.
> > 240 cm?? .... ping 32, 1450, 4096b v poradku
> > 260 cm??? .... prochazi uz jen pin 32 a 1450b
> > 270 cm ..... prochazi uz jen ping o velikosti 32b
> > A ted babo rad :)))
> > Alespon to jede na 240cm.
> > Jeste se v patek juknu na test pointy v RX, jinak na to ....... .
> A to se ti zda malo?? Ja bych byl za takovy vysledek rad. Ted jsem 
> postavil 1 novy set(2x tx, 2x rx) a zatim to jede tak na 190cm. Vsechny 
> obvykli veci co zhorsujou dosah mam osetreny - fotodioda zastrcena, 
> kondiky maji co nejkratsi nozicky, odpory jsou poladeny, prepazky 
> naletovany po celym obvodu, vsechna kabelaz kvalitne zapojena, testpointy 
> 
> sedej. Myslim ze je to OK, ne?
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 


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From ronja at cobrik.net  Fri Sep 30 00:37:33 2005
From: ronja at cobrik.net (ronja@cobrik.net)
Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 01:37:33 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Anomalie s Twisterem
Message-ID: <1128037053.433c7abd6fd6a@mail.cobrik.net>

Zdravim,

mam takovej problemek a zaroven dotazek jestli jste se uz nekdo s touto anomalii
nesetkal a netusite cim by to mohlo byt zapricineno ...

Mam vyrobenej jeden kompletni spoj Ronji 2x Tx, Rx, Twister, vesmes vse funguje
jak ma Tx vs. Rx jede cca az do 2 - 2,5m vzdalenosti na koberci bez optiky.
Kdyz sem vse testoval doma bylo to OK zde jsem pouzival sitove karty Micronet,
Realtek, 3com, Intell. Pote sem zarizeni prenesl ke kamaradovi kde sme
realizovali propojeni Realtek (3com) a na druhe strane sitovka Marvell a
nestacil sem se divit ...
Kdyz sme pingovali prosel mi tak kazdej treti ctvrtej paket nekdy ani to ne a co
bylo nejzajimavejsi kdyz sme prekryli trasu Tx vs Rx (Tx vedlo z Twisteru co byl
v Realteku Rx vedlo do Twisteru smerem do Marvella) tak PC se sitovkou Marvell
zahlasilo: sitovy kabel byl odpojen ... po odsraneni prekazky ohlasilo: sitovy
kabel byl pripojen ... a tak se to dalo opakovat porad dokolecka. Pote sem
zkousel zamenit jednotlive moduly Tx a Rx a porad beze zmen. Zmena prisla po
zamene Twisteru ... vse se rozjelo bez nejmensiho problemu a spoj byl plne
funkcni pri prohozeni twisteru nazpatek opet spoj zase trpel stejnou chybou.

Zapojeni je dle navodu Tx a Rx vzdusna konstrukce Twister na PCB jedina obmena
je trosku delsi UTP z Twistru (cca 2,5m) jinak zbytek je vesmes dopuntiku
stejnej vcetne soucastek ... max jsou uzity vyslovne povolene nahrady, napajeni
12V starsi PC zdroj popr i 2x pro kazdej twister zvlast (ale vesmes to bylo fuk
chova se to porad stejne).

Diky

Milos Hladena


From cd930 at centrum.cz  Fri Sep 30 07:37:16 2005
From: cd930 at centrum.cz (-=RYS=-)
Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 08:37:16 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Anomalie s Twisterem
Message-ID: <200509300837.30200@centrum.cz>

