From r.boesch at gmx.net Fri Aug 1 18:38:24 2003 From: r.boesch at gmx.net (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Raffael_B=F6sch?=) Date: Fri Aug 1 16:38:24 2003 Subject: [Ronja] TP-Interface: some questions Message-ID: <001901c35842$f286c430$a37ba8c0@eigi> Hi all I have some questions about the modified TP-Interface. - Does someone has a material list? - What's FILTR? I think it's kind of a IC. - Where have I to connect the power, the transmitter and the receiver? - How big has the box for the TP-Interface to be? - Where do I place the elements in the box? Is it important where to put them? Thank you for you help Raffael From farkas at szm.sk Sat Aug 2 01:58:43 2003 From: farkas at szm.sk (Richard Farkas) Date: Sat Aug 2 00:11:05 2003 Subject: [Ronja] TP-Interface: some questions In-Reply-To: <001901c35842$f286c430$a37ba8c0@eigi> References: <001901c35842$f286c430$a37ba8c0@eigi> Message-ID: <178598135.20030802005843@szm.sk> I think that there is one useful answer to all yours questions. Read carefully whole Clock's "How to do" at ronja.advel.cz. RB> Hi all RB> I have some questions about the modified TP-Interface. RB> - Does someone has a material list? RB> - What's FILTR? I think it's kind of a IC. RB> - Where have I to connect the power, the transmitter and the receiver? RB> - How big has the box for the TP-Interface to be? RB> - Where do I place the elements in the box? Is it important where to put them? RB> Thank you for you help RB> Raffael RB> _______________________________________________ RB> Ronja mailing list RB> Ronja@lists.pointless.net RB> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja -- S pozdravom, Richard mailto:farkas@szm.sk From r.boesch at gmx.net Sat Aug 2 02:27:35 2003 From: r.boesch at gmx.net (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Raffael_B=F6sch?=) Date: Sat Aug 2 00:27:31 2003 Subject: [Ronja] TP-Interface: some questions References: <001901c35842$f286c430$a37ba8c0@eigi> <178598135.20030802005843@szm.sk> Message-ID: <001701c35884$7d4a1400$a37ba8c0@eigi> Hi Richard > I think that there is one useful answer to all yours questions. Read > carefully whole Clock's "How to do" at ronja.advel.cz. My questions are not about the normal Ronja. My questions are related to the twistedpair-interface of Silvije Milisic (http://ronja.silvije.tk/). So I don't find the answears one the Ronja-homepage. Raffael From farkas at szm.sk Sat Aug 2 09:42:02 2003 From: farkas at szm.sk (Richard Farkas) Date: Sat Aug 2 07:54:22 2003 Subject: [Ronja] TP-Interface: some questions In-Reply-To: <001701c35884$7d4a1400$a37ba8c0@eigi> References: <001901c35842$f286c430$a37ba8c0@eigi> <178598135.20030802005843@szm.sk> <001701c35884$7d4a1400$a37ba8c0@eigi> Message-ID: <71323287.20030802084202@szm.sk> I am sorry, You are completely right. I didn't notice this "TP". RB> Hi Richard >> I think that there is one useful answer to all yours questions. Read >> carefully whole Clock's "How to do" at ronja.advel.cz. RB> My questions are not about the normal Ronja. My questions are related to the RB> twistedpair-interface of Silvije Milisic (http://ronja.silvije.tk/). So I don't RB> find the answears one the Ronja-homepage. RB> Raffael RB> _______________________________________________ RB> Ronja mailing list RB> Ronja@lists.pointless.net RB> http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja -- S pozdravom, Richard mailto:farkas@szm.sk From clock at twibright.com Sun Aug 3 23:07:45 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Sun Aug 3 21:07:49 2003 Subject: [Ronja] TP-Interface: some questions In-Reply-To: <001701c35884$7d4a1400$a37ba8c0@eigi>; from r.boesch@gmx.net on Sat, Aug 02, 2003 at 01:27:35AM +0200 References: <001901c35842$f286c430$a37ba8c0@eigi> <178598135.20030802005843@szm.sk> <001701c35884$7d4a1400$a37ba8c0@eigi> Message-ID: <20030803220745.A32492@beton.cybernet.src> On Sat, Aug 02, 2003 at 01:27:35AM +0200, Raffael B?sch wrote: > Hi Richard > > > I think that there is one useful answer to all yours questions. Read > > carefully whole Clock's "How to do" at ronja.advel.cz. I would like to point out that the new address is ronja.twibright.com (I have bought a domain for these purposes so that when Ronja or Twibright Labs or whatever get rehosted, people won't be forced to remember a new URL). Cl< From ladmanj at volny.cz Sun Aug 3 23:58:03 2003 From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman) Date: Sun Aug 3 22:03:08 2003 Subject: [Ronja] TP-Interface: some questions In-Reply-To: <001901c35842$f286c430$a37ba8c0@eigi> References: <001901c35842$f286c430$a37ba8c0@eigi> Message-ID: <200308032258.03615.ladmanj@volny.cz> > - What's FILTR? I think it's kind of a IC. FILTR is a czech version of a english word FILTER. In this application is it double transformer which insulates TP cable from driver (to prevent DC and LF current flow between NICs and other devices supplied from diferent sources (wall sockets)) It also cuts-off harmonics and ends the TP trace with 100 ohm load. I hope that it is uderstandable. My english is horrible. I can only place known words into sequences. But i learn it only from reading datasheets. :-D From clock at twibright.com Mon Aug 4 23:46:49 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Mon Aug 4 21:47:05 2003 Subject: [Ronja] TP-Interface: some questions In-Reply-To: <200308032258.03615.ladmanj@volny.cz>; from ladmanj@volny.cz on Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 10:58:03PM +0200 References: <001901c35842$f286c430$a37ba8c0@eigi> <200308032258.03615.ladmanj@volny.cz> Message-ID: <20030804224649.A387@beton.cybernet.src> On Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 10:58:03PM +0200, Jakub Ladman wrote: > > - What's FILTR? I think it's kind of a IC. > FILTR is a czech version of a english word FILTER. > In this application is it double transformer which insulates TP cable from > driver (to prevent DC and LF current flow between NICs and other devices > supplied from diferent sources (wall sockets)) > It also cuts-off harmonics and ends the TP trace with 100 ohm load. > > I hope that it is uderstandable. My english is horrible. I can only place > known words into sequences. But i learn it only from reading datasheets. :-D Obviously the English in datasheets is fairly good :) Cl< From klapek at kki.net.pl Tue Aug 5 09:25:27 2003 From: klapek at kki.net.pl (Tomasz Koprowski) Date: Tue Aug 5 07:25:46 2003 Subject: [Ronja] TP-Interface: some questions In-Reply-To: <20030804224649.A387@beton.cybernet.src> References: <200308032258.03615.ladmanj@volny.cz>; from ladmanj@volny.cz on Sun, Aug 03, 2003 at 10:58:03PM +0200 Message-ID: <3F2F69F7.26531.9E1B6@localhost> Hi, > > I hope that it is uderstandable. My english is horrible. I can only place > > known words into sequences. But i learn it only from reading datasheets. :-D > > Obviously the English in datasheets is fairly good :) I only wonder in what datasheet and what context the words "hope" and "horrible" were used ;-) Regards, Tomek Koprowski From clock at twibright.com Tue Aug 5 11:26:20 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Tue Aug 5 09:26:33 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: Prosim o pomoc s 10M metropolis In-Reply-To: <200308041519.10029.vojta@sinus.cz>; from vojta@sinus.cz on Mon, Aug 04, 2003 at 03:19:09PM +0200 References: <200308041519.10029.vojta@sinus.cz> Message-ID: <20030805102620.A17437@beton.cybernet.src> On Mon, Aug 04, 2003 at 03:19:09PM +0200, Vojt?ch Pithart wrote: > Dobry den, > chapu, ze jste podobnymi otazkami asi dost zatizen, ale vase eventualni pomoc > je pro me snad posledni moznost jak promenit hromadu nakoupeneho materialu ve > funkcni ronju. > Vse jsem postavil dle navodu, teda mechanickou cast se 130mm cockami trochu > odlisne. Elektronika v laboratornich podminkach slape. Lec, jen na vzdalenost > cca 40 cm. Na 1 metr i vice sice zelena LED na prijimaci strane blika v rytmu > cervene LED na vysilaci strane, ale sitova karta uz pakety neprijima. Muj > budouci ronja spoj meri 800 +-50 metru; jiz jsem to tam namontoval, ale bez > uspechu. Prijem signalu byl na hranici toho, ze prijimaci LED zhasne, a to > jen v noci. > Vytvoril jsem tedy opet v laboratori spojeni mezi 2 ronjama na 1 metr bez > optiky a meril osciloskopem v jednom z AUI. (dost nizke) hodnoty RSSI na > prijimaci a tvary signalu na nekterych bodech prikladam v priloze. Byl bych > vdecen, kdybyste se na to podival a napsal mi, kde hledat chybu. > Soucastky: > Tranzistory v limiterech: BC564B (vymena za 2N3904 => stejne chovani) To je timhle. S BC546B to temer nefunguje. Vymente je za 2N3904 nebo aspon jine _spinaci_ tranzistory podobneho razeni. BC546B jsou "general purpose transistors" coz znamena neco jako na audio aplikace a nizsi frekvence ;-) Jsou hrozne line pokavad od nich chce clovek aby rychle prebihaly mezi vzdalenejsimi hodnotami. Myslim ze to byly 2N2221 nebo nejak tak se to jmenovalo, nekdo to zkousel a zdalo se ze to s tim chodi stejne. BTW co je sinus.cz? Nema to neco spolecneho s Patrolem? :) Cl< > NE592 v 8vyvodovem pouzdre > BF960 > integrace: vsechny 74HCxx > prijimaci diody BPW43 > RX a AUI propojene 1 metrem 75ohm televizniho koaxu > AUI a sitovka (3c509) propojene 1 metrem asi 6ziloveho tenkeho kabliku > > Diky za odpoved > Vojta Lhota > From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 11:09:53 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 09:10:04 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: Prosim o pomoc s 10M metropolis In-Reply-To: <200308051126.00773.vojta@sinus.cz>; from vojta@sinus.cz on Tue, Aug 05, 2003 at 11:26:00AM +0200 References: <200308041519.10029.vojta@sinus.cz> <20030805102620.A17437@beton.cybernet.src> <200308051126.00773.vojta@sinus.cz> Message-ID: <20030806100953.A276@beton.cybernet.src> On Tue, Aug 05, 2003 at 11:26:00AM +0200, Vojt?ch Pithart wrote: > > To je timhle. S BC546B to temer nefunguje. Vymente je za 2N3904 > > nebo aspon jine _spinaci_ tranzistory podobneho razeni. BC546B jsou > > "general purpose transistors" coz znamena neco jako na audio aplikace > > a nizsi frekvence ;-) Jsou hrozne line pokavad od nich chce clovek aby > > rychle prebihaly mezi vzdalenejsimi hodnotami. > OK, zkusim je tedy povymenovat za 2N3904. Jeste me napada - muze se obvod > hodne zmenit, kdyz do nej sahnu osciloskopem se sondou 1:10? Muze. Tam jde o kazdy pikofarad. > > Zkusim si tedy pohrat s tema tranzistorama. Kolik ns by mel trvat prebeh z 0 > do max v P56? Jo tak to nevim :( Ale melo by se to nechat asi nejak vypocist z vystupni kapacity toho tranzistoru a proudu. Proud je danej tim kolik tece tim odporem v emitoru (na nem je temer konstantni napeti). A mozna tam jeste bude hrat roli Ft toho tranzistoru ale to nevim. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 11:20:25 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 09:20:31 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Hokus pokus In-Reply-To: <3EDE6602.24072.815CF@localhost>; from Seligr@sh.cvut.cz on Wed, Jun 04, 2003 at 09:34:58PM +0200 References: <3EDE6602.24072.815CF@localhost> Message-ID: <20030806102025.F282@beton.cybernet.src> On Wed, Jun 04, 2003 at 09:34:58PM +0200, Seligr@sh.cvut.cz wrote: > To clock: Jak by jsi ohodnotil konstrukci publikovanou zde > http://laser.webpark.cz/ronja.html Na posledn?m obr?zku je ten > kmitaj?c? RX modul. Ja nevim. Jsou tam nejaky divoky vrabci hnizda ktery budou fungovat pokud v nich neni studenak a tistaky s tenkejma cestickama - jejich funkcnost nedokazu predpovedet. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 11:24:32 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 09:24:33 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: Hygiena In-Reply-To: <000e01c32df7$ce5bca80$0900c6c3@j6d6v4>; from Sokolov621427@volny.cz on Sun, Jun 08, 2003 at 09:54:25PM +0200 References: <000e01c32df7$ce5bca80$0900c6c3@j6d6v4> Message-ID: <20030806102432.I282@beton.cybernet.src> On Sun, Jun 08, 2003 at 09:54:25PM +0200, Patrik Oravec wrote: > Ahoj Karle, > > tak?e jsem dostal odpov?? od ?lov?ka, kter? se zab?v? za?azov?n?m laser? do t??d, a n?co mi tady kolabuje .... > ty tvrd??, ?e to spad? do viditeln?ho p?sma a on ?e do t??dy laser? IIIb. Tak?e pokud m??e? a bude? m?t trochu ?asu, napi? mi pros?m jax to za?azoval. Do viditeln?ho p?sma. Laser v tom neni. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 11:27:19 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 09:27:21 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Konektor na RT, TX In-Reply-To: <14187432437.20030619191616@iol.cz>; from michal.grunt@iol.cz on Thu, Jun 19, 2003 at 07:16:16PM +0200 References: <000601c33046$c478c940$152ea8c0@x7i3g3> <20030618005650.E2382@beton.cybernet.cz> <14187432437.20030619191616@iol.cz> Message-ID: <20030806102719.K282@beton.cybernet.src> On Thu, Jun 19, 2003 at 07:16:16PM +0200, Michal Grunt wrote: > Ano. Je v tom nejaky problem? Problem je ze medeny drat zoxiduje a prestane to po urcite dobe spolehlive vodit. Cl< > > > Co tvori centralni kontakt u F konektoru? Jestli si dobre pamatuju, neni > > tam z jedne strany medeny drat toho koaxialniho kabelu? > > -- > Michal Grunt > > > _______________________________________________ > Ronja mailing list > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 12:03:59 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 10:04:01 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: ronja a sitovka In-Reply-To: ; from xoberon@atlas.cz on Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 07:57:26AM +0200 References: Message-ID: <20030806110359.Q282@beton.cybernet.src> On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 07:57:26AM +0200, Jan Novak wrote: > cau Clocku, tak Ronja se uspesne rozviji, vzdalenost 1.7km to je dobre a > 30-75 km, teda jestli se to podari, tak to bude teda super.I kdyz tam asi > budou furt pouzivat mikrovlne spoje, ale s technickeho hlediska je to dost > zajimave.Ja mam trochu jiny problem a predstavu.Laserove diody jsou super, > ale jak vidim jak sviti, tak s toho nejsem moc nadceny, hlavne na tech Od toho tam bude rozsirovac svazku, ktery zajisti bezpecnost oka i pri bezprostrednim pohledu tesne do vystupni cocky. > fotkach, a do takove diody se podivas asi jen jednou.Kdyz jsem cetl neco o > pasmu 10GHz, tak tam radili at se do vlnovodu radeji nedivam a kdyz uz musi, > tak at ma zrcadlove bryle.:))) Ale proc Ti pisi, hlavne proto ,ze bych se > chtel zeptat jak by se dala snizit rychlost na sitove karte na asi 1MB/s nebo > max 2MB/s.Jestli by stacilo ciste sw nebo hw napr. snizenim frekvence 20MHz > krystalu na desce.Nezkousel jsem jeste zadnou moznost.videl jsem jedno reseni > v pouziti FIFO pameti a pak to prevedl na CDMA, snizil to na 2.5MB/s, vystup > RX,TX, PTT link v pasmu 2.4GHz.na konstrukci byly pouzity XILINXy.Idealni by > bylo snizit to softwarove.Moc dik za odpoved.Hodne uspechu v dalsi Ja jsem skousel podtaktovat 10Mbps sitovku preletovanim krystalu a chodila na 5Mbps ale niz nejak uz ne. Podle me to bylo trafkama. Ale muselo by se to overit. Mozna jsou tam jeste nejake fixni casy v tom serializtoru/deserializatoru nebo detektoru paketu a to by uz bylo horsi. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 14:11:13 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 12:11:20 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: ronja,sitovka In-Reply-To: <24fc2ca6171e46ad8464256a4446372f@atlas.cz>; from xoberon@atlas.cz on Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 12:42:46PM +0200 References: <24fc2ca6171e46ad8464256a4446372f@atlas.cz> Message-ID: <20030806131113.B206@beton.cybernet.src> On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 12:42:46PM +0200, Jan Novak wrote: > cau, a co tak 2 metrova truba, to pak nikdo neuvidi nic, musel by byt primo > naproti tomu, ale zas ten rozmer:-)).No reseni je asi vic. co to znamena Hm to bohuzel jaksi je mechanicky neresitelne tam mit 2-metrovou trubku. > proletovani krystalu?, ted tam je 20MHz, myslis vymena za 10MHz nebo Jo, misto 20MHz jsem naletoval 10MHz. > pripojeni jineho externiho zdroje clocku.jo a chci to napojit na AUI, tam > nejsou transformatory. Ja jsem to zkousel myslim s BNC. Cl< From hoe at dle.sk Wed Aug 6 14:23:11 2003 From: hoe at dle.sk (HoE) Date: Wed Aug 6 12:23:34 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Konektor na RT, TX In-Reply-To: <20030806102719.K282@beton.cybernet.src> References: <000601c33046$c478c940$152ea8c0@x7i3g3> <20030618005650.E2382@beton.cybernet.cz> <14187432437.20030619191616@iol.cz> <20030806102719.K282@beton.cybernet.src> Message-ID: <20030806112311.GA392@dle.sk> jo presne tento problem mam aj ja, doporucujem ocinovat koniec koaxu ako to pre mna urobil airborne :) On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 10:27:19AM +0200, Clock wrote: > On Thu, Jun 19, 2003 at 07:16:16PM +0200, Michal Grunt wrote: > > Ano. Je v tom nejaky problem? > > Problem je ze medeny drat zoxiduje a prestane to po urcite dobe > spolehlive vodit. > > Cl< > > > > > > Co tvori centralni kontakt u F konektoru? Jestli si dobre pamatuju, neni > > > tam z jedne strany medeny drat toho koaxialniho kabelu? > > > > -- > > Michal Grunt > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ronja mailing list > > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja > > _______________________________________________ > Ronja mailing list > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja From klein at eshs.sk Wed Aug 6 12:57:25 2003 From: klein at eshs.sk (Marcel Klein) Date: Wed Aug 6 12:30:39 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Konektor na RT, TX References: <000601c33046$c478c940$152ea8c0@x7i3g3><20030618005650.E2382@beton.cybernet.cz><14187432437.20030619191616@iol.cz> <20030806102719.K282@beton.cybernet.src> Message-ID: <001e01c35c01$23afeac0$1200000a@hw> Az take strasne to nebude ak to par rokov vydrzi na nablovke na dazdi a aj potom to ma utlm len par dB. Ak sa do toho nedostane voda, tak aj po 10 rokoch to nema znatelne vecsi utlm. Ak by to tak nebolo, tak by sa to na paraboly nepouzivalo. BNC s tymi som mal vecsie problemy. Holt moje skusenosti... Emsi ----- Original Message ----- From: "Clock" To: "Michal Grunt" ; "GPL free-space optical datalink" Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 10:27 AM Subject: Re: [Ronja] Konektor na RT, TX > On Thu, Jun 19, 2003 at 07:16:16PM +0200, Michal Grunt wrote: > > Ano. Je v tom nejaky problem? > > Problem je ze medeny drat zoxiduje a prestane to po urcite dobe > spolehlive vodit. > > Cl< > > > > > > Co tvori centralni kontakt u F konektoru? Jestli si dobre pamatuju, neni > > > tam z jedne strany medeny drat toho koaxialniho kabelu? > > > > -- > > Michal Grunt > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ronja mailing list > > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja > > _______________________________________________ > Ronja mailing list > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 15:50:28 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 13:50:32 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: ronja a sitovka In-Reply-To: ; from xoberon@atlas.cz on Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 01:26:38PM +0200 References: Message-ID: <20030806145028.C261@beton.cybernet.src> On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 01:26:38PM +0200, Jan Novak wrote: > no mozna 2 metry jsem ustrelil az moc od pasu ,ale kdyz se s pojite s hvezdarama, tak oni maji dostatek zkusenosti se stavbou dalekohledu a testovanim zrzadel a podobnych veci.Je fakt ,ze mechanicky je to nekdy daleko horsi nez po strance elektricke. > Aha, takze 10MHz, krystal, zkusim to.A neslo by to nejak udelat softwarove Cemu presne rikate snizeni prenosove rychlosti? Slo by treba udelat ze by se linka zatizila tokem 8Mbps z nejakyho FTPka a pak by se snizila softwarove rychlost na 2Mbps. Cl< > ,bud driveru ,sice ten asi na to uz nema takovy vliv, jen posle do chipu > data a ten se uz o vsechno postara.ted me napada, mozna nejaka stara deska > ,kde jsou diskretni soucastky, fifo atd.Dale bych se chtel zeptat,v kterem > miste by se dala vzit informace o prepinani RX/TX.kdyz se nastavuje > fullduplex, tak pro halfduplex? s pozdravem Honza > > ________________________________________________________________________________ > Styd?m se ho vyt?hnout! A jak? je v?? d?vod vym?nit sv?j telefon za nov?? > Nokia 6610 ji? od 6577 K?. http://www.atlas.cz/clickAD.asp?ad=34223 From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 16:19:10 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 14:19:12 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Spoj Ujezd Message-ID: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> Ahoj Je spoj Ujezd na tistacich? Pouzivali jste anglicky navod nebo cesky preklad od Dana Hrotka? Jake zavady se na spoji pri zamerovani vyskytly? Predpokladam, ze jste postupovali podle navodu a v jednom okamziku doslo k selhani neceho a neslo dal podle postupu postupovat. Potreboval bych vedet, ktery krok v navodu to byl a co selhalo, abych to mohl vysetrit a pokud je to chyba navrhu Metropolis nebo toho navodu, abych to mohl opravit. Mej se, Cl< From bobriks at volny.cz Wed Aug 6 17:25:18 2003 From: bobriks at volny.cz (bobriks@volny.cz) Date: Wed Aug 6 15:25:21 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Spoj Ujezd In-Reply-To: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> Message-ID: <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> > Je spoj Ujezd na tistacich? > Pouzivali jste anglicky navod nebo cesky preklad od > Dana Hrotka? Jake zavady se na spoji pri zamerovani > vyskytly? > Ano, RX, TX, AUI na obou stranach spoje jsou na tistacich od Ondry Tesare. > Predpokladam, ze jste postupovali podle navodu a v > jednom okamziku doslo k selhani neceho a neslo dal > podle postupu postupovat. > Potreboval bych vedet, ktery krok v navodu to byl a co > selhalo, abych to mohl vysetrit a pokud je to chyba > navrhu Metropolis nebo toho navodu, abych to mohl opravit. > Ne, nepostupovali jsme presne podle zadneho z navodu. V danem okamziku nemam zadne doporuceni cim doplnit/opravit tvuj navod. Mozna az pujde vylezt na nerozpalenou strechu a az to rozchodime. Snad prece jen detail: cim vetsi vzdalenost, tim musi byt vetsi plocha odrazek! Presne rozmery ale nevim. Standa -- Hork? l?to s VOLN?: Vyhraj Ford s klimatizac?! Vice na http://soutez.volny.cz From clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz Wed Aug 6 18:12:13 2003 From: clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Karel Kulhavy) Date: Wed Aug 6 16:12:17 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Spoj Ujezd In-Reply-To: <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> Message-ID: <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > > Je spoj Ujezd na tistacich? > > Pouzivali jste anglicky navod nebo cesky preklad od > > Dana Hrotka? Jake zavady se na spoji pri zamerovani > > vyskytly? > > > Ano, RX, TX, AUI na obou stranach spoje jsou na tistacich > od Ondry Tesare. Ondra Tesar je i navrhoval, nebo pouze bastlil? Pokud je pouze bastlil, nejsou od Skontorpa? > > > Predpokladam, ze jste postupovali podle navodu a v > > jednom okamziku doslo k selhani neceho a neslo dal > > podle postupu postupovat. > > Potreboval bych vedet, ktery krok v navodu to byl a co > > selhalo, abych to mohl vysetrit a pokud je to chyba > > navrhu Metropolis nebo toho navodu, abych to mohl opravit. > > > Ne, nepostupovali jsme presne podle zadneho z navodu. > V danem okamziku nemam zadne doporuceni cim doplnit/opravit > tvuj navod. Mozna az pujde vylezt na nerozpalenou strechu > a az to rozchodime. Snad prece jen detail: cim vetsi > vzdalenost, tim musi byt vetsi plocha odrazek! Presne > rozmery ale nevim. To jsem do navodu uz zanesl. Je tam tabulka kolik odrazek je potreba na jakou vzdalenost. Mej se hezky, Cl< From clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz Wed Aug 6 18:14:41 2003 From: clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Karel Kulhavy) Date: Wed Aug 6 16:14:46 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Konektor na RT, TX In-Reply-To: <20030806112311.GA392@dle.sk> References: <000601c33046$c478c940$152ea8c0@x7i3g3> <20030618005650.E2382@beton.cybernet.cz> <14187432437.20030619191616@iol.cz> <20030806102719.K282@beton.cybernet.src> <20030806112311.GA392@dle.sk> Message-ID: <20030806151441.GC18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > jo presne tento problem mam aj ja, doporucujem ocinovat koniec koaxu ako to pre mna urobil airborne :) Ale cin take oxiduje :( Mozna pozdejc nez med, ale bojim se, ze casem se z toho stane stejne nespolehlivy spoj. Cl< From clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz Wed Aug 6 18:17:34 2003 From: clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Karel Kulhavy) Date: Wed Aug 6 16:17:35 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Konektor na RT, TX In-Reply-To: <001e01c35c01$23afeac0$1200000a@hw> References: <20030806102719.K282@beton.cybernet.src> <001e01c35c01$23afeac0$1200000a@hw> Message-ID: <20030806151734.GD18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > Az take strasne to nebude ak to par rokov vydrzi na nablovke na dazdi a aj > potom to ma utlm len par dB. > Ak sa do toho nedostane voda, tak aj po 10 rokoch to nema znatelne vecsi > utlm. Ak by to tak nebolo, tak by sa to na paraboly nepouzivalo. > BNC s tymi som mal vecsie problemy. > Holt moje skusenosti... Tam to podle me funguje tak, ze na 1GHz se ta tenka vrstvicka izolantu (oxidu) chova jako vazebni kondenzator a nevadi, i kdyz Ronje, co potrebuje 1MHz, by to vadilo. Cl< From bobriks at volny.cz Wed Aug 6 18:32:12 2003 From: bobriks at volny.cz (bobriks@volny.cz) Date: Wed Aug 6 16:32:14 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Spoj Ujezd In-Reply-To: <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: <3660273f5cdb0e2235f46e9ad57ce1e4@www1.mail.volny.cz> > > Ano, RX, TX, AUI na obou stranach spoje jsou na > > tistacich od Ondry Tesare. > > Ondra Tesar je i navrhoval, nebo pouze bastlil? Pokud > je pouze bastlil, nejsou od Skontorpa? > Ano, jsou od Skontorpa vyrobene u firmy dle http://www.volny.cz/ondrej.tesar/ronja.htm , s opravou FETu na RX a zpetnovazebnim C=270p u NE592. Momentalni neuspech na Ujezde bych ale na ty tistaky hned tak nesvadel. Pri prvnim zapnuti cast spoje fungovala. -- Hork? l?to s VOLN?: Vyhraj Ford s klimatizac?! Vice na http://soutez.volny.cz From clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz Wed Aug 6 18:36:20 2003 From: clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Karel Kulhavy) Date: Wed Aug 6 16:36:23 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Spoj Ujezd In-Reply-To: <3660273f5cdb0e2235f46e9ad57ce1e4@www1.mail.volny.cz> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <3660273f5cdb0e2235f46e9ad57ce1e4@www1.mail.volny.cz> Message-ID: <20030806153620.GB21825@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > > > Ano, RX, TX, AUI na obou stranach spoje jsou na > > > tistacich od Ondry Tesare. > > > > Ondra Tesar je i navrhoval, nebo pouze bastlil? Pokud > > je pouze bastlil, nejsou od Skontorpa? > > > Ano, jsou od Skontorpa vyrobene u firmy > dle http://www.volny.cz/ondrej.tesar/ronja.htm , > s opravou FETu na RX a zpetnovazebnim C=270p u NE592. > > Momentalni neuspech na Ujezde bych ale na ty tistaky > hned tak nesvadel. Pri prvnim zapnuti cast spoje fungovala. Mate tam standardni mechanicke rozhrani a mechanismus jemneho zamerovani? Pokud ano, mohl bych teoreticky opravit nektere ze svych vraku elektroniky a skocit to tam zkusit, cimz by se zjistilo, jestli je to elektronikou, nebo optomechanikou. Cl< From bobriks at volny.cz Wed Aug 6 19:50:42 2003 From: bobriks at volny.cz (bobriks@volny.cz) Date: Wed Aug 6 17:50:44 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Spoj Ujezd In-Reply-To: <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: > To jsem do navodu uz zanesl. Je tam tabulka kolik > odrazek je potreba na jakou vzdalenost. At http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/installing.php I did not find how many retroreflectors are to be used according to a distance between the peers. Please where is the table with data? -- Hork? l?to s VOLN?: Vyhraj Ford s klimatizac?! Vice na http://soutez.volny.cz From jkl at jkl.darktech.org Wed Aug 6 20:06:22 2003 From: jkl at jkl.darktech.org (JKLamer) Date: Wed Aug 6 18:08:11 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Spoj Ujezd References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src><15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz><20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> ----- Original Message ----- From: >At http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/installing.php >I did not find how many retroreflectors are to be used >according to a distance between the peers. Please where >is the table with data? http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/modules.php under section Material Required From bobriks at volny.cz Wed Aug 6 21:33:30 2003 From: bobriks at volny.cz (bobriks@volny.cz) Date: Wed Aug 6 19:33:33 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Retroreflectors In-Reply-To: <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src><15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz><20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> Message-ID: <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> > >At > >http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/installing.php > >I can not find how many retroreflectors are to be used > >according to a distance between the peers. Please > >where is the table with data? > > http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/modules.php > under section Material Required Thank you. Just a note: on my opinion for a distance 1145m a car warning triangle is not enough at all! -- Hork? l?to s VOLN?: Vyhraj Ford s klimatizac?! Vice na http://soutez.volny.cz From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 22:17:52 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 20:18:13 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Spoj Ujezd In-Reply-To: ; from bobriks@volny.cz on Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 06:50:42PM +0200 References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: <20030806211752.B228@beton.cybernet.src> On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 06:50:42PM +0200, bobriks@volny.cz wrote: > > To jsem do navodu uz zanesl. Je tam tabulka kolik > > odrazek je potreba na jakou vzdalenost. > > At http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/installing.php > I did not find how many retroreflectors are to be used > according to a distance between the peers. Please where > is the table with data? http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/modules.php Nevertheless, I have just added the same into http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/installing.php Cl< From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 23:36:22 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 21:37:44 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Retroreflectors In-Reply-To: <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz>; from bobriks@volny.cz on Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 08:33:30PM +0200 References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src><15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz><20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> Message-ID: <20030806223622.A723@beton.cybernet.src> On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 08:33:30PM +0200, bobriks@volny.cz wrote: > > >At > > >http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/installing.php > > >I can not find how many retroreflectors are to be used > > >according to a distance between the peers. Please > > >where is the table with data? > > > > http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/modules.php > > under section Material Required > > Thank you. Just a note: on my opinion for a distance > 1145m a car warning triangle is not enough at all! Do you think car warning triangle has more retroreflector area than 7 big red triangular retroreflectors with 16cm side? Cl< From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 6 23:40:56 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Wed Aug 6 21:41:35 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: Otazky na Ronju In-Reply-To: <3F3157E2.2050705@syndrome.sk>; from devnull@syndrome.sk on Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 09:32:50PM +0200 References: <3F3157E2.2050705@syndrome.sk> Message-ID: <20030806224056.B723@beton.cybernet.src> On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 09:32:50PM +0200, Rado wrote: > Zdravim! > 1) Projekt poznam uz dlhsiu dobu (od dob myslim este 115 kbps pojitka), > ale nikdy som nesiel hlboko do detailov. Zacala ma ale lakat myslienka > nieco podobne si postavit. Mam ale otazku (prepac, ak to mas na > strankach, uz par mesiacov mam stiahnute dokumenty z tvojich stranok a > nikde som to nenasiel). Radsi si procti nove texty - neco se tam opravovalo. > Akou mierou je dosah/spolahlivost Ronje 10M Metropolis ovplyvnena > "vlnenim svetla" (snad chapes, co myslim) zapricinenym teplym vzduchom > nad strechami panelakov v lete (zamer je totiz spojit strechy 2 panelakov)? Kdyz se to da moc nizko nad tu strechu tak to vadi. Je potreba co nejvys - napriklad metr nad rozpalenou strechou nebo jeste vic. Nejlepsi je to dat aby to nad tou rozpalenou strechou slo co nejkratsi cestu - neco podobnyho se pise v navode. > > 2) Precital som si diskusiu na roote a podla mna mas plne pravo byt > nasr**y. Mozno je sice pravda, ze si od dotycneho, co upravil tvoj > projtekt, chcel nieco, co mu GPL neprikazuje, ale aj tak by som bol > zvedavy, ci aspon platiacim zakaznikom spominanu _kompletnu_ > dokumentaciu poskytol. Kazdopadne by si to asi mal hodit za hlavu (viem, > ze sa to lahko povie) a ist dalej. Drzim ti palce v zlepsovani Ronje a > nenechaj sa znechutit tym, ze ti banda vecnych rypalov bude furt nieco > vycitat. Prave to bych rad udelal :) Diky. Cl< From bobriks at volny.cz Thu Aug 7 01:54:00 2003 From: bobriks at volny.cz (bobriks@volny.cz) Date: Wed Aug 6 23:54:06 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Retroreflectors In-Reply-To: <20030806223622.A723@beton.cybernet.src> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src><15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz><20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806223622.A723@beton.cybernet.src> Message-ID: > On Wed, Aug 06, 2003 at 08:33:30PM +0200, > bobriks@volny.cz wrote: > > > >At > > > >http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/installing.php > > > >I can not find how many retroreflectors are to be > > > >used according to a distance between the peers. > > > >Please where is the table with data? > > > > > > http://ronja.twibright.com/metropolis/modules.php > > > under section Material Required > > > > Thank you. Just a note: on my opinion for a distance > > 1145m a car warning triangle is not enough at all! > > Do you think car warning triangle has more retroreflector > area than 7 big red triangular retroreflectors with 16cm > side? I wrote: "a car warning triangle is NOT enough at all". ;) Refering to a common Czech triangle with approx. 30cm long and 5cm wide reflecting side and empty space inside. Of course, I believe that 7 big red 16^3cm triangles would be enough for our distance! I've bought 8 pcs already. :) -- Hork? l?to s VOLN?: Vyhraj Ford s klimatizac?! Vice na http://soutez.volny.cz From if at sil.at Thu Aug 7 02:20:11 2003 From: if at sil.at (Ingo Flaschberger) Date: Thu Aug 7 00:20:13 2003 Subject: [Ronja] use other / brigther leds? Message-ID: Hi is it possibble to use the Toshiba TLOH190P? http://www.semicon.toshiba.co.jp/openb2b/servlet/websearch/pip2a9.ws.cSearchResult-getPIO?key=TLOH190P%28F%29&objectID=pdf%3Adocget.jsp%253Fpid%253DTLOH190P%2526lang%253Den&extension=PDF outline: 10mm led 33cd 4 viewing angle available at: http://www.hosfelt.com/ thnx, Ingo -- we own the fibre; 9.6.98 illiad From clock at twibright.com Thu Aug 7 10:32:59 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Thu Aug 7 08:33:17 2003 Subject: [Ronja] use other / brigther leds? In-Reply-To: ; from if@sil.at on Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 01:20:11AM +0200 References: Message-ID: <20030807093258.A6477@beton.cybernet.src> On Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 01:20:11AM +0200, Ingo Flaschberger wrote: > Hi > > is it possibble to use the Toshiba TLOH190P? > > http://www.semicon.toshiba.co.jp/openb2b/servlet/websearch/pip2a9.ws.cSearchResult-getPIO?key=TLOH190P%28F%29&objectID=pdf%3Adocget.jsp%253Fpid%253DTLOH190P%2526lang%253Den&extension=PDF Unfortunately not. The bad factors: * orange colour * 50mA max current * low viewing angle It would work, but just only on short distance. Cl< > > outline: > 10mm led > 33cd > 4 viewing angle > > available at: http://www.hosfelt.com/ > > thnx, > Ingo > > -- > we own the fibre; 9.6.98 illiad > > _______________________________________________ > Ronja mailing list > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja From clock at twibright.com Thu Aug 7 10:57:29 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Thu Aug 7 08:57:38 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: sponzoring In-Reply-To: <3F320177.9000008@bithill.net>; from matl@bithill.net on Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 09:36:23AM +0200 References: <3F320177.9000008@bithill.net> Message-ID: <20030807095729.B8215@beton.cybernet.src> Ahoj On Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 09:36:23AM +0200, Rostislav Matl wrote: > Chtel jsem te poprosit, jestli bude nejaky zasadni posun kolem ronji > interpolis, abys mi dal > vedet. BTW tusis, kolik bude stat vyroba jednoho spoje ? Myslim > soucastky, ja se v tom Cena bude primo umerna dosahu, nejaky desitky tisic na spoj. > nevyznam, ale mam kamarada, ktery by mi to mozna poslepoval. V jake > fazi je stavba > prototypu ? Ted je laboratorne overena realizovatelnost samotne optiky laseroveho vysilace. Cl< From p.deelman at hccnet.nl Thu Aug 7 17:24:34 2003 From: p.deelman at hccnet.nl (Patrick Deelman) Date: Thu Aug 7 15:09:34 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src><15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz><20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> Message-ID: <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> I have seen some messages regarding a 100mbit version of ronja around jan 2003 by john. There is also report of the dessto, but i don't see much progress there (well i only can find a site with some schemetics in a format i can't read with my programs :( I don't have eagle) So my question is whether someone is still working on a 100mbit version. I sure would be intrested in that :) Ow and by the way. Why is that radio amateurs are reaching distances from 100 miles (160km) and more (okay i know they are DX-records) but compared to the 1,7 km ronja reaches it's rather limited. Is it really so hard to reach lets say 5km? or 10km? Patrick From matt at tmmz.net Thu Aug 7 13:26:48 2003 From: matt at tmmz.net (Matthew Zahorik) Date: Thu Aug 7 17:27:11 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> References: <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20030807103555.038a01a0@mail.tmmz.net> At 04:24 PM 8/7/2003 +0000, Patrick Deelman wrote: >So my question is whether someone is still working on a 100mbit version. I >sure would be intrested in that :) Me too! >Ow and by the way. Why is that radio amateurs are reaching distances from >100 miles (160km) and more (okay i know they Well, there are a couple of things working against Ronja... The lower the wavelength, the further the signal will go. Light is a really, really, really high wavelength. (terahertz) The corollary is that the higher the wavelength, the more information carrying capacity you have. Which means that at lower wavelengths you need wide swaths of spectrum to get a decent amount of information across. High wavelengths such as light can transmit a staggering amount of information in a very narrow frequency range. Ronja is woefully under using the information carrying capacity of light. (think fiber optics) Finally, radio frequencies are regulated. Light currently isn't. So, to answer your question.. yes, radio amateurs do go 100s of kms and more. They use up huge chunks of frequencies to do so and ultimately their fastest speeds are only a match for the crudest optical setups. More refined optical links will far outpace them. Now, to address distance in Ronja. First and foremost the enemy of distance is aiming this sucker. As you extend the distance, even minute changes on the transmitter end translate into wide arcs at the receiving end. Please realize no mount is 100% solid - even the most solid building sways slightly in the wind, mounts change with temperature, and more. What you need to counteract this all is a precise aiming system. Complex and costly. Ronja could switch to lasers, it adds cost but gets more photons over the distance. The question with lasers is eye safety - as you crank the power you can cause real damage to people who inadvertently look in the laser's direction - or worse yet point a pair of binoculars in the laser's direction. Every laser beam spreads over distance as a result of focusing and scattering, and that circle can be many meters wide at the receiving end - so it is possible that someone with a window near the receiver could be hurt. To address someone sticking their face in the transmitter lens, there are systems that quickly shut off the laser if contact is lost and does only very quick