Milosi, zkus zkratit UTP kabel na 50cm co to udela.
Martin -=RYS=-

______________________________________________________________
> Od: ronja at cobrik.net
> Komu: ronja at lists.pointless.net
> CC: 
> Datum: 30.09.2005 01:38
> P?edm?t: [Ronja] Anomalie s Twisterem
>
> Zdravim,
> 
> mam takovej problemek a zaroven dotazek jestli jste se uz nekdo s touto
> anomalii
> nesetkal a netusite cim by to mohlo byt zapricineno ...
> 
> Mam vyrobenej jeden kompletni spoj Ronji 2x Tx, Rx, Twister, vesmes vse
> funguje
> jak ma Tx vs. Rx jede cca az do 2 - 2,5m vzdalenosti na koberci bez
> optiky.
> Kdyz sem vse testoval doma bylo to OK zde jsem pouzival sitove karty
> Micronet,
> Realtek, 3com, Intell. Pote sem zarizeni prenesl ke kamaradovi kde sme
> realizovali propojeni Realtek (3com) a na druhe strane sitovka Marvell a
> nestacil sem se divit ...
> Kdyz sme pingovali prosel mi tak kazdej treti ctvrtej paket nekdy ani to
> ne a co
> bylo nejzajimavejsi kdyz sme prekryli trasu Tx vs Rx (Tx vedlo z Twisteru
> co byl
> v Realteku Rx vedlo do Twisteru smerem do Marvella) tak PC se sitovkou
> Marvell
> zahlasilo: sitovy kabel byl odpojen ... po odsraneni prekazky ohlasilo:
> sitovy
> kabel byl pripojen ... a tak se to dalo opakovat porad dokolecka. Pote sem
> zkousel zamenit jednotlive moduly Tx a Rx a porad beze zmen. Zmena prisla
> po
> zamene Twisteru ... vse se rozjelo bez nejmensiho problemu a spoj byl plne
> funkcni pri prohozeni twisteru nazpatek opet spoj zase trpel stejnou
> chybou.
> 
> Zapojeni je dle navodu Tx a Rx vzdusna konstrukce Twister na PCB jedina
> obmena
> je trosku delsi UTP z Twistru (cca 2,5m) jinak zbytek je vesmes dopuntiku
> stejnej vcetne soucastek ... max jsou uzity vyslovne povolene nahrady,
> napajeni
> 12V starsi PC zdroj popr i 2x pro kazdej twister zvlast (ale vesmes to
> bylo fuk
> chova se to porad stejne).
> 
> Diky
> 
> Milos Hladena
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> 




From schum at seznam.cz  Fri Sep 30 08:15:52 2005
From: schum at seznam.cz (=?us-ascii?Q?schumann=20miroslav?=)
Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 09:15:52 +0200 (CEST)
Subject: [Ronja] Anomalie s Twisterem
In-Reply-To: <1128037053.433c7abd6fd6a@mail.cobrik.net>
Message-ID: <1368.2318-8544-62227451-1128064552@seznam.cz>


<  ------------ Puvodni zprava ------------
<  Od:  <ronja at cobrik.net>
<  Predmet: [Ronja] Anomalie s Twisterem
<  Datum: 30.9.2005 02:37:47
<  ----------------------------------------
<  Zdravim,
<  
<  mam takovej problemek a zaroven dotazek jestli jste se uz nekdo s touto
<  anomalii
<  nesetkal a netusite cim by to mohlo byt zapricineno ...
<  
<  Mam vyrobenej jeden kompletni spoj Ronji 2x Tx, Rx, Twister, vesmes vse funguje
<  jak ma Tx vs. Rx jede cca az do 2 - 2,5m vzdalenosti na koberci bez optiky.
<  Kdyz sem vse testoval doma bylo to OK zde jsem pouzival sitove karty Micronet,
<  Realtek, 3com, Intell. Pote sem zarizeni prenesl ke kamaradovi kde sme
<  realizovali propojeni Realtek (3com) a na druhe strane sitovka Marvell a
<  nestacil sem se divit ...
<  Kdyz sme pingovali prosel mi tak kazdej treti ctvrtej paket nekdy ani to ne

zkus dat paraleln? ke kondikum 22pF je?t? dal??ch 22pF a dej vedet jestli to pomohlo, me se to chovalo zrovna tak a od te doby to jede

 a
<  co
<  bylo nejzajimavejsi kdyz sme prekryli trasu Tx vs Rx (Tx vedlo z Twisteru co
<  byl
<  v Realteku Rx vedlo do Twisteru smerem do Marvella) tak PC se sitovkou Marvell
<  zahlasilo: sitovy kabel byl odpojen ... po odsraneni prekazky ohlasilo: sitovy
<  kabel byl pripojen ... a tak se to dalo opakovat porad dokolecka. 

To je jednoduche, kdyz prijima? nema zadnej signal, ?um kterej ti z neho vychazi zblbne twistra, ten si mysli ?e ?um jsou data a prestane generovat linkove pulsy, no a PC to vyhodnoti ze byl odpojen kabel
Kdy? ten Rx zakryje? tak se ti na twistru rozsv?t? nejsp?? Rx LED

Pote sem
<  zkousel zamenit jednotlive moduly Tx a Rx a porad beze zmen. Zmena prisla po
<  zamene Twisteru ... vse se rozjelo bez nejmensiho problemu a spoj byl plne
<  funkcni pri prohozeni twisteru nazpatek opet spoj zase trpel stejnou chybou.
<  
<  Zapojeni je dle navodu Tx a Rx vzdusna konstrukce Twister na PCB jedina obmena
<  je trosku delsi UTP z Twistru (cca 2,5m) jinak zbytek je vesmes dopuntiku
<  stejnej vcetne soucastek ... max jsou uzity vyslovne povolene nahrady, napajeni
<  12V starsi PC zdroj popr i 2x pro kazdej twister zvlast (ale vesmes to bylo fuk
<  chova se to porad stejne).
<  
<  Diky
<  
<  Milos Hladena
<  
<  _______________________________________________
<  Ronja mailing list
<  Ronja at lists.pointless.net
<  http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
<  
<  
<  


From asteri_x at freemail.hu  Fri Sep 30 08:21:20 2005
From: asteri_x at freemail.hu (Martin)
Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 09:21:20 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] LOL Subversion+apache2+gentoo
In-Reply-To: <7640.1128010210@www9.gmx.net>
References: <20050927203708.GA28257@kestrel> <7640.1128010210@www9.gmx.net>
Message-ID: <433CE770.9030401@freemail.hu>

Lucas Vogelsang ?rta:
> gentoo, get ubuntu !