and eye safe pulses to regain contact, but that once again adds costs. Ronja's current LEDs are safer - they're so bright you turn away and because they're not coherent laser light they won't seriously hurt your eyes for that brief exposure. But that lack of coherency makes them less likely to cross the distance - the non-coherent light, no matter how well it is focused, won't stay together as well as a laser. It's also difficult to find high powered LEDs that switch fast enough to sustain 100Mb. Finally, there's the curve of the planet. Light goes in a straight line. Lower frequency radio waves can curve around the horizon. This means for a significant distance, you need to get both transmit and receive way high up on a tower to see over the horizon. Microwaves (GHz radio waves) have the same limitations. So, in summary, add precise and constantly adjustable aiming to Ronja, (and the logic to control that aiming) crank up the brightness, maybe add a encoding method that is handles noise better, maybe use lasers, and you should be able to get significant distances. Of course, all this makes Ronja harder and more expensive to build. For me, the perfect Ronja is 100Mb, self-aiming over shorter distances (0.5km to 2km), eye safe, is a circuit that works on a board, and has a auto negotiating twisted pair port. (ie. something that only needs course aiming and doesn't require going out and constantly re-aiming it) With that my friends and I can set up a reliable, high speed, mesh to share bandwidth. Thanks! - Matt ps. The perfect, perfect Ronja is one that has both the Ethernet TX/RX, Optical TX/RX, and a couple of auxiliary lines into fed into a FPGA. This would give us a programmable Ronja - people could program the FPGA to do whatever they'd like (different link encoding, encryption, autoneg, speed negotiation on the optical link, steering logic, whatever) using a single hardware design. Don't know if that's feasible - I'm a software/logic guy, not a hardware guy. If the hardware is standard, it would be feasible to maybe even construct and sell a kit as a business... From p.deelman at hccnet.nl Thu Aug 7 19:56:51 2003 From: p.deelman at hccnet.nl (Patrick Deelman) Date: Thu Aug 7 17:41:49 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20030807103555.038a01a0@mail.tmmz.net> References: <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <5.2.1.1.0.20030807103555.038a01a0@mail.tmmz.net> Message-ID: <3F32A0F3.2070100@hccnet.nl> Matthew Zahorik wrote: > At 04:24 PM 8/7/2003 +0000, Patrick Deelman wrote: > >> So my question is whether someone is still working on a 100mbit >> version. I sure would be intrested in that :) > > > Me too! > >> Ow and by the way. Why is that radio amateurs are reaching distances >> from 100 miles (160km) and more (okay i know they > > > The lower the wavelength, the further the signal will go. Light is a > really, really, really high wavelength. (terahertz) i just cutted the rest of the story :) It was mega intresting and i must agree with you on your points. But (there is the but) you were talking about amateurs and lower frequencies. There are also amateurs experimenting with laser and they can reach more then 100miles http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2000/07/06/1/ this is a standard el cheapo $2,80 laser pointers over 12,8 miles (about 20km) http://www.k3pgp.org/ click on laser DX-records you will see 95+ miles records :) (one 95,6 mile, one 118 mile and one 153,97 miles) Patrick From matt at tmmz.net Thu Aug 7 13:58:32 2003 From: matt at tmmz.net (Matthew Zahorik) Date: Thu Aug 7 17:58:54 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <3F32A0F3.2070100@hccnet.nl> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20030807103555.038a01a0@mail.tmmz.net> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <5.2.1.1.0.20030807103555.038a01a0@mail.tmmz.net> Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20030807124637.00bb1a20@mail.tmmz.net> At 06:56 PM 8/7/2003 +0000, Patrick Deelman wrote: >There are also amateurs experimenting with laser and they can reach more >then 100miles >http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2000/07/06/1/ >this is a standard el cheapo $2,80 laser pointers over 12,8 miles (about 20km) >http://www.k3pgp.org/ >click on laser DX-records Yeah, I've seen those before. Especially one who didn't use the laser for digital communications, but modulated a VHF television signal over the laser. As I said, lasers will give you more distance. Those particular instances were low bit rates. 9600bps, 56Kbps, maybe as high as 1Mbps. Because of their low speed, they also used off the shelf modulators with noise-resistant encodings (the kind used for infrared ports in laptops and the like). The slower you go, the easier it is to pick out the signal from the noise. Crank up the speed, and you require a cleaner signal. The 100mi contacts were just that, contacts a minimal amount of data exchanged. Also, these long distance contacts had people standing there doing real careful alignments and re-alignments. Keeping a link running reliably week after week is Ronja's goal. Doable? Yes! 10 or 100Mbps over 20mi? 100mi? Sure! It's just gets significantly harder as you add on the distance. Keeping the thing aimed is the hardest part. Lasers at 50mW can easily push enough light across that distance. Thanks! - Matt From p.deelman at hccnet.nl Thu Aug 7 20:51:00 2003 From: p.deelman at hccnet.nl (Patrick Deelman) Date: Thu Aug 7 18:35:57 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20030807103555.038a01a0@mail.tmmz.net> References: <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <5.2.1.1.0.20030807103555.038a01a0@mail.tmmz.net> Message-ID: <3F32ADA4.1080205@hccnet.nl> Matthew Zahorik wrote: > > ps. The perfect, perfect Ronja is one that has both the Ethernet > TX/RX, Optical TX/RX, and a couple of auxiliary lines into fed into a > FPGA. This would give us a programmable Ronja - people could program > the FPGA to do whatever they'd like (different link encoding, > encryption, autoneg, speed negotiation on the optical link, steering > logic, whatever) using a single hardware design. Don't know if that's > feasible - I'm a software/logic guy, not a hardware guy. If the > hardware is standard, it would be feasible to maybe even construct and > sell a kit as a business... Now it's time for me to mess up 2 posts :) first of all i would to comment on the ps of your first post :) all those things would really be ideal, but face the facts. Personally i would jump in the sky if we only had UTP :) FPGA is fun and you can do lots of things with it, but stuff like encryption nah... i personally like to do that inside my own computer and encryption is a bit useless when it's almost impossible to tap the signal. Autoneg and speedneg are done in the 6652 (that chip crusader uses for example) that's what those chips are for :)) steering logic ? for what do you need that for ? so that the laser can trim itself out ? Well it's feasible, because the 6652 has a serial port from which you can read out different kind of stuff (but how? don't ask me :) the datasheet is a bit limited in it's information) Now for your 2nd post :) low speed, higher noise. It sound logical. Stupid me :) and reallignment over and over again, true. But as far as i can make out, the 20km link with those cheapo laserpointers worked for a day or so. Or at least a couple of hours :) And then that laser eye-safety thing...... Troubelish, well just put out a warning over local television "you are warned not to look at 223 degrees in the whateverstreet at 45 meters height, your eyes WILL be damaged". Maybe that will work :) But then again are there really ppl standing on roofs looking right into lasers ? If you limit the dangerous links to only high rooftops it should be reasonably safe for ppl. Just combine it with wifi and ronja LED (hopefully with 100mbit) to spots lower on roofs, but the higher distance links should be laser on high buildings. By the way, isn't it so that at a certain distance a low power laser (lets say 5mW laser) the risk of damaging your eyes isn't that high anymore ? I haven't worked with lasers that much :) only those laserpointer toy things Patrick From matt at tmmz.net Thu Aug 7 16:26:22 2003 From: matt at tmmz.net (Matthew Zahorik) Date: Thu Aug 7 20:26:28 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <3F32ADA4.1080205@hccnet.nl> References: <5.2.1.1.0.20030807103555.038a01a0@mail.tmmz.net> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src> <15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz> <20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <5.2.1.1.0.20030807103555.038a01a0@mail.tmmz.net> Message-ID: <5.2.1.1.0.20030807144836.00bcc498@mail.tmmz.net> At 07:51 PM 8/7/2003 +0000, you wrote: > those chips are for :)) steering logic ? for what do you need > that for ? so that the laser can trim itself out ? Logic that controls a stepper motor to turn and aim the laser. Some sort of search program would be in order, using some preset protocol that both sides search for. The units would then do minor adjustments over time to compensate for movement. > worked for a day or so. Or at least a couple of hours :) Yeah, moving from hobbyist to real world use will require uninterrupted use for months on end (: Stick a battery and solar cell and you don't even need power... > By the way, isn't it so that at a certain distance a low > power laser (lets say 5mW laser) the risk of damaging your > eyes isn't that high anymore ? I haven't worked with lasers > that much :) only those laserpointer toy things Certain frequencies are more troublesome than others. IR is partially absorbed by the cornea, but visible frequencies are very efficiently focused onto the retina by the lens. (duh) The danger with lasers is that they are coherent light - they deliver all of their power into a small space and can do significant damage before you can look away. Yes, real low power lasers have different degrees of eye safeness. Look on the web for the differences between Class I, II, III and IIIb lasers. Class I lasers are generally completely eye safe, II and above are eye unsafe over various time intervals. Laser pointer things are generally IIIb - stare into them for too long and you'll damage your eyes. They don't cause instant damage though, and most people turn away from the brightness long before that. Most people prefer low power visible lasers because you can see them - you can mistakenly stare into IR lasers and not know it. Again, look at the web to find out the exact regulations. In the US it's managed by the agency responsible for health and safety, not the FCC. The danger of lasers is that as optical links become more popular are from those that go off target and shine into people's windows, not the ones properly targeted at other roofs. I would hate to blind someone eating dinner next door because my laser fell off the mount and is shining in their window. Better the neighbor complain about the bright light rather than the loss of his/her eyesight. - Matt From clock at twibright.com Fri Aug 8 09:06:17 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Fri Aug 8 07:06:23 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl>; from p.deelman@hccnet.nl on Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 04:24:34PM +0000 References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src><15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz><20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> Message-ID: <20030808080617.A218@beton.cybernet.src> On Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 04:24:34PM +0000, Patrick Deelman wrote: > I have seen some messages regarding a 100mbit version of ronja around > jan 2003 by john. There is also report of the dessto, but i don't see > much progress there (well i only can find a site with some schemetics in > a format i can't read with my programs :( I don't have eagle) > > So my question is whether someone is still working on a 100mbit version. > I sure would be intrested in that :) I will work on it as soon as the sniffer and Interpolis will be ready. > > Ow and by the way. Why is that radio amateurs are reaching distances > from 100 miles (160km) and more (okay i know they are DX-records) but > compared to the 1,7 km ronja reaches it's rather limited. Is it really > so hard to reach lets say 5km? or 10km? They were doing it in clear weather. Ronja must work also in rain etc. And they were using lasers, Metropolis still uses plain LEDs :) Cl< From klapek at kki.net.pl Fri Aug 8 09:34:50 2003 From: klapek at kki.net.pl (Tomasz Koprowski) Date: Fri Aug 8 08:58:46 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <5.2.1.1.0.20030807144836.00bcc498@mail.tmmz.net> References: <3F32ADA4.1080205@hccnet.nl> Message-ID: <3F3360AA.32548.14F4C5@localhost> Hello, > > those chips are for :)) steering logic ? for what do you need > that for > ? so that the laser can trim itself out ? > > Logic that controls a stepper motor to turn and aim the laser. Some sort ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Some one on pl.misc.elektronika suggested using in such a case 2 or 4 loudspeakers. A small diode laser doesn't weight much so you can use loadspeakers as quite precise actuators by simply applying voltages to them. In the receiver you place a cross made of 5 receiver diodes and control signal strength on them - this way you can get to know in which direction the transmitter should be moved. Yet, as you have written, this greatly complicates the design. Designing a Ronja-like device with current features requires knowledge in the fields of electronics (analogue and digital), optics and mechanics. Adding an auto-aiming (correcting) system would require control theory knowledge as well. Regards, Tomek Koprowski From bobriks at volny.cz Fri Aug 8 11:37:37 2003 From: bobriks at volny.cz (bobriks@volny.cz) Date: Fri Aug 8 09:37:40 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <20030808080617.A218@beton.cybernet.src> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src><15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz><20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> <20030808080617.A218@beton.cybernet.src> Message-ID: > > So my question is whether someone is still working on > > a 100mbit version. A group of guys here in Czechia work hardly on 100Mbit. But! First, their philosophy is much more commercial, i.e. no GNU/GPL, but a typical final product for sale. That means high price in the beginning which will gradualy fall down, or will be new models for the same price. Second, there are still heavy problems with that 100Mbit version and they are not finally solved. On every case, it will work with different hw than Ronja, using laser and for the shorter distances than mechanically equal 10Mbit one. see: http://czfree.net/forum/showthread.php?postid=50283#post50283 -- Hork? l?to s VOLN?: Vyhraj Ford s klimatizac?! Vice na http://soutez.volny.cz From bobriks at volny.cz Fri Aug 8 11:46:32 2003 From: bobriks at volny.cz (bobriks@volny.cz) Date: Fri Aug 8 09:46:34 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Development management In-Reply-To: <20030808080617.A218@beton.cybernet.src> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src><15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz><20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> <20030808080617.A218@beton.cybernet.src> Message-ID: <415e8e4ab8ebda61598112b6e9c9e6b2@www2.mail.volny.cz> > From: "Clock" > Date: 8.8.2003 - 8:06:25 > On Thu, Aug 07, 2003 at 04:24:34PM +0000, Patrick > Deelman wrote: > > So my question is whether someone is still working on > > a 100mbit version. > > I will work on it as soon as the sniffer and Interpolis > will be ready. > It is a basic mistake, on my mind. We must try to improve a management of further open Ronja's development to make it much more efficient!!! It is impossible to let all the work onto a single Clock. Please any concrete suggestions?! ;) -- Hork? l?to s VOLN?: Vyhraj Ford s klimatizac?! Vice na http://soutez.volny.cz From if at sil.at Fri Aug 8 15:09:09 2003 From: if at sil.at (Ingo Flaschberger) Date: Fri Aug 8 13:09:18 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <20030808080617.A218@beton.cybernet.src> References: <20030806151910.A355@beton.cybernet.src><15af0e6583d0885074d83a82c9d01bb1@www1.mail.volny.cz><20030806151213.GA18370@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> <20030808080617.A218@beton.cybernet.src> Message-ID: Hi > > I sure would be intrested in that :) > > I will work on it as soon as the sniffer and Interpolis will be ready. you use laser? because of the slow leds? is it possible to generate very short pulses with leds? then more than one led could be used (perhaps 4?) and the signal could be split over the 4 leds -> slower datarate for every led? bye, Ingo From clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz Fri Aug 8 19:22:05 2003 From: clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Karel Kulhavy) Date: Fri Aug 8 17:22:11 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: References: <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> <20030808080617.A218@beton.cybernet.src> Message-ID: <20030808162204.GA29135@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > Hi > > > > I sure would be intrested in that :) > > > > I will work on it as soon as the sniffer and Interpolis will be ready. > > you use laser? because of the slow leds? Yes. > > is it possible to generate very short pulses with leds? No, those LEDs I use on Metropolis are suitable just for the 10Mbps rate. It is impossible to generate even short pulses with low repeat pulses with the LEDs. Cl< From if at sil.at Fri Aug 8 19:23:21 2003 From: if at sil.at (Ingo Flaschberger) Date: Fri Aug 8 17:23:27 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <20030808162204.GA29135@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> References: <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> <20030808080617.A218@beton.cybernet.src> <20030808162204.GA29135@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: Hi > > is it possible to generate very short pulses with leds? > > No, those LEDs I use on Metropolis are suitable just for the 10Mbps > rate. It is impossible to generate even short pulses with low > repeat pulses with the LEDs. whats the data-rate? 125MHz? bye, Ingo From clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz Fri Aug 8 19:26:21 2003 From: clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Karel Kulhavy) Date: Fri Aug 8 17:26:22 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: References: <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> <20030808080617.A218@beton.cybernet.src> <20030808162204.GA29135@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: <20030808162620.GC29213@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > Hi > > > > is it possible to generate very short pulses with leds? > > > > No, those LEDs I use on Metropolis are suitable just for the 10Mbps > > rate. It is impossible to generate even short pulses with low > > repeat pulses with the LEDs. > > whats the data-rate? 125MHz? Data rate is 100Mbps. Modulation speed is 125Mbaud (maximum frequency 62.5MHz). Cl< From sorin_a99 at yahoo.com Sat Aug 9 05:52:26 2003 From: sorin_a99 at yahoo.com (popa-popescu sorin-gabriel) Date: Sat Aug 9 12:52:33 2003 Subject: [Ronja] rise time... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <20030809115226.46031.qmail@web14006.mail.yahoo.com> ------------------------------------------------ 62.5Mhz is max.modulation for 100Base-FX (media converters).. an ordinary laserpointer (cheaper 2-3euro) can work at this speed. i think an goog correlation (from my point view) is: 17-18Mhz --- 20ns rise time (hpwt leds and infrared leds for comunication like OPE5687HP,..) 35Mhz --- 10-8ns rise time ( TSFF5200/5400 infrared led...) 70Mhz --- 3-5ns rise time (ELD-870f-525 infrared led -http://www.roithner-laser.com/LED_diverse.htm -- ) 100Mhz --- 1ns rise time any cheaper laserpointer .(you have 2 adapt. electronics for it) ------------- bpw43 --- 4ns rise time .. i think 60-70Mhz should work with it sfh203 --- 5ns rise time .. max 60-70Mhz.. but have big capacitance.... i think isn't an bad calculate..:)).. i hope..:)) -------------------------------- --- ronja-request@lists.pointless.net wrote: > Send Ronja mailing list submissions to > ronja@lists.pointless.net > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, > visit > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja > or, via email, send a message with subject or body > 'help' to > ronja-request@lists.pointless.net > > You can reach the person managing the list at > ronja-owner@lists.pointless.net > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it > is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Ronja digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: 100mbit link (Ingo Flaschberger) > 2. Re: 100mbit link (Karel Kulhavy) > 3. Re: 100mbit link (Ingo Flaschberger) > 4. Re: 100mbit link (Karel Kulhavy) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 14:09:09 +0200 (CEST) > From: Ingo Flaschberger > Subject: Re: [Ronja] 100mbit link > To: GPL free-space optical datalink > > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > Hi > > > > I sure would be intrested in that :) > > > > I will work on it as soon as the sniffer and > Interpolis will be ready. > > you use laser? because of the slow leds? > > is it possible to generate very short pulses with > leds? > then more than one led could be used (perhaps 4?) > and the signal could be > split over the 4 leds -> slower datarate for every > led? > > bye, Ingo > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 18:22:05 +0200 > From: Karel Kulhavy > Subject: Re: [Ronja] 100mbit link > To: GPL free-space optical datalink > > Message-ID: > <20030808162204.GA29135@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > > Hi > > > > > > I sure would be intrested in that :) > > > > > > I will work on it as soon as the sniffer and > Interpolis will be ready. > > > > you use laser? because of the slow leds? > > Yes. > > > > > is it possible to generate very short pulses with > leds? > > No, those LEDs I use on Metropolis are suitable just > for the 10Mbps > rate. It is impossible to generate even short pulses > with low > repeat pulses with the LEDs. > > Cl< > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 18:23:21 +0200 (CEST) > From: Ingo Flaschberger > Subject: Re: [Ronja] 100mbit link > To: GPL free-space optical datalink > > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > Hi > > > > is it possible to generate very short pulses > with leds? > > > > No, those LEDs I use on Metropolis are suitable > just for the 10Mbps > > rate. It is impossible to generate even short > pulses with low > > repeat pulses with the LEDs. > > whats the data-rate? 125MHz? > > bye, Ingo > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 18:26:21 +0200 > From: Karel Kulhavy > Subject: Re: [Ronja] 100mbit link > To: GPL free-space optical datalink > > Message-ID: > <20030808162620.GC29213@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > > Hi > > > > > > is it possible to generate very short pulses > with leds? > > > > > > No, those LEDs I use on Metropolis are suitable > just for the 10Mbps > > > rate. It is impossible to generate even short > pulses with low > > > repeat pulses with the LEDs. > > > > whats the data-rate? 125MHz? > > Data rate is 100Mbps. Modulation speed is 125Mbaud > (maximum frequency > 62.5MHz). > > Cl< > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Ronja mailing list > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja > > > End of Ronja Digest, Vol 4, Issue 10 > ************************************ __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From highlander_____ at hotmail.com Sat Aug 9 16:07:08 2003 From: highlander_____ at hotmail.com (Highlander) Date: Sat Aug 9 14:06:32 2003 Subject: [Ronja] rise time... References: <20030809115226.46031.qmail@web14006.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: SFH203 and BPW43 works with 100Mb. Developer of Crusader project Lada Myslik tested it. But big problem is self capacitance, so SFH203 or BPW43 needs realy high bias voltage. About 50V. Highlander. ----- Original Message ----- From: "popa-popescu sorin-gabriel" To: Sent: Saturday, August 09, 2003 1:52 PM Subject: [Ronja] rise time... > ------------------------------------------------ > 62.5Mhz is max.modulation for 100Base-FX (media > converters).. an ordinary laserpointer (cheaper > 2-3euro) can work at this speed. i think an goog > correlation (from my point view) is: > 17-18Mhz --- 20ns rise time (hpwt leds and infrared > leds for comunication like OPE5687HP,..) > 35Mhz --- 10-8ns rise time ( TSFF5200/5400 infrared > led...) > 70Mhz --- 3-5ns rise time (ELD-870f-525 infrared led > -http://www.roithner-laser.com/LED_diverse.htm -- ) > > 100Mhz --- 1ns rise time any cheaper laserpointer > .(you have 2 adapt. electronics for it) > ------------- > bpw43 --- 4ns rise time .. i think 60-70Mhz should > work with it > sfh203 --- 5ns rise time .. max 60-70Mhz.. but have > big capacitance.... > i think isn't an bad calculate..:)).. i hope..:)) > > -------------------------------- > > > > > > > > --- ronja-request@lists.pointless.net wrote: > > Send Ronja mailing list submissions to > > ronja@lists.pointless.net > > > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, > > visit > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja > > or, via email, send a message with subject or body > > 'help' to > > ronja-request@lists.pointless.net > > > > You can reach the person managing the list at > > ronja-owner@lists.pointless.net > > > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it > > is more specific > > than "Re: Contents of Ronja digest..." > > > > > > Today's Topics: > > > > 1. Re: 100mbit link (Ingo Flaschberger) > > 2. Re: 100mbit link (Karel Kulhavy) > > 3. Re: 100mbit link (Ingo Flaschberger) > > 4. Re: 100mbit link (Karel Kulhavy) > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Message: 1 > > Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 14:09:09 +0200 (CEST) > > From: Ingo Flaschberger > > Subject: Re: [Ronja] 100mbit link > > To: GPL free-space optical datalink > > > > Message-ID: > > > > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > > > Hi > > > > > > I sure would be intrested in that :) > > > > > > I will work on it as soon as the sniffer and > > Interpolis will be ready. > > > > you use laser? because of the slow leds? > > > > is it possible to generate very short pulses with > > leds? > > then more than one led could be used (perhaps 4?) > > and the signal could be > > split over the 4 leds -> slower datarate for every > > led? > > > > bye, Ingo > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 2 > > Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 18:22:05 +0200 > > From: Karel Kulhavy > > Subject: Re: [Ronja] 100mbit link > > To: GPL free-space optical datalink > > > > Message-ID: > > <20030808162204.GA29135@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > > > > Hi > > > > > > > > I sure would be intrested in that :) > > > > > > > > I will work on it as soon as the sniffer and > > Interpolis will be ready. > > > > > > you use laser? because of the slow leds? > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > is it possible to generate very short pulses with > > leds? > > > > No, those LEDs I use on Metropolis are suitable just > > for the 10Mbps > > rate. It is impossible to generate even short pulses > > with low > > repeat pulses with the LEDs. > > > > Cl< > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 3 > > Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 18:23:21 +0200 (CEST) > > From: Ingo Flaschberger > > Subject: Re: [Ronja] 100mbit link > > To: GPL free-space optical datalink > > > > Message-ID: > > > > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > > > > Hi > > > > > > is it possible to generate very short pulses > > with leds? > > > > > > No, those LEDs I use on Metropolis are suitable > > just for the 10Mbps > > > rate. It is impossible to generate even short > > pulses with low > > > repeat pulses with the LEDs. > > > > whats the data-rate? 125MHz? > > > > bye, Ingo > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > Message: 4 > > Date: Fri, 8 Aug 2003 18:26:21 +0200 > > From: Karel Kulhavy > > Subject: Re: [Ronja] 100mbit link > > To: GPL free-space optical datalink > > > > Message-ID: > > <20030808162620.GC29213@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > > > > Hi > > > > > > > > is it possible to generate very short pulses > > with leds? > > > > > > > > No, those LEDs I use on Metropolis are suitable > > just for the 10Mbps > > > > rate. It is impossible to generate even short > > pulses with low > > > > repeat pulses with the LEDs. > > > > > > whats the data-rate? 125MHz? > > > > Data rate is 100Mbps. Modulation speed is 125Mbaud > > (maximum frequency > > 62.5MHz). > > > > Cl< > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ronja mailing list > > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja > > > > > > End of Ronja Digest, Vol 4, Issue 10 > > ************************************ > > > __________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software > http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com > > _______________________________________________ > Ronja mailing list > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja > From jdalton at swiftdsl.com.au Mon Aug 11 16:20:22 2003 From: jdalton at swiftdsl.com.au (John Dalton) Date: Mon Aug 11 06:16:58 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl>; from p.deelman@hccnet.nl on Fri, Aug 08, 2003 at 02:24:34 +1000 References: <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> Message-ID: <20030811052022.GA18149@bing> > I have seen some messages regarding a 100mbit version of ronja around > jan 2003 by john. I'm still working on it. Progress is VERY slow though. I'm in the process of prototyping a promising transmitter. I've done a fair bit of simulation for a a receiver, but haven't built anything yet. I've also done a lot of design (and some basic experiments) for active aiming, in an attempt to make mounting more flexible. I'm trying to keep the design as simple as possible so the only source of components is the local electronics shop. Unfortunately, this means I have to design most circuits from first principles, using raw transistors and widely available ICs, which is slowing me down. Anyway, don't hold your breath waiting! Once I am happy with the transmitter, I will release it so Clock (or other person) can hopefully save some effort. Regards John From sorin_a99 at yahoo.com Mon Aug 11 06:56:53 2003 From: sorin_a99 at yahoo.com (popa-popescu sorin-gabriel) Date: Mon Aug 11 13:57:00 2003 Subject: [Ronja] SFH203 or BPW43 needs realy high voltage .50V. Message-ID: <20030811125653.67231.qmail@web14004.mail.yahoo.com> can you explain me what represent ''high voltage 50V''?.. tks.. sorry for my question...:)).. but really i don't understand.... tks.. __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From clock at twibright.com Mon Aug 11 17:17:13 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Mon Aug 11 17:17:14 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: =?iso-8859-2?q?=5Biso-8859-2=5D_=E8o=E8ky_k_ronje_a_ti=B9ten?= =?iso-8859-2?q?=E9_spoje_=28fwd=29?= In-Reply-To: ; from brain@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz on Sun, Aug 10, 2003 at 07:12:40PM +0200 References: Message-ID: <20020101011311.A240@beton.cybernet.src> Dobry den Cocky jsou lupy 130mm co se koupi u Vietnamcu. Daji se koupit v Holesovicke trznici v Praze, od hlavniho vchodu se jde 3m doprava a tam je stanek. Navrhu tistaku je nekolik ale o zadnem neni dokazano, ze chodi spolehlive. O nekterych je dokazano, ze chodi pouze nekdy nebo pouze za specialnich podminek. Na poradnem tistaku se pracuje. Najdete je v sekci Contrib/ u Modules. Prectete si archiv mailing listu a z tech prispevku kde se popisuje co komu chodilo a nechodilo zkuste usoudit, ktere tistaky jsou pro Vas nejvhodnejsi. Cl< On Sun, Aug 10, 2003 at 07:12:40PM +0200, Petr Kulhavy wrote: > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > Date: Sat, 19 Jul 2003 14:06:53 +0200 > From: "[iso-8859-2] Otto Sedl??ek" > To: brain@artax.karlin.mff.cuni.cz > Subject: [iso-8859-2] ?o?ky k ronje a ti?ten? spoje > > Rozhodl jsem se ,?e si postav?m Ronju ale nezjistil jsem jak? pou??v?te > ?o?ky. Tak bych se cht?l zeptat na optickou mohutnost t?ch ?o?ek a kde se > daj? sehnat.D?le sem se cht?l zeptat jestli nem?te n?vrh ti?t?n?ch spoj? pro > Ronju 10M. > > From bw at cexx.org Wed Aug 13 05:35:32 2003 From: bw at cexx.org (bw@cexx.org) Date: Thu Aug 14 09:39:04 2003 Subject: [Ronja] SFH203 or BPW43 needs realy high voltage .50V. In-Reply-To: <20030811125653.67231.qmail@web14004.mail.yahoo.com> References: <20030811125653.67231.qmail@web14004.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <3F3A0664.6080108@cexx.org> This means, for the end of the photodetector tied to +V, this +V must be a fairly high voltage (e.g. 50V) so that its speed is not affected so much by the photodetector's internal capacitance. The current Ronja design connects the photodiode to only +12V. popa-popescu sorin-gabriel wrote: > can you explain me what represent ''high voltage > 50V''?.. > tks.. sorry for my question...:)).. but really i don't > understand.... > tks.. From clock at twibright.com Sat Aug 16 00:20:07 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (Clock) Date: Fri Aug 15 20:20:07 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: =?iso-8859-2?q?Podez=F8el=E9_hodnoty_na_RX?= In-Reply-To: <20030815190000Z106087-17226+587072@mail.centrum.cz>; from vojtech.cizinsky@centrum.cz on Fri, Aug 15, 2003 at 08:59:51PM +0200 References: <20030815190000Z106087-17226+587072@mail.centrum.cz> Message-ID: <20030815232007.B5681@beton.cybernet.src> On Fri, Aug 15, 2003 at 08:59:51PM +0200, vojtech.cizinsky@centrum.cz wrote: > Zdravim do Prahy. Dostav?l jsem Ronju, po zapojeni sviti (obe dve). > Ale co je to platne, kdyz nefunguje. Merici body na vysilaci a aui > interfacu odpovidaji pravym hodnotam (odchylka max. 200mV). > > Prvni vec, na kterou se chci zeptat je, zda je na aui jednotce v bode > P56 11,94 resp. 11,99V v poradku (spravne uvadite 9,9V)? Ne. Takhle to nikdy nebude prijimat. > > Druha, o dost zavaznejsi, jsou potize s prijimaci. Pouzil jsem tr. > BF988, R106 mam 330 ohmu. Merici body P101,P102,P103,P105,P107 jsou > OK, ale: > na P104 mam namisto 6V-7V 11,72V!! R106 se ma nastavit. Nicmene to vypada podezrele, skoro jako by ten tranzistor nic nebral. > na P106 mam namisto 6V 0,89V Blbe > na P108 mam namisto 10,9V 1,7V Blbe > na P109 mam namisto 5,3V 0,23V Blbe > dukladne jsem to prohledl a ozkousel, zadny zkrat by tam nemel byt. Tak tak chybeji asi nekde nejake draty, nebo je neco zapojeno jinam, nebo neco ma jinou hodnotu, nebo jsou nektere soucastky odpraskle pripadne spalene letovanim (napr. pajkou na 400 stupnu po dobu 10 minut ;-] ) Cl< From farkas at szm.sk Sat Aug 16 00:25:21 2003 From: farkas at szm.sk (Richard Farkas) Date: Fri Aug 15 22:31:30 2003 Subject: =?ISO-8859-2?B?UmU6IFtSb25qYV0gUmU6IFBvZGV6+GVs6SBob2Rub3R5IG5hIFJY?= In-Reply-To: <20030815232007.B5681@beton.cybernet.src> References: <20030815190000Z106087-17226+587072@mail.centrum.cz> <20030815232007.B5681@beton.cybernet.src> Message-ID: <14354496063.20030815232521@szm.sk> >> Zdravim do Prahy. Dostav?l jsem Ronju, po zapojeni sviti (obe dve). >> Ale co je to platne, kdyz nefunguje. Merici body na vysilaci a aui >> interfacu odpovidaji pravym hodnotam (odchylka max. 200mV). C> Tak tak chybeji asi nekde nejake draty, nebo je neco zapojeno jinam, nebo neco C> ma jinou hodnotu, nebo jsou nektere soucastky odpraskle pripadne spalene C> letovanim (napr. pajkou na 400 stupnu po dobu 10 minut ;-] ) moja ronja zatial chodi len v ramci obyvacky, ale kym som to docielil, ako neznaly pajkovania som uz mal hlavu v smutku. tiez niektore meracie body boli dobre a niektore nie. nakoniec sa ukazalo (po DRUHOM kontrolnom prechode schemou), ze jeden integrac bol nuteny fungovat bez napajania a jeden spoj v AUI (to bola cista nahoda, ze som to nasiel) drzal len kolofoniou, nie cinom. vela zdaru a pevne nervy :) -- S pozdravom, Richard Farkas mailto:farkas@szm.sk From sorin_a99 at yahoo.com Fri Aug 15 16:12:50 2003 From: sorin_a99 at yahoo.com (popa-popescu sorin-gabriel) Date: Fri Aug 15 23:12:57 2003 Subject: [Ronja] laserpointers life...leds.. Message-ID: <20030815221250.8994.qmail@web14007.mail.yahoo.com> Anyone know if laserpointers have longer life than leds? ( about those cheapest pointers) i understand that winter is ''major test'' for good working. An ordinary laserpointer (2-4$) can resist in combination with Ronja for a long time? (1-3 years) and, how can be improved an laser pointer 2 have long life over Ronja?.. tks.. Anyone here have an ronja laser link stable over 6 month without any laser problems? .. tks.. it's possible that an chinese glass lens (90-130mm) to work bad with 880 nm spectrum? i tried with my OPE5687HP infrared led ( 880nm,45mW/100mA,max.1A, 44 degree) and 100mm dia lens at Tx and 128mm dia lens at Rx and over 1Km results was disastrous. 20mV at Rx!!!! and with hpwt-dh00-g400 i had only 10mV!!! .. ( my rx and tx are the same like in clock guide).. tks.... __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! SiteBuilder - Free, easy-to-use web site design software http://sitebuilder.yahoo.com From clock at twibright.com Sat Aug 16 18:38:02 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_'Clock'_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Sat Aug 16 14:37:52 2003 Subject: [Ronja] laserpointers life...leds.. In-Reply-To: <20030815221250.8994.qmail@web14007.mail.yahoo.com>; from sorin_a99@yahoo.com on Fri, Aug 15, 2003 at 03:12:50PM -0700 References: <20030815221250.8994.qmail@web14007.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20030816173802.A4993@beton.cybernet.src> On Fri, Aug 15, 2003 at 03:12:50PM -0700, popa-popescu sorin-gabriel wrote: > Anyone know if laserpointers have longer life than > leds? ( about those cheapest pointers) No, shorter. > i understand that winter is ''major test'' for good > working. > An ordinary laserpointer (2-4$) can resist in > combination with Ronja for a long time? (1-3 years) > and, how can be improved an laser pointer 2 have long > life over Ronja?.. tks.. > Anyone here have an ronja laser link stable over 6 > month without any laser problems? .. tks.. > it's possible that an chinese glass lens (90-130mm) to > work bad with 880 nm spectrum? Yes. Ordinary glass filters NIR a bit. You can see it's a bit blue - it filters the deepest red portion of spectrum too. > i tried with my OPE5687HP infrared led ( > 880nm,45mW/100mA,max.1A, 44 degree) and 100mm dia lens > at Tx and 128mm dia lens at Rx and over 1Km results > was disastrous. 20mV at Rx!!!! and with > hpwt-dh00-g400 i had only 10mV!!! .. ( my rx and tx > are the same like in clock guide).. > tks.... Cl< From clock at twibright.com Sat Aug 16 18:39:55 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_'Clock'_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Sat Aug 16 14:39:47 2003 Subject: =?iso-8859-2?Q?=5BRonja=5D_Re:_Podez=F8el=E9_hodnoty_na_RX?= In-Reply-To: <14354496063.20030815232521@szm.sk>; from farkas@szm.sk on Fri, Aug 15, 2003 at 11:25:21PM +0200 References: <20030815190000Z106087-17226+587072@mail.centrum.cz> <20030815232007.B5681@beton.cybernet.src> <14354496063.20030815232521@szm.sk> Message-ID: <20030816173955.B4993@beton.cybernet.src> On Fri, Aug 15, 2003 at 11:25:21PM +0200, Richard Farkas wrote: > >> Zdravim do Prahy. Dostav?l jsem Ronju, po zapojeni sviti (obe dve). > >> Ale co je to platne, kdyz nefunguje. Merici body na vysilaci a aui > >> interfacu odpovidaji pravym hodnotam (odchylka max. 200mV). > C> Tak tak chybeji asi nekde nejake draty, nebo je neco zapojeno jinam, nebo neco > C> ma jinou hodnotu, nebo jsou nektere soucastky odpraskle pripadne spalene > C> letovanim (napr. pajkou na 400 stupnu po dobu 10 minut ;-] ) > > moja ronja zatial chodi len v ramci obyvacky, ale kym som to docielil, > ako neznaly pajkovania som uz mal hlavu v smutku. tiez niektore > meracie body boli dobre a niektore nie. nakoniec sa ukazalo (po DRUHOM > kontrolnom prechode schemou), ze jeden integrac bol nuteny fungovat > bez napajania a jeden spoj v AUI (to bola cista nahoda, ze som to > nasiel) drzal len kolofoniou, nie cinom. Jo takove svinske spoje se odstrani kdyz clovek veme pajku a vsechny spoje naslepo znovy roztavi a necha (ciste) ztuhnout. Chybejici spoje by melo odhalit odskrtavani propiskou ve schematu (je to v navodu, pokud ne, tak me zmlatte :) ) Cl< > > vela zdaru a pevne nervy :) > > -- S pozdravom, Richard Farkas > mailto:farkas@szm.sk > > > > _______________________________________________ Ronja mailing list > Ronja@lists.pointless.net http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja From clock at twibright.com Sat Aug 16 23:08:42 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Sat Aug 16 19:08:33 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Thanks to Standa Bobrik for lending scope Message-ID: <20030816220842.A18408@beton.cybernet.src> I would like to thank Standa Bobrik for lending me his M621/E digital oscilloscope to support the Ronja project. http://www.etcsk.com/products/m621/ It's a dual-channel, 150MHz bandwidth, 50Ms/s regular sampling rate, 5Gs/s, interleaved sampling rate, 32768 samples/channel with a parallel port interface to the PC. It is said to be the only digital scope existing supporting Linux and I have already successfully measured with the scope under Linux :) The drivers are cumbersome, require root access even for the GUI application, nevertheless this clearly shows the overall trend in EDA - availability of more and more open source solutions :) Cl< From clock at twibright.com Sun Aug 17 15:53:21 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Sun Aug 17 11:53:13 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Advances on Ronja sniffer Message-ID: <20030817145321.A23351@beton.cybernet.src> I am pleased to announce that the redesign of digital part of the sniffer works. The first revision showed to be useless. I have performed first test of the redesign and the signal analysis resolution exceeded my expectations. Further improvements in the digital part and further validation tests are on the schedule. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Sun Aug 17 16:27:46 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Sun Aug 17 12:27:34 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: Sponsoring - How much In-Reply-To: ; from divorne@hotmail.com on Sun, Aug 17, 2003 at 10:57:07AM +0000 References: Message-ID: <20030817152746.B23401@beton.cybernet.src> On Sun, Aug 17, 2003 at 10:57:07AM +0000, Christian Divorne wrote: > Hello from Switzerland, > I'd like to know if possible the prices to sponsor your designs, for example > how much to finish Ronja 10M Interpolis, how much for Enhanced TP interface, > etc... I don't know - now I'm working on the sniffer (digital part - some tweak in digital part and building analog part is necessary and the design will be ready) and after finishing will release the cost of the design. > > My dream is a long distance 100M ronja, self/auto-aiming, eye-safe*, with auto-aiming is still a music of the future. Is not a key factor in these systems though. > enhanced TP interface and i would like know the price of my dream. :) As Ronja project is modular the price will consist of prices of individual steps toward your dream, first of which will be the sniffer, second Interpolis etc. (I think the sniffer will be nearly as comfortable to aim as autoaiming and still much much cheaper). > > *eye-safe: there are systems that quickly shut off the laser if contact is > lost and does only very quick and eye safe pulses to regain contact. > (source: http://lists.pointless.net/pipermail/ronja/2003-August/000709.html > ) I don't like this idea. I like an idea of passive safety which also brings other technical advantages to the system (better performance). Cl< From leos.kratochvil at worldonline.cz Sun Aug 17 23:36:35 2003 From: leos.kratochvil at worldonline.cz (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Leo=B9_Kratochv=EDl?=) Date: Sun Aug 17 22:38:23 2003 Subject: [Ronja] TCP / IP over Com port Message-ID: <007301c364ff$72162d80$0103a8c0@homer> Is it possible to make a TCP/IP connection over the serial port (COM) ? Is it possible in Microsoft Windows or I must use Linux? Sorry for my english :) From clock at twibright.com Mon Aug 18 02:44:01 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Sun Aug 17 22:43:54 2003 Subject: [Ronja] TCP / IP over Com port In-Reply-To: <007301c364ff$72162d80$0103a8c0@homer>; from leos.kratochvil@worldonline.cz on Sun, Aug 17, 2003 at 10:36:35PM +0200 References: <007301c364ff$72162d80$0103a8c0@homer> Message-ID: <20030818014401.B29736@beton.cybernet.src> On Sun, Aug 17, 2003 at 10:36:35PM +0200, Leo? Kratochv?l wrote: > Is it possible to make a TCP/IP connection over the serial port (COM) ? It is possible. man pppd. > Is it possible in Microsoft Windows or I must use Linux? I don't use Microsoft Windows so I don't know :( But dialup users use TCP/IP over serial port (COM) -- their modem so if the configurator is flexible enough it should work. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Mon Aug 18 13:50:46 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Mon Aug 18 09:50:37 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Sniffer progress Message-ID: <20030818125046.A1423@beton.cybernet.src> Today I have finished tweaking of the digital part of the sniffer and tested it. It seems to work fine. I tried to do some alignment with the sniffer and it is more sensitive than the RSSI. And the aligning comfort is much, much higher than with bare RSSI. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Tue Aug 19 00:17:18 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Mon Aug 18 20:17:12 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Two new installations Message-ID: <20030818231718.A31308@beton.cybernet.src> I have got a report about two new installations of Metropolis 1) Kecskemet, 1km 2) Zagreb, 500m The photos have been added to the gallery and also to the table of running installations Cl< From vojta at sinus.cz Tue Aug 19 15:19:33 2003 From: vojta at sinus.cz (=?iso-8859-2?q?Vojt=ECch=20Pithart?=) Date: Tue Aug 19 13:19:47 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: Prosim o pomoc s 10M metropolis In-Reply-To: <20030805102620.A17437@beton.cybernet.src> References: <200308041519.10029.vojta@sinus.cz> <20030805102620.A17437@beton.cybernet.src> Message-ID: <200308191419.33604.vojta@sinus.cz> > To je timhle. S BC546B to temer nefunguje. Vymente je za 2N3904 Tak jsem vymenu provedl a ejhle, dosah se zvysil. V jednom smeru 220 cm, ve druhem 150cm bez optiky. Je to jiz v poradku? From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 20 16:22:04 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Tue Aug 19 14:22:56 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: Prosim o pomoc s 10M metropolis In-Reply-To: <200308191419.33604.vojta@sinus.cz>; from vojta@sinus.cz on Tue, Aug 19, 2003 at 02:19:33PM +0200 References: <200308041519.10029.vojta@sinus.cz> <20030805102620.A17437@beton.cybernet.src> <200308191419.33604.vojta@sinus.cz> Message-ID: <20030820152204.A15700@beton.cybernet.src> On Tue, Aug 19, 2003 at 02:19:33PM +0200, Vojt?ch Pithart wrote: > > To je timhle. S BC546B to temer nefunguje. Vymente je za 2N3904 > Tak jsem vymenu provedl a ejhle, dosah se zvysil. V jednom smeru 220 cm, ve > druhem 150cm bez optiky. Je to jiz v poradku? Jo v zasade jo. Zalezi na sile osvetleni pri kterem to zkousite. Nam to delalo tak asi 250cm. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Wed Aug 20 20:17:31 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Tue Aug 19 18:18:18 2003 Subject: [Ronja] 100mbit link In-Reply-To: <20030811052022.GA18149@bing>; from jdalton@swiftdsl.com.au on Mon, Aug 11, 2003 at 03:20:22PM +1000 References: <001001c35c3d$0ffcebe0$020110ac@jklhome1> <3bf7f7a1047d4d3b5b2c0d2718cdeef0@www1.mail.volny.cz> <3F327D42.4080200@hccnet.nl> <20030811052022.GA18149@bing> Message-ID: <20030820191731.A16086@beton.cybernet.src> On Mon, Aug 11, 2003 at 03:20:22PM +1000, John Dalton wrote: > > I have seen some messages regarding a 100mbit version of ronja around > > jan 2003 by john. > > I'm still working on it. Progress is VERY slow though. > > I'm in the process of prototyping a promising transmitter. > I've done a fair bit of simulation for a a receiver, but haven't > built anything yet. I've also done a lot of design (and some > basic experiments) for active aiming, in an attempt to make > mounting more flexible. > > I'm trying to keep the design as simple as possible so the only > source of components is the local electronics shop. Unfortunately, > this means I have to design most circuits from first principles, > using raw transistors and widely available ICs, which is slowing > me down. > > Anyway, don't hold your breath waiting! Once I am happy with > the transmitter, I will release it so Clock (or other person) > can hopefully save some effort. Thanks. Looking forward. Cl< From zapadlo at melzer.cz Wed Aug 20 13:51:04 2003 From: zapadlo at melzer.cz (Petr Zapadlo) Date: Wed Aug 20 11:51:14 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Cocky - uvaha Message-ID: <200308201251.04293.zapadlo@melzer.cz> Dobry den nosim v hlave takovou myslenku a poprsil bych zda byste mi ji vyvratili nebo potvrdili. Podle mych zkusenosti je kvalita cocek kriticka predevsim na vysilaci. Na prijimaci jsem ruzne kvalitni cocky temer nepoznal. Vzhledem k tomu ze meopta prerov dela seriove max 10cm cocky, tak pouzit na vysilac 10cm a prijimac normalni vietnamskou 13cm. redukovalo by to dosah? Podle meho nazoru ne, ukolem vysilaci je soustredit paprsky do co nejuzssiho svazku a to by se mohlo s tou meoptackou cockou povest vyrazne lepe. Dekuji za nazory S pozdravem -- Petr "Zapik" Zapadlo Ing. Petr Zapadlo vedouc? odd?len? syst?mov? podpory Melzer, spol. s r.o. Doln? 71, 796 01 Prost?jov tel: 582 330 301 fax: 582 330 302 mailto: zapadlo@melzer.cz http://www.melzer.cz From clock at twibright.com Mon Aug 25 13:58:50 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Sun Aug 24 11:59:36 2003 Subject: [Ronja] sw patents protest Message-ID: <20030825125850.A16461@beton.cybernet.src> Hello I have "closed" Ronja website temporarily in protest against planned software patent introduction into Europe (and thus into Czech Republic when we join the European Union). Czech Republic doesn't have software patents at the moment. The original content is still accessible through a link on the page. Cl< From ladmanj at volny.cz Mon Aug 25 16:23:28 2003 From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman) Date: Mon Aug 25 14:23:50 2003 Subject: [Ronja] sw patents protest In-Reply-To: <1061815349.4378.512.camel@term-serv> References: <20030825125850.A16461@beton.cybernet.src> <1061815349.4378.512.camel@term-serv> Message-ID: <200308251523.28545.ladmanj@volny.cz> Ahoj Clocku, o problematice softwarov?ch patent? nic nev?m. Zn?? link na n?jak? shrnut? (nejl?pe v ?e?tin?)? Nic jsem o tom nikdy nesly?el, ale to co m? napad? jen podle n?zvu, m? t??ce d?s?. D?ky Jakub From clock at twibright.com Tue Aug 26 16:27:56 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Mon Aug 25 14:28:37 2003 Subject: [Ronja] sw patents protest In-Reply-To: <1061815349.4378.512.camel@term-serv>; from jason@plug.ca on Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 07:42:29AM -0500 References: <20030825125850.A16461@beton.cybernet.src> <1061815349.4378.512.camel@term-serv> Message-ID: <20030826152756.B3057@beton.cybernet.src> On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 07:42:29AM -0500, Jason Loughead wrote: > Is there any way I can help? We have a website ( http://www.plug.ca ) > for our Linux User Group, perhaps a story on it would be a good idea? There are links from the "closed" Ronja page. You can find a list of already closed down websites and also an online petition. Maybe you could consider "closing down" your website too. Cl< > > Regards, > Jason > > > On Mon, 2003-08-25 at 05:58, Karel Kulhav?? wrote: > > Hello > > > > I have "closed" Ronja website temporarily in protest against planned software > > patent introduction into Europe (and thus into Czech Republic when we join the > > European Union). Czech Republic doesn't have software patents at the moment. > > > > The original content is still accessible through a link on the page. > > > > Cl< > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Ronja mailing list > > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja > > > _______________________________________________ > Ronja mailing list > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja From clock at twibright.com Tue Aug 26 17:46:16 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Mon Aug 25 15:46:59 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: Montaz Ronji v Jicine In-Reply-To: <2322958620.20030825162352@volny.cz>; from ondrej.tesar@volny.cz on Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 04:23:52PM +0200 References: <396577317.20030623101028@volny.cz> <20030711083238.A291@beton.cybernet.cz> <1296250636.20030713111835@volny.cz> <20030713130538.E338@beton.cybernet.cz> <1023889670.20030714082745@volny.cz> <20030714135256.B9038@beton.cybernet.cz> <1881740733.20030714144022@volny.cz> <20030815130755.A248@beton.cybernet.src> <2322958620.20030825162352@volny.cz> Message-ID: <20030826164616.A3190@beton.cybernet.src> > Chtel jsem se zeptat, na kdy odhadujes mozne zkouseni toho snifferu na > spoji na Ujezde? Nevim jestli to budu zkouset na Ujezde. Sniffer jsem uz v zasade ozkousel, ta "vykonna" cast je uz hotova a zkousel jsem to predbezne na spoji u sebe doma a chodi to vynikajicne - rozeznava to pritomnost signalu mnohem driv nez RSSI a indikuje ji to taky mnohem prijemnejsim zpusobem, takze pro zamerovani to myslim bude hyperluxusni :) Ted na tom udelam jeste ty ozdobicky kolem (tu analogarinu) aby to bylo kompletni a pak navrhnu asi nakej tistak a pro kontrolu to osadim a postavim a pak by to melo bejt hotovy. Cl< From vojta at sinus.cz Mon Aug 25 22:53:22 2003 From: vojta at sinus.cz (=?iso-8859-2?q?Vojt=ECch=20Pithart?