Debian Sarge is the solution for every problems.
It is now stable, easy to install, every component is free.
There are deb packages for subversion, apache and geda too.
(gschem, pcb, gnetlist etc.)

So noone has to mess with compiling etc.
I'm using it, and I'm satisfied.

Martin



From ronja at cobrik.net  Fri Sep 30 09:09:10 2005
From: ronja at cobrik.net (ronja@cobrik.net)
Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 10:09:10 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Anomalie s Twisterem
In-Reply-To: <1368.2318-8544-62227451-1128064552@seznam.cz>
References: <1368.2318-8544-62227451-1128064552@seznam.cz>
Message-ID: <1128067750.433cf2a68d8f5@mail.cobrik.net>

Ty kondiky hned zkusim zajimavy je ze to dela jen jeden kus ze 2 a to sem je
stavel paralelne cili bud sem mel smulu na soucastky a nebo sem nekde ujel pri
pajeni ... ale osazeny jsou na 100% stejne.

No ale co mi je divny ze kdyz zakreju prvni trasu Tx, Rx tak se nic nestane jen
prestanou chodit data ale ze by me to odpojilo PC to ne ... a kdyz zakreju tu
druhou tak se to proste chova jak kdyz vytahnu na te jedne strane sitovej kabel
... (a co je na tom uplne nejhorsi ze kdyz zamenim twistery a toho podivnyho dam
do Realtekacky ci jiny sitovky nez do toho namaklyho Marvella tak je po problemu
a muzu si zakrejvat co chci)

No nic testnu ty kondiky ... popr. zkratim kabel jak bylo v minulem prispevku a
dam vedet ...

Milos

>
> <  ------------ Puvodni zprava ------------
> <  Od:  <ronja at cobrik.net>
> <  Predmet: [Ronja] Anomalie s Twisterem
> <  Datum: 30.9.2005 02:37:47
> <  ----------------------------------------
> <  Zdravim,
> <
> <  mam takovej problemek a zaroven dotazek jestli jste se uz nekdo s touto
> <  anomalii
> <  nesetkal a netusite cim by to mohlo byt zapricineno ...
> <
> <  Mam vyrobenej jeden kompletni spoj Ronji 2x Tx, Rx, Twister, vesmes vse
> funguje
> <  jak ma Tx vs. Rx jede cca az do 2 - 2,5m vzdalenosti na koberci bez
> optiky.
> <  Kdyz sem vse testoval doma bylo to OK zde jsem pouzival sitove karty
> Micronet,
> <  Realtek, 3com, Intell. Pote sem zarizeni prenesl ke kamaradovi kde sme
> <  realizovali propojeni Realtek (3com) a na druhe strane sitovka Marvell a
> <  nestacil sem se divit ...
> <  Kdyz sme pingovali prosel mi tak kazdej treti ctvrtej paket nekdy ani to
> ne
>
> zkus dat paraleln? ke kondikum 22pF je?t? dal??ch 22pF a dej vedet jestli to
> pomohlo, me se to chovalo zrovna tak a od te doby to jede
>
>  a
> <  co
> <  bylo nejzajimavejsi kdyz sme prekryli trasu Tx vs Rx (Tx vedlo z Twisteru
> co
> <  byl
> <  v Realteku Rx vedlo do Twisteru smerem do Marvella) tak PC se sitovkou
> Marvell
> <  zahlasilo: sitovy kabel byl odpojen ... po odsraneni prekazky ohlasilo:
> sitovy
> <  kabel byl pripojen ... a tak se to dalo opakovat porad dokolecka.
>
> To je jednoduche, kdyz prijima? nema zadnej signal, ?um kterej ti z neho
> vychazi zblbne twistra, ten si mysli ?e ?um jsou data a prestane generovat
> linkove pulsy, no a PC to vyhodnoti ze byl odpojen kabel
> Kdy? ten Rx zakryje? tak se ti na twistru rozsv?t? nejsp?? Rx LED
>
> Pote sem
> <  zkousel zamenit jednotlive moduly Tx a Rx a porad beze zmen. Zmena prisla
> po
> <  zamene Twisteru ... vse se rozjelo bez nejmensiho problemu a spoj byl plne
> <  funkcni pri prohozeni twisteru nazpatek opet spoj zase trpel stejnou
> chybou.
> <
> <  Zapojeni je dle navodu Tx a Rx vzdusna konstrukce Twister na PCB jedina
> obmena
> <  je trosku delsi UTP z Twistru (cca 2,5m) jinak zbytek je vesmes dopuntiku
> <  stejnej vcetne soucastek ... max jsou uzity vyslovne povolene nahrady,
> napajeni
> <  12V starsi PC zdroj popr i 2x pro kazdej twister zvlast (ale vesmes to
> bylo fuk
> <  chova se to porad stejne).
> <
> <  Diky
> <
> <  Milos Hladena
> <
> <  _______________________________________________
> <  Ronja mailing list
> <  Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> <  http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
> <
> <
> <
>
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja
>





From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Fri Sep 30 12:46:30 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 13:46:30 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [Ronja] LOL Subversion+apache2+gentoo
References: <433CE770.9030401@freemail.hu>
Message-ID: <25944.1128080790@www49.gmx.net>

Hi,

I use sarge as well, but I quite like the idea of ubuntu. And every
component is free as well.

Most of normal Debian compiled apps also work on ubuntu.

PCB isn't even with gtk gui on the sarge testing mirror, you have to compile
it anyway.


Lucas

> --- Urspr?ngliche Nachricht ---
> Von: Martin <asteri_x at freemail.hu>
> An: Twibright Ronja <ronja at lists.pointless.net>
> Betreff: Re: [Ronja] LOL Subversion+apache2+gentoo
> Datum: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 09:21:20 +0200
> 
> Lucas Vogelsang ??rta:
> > gentoo, get ubuntu !
> 
> Debian Sarge is the solution for every problems.
> It is now stable, easy to install, every component is free.
> There are deb packages for subversion, apache and geda too.
> (gschem, pcb, gnetlist etc.)
> 
> So noone has to mess with compiling etc.
> I'm using it, and I'm satisfied.
> 
> Martin
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Ronja mailing list
> Ronja at lists.pointless.net
> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja

-- 
5 GB Mailbox, 50 FreeSMS http://www.gmx.net/de/go/promail
+++ GMX - die erste Adresse f?r Mail, Message, More +++


From asteri_x at freemail.hu  Fri Sep 30 13:33:06 2005
From: asteri_x at freemail.hu (Martin)
Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 14:33:06 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] LOL Subversion+apache2+gentoo
In-Reply-To: <25944.1128080790@www49.gmx.net>
References: <433CE770.9030401@freemail.hu> <25944.1128080790@www49.gmx.net>
Message-ID: <433D3082.2020903@freemail.hu>

Lucas Vogelsang ?rta:
> Hi,
> 
> I use sarge as well, but I quite like the idea of ubuntu. And every
> component is free as well.
> 
> Most of normal Debian compiled apps also work on ubuntu.
> 
> PCB isn't even with gtk gui on the sarge testing mirror, you have to compile
> it anyway.

I don't know how, but I'm using it, and didn't compile anything:
http://packages.debian.org/stable/electronics/pcb

Sarge is stable now :)

Bye,
Martin



From clock at twibright.com  Fri Sep 30 22:20:59 2005
From: clock at twibright.com (Karel Kulhavy)
Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 23:20:59 +0200
Subject: [Ronja] Teflon tape on Limehouse Town Hall toilet
Message-ID: <20050930212059.GA13752@kestrel>

Hello

I have been couple of minutes ago on the toilet in Limehouse Town Hall
in London. I have noticed how the flush tank is sealed against the flush
piping.

A teflon tape was first wound on the seam and silicone sealant was
applied after that.

I think this is a very clever idea. That ensures that if you leave
bubble in the sealana it won't cause a leakage.

I think this method should be recommended to be employed for sealing the
front and rear lid to increase reliability of the sealing process. What
do you think?

How expensive is teflon tape? I think not much because we got it at home
since ages...

CL<


From lucasvo at gmx.ch  Fri Sep 30 22:40:17 2005
From: lucasvo at gmx.ch (Lucas Vogelsang)
Date: Fri, 30 Sep 2005 23:40:17 +0200 (MEST)
Subject: [Ronja] LOL Subversion+apache2+gentoo
References: <433D3082.2020903@freemail.hu>
Message-ID: <6419.1128116417@www12.gmx.net>

Hi

> 
> I don't know how, but I'm using it, and didn't compile anything:

No it doens't compile anything, but have you seen the ugly graphics. It
hans't got any gtk. just text based menus.

> http://packages.debian.org/stable/electronics/pcb
> 
> Sarge is stable now :)
> 
yes

lucas

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