=) Date: Mon Aug 25 20:53:40 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Zadost o zarazeni nove ronji do tabulky Message-ID: <200308252153.23072.vojta@sinus.cz> Ahoj Clocku, Po desli odmlce a implementaci Tvych rad ohledne 2N3904 jsem uvedl za velke slavy prihlizejicich do provozu (muj prvni) spoj s Ronjou v nasi vesnicce. Je soucasti male soukrome site (pripojuje do ni jediny pocitac). V budoucnosti se planuje, ze se spoj stane soucasti site HKfree.org (Kralovehradecka obdoba CZfree) Uvedl bych nasledujici udaje: Place: Lhota pod Lib?any, Hradec Kr?lov?, Czechia Track Length: 800m/1km Aperture diameter: 130mm Construction details: HPWT-BD00, BPW43, plastic tubes, nonstd. holders Photos: Where can I upload them? URL: none In operation since: 20.8.2003 Notes: Connects one computer to community network Diky velice Vojta Lhota From clock at twibright.com Tue Aug 26 23:08:56 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Mon Aug 25 21:09:43 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Zadost o zarazeni nove ronji do tabulky In-Reply-To: <200308252153.23072.vojta@sinus.cz>; from vojta@sinus.cz on Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 09:53:22PM +0200 References: <200308252153.23072.vojta@sinus.cz> Message-ID: <20030826220856.A3647@beton.cybernet.src> Ahoj Diky za zpravu :) Gratuluju k uspesnemu rozjeti :) On Mon, Aug 25, 2003 at 09:53:22PM +0200, Vojt?ch Pithart wrote: > Ahoj Clocku, > Po desli odmlce a implementaci Tvych rad ohledne 2N3904 jsem uvedl za velke > slavy prihlizejicich do provozu (muj prvni) spoj s Ronjou v nasi vesnicce. Je > soucasti male soukrome site (pripojuje do ni jediny pocitac). V budoucnosti > se planuje, ze se spoj stane soucasti site HKfree.org (Kralovehradecka obdoba > CZfree) > > Uvedl bych nasledujici udaje: > Place: Lhota pod Lib?any, Hradec Kr?lov?, Czechia > Track Length: 800m/1km > Aperture diameter: 130mm > Construction details: HPWT-BD00, BPW43, plastic tubes, nonstd. holders > Photos: Where can I upload them? Misto kam by se dalo uploadovat bohuzel nemam. Mohl bych ty fotky odnekud stahnout? Nebo mi je posli normalne mailem - muzu prijimat velke maily (aspon si to myslim :) ). Cl< > URL: none > In operation since: 20.8.2003 > Notes: Connects one computer to community network > > Diky velice > > Vojta Lhota > > > > _______________________________________________ > Ronja mailing list > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja From simandl at mujmail.cz Tue Aug 26 00:36:47 2003 From: simandl at mujmail.cz (Petr Simandl) Date: Mon Aug 25 22:36:52 2003 Subject: [Ronja] sw patents protest In-Reply-To: <200308251523.28545.ladmanj@volny.cz> References: <20030825125850.A16461@beton.cybernet.src> <1061815349.4378.512.camel@term-serv> <200308251523.28545.ladmanj@volny.cz> Message-ID: <3F4A816F.7030604@mujmail.cz> http://swpat.hakl.net/texts/01.html Jakub Ladman wrote: > Ahoj Clocku, o problematice softwarov?ch patentu* nic nev?m. > Zn?? link na ne(jak? shrnut? (nejl?pe v c(e?tine()? > Nic jsem o tom nikdy nesly?el, ale to co me( napad? jen podle n?zvu, me( te(?ce > de(s?. > D?ky > Jakub From ladmanj at volny.cz Tue Aug 26 09:56:11 2003 From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman) Date: Tue Aug 26 07:56:24 2003 Subject: [Ronja] sw patents protest In-Reply-To: <3F4A816F.7030604@mujmail.cz> References: <20030825125850.A16461@beton.cybernet.src> <200308251523.28545.ladmanj@volny.cz> <3F4A816F.7030604@mujmail.cz> Message-ID: <200308260856.11937.ladmanj@volny.cz> Jak to tak vidim, predem bych se chtel omluvit za pouziti diakritiky v predchozim mailu. Podle linku od Petra Simandla, je zamysleny softwarovy patent presne to co me v prvni chvili napadlo. Opravdu totalni smrt. A tezce se to vzdaluje od moji predstavy, ze programator (jeho zamestnavatel, jeho pravnik) by si mel na chleba vydelavat praci a nikoliv dozivotnym kopirovanim prace odvedene pred lety. Jakub Ladman Dne po 25. srpna 2003 23:36 Petr Simandl napsal(a): > http://swpat.hakl.net/texts/01.html > > Jakub Ladman wrote: > > Ahoj Clocku, o problematice softwarov?ch patentu* nic nev?m. > > Zn?? link na ne(jak? shrnut? (nejl?pe v c(e?tine()? > > Nic jsem o tom nikdy nesly?el, ale to co me( napad? jen podle n?zvu, me( > > te(?ce de(s?. > > D?ky > > Jakub > > _______________________________________________ > Ronja mailing list > Ronja@lists.pointless.net > http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja From clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz Tue Aug 26 21:27:39 2003 From: clock at atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz (Karel Kulhavy) Date: Tue Aug 26 19:27:45 2003 Subject: [Ronja] laser safety In-Reply-To: <000a01c36bfd$7beaf700$4200000a@italnet.com.br> References: <000a01c36bfd$7beaf700$4200000a@italnet.com.br> Message-ID: <20030826182739.GA6484@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> > Thanks to Clock, here in Brazil I have a link running in a distance of 850 m. ( using the original desing and 100 mm chinese lenses) Would you please mind if I added your link to the table at http://ronja.twibright.com/tour/tour5.php ? Could you please tell me your details and send photos if you have got any? > > I need more distance, than, lets consider the use of laser: If I use a > beam expander ( the laser beam have a diameter of 10 mm ), is this > beam dangerous to the eyes when you look into it ? (when you put > your eyes in front of the beam) Take your Brazilian state regulations and fill in the formulas with physical values and you'll get an authoritative answer. This will differ country to country. Cl< From if at sil.at Tue Aug 26 21:37:37 2003 From: if at sil.at (Ingo Flaschberger) Date: Tue Aug 26 19:38:08 2003 Subject: [Ronja] laser safety In-Reply-To: <20030826182739.GA6484@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> References: <000a01c36bfd$7beaf700$4200000a@italnet.com.br> <20030826182739.GA6484@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: Hi > Take your Brazilian state regulations and fill in the formulas with > physical values and you'll get an authoritative answer. This will differ > country to country. i have found out, that at europe (with DIN EN 60825-1/11:2001) a laserlight with a wavelength from 1,4um till 1mm 1mW/mm^2 for a time over 10s is allowed. laserlight at this range does not reach the whole eye, it is already blocked at the cornea of the eye. perhaps at this wavelength more power could be used? bye, Ingo From ladmanj at volny.cz Wed Aug 27 08:44:40 2003 From: ladmanj at volny.cz (Jakub Ladman) Date: Wed Aug 27 06:44:25 2003 Subject: [Ronja] laser safety In-Reply-To: <20030826182739.GA6484@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> References: <000a01c36bfd$7beaf700$4200000a@italnet.com.br> <20030826182739.GA6484@atrey.karlin.mff.cuni.cz> Message-ID: <200308270744.40308.ladmanj@volny.cz> is this > > beam dangerous to the eyes when you look into it ? (when you put > > your eyes in front of the beam) > This will differ > country to country. > > Cl< eh????? From clock at twibright.com Fri Aug 29 15:34:38 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Thu Aug 28 13:35:21 2003 Subject: [Ronja] RSSI fix Message-ID: <20030829143438.A7129@beton.cybernet.src> I have fixed the receiver RSSI so that now it shouldn't generate any interference that propagates between outputs of NE592 and degrades nigttime range of the device. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Fri Aug 29 16:01:03 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Thu Aug 28 14:01:46 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Blocking fix, also in output limitter Message-ID: <20030829150103.A7227@beton.cybernet.src> Someone (Mnaga I think) has reported that the output limitter is improperly blocked and generates interference. No I have fixed the blocking and also fixed it at some other places to what I think will work better. The changes are in the Ronja 10M Metropolis Receiver. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Thu Aug 28 20:51:27 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Thu Aug 28 20:51:29 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: Wicked screensaver In-Reply-To: ; from petr.svojanovsky@seznam.cz on Thu, Aug 28, 2003 at 09:47:12PM +0200 References: Message-ID: <20200329215132.A7664@beton.cybernet.src> On Thu, Aug 28, 2003 at 09:47:12PM +0200, petr.svojanovsky@seznam.cz wrote: > Please see the attached file for details. Poslal jste spam do konference. Rucne Vas vyhazuji. You have sent a spam into the conference. I'm manually kicking you out. Cl< From zapadlo at melzer.cz Fri Aug 29 08:47:27 2003 From: zapadlo at melzer.cz (Petr Zapadlo) Date: Fri Aug 29 06:47:45 2003 Subject: [Ronja] gumove bloky do Ronja Holder Message-ID: <200308290747.27683.zapadlo@melzer.cz> Zdravim byl jsem vcera prozkoumat mototechnu a objevil jsem tam gumove valecky o prumeru cca 3cm, delce 3cm s otvorem 8mm. Barva cerna. Cena 3Kc. Puvodni urceni: uchyceni horniho konce tlumice perovani u nejake skodovky (myslim ze to byl Favorit). Budou pouzitelne? Proc Clock doporucuje vrtat diru do gumoveho bloku excentricky? Jeste jeden dotaz: Clock tady avizoval zmenu ve schematu Rx ohledne RSSI, ale na ronja.twibright.com jsem zadnou zmenu nenalezl? (nebo jsem slepy?) Diky S pozdravem -- Petr "Zapik" Zapadlo Ing. Petr Zapadlo vedouc? odd?len? syst?mov? podpory Melzer, spol. s r.o. Doln? 71, 796 01 Prost?jov tel: 582 330 301 fax: 582 330 302 mailto: zapadlo@melzer.cz http://www.melzer.cz From clock at twibright.com Fri Aug 29 10:55:36 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Fri Aug 29 08:55:53 2003 Subject: [Ronja] gumove bloky do Ronja Holder In-Reply-To: <200308290747.27683.zapadlo@melzer.cz>; from zapadlo@melzer.cz on Fri, Aug 29, 2003 at 07:47:27AM +0200 References: <200308290747.27683.zapadlo@melzer.cz> Message-ID: <20030829095536.A280@beton.cybernet.src> On Fri, Aug 29, 2003 at 07:47:27AM +0200, Petr Zapadlo wrote: > Zdravim > > byl jsem vcera prozkoumat mototechnu a objevil jsem tam gumove valecky o > prumeru cca 3cm, delce 3cm s otvorem 8mm. Barva cerna. Cena 3Kc. > Puvodni urceni: uchyceni horniho konce tlumice perovani u nejake skodovky > (myslim ze to byl Favorit). > > Budou pouzitelne? Budou, ale mozna vam to pujde ztuha to nastavovani. Ta excentricita je tam aby to nepresahovalo kraj te plotny a nevyhrezavalo ven ale to v zasade nevadi. > Proc Clock doporucuje vrtat diru do gumoveho bloku excentricky? > > Jeste jeden dotaz: > Clock tady avizoval zmenu ve schematu Rx ohledne RSSI, ale na > ronja.twibright.com jsem zadnou zmenu nenalezl? (nebo jsem slepy?) Ted jsem to kontroloval a je to tam. R122, C116, D102. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Fri Aug 29 11:54:29 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Fri Aug 29 09:54:34 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Blocking capacitors Message-ID: <20030829105429.A598@beton.cybernet.src> Don't you anyone please have some extensive experience with blocking capacitors? I wonder if a combination of 100n & 1n or a combination of 100n & 10n is better for blocking the HC gates. They generate nice nasty chirps of HF energy somewhere at 50MHz when they switch. Cl< From clock at twibright.com Fri Aug 29 18:15:52 2003 From: clock at twibright.com (=?iso-8859-2?Q?Karel_Kulhav=FD?=) Date: Fri Aug 29 16:15:57 2003 Subject: [Ronja] to improve sensitivity In-Reply-To: <000801c36d7a$3ee468e0$0100000a@julica>; from andre@italnet.com.br on Thu, Aug 28, 2003 at 12:37:05PM -0300 References: <000801c36d7a$3ee468e0$0100000a@julica> Message-ID: <20030829171552.B6643@beton.cybernet.src> On Thu, Aug 28, 2003 at 12:37:05PM -0300, Andr? wrote: > * NE592 I changed C11 - 270 pF to 470pF. This result in a change of Vout in receiver of 450 mV to 600 mV. > > In that time, some monthes ago, using SFH 203P, 100mm lenses, 850 m link: > 270 pF, 30% packet loss, size of packets = 508 bytes. > 470 pF, 20% packet loss, size of packets = 508 bytes. This is IMHO incorrect. It cripples the frequency response. > > > * SFH 203P , I put two 9 V baterry in series to have a total of 30 V in to receiver diode. Bether than just 12 V. This is a correct patch however requires replacement of the batteries in regular periods. Cl< From andre at italnet.com.br Sat Aug 30 10:48:38 2003 From: andre at italnet.com.br (=?iso-8859-1?B?QW5kcuk=?=) Date: Sat Aug 30 13:48:40 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: to improve sensitivity (Karel Kulhav?) References: Message-ID: <000701c36ef5$0a5a0360$0100000a@julica> Hi to All, > > * NE592 I changed C11 - 270 pF to 470pF. This result in a change of Vout in receiver of 450 mV to 600 mV. > > > > In that time, some monthes ago, using SFH 203P, 100mm lenses, 850 m link: > > 270 pF, 30% packet loss, size of packets = 508 bytes. > > 470 pF, 20% packet loss, size of packets = 508 bytes. > > This is IMHO incorrect. It cripples the frequency response. Ok, but in my case, it works better... Maiby becasuse I was using SFH203 P (planar face). Sorry, but what?s the meaning of IMHO ? > > > > > > > * SFH 203P , I put two 9 V baterry in series to have a total of 30 V in to receiver diode. Bether than just 12 V. > > This is a correct patch however requires replacement of the batteries in > regular periods. > Cl< > > Andre From xerox_irs at lvcm.com Sat Aug 30 11:43:29 2003 From: xerox_irs at lvcm.com (Daniel Kluss) Date: Sat Aug 30 18:39:37 2003 Subject: [Ronja] Re: to improve sensitivity (Karel Kulhav?) References: <000701c36ef5$0a5a0360$0100000a@julica> Message-ID: <000401c36f1e$3beb8a60$0480ea18@lv.cox.net> IMHO // abbrev. [from SF fandom via Usenet; abbreviation for `In My Humble Opinion'] "IMHO, mixed-case C names should be avoided, as mistyping something in the wrong case can cause hard-to-detect errors -- and they look too Pascalish anyhow." Also seen in variant forms such as IMNSHO (In My Not-So-Humble Opinion) and IMAO (In My Arrogant Opinion). ----- Original Message ----- From: "Andr?" To: Sent: Saturday, August 30, 2003 5:48 AM Subject: [Ronja] Re: to improve sensitivity (Karel Kulhav?) Hi to All, > > * NE592 I changed C11 - 270 pF to 470pF. This result in a change of Vout in receiver of 450 mV to 600 mV. > > > > In that time, some monthes ago, using SFH 203P, 100mm lenses, 850 m link: > > 270 pF, 30% packet loss, size of packets = 508 bytes. > > 470 pF, 20% packet loss, size of packets = 508 bytes. > > This is IMHO incorrect. It cripples the frequency response. Ok, but in my case, it works better... Maiby becasuse I was using SFH203 P (planar face). Sorry, but what?s the meaning of IMHO ? > > > > > > > * SFH 203P , I put two 9 V baterry in series to have a total of 30 V in to receiver diode. Bether than just 12 V. > > This is a correct patch however requires replacement of the batteries in > regular periods. > Cl< > > Andre _______________________________________________ Ronja mailing list Ronja@lists.pointless.net http://pointless.net/mailman/listinfo/